Subject: SMML20/12/98VOL400 Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1998 23:47:30 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Hey Rusty, Are there any photos of your Enterprise? 2: Re: Vosper MTB's 3: KIROV 4: Vosper MTBs in USN service 5: Airfix RMS Queen Mary 6: Re: Metallic Rings on Barrels 7: USS Enterprise 8: U.S. Built Vosper MTB's` 9: L'Arsenal 10: Re: RMS Queen Elizebeth 11: Re: Lutzow stuff 12: Re: RMS Queen Mary 13: Lutzow & USS Ranger 14: Re: Cones for Cage Masts in 1/350 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Terry Sumner" Subject: Hey Rusty, Are there any photos of your Enterprise? Hi Rusty, Just wondering if there are any photos of your Enterprise available to view and where? Thanks, Terry Sumner -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: ALROSS2@aol.com Subject: Re: Vosper MTB's >> For Al Millen try getting the Naval Institute Press US Small Combatants. On Vospers There's Pt's 368-371,384-449,661-730 that were U.S built. << Slight correction here. PT 368-371 were not Vosper designs. Rather, they were a 70' Canadian Power Boat Company design based on the British Power Boat Company's 70' MASB/MGB concept. The same basic BPB concept was the basis for the 70' and 77' ELCO PTs. Al Ross -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Baker Subject: KIROV For those with an interest in the KIROV model mentioned by Caroline Carter in today's SMML, the actual ship was stricken from the Russian Navy last month and is to be used as a spare parts source for an overhaul of her sister ADMIRAL NAKHIMOV (ex-KALININ). KIROV herself was renamed ADMIRAL USHAKOV after the demise of the Soviet Union and had not operated since returning early from a Mediterranean cruise in January 1990; reliable reports state that her screws were removed for refurbishing in 1992 and have never been reinstalled, so if anyone wants to build an accurate, full-hull model of the former pride of the Northern Fleet, they can leave off the props. Of the other two ships of the class, ADMIRAL LAZAREV (ex-FRUNZE) is inactive in the Pacific Fleet, and the greatly-delayed PETR VELIKIY(ex-YURI ANDROPOV) was at last commissioned in the Northern Fleet in April 1998--twelve years after her keel was laid. This August, the commander-in-chief of what is left of the Russian Navy announced at a press conference that no new warships would be ordered for the Russian Navy for five years--and that was before the more recent further collapse of the Russian economy. Since then, the Yantar yard at Kaliningrad has announced that it would be scrapping the two incomplete NEUSTRASHIMYY-class frigates, while work on the new frigate NOVIK essentially ceased they day her first section was placed on the ways in July 1997. Thus, those who love the ships of the Russian Navy are left with modelling a fleet of the past--for the foreseeable future. Oh, other recent reports indicate that ALL submarine construction work has now ceased in Russia. A.D. Baker, III COMBAT FLEETS OF THE WORLD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Vosper MTBs in USN service The most comprehensive work I have found on Vospers is the second volume of 'Allied Coastal Forces of WW2' by SMML contributors John Lambert (Hi, John) and Al Ross. I have trawled through it but can find no indication in it that the USN actually operated Vospers itself, preferring Elcos, Higgins and Huckins boats. A number of Vospers were built in US yards but according to Harald Fock in 'Fast Fighting Boats', the 184 craft constructed were all of the 70ft (actually 70' 6.5") design and the Airfix kit is a late war 73ft boat. The US-built Vospers were sometimes given US numbers (PT384-449 and PT661-730) but were all intended for supply to the British and Soviet navies under lend lease. Apparently, MTB317-326 were never delivered and instead retained by the USN as PT59-68 but these were all 70ft boats built by Elco. Lambert and Ross state that armaments were supplied from Britain (and possibly Canada). I can find no reference to PT611 being a Vosper design; it seems to be an 80ft Elco which entered service in July 1945 and was subsequently supplied to the Royal Norwegian Navy. There are drawings of the 70ft Vosper design in the Lambert and Ross book and I believe that John may well have them in larger size if you are keen to build one. Unfortunately there is not too much of the Airfix kit that can be used for the early boat but a friend is scratchbuilding a hull in 1/76 so it is possible. Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Noel Ray Subject: Airfix RMS Queen Mary >> While discussing models, the sales person commented that one of Airfix's RMS Queen Elizabeth, (the liner) models, which they were biding for on the net, was auctioned off for $800! If that is true, Wow! ( and, let's face it, good subject, but a very so-so kit, especially compared to today's standards).<< I paid about (if I remember correctly!) £65 (English pounds) for a mint unmade sample at "Cobwebs" maritime antiques store in Southampton, UK, last July. This is now under construction - it does make an interesting comparison with the Modelcraft "Queen Mary". Noel Ray Cork City Ireland http://homepages.iol.ie/~noelray/index.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: Metallic Rings on Barrels Hi Art: My recollection from Navy days is that the color is not so much plain bare steel, but rather a warmer color about halfway off toward bronze, from lubricant over the bare metal. I too always assumed that was the portion of the barrel that passed into the recoil mechanism. However--why don't you give Mike Davis a call, since he's a former cannon-cocker? John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys (Who'll be starting to paint chips for USN Set 2 on Monday) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: The Codes Subject: USS Enterprise Hello List, I've seen several nice build ups of this 1/350 scale kit..I would agree that the more aircraft on deck the merrier! If your building her as she was in the early 80s you'll have to decide If you want here with A-7Es or early marks of the f-18s. I have not built this kit but have done other tamiya kits in this scale. Pick your time frame get as much info on her during that time as you can and go slow. I would build this kit myself BUT! Im holding out for a NIMTZ class ship in this Scale!!! My pet peve with Tamiya!!! they go to the expence of a 1/350 injection mold kit and what do they bring out?? why the Enterprise of course!!! A wonderful example of a super carrier no argument there. But how many are you going to sell???? She is a one of a kind!!! With a Nimitz class mold you change the box art and a part here and there and presto! you have kits of all the mighty Nimitz class to date! It makes an old salt who payed his dues on Nimitz's flight deck as a launch trouble-shooter a wee bit angry! Gee, now that Ive got that off my chest I feel so much better!!! fair winds and following seas Bill Code -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "lamkeel@email.msn.com" Subject: U.S. Built Vosper MTB's` Re Alan Millen's query. The U.S. built a considerable number of units to British Vosper designs,under Lend-Lease from 1941. The details will be found in Volume Two of Allied Coastal Forces of W.W.II. published by Conway Maritime Press. This publication is still in print, and covers all the Vosper wartime designs as well as U.S. Elco's and contains detailed drawings and excellent photographic cover. U.S. built units were supplied to the R.N. in the Med., the Royal Indian Navy, but by far the larger numbers were provided to the U.S.S.R. Drawings for the Annapolis built PT 661-730 constructed in late 1944 and early 45 are available. Drawn at a scale of 3/16" = 1 ft. They were fitted with standard U.S. weapons, - 20 mm Oerlikons and 21" torpedo tubes, U.S. SO. radar and whip aerials rather than the usual mast. Another noticable difference was the lack of hull scuttles. Drawings of ALL the C/F craft are available from Al Ross in Maine or my plans service here in the U.K. Seasons greetings to you all. Yours "aye" John Lambert -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Jean-Paul Binot" Subject: L'Arsenal Hi All SMMLers, I have tried to locate 1/400 resin and photoetch aftermarket products for some time to enhance Heller kits (some of which are being re-issued), besides the obvious (and excellent) GMM products. I have heard of a small French company named "L'Arsenal", but I cannot find any of their products, even in France (I have just relocated in Paris). Would anybody be able to point me in the direction of a source for a catalog of their products, or even better for their address so that I can contact them directly. Many thanks in advance. Jean-Paul Binot -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Robert J. Mitchell" Subject: Re: RMS Queen Elizebeth I remember reading an article ages and ages ago about a British firm that made fibreglass Ocean Liners, Cruise Ship and Air Liner models for travel agents. two of the models they had produced a considerable number of were the two Queens. I was wondering if a). does the firm still exist, and b). if any of these old display models ever come up for sale at Toy and Model Boat Auctions. I seem to remember they were about 1/192 scale. It's one way of boosting a collection if they aren't worth a small fortune as most old things seem to be these days Bob Mitchell -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: jmaine@golden.net Subject: Re: Lutzow stuff Hi SMMLies: I couldn't resist adding something to the recent inquiries about the panzerschiff Lutzow (ex-Deutschland). For a number of reasons she's always been a favourite of mine, perhaps especially because she was the first ship I ever modeled, many moons ago. Lutzow is also quite fascinating as what one historian has called "the hoo-doo ship of the German Navy". She certainly was a magnet for ill fortune that affected not only the ship itself but the German Navy and Germany as well, as the following highlights of her record will attest: 1934 - Hitler hosts a secret meeting on board the ship with senior military leaders. Hitler asks for their support for his bid to succeed Hindenburg as President of the Reich, in return offering to curtail the power of his Nazi Party army (the SA) which is resented by the generals as a rival to their own role. They agree to this "Deutschland Pact" as it is known and this helps Hitler consolidate his power as dictator). 1937 - the ship is part of the farcical "Non-Intervention Patrol" during the Spanish Civil War when it is bombed by two Republican aircraft. Forty-three crewmen are killed or injured. 1939 - sailing on her first and only ocean-going war cruise, Deutschland creates a major diplomatic embarassment for Germany by capturing an American freighter (the ship is eventually returned to its American owners). On returning home, the captain (Captain Wennecker) is promptly relieved of command for this affair. 1940 - now renamed Lutzow, the ship is to break out into the Atlantic again after the invasion of Norway but first gets shot up by Norwegian shore batteries and then gets torpedoed by HM submarine Spearfish. Lutzow is out of action for a year. 1941 - Lutzow puts to sea again to attempt a second time to break out into the Atlantic but, in an almost million-to-one shot, a lone Beaufort torpedoes her. Lutzow is out of action for another year. 1942 - Lutzow is sent north to Norway and is detailed to participate in Operation Rosselsprung, a major German fleet action aimed at convoy PQ 17. However the ship runs aground in a fjord and again is out of action until the end of the year. Then on Dec 30-31, she participates in Operation Regenbogen (a.k.a. the Battle of the Barents Sea) but her Captain, Stange, behaves so cautiously that, although the convoy JW 51B is virtually under the Lutzow's guns, no merchant ships are sunk and the convoy escapes. As a result of this dismal performance, Hitler demands the scrapping of his "useless" navy and Grand Admiral Raeder resigns. Moreover, Lutzow was to have attempted, after the battle, to try yet a third time to break out into the Atlantic but this is now abandoned and, in fact, Lutzow never ventures out on to the high seas. 1943 - After accomplishing nothing in the Norwegian theater, Lutzow is transferred back to Germany to become a training ship. 1944-45 - Lutzow comes into her own at last as a shore bombardment ship, shelling the advancing Russian armies as they drive into east Prussia. Indeed, even after she is sunk in an upright position in very shallow water, she continued firing with some of her guns in May, 1945, thus doing her part to protract the existence of the dying Third Reich. In 1947 the wreck was broken up by the Russians. . . John Maine -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: SantMin@aol.com Subject: Re: RMS Queen Mary >> On the back burner, I am planning to do a WW2 Queen Mary troopship using Revell's old kit (Gee, just think, quite the buy at around $30). I did one years ago, before the age of photo-etch, and it was displayed in the QM's hobby store for many years. With WEM and Gold Medal accessories, it should be a fun project. << A while back I did the WW2 QM troopship conversion on a GHQ 1:2400 QM kit and it is quite impressive! In fact, I did her both ways, civilian and troopship, and display them side by side. Cheers, Bob Santos -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: jmaine@golden.net Subject: Lutzow & USS Ranger OK, this post won't be as long as the other one, honest, but I just wanted to mention something that ties in the Lutzow with American CV's, the deck colours and recognition markings of which have been an interesting, recent thread. It seems that the Lutzow was the only major German warship (heavy cruiser or battleship) that was very nearly the subject of an American carrier air strike. This occurred when the Lutzow was recalled to Germany from Norway in September, 1943. By this time the growth of Allied air power had made a voyage on the open seas a very dangerous proposition for German naval forces. Sure enough, the Lutzow was detected in her southward passage by British air reconnaissance but initial Fleet Air Arm strikes missed her due to bad weather. A new strike force, with an escort of Wildcat fighters from the USS Ranger (CV 4), was assembled but finally abandoned when it was realized that it was too late for the strike to be successful. Incidentally, the voyage of the Lutzow from Arctic waters to the Baltic without interception was treated as a significant tactical defeat by the Allies (according to Roskill in the official RN history). The affair caused an official inquiry that resulted in a considerable strengthening of RAF Coastal Command. John Maine -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Re: Cones for Cage Masts in 1/350 Hi SMML, I thought I read the other day that someone makes a cone for bending 1/350 photoetched cage masts into shape. If so, who makes them? I haven't attempted a cagemast in 1/350 yet, but it seems like a cone would be a big help. Thanks, Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume