Subject: SMML7/11/98VOL356 Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 18:08:57 +1100 (EST) shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: USS Massachusetts on its way! 2: Small alphabet decals 3: Abdiel class minesweepers 4: Model of Sea Ray cabin cruiser 5: US Coast Guard Model Kits 6: HMS Kelly 7: Re: German Shipborne A/C colors 8: Re: David Vs. Goliath 9: Re: Favorite Naval Books 10: Re: 1:500 Scale Figures 11: Re: colours? 12: Re: Jeff Robert's book list. 13: Re: Ships' Data Books on North Carolina and Massachusetts 14: Re: Krivak II 15: REVELL INVINCIBLE -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Sheridan, John" Subject: USS Massachusetts on its way! The USS Massachusetts was moved from Fall River Massachusetts on November 4th! Looks like they got her out of the mud and she's on her way to Boston for Drydocking and a major overhaul. The Massachusetts will arrive in Boston on Saturday. The Massachusetts has been on public display in Fall River Ma. since 1965. The last time she saw a drydock was in 1952 for routine maintanence. This will be the first time in 46 years that she's been out of the water. She is due for 10 million dollars in repairs to her hull and superstructure. The drydock she is due to be placed in is pretty close to the street in the old South Boston navy yard so it should be pretty easy to see her in drydock. The USS Salem is also due to be placed in drydock sometime this winter for repainting and renovations. Get those cameras ready!!! John Sheridan @ Microscale Decals http://www.microscale.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Small alphabet decals Doug, I found some 1/285 white waterslide decals from GHQ (intended for wargames vehicles) which I wanted for 1/76 scale WD census numbers, which might do the trick. They are about 1mm tall and come in groups of three, from 100 to 935 (numerals only, no alpha characters) and I think a black set is available as well. There are about 300 on a sheet, so they should last a while. Robert Lockie -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Abdiel class minesweepers Yunchi, Other sources of information are articles in Airfix Magazine July 1970 and March 1979. The latter has camouflage plans (both sides) and deck plans for Apollo and Ariadne, as well as Manxman's French destroyer disguise. Airfix Magazine January 1979 had an article on the post-war Manxman, with plans. If you would like to see the articles (these magazines can be hard to acquire these days), I can make some copies. Robert Lockie -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Denis and Marilyn Campbell Subject: Model of Sea Ray cabin cruiser A friend has a 34ft Sea Ray Express cabin cruiser and asked me if I knew of a kit to build a model of it (or a close aproximation). He doesn't mind if it is a plastic display model or a wood or fiberglass model made for RC and size is not a great consideration. Anyone know where I might find such a kit? Denis Campbell Avon Mass. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Bill Michaels" Subject: US Coast Guard Model Kits Just a quick note to my SMML brethren: I am compiling a list of model kits of USCG subjects. Boats, ships, and aircraft; plastic and wood, static and RC. I have recently updated the list-- if you're interested in USCG models (much better than Yamatos, in my opinion ), please check it out. I'm especially interested in listing small outfits that I didn't know about..... Note to listmaster: This is a reference list only-- there's nothing for sale. Thanx! Bill http://www.tiac.net/users/billkaja/kitlist.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: HMS Kelly Yunchi, I have trawled my references and according to an article by IM Fleming in Airfix Magazine February 1981, Kelly did indeed carry the 4" in place of the after torpedo tubes (in fact the article contains IWM photograph A4081, which clearly shows it). She also carried an MF/DF aerial on a bracket projecting from the front of the wheelhouse, just below the slope (glacis?). There was also a single 20mm on a platform either side of the engine room vent (abeam of the searchlight) but apparently she retained the quad 0.5" MGs on the bridge wings. No DC throwers were carried due to the leader's larger deckhouse aft, although DC racks are still present on the stern. My sources do not indicate whether a pendant number was still carried at the time of her loss, but I hope the rest is helpful. Robert Lockie -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: JohnVCP@aol.com Subject: Re: German Shipborne A/C colors I was trying to clean-up my hobby area (no small feat!) when I ran across the following reference book: "The Official Monogram Painting Guide to German Aircraft, 1935 - 1945" by K. Merrick and T. Hitcgcock. This was published in 1980 by Monogram Aviation Publications, Boylston, Mass. I had forgotten that had it! It was quite expensive as it contains color chips (real ones, not printed equivalents) and it has the following information regarding Maritime aircraft colors: Color 72 = Medium Green Color 73 = Light Green Color 65 = Light Blue Color 63 = Green Gray Color 01 = Silver Seaborne a/c, prior to 1935 were silver (01) overall. After 1935 it was changed to Color 63 overall on multiseat float palnes (He 59 and He 60). The floats were finished in silver (Color 01) with a clear protective topcoat. The He 51 singleseat float plane used Color 63 over all with the floats finished in Color 01. In late 1939 all front line seaborne a/c converted to Colors 72 & 73 on all upper surfaces and Color 65 on under surfaces. This remained unchanged thru out the war. Hope this helps on painting shipborne a/c on German ships. John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: YHSAIO@aol.com Subject: Re: David Vs. Goliath Oh my! Looks like I did forget Captain Sherbrooke's exploits in the Barents Sea. As Tamiya has re-released the old Skywave O-class destroyers and WEM has the O/P photoetch set, this may be one thread worth mentioning. Anyone have ideas on camo? Also, I always wondered about the Kriegsmarine's reluctance to engage, and this battle shows the problem that plagued the Kriegsmarine. The Admiral Hipper did her part to draw off the escort for JW55B, but the Luetzow sat around doing nothing, even though at a critical point in the battle the convoy had no escort. Also, the Jamaica and the Sheffield were no match for the 8" and 11" guns of the German ships (a replay of the River Plate?), but they inflicted severe damage on the Hipper at a critical point in the battle (possibly why rapid-fire 6" guns were favored by the RN and USN in these types of engagements). It seems as if the initiative of the old High Seas Fleet at Jutland didn't influence Captain Stange of the Luetzow. Of course, the contradictary orders given by the German High Command didn't help much. Here's another candidate for David vs. Goliath: HMS Acasta damaging Scharnhorst severely off Norway while escorting HMS Glorious (any chance of seeing an A class destroyer and Courageous/Glorious kits soon Caroline?). Yunchi Hsaio -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: Re: Favorite Naval Books Tim stated: >>Subject: Snorkers, Good Oh! Book list What a book! What a film! << Classics both. With the success last year of "Titanic", let's hope that someone in Hollywood decides to do a proper naval film with state-of-the-art special effects. Too many big budget attempts turned out to be fiascos with their pools filled with toy boats (as with "In Harm's Way", for example). >> I suggested a SMMLies favourite book list a few months ago, but got no response. Any contributions now? Just mention a book and author that have inspired your modelmaking. Gene and I obviously vote for Nicholas Monsarrat! << One of the most unforgettable non-fiction books I can think of is Eric Hammel's "Guadalcanal: Decision at Sea". Absolutely gripping from start to finish. Naval fiction: "Tide and Tide" by Thomas Fleming. The fictitious cruiser USS Jefferson City forms a backdrop for several thinly-disguised WW2 battles and incidents, and the story culminates with the ship being sunk in a fashion very much like the Indianapolis. Great characters and great action. Also the WW2 destroyer series by Admiral William Mack: "South to Java", "New Guinea", "Strait of Messina", and a couple of others that escape me just now. More contemporary is the series by David Poyer: "The Gulf", "The Med", "The Circle", "The Passage", and "Tomahawk" which follows the ups and downs in the career of a naval officer through his assignments at sea. Poyer is a Naval Academy graduate who's 'been there, done that' and the authenticity is evident in his writing. Fine, believable characters. No Tom Clancy style cardboard heroes... Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: Re: 1:500 Scale Figures Tim Perry wrote: >> Can I endorse the previous comments on WEMs beautiful little 1:350 MTBs, and say I WANT some of the figures Caroline and Dave had on show. I have often thought how dead model ships look without crews, but the etched figures available are so very flat, especially in the larger scales. I have found that EMA sell several ranges of figures including some in 1:400, 1:500 and 1:200. They are really architectural so if you look closely they have suits (and skirts!!) but they are injection moulded, so rounded. I will get some prices and contact details. << Excellent. Looking forward to seeing those MTBs. For those looking for 1:500 figures, Preiser also makes some scaled-down railroad people, they come in a set of 30 unpainted figures, molded in white. Check prices and availability at Walther's: http://www.walthers.com Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Beynart@aol.com Subject: Re: colours? I am a relatively new SMMLer, and this is my first attempt to ask a question. It has not started auspiciously, my first message having been eaten by my PC. I should note that I am the guy whose downloaded SMMLnotes disappeared into the nether regions of my PC. My thanks to all who sent words of advice and encouragement. You'll be pleased to know that I have found the errant missives and have read most. Not all, because my header collection has been replaced with a (smaller) collection of messages reading: "This document is too large to be opened by Simpletext." Sigh! My question is: what camo colors were worn by USN vessels during the Guadalcanal fighting in late 1942? I gather the predominate measure was 12 Modified, but I am not sure if the grays were the neutral grays called for (I think) by SHIPS-2, January 1941 and again (I again think) by SHIPS-2, June 1942. I assume the blue-grays of SHIPS-2, March, 1943, were not in use six months previously. However, the sources I've read don't seem to distinguish between "gray" 5-H and 5-O and "blue" 5-H and 5-O when discussing the period, and at least one source (Herne's Warship Perspective piece on Fletcher, et al) seems to use the same colors for all camo schemes regardless of year (it may just be the printing process.) Logically, Fletcher and Atlanta (my projects) should be clad in neutral grays, not blue grays. Were they? Another related question. I believe Missouri wore Measure 22 in Tokyo Bay. Were the colors 1943 blue-grays, or 1944 neutral grays? Another. What colors did Hornet wear on the Tokyo raid in early '42? Thanks. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: b29@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: Jeff Robert's book list. Jeff, You've hit one of my favorite areas. All the ships that you want to make (and more) I already have, albeit in 1:1250 scale. As for books, I strongly recommend the following: THE FIRST SOUTH PACIFIC CAMPAIGN by Lundstrom THE BARRIER AND THE JAVELIN and EMPIRES IN THE BALANCE by H.P. Willmot THE FIRST TEAM (2 VOLS) by Lundstrom. All were published by the USNIP. THE FIRST TEAM deals with PacFleet Navy carrier fighter pilots, but goes into new and incredible detail about every action where our CV's were involved. Vol 1 goes from Pearl Harbor through Midway. Vol.2 through Guadalcanal. Of course, S.E. Morison's HISTORY OF U.S. NAVAL OPERATIONS IN WW II, is a standard and necessary source. A great variety of other books have been written on events during the first six mos. of the war, far too many to try and list. Arthur Marder's OLD FRIEND'S, NEW ENEMIES has good coverage of the Royal Navy's travails during that time. Van Oosten's THE BATTLE OF THE JAVA SEA has good coverage of the Dutch, and Gill's 2 Vol. ROYAL AUSTRALIAN NAVY IN WW II covers the Aussies. One other book worth reading: THE GREAT PACIFIC WAR 1931, by Hector Bywater. A fictional, by very entertaining, account of war between the US and Japan written in 1925, it provides a truly fascinating look at how a knowledgeable writer on military affairs foresaw the naval war, and gives great insight into the thinking of the times. It helps one to understand what shaped the naval strategies that were central to the war in the Pacific years later. Paul Jacobs 1250 Editor http://warship.simplenet.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Re: Ships' Data Books on North Carolina and Massachusetts Hi, I just got a notice from Antheil Books that they have the old Ships' Data books on the North Carolina and the Massachusetts for $15.00 each plus $2.00 shipping. I am no longer looking for them, so if anyone wants them I'll put you in touch with Antheil. Cheers, Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Re: Krivak II Hi, I don't have any detailed references on the Krivak II, but for colors you might want to check the color photographs in the books published by Concord on the Slava, Udaloy and Sovremenniy (by Steven Zaloga) and Kiev and Kuznetsov Russian Aircraft Carriers (by Barry Dean). Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: Martin.Lamb@dtf.vic.gov.au Subject: REVELL INVINCIBLE Hi People, Does anyone know when Revell's HMS Invincible is too be released ? Thanks Martin. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume