Subject SMML30/12/98VOL410 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:58:22 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: USS Massachusetts Kit 2: Re: Carrier deck weathering 3: Kresta 4: What Did You Get For Xmas 5: Re: Kriegsmarine Colors 6: Re: HMS Kelly 7: Re: Kriegsmarine Color - RAL codes 8: Re: INDIANAPOLIS 9: Re: TV Shows 10: Measure 22 11: Nichimo 1/200 Yamato Deck Question 12: Re USS Shangri La 13: DETAILING 1/700 AIRCRAFT 14: Correction from the "detail police" 15: Admiralty Accounts. 16: Re: Revell ESSEX carriers... 17: Re: Lindberg Essex Carrier Kit #760M @ 1/525 18: Re: Aurora Forrestal question -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Revell USS Lexington 2: Re: 1/35 Close In Weapon System 3: USS Massachusetts prices 4: Warship 'books' -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Sheridan, John" Subject: Re: USS Massachusetts Kit >> My wife gave me a stocking full of cash to spend on kits,supplies etc... Anyone know how much (the least) the new USS Massachusetts Kit can be had for and from whom? << THe BWN USS Massachusetts can be found at the usual places (Pacifc Front, Naval Base Hobbies, BWN Direct, etc...) You get to choose your favorite store to buy it from . I am working on the USS Massachusetts right now. Suffice to say, it is a beautiful kit to work on and the casting quality is superb. However, you will need to figure out what timeframe you are modeling her in *before* you start working on the superstructure. The kit is modeled in her late 1945 appearence just before she got the SK-2? Radar set(The big circular antenna). If you wish to model the ship in 1942, you can use a mix of parts from the USS South Dakota kit which are all included with the USS Massachusetts kit. If you are interested in her late 1944 fit, then you will need to order a couple of extra parts from BWN. A word of caution about the kit: The splinter shields on the superstructure parts are very delicate and tend to break easily. I've had to replace some of mine with .020 styrene strips because of my handling the kit while sanding the hull seams. On the plus side, the rudders are next to impossible to break-off even though they are molded into the lower hull . If you have any questions, please feel free to ask. Also, I recommend getting a copy of the book on the USS Massachusetts (available from the Battleship Cove Ship Museum) and the Floating Drydock plans TFW-BB59/16 (1/192 Scale, 1945 fit). Good luck with the kit! John Sheridan @ Microscale Decals http://www.microscale.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Carrier deck weathering If you want to see a GREAT job of deck weathering, check out Toms Modelworks web site. As I recall, there is a photo of his 1/700 jeep carrier kit (Casablanca class?)with a deck blue flight deck. The builder painted the heavily weathered deck with the brown wood showing through the blue stain where the aircraft touched down on the deck. It is most impressive and the best weathering job I have seen in many years. I'm going to give this a try on my 1/350 Yorktown model. If I can get it to look half as good as that model I'll be happy. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Pieter Cornelissen Subject: Kresta I'm looking for good top views (either drawings or photographs) of Soviet Kresta 1 and Kresta 2 class cruisers. I'm trying to find out their funnel configuration. Anybody know any sources? Pieter Cornelissen BTW on the 'christmas thread', I ordered myself a WEM 1/700 Askold. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Felix Bustelo Subject: What Did You Get For Xmas Since I proposed this thread, let me add what Santa (actually my beautiful wife) left under the tree for me: An Aztec A4709 Airbrush set - a A470 airbrush with a variety of nozzles and paint cups, all in a very nice wooden storage case. While I had no new additions to the kit pile (I have already done enough for that cause on my own, thank you very much) my wife as provided me with much needed help getting through it! Felix Bustelo -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Foeth" Subject: Re: Kriegsmarine Colors In Jung, Abendroth's and Kelling's "Anstriche und Tarnanstriche der deutschen Kriegsmarine", both old and new RAL names are provided, not numbers. But, as long as nobody knows what the correct color is, nobody can tell you your model is wrong. Modeling is about suggesting reality, not copying it. Even if your color is slightly darker, you just painted your model in clouded weather. I never "paint by numbers". I just throw some jars together until I am happy. Evert-Jan Foeth fact provider -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Vimieraa@aol.com Subject: Re: HMS Kelly Fitted with two single 20mm and two quad 0.5" at time of loss. For other ships, check armament returns held at Naval Historical Branch in London. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Pletscher-Lenz-Schneider" Subject: Re: Kriegsmarine Color - RAL codes The Kriegsmarine color system did NOT relay to the RAL system. The Kriegsmarine had its own system of defining colors and used RAL-colors only for some interior details. There are some cross references between Kriegsmarine colors and the RAL system. Most of them are documented in the second edition of Abendroth/Jung/Kelling, "Anstriche und Tarnanstriche der deutschen Kriegsmarine". But they are no exact matches, and in addition there are all the impoderabilities which David Krakow described in his posting No.2/Vol.409. So you should not care too much about RAL color chips. Falk Pletscher -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: INDIANAPOLIS Like NEW JERSEY, which repainted into Ms.22 at about the same time, INDY should be in neutral Haze Gray (5-H) over purple-blue Navy Blue (5-N). Hope this helps. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: TV Shows OK, now that we've taken on Navy Log, Silent Service, etc., does anyone else on the list remember watching Thomas Mitchell--great character actor--playing the lead role as the Chief Engineer of the INCHECLIFF CASTLE in "Glencannon", a short-lived 1950s series based on the books by Guy Gilpatrick? John Snyder -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "ROBERT MORGAN" Subject: Measure 22 Does anyone know if the overhangs on ships painted in Measure 22 were countershaded? I know they were sometimes painted a lighter color to prevent shadows, but what color precisely? Thanks. Robert Morgan -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "Theodore T. Moran" Subject: Nichimo 1/200 Yamato Deck Question I have the Nichimo 1/200th Yamato and have been quietly acquiring everything I would need. The anatomy of a ship and Gold Medal's Yamato brass kit. I am almost ready to start building her, but the two piece deck has me worried. I am not sure I like the fact that a large seam will run across her width. I was thinking of applying a veneer of wood, but I can not seem to find any thin enough. Does any one have any suggestions as to how to tackle this two piece deck? Thanks Ted Moran -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Chris Hughes" Subject: Re USS Shangri La Hi Shane, Please pass on my thanks to the group for all the responses, both email and here in SMML, to my Shangri La question. I'll certainly be keeping my eyes open at UK kitswaps from now on... Regards Chris Hughes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Martin.Lamb@dtf.vic.gov.au Subject: DETAILING 1/700 AIRCRAFT I'm seeking advice the various methods the SMML'ers use to detail small scale aircraft, in particular cockpit panel lines, flaps etc... Unfortunately a well presented ship model can be marred by a blob of plastic that supposed to be the ship's float plane, or a carrier's flight deck. As annoying as it is for us ship builders, I find that when people are admiring a ship (particularly carriers) they are inevitably drawn to the ship's planes. Thanks. Martin Lamb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: BSteinIPMS@aol.com Subject: Correction from the "detail police" In a message dated 12/29/98 06:44:48, Dan Jones, publisher of one of my favorite magazines, "Plastic Ship Modeler" and one of the real gentlemen in this hobby, with a slip of his pen, wrote: >> From: dhjonespsm@juno.com Subject: Re: USS Shingra La kits << That's SHANGRI-LA to you, cowboy! >> And, I hasten to add......:-) :-) Bob Steinbrunn Minutia HQ Minneapolis -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Douglas Martin" Subject: Admiralty Accounts. Many years ago I was given 3-4 books written as The Admiralty Account of Naval Operations in the Med, "East of Malta, West of Suez", Sept 1939 to March 1941 and "Greece to Tripoli", April 1941 to January 1943. Both are worse for wear now, but still readable, costing 1 shilling, 1 and sixpence (5 pence, 7.5 pence), HMSO 1943, 1944. Kelly is seen with other DDs of the 5th Flotilla on the 22/05/41, dropping depth charges, and the 4"AA gun in lieu of the second bank of TTs is clearly visible. Unfortunately the picture is chopped off just forward of the first bank of TTs, the 4 barrelled 2pdr is seen, but no bridge is shown. There is mention of O/S Ian D Rhodes, RANVR of Kashmir shooting down a JU87 with an Oerlikon gun. I have a book on HMS Jervis, titled Mediterranean Maelstrom as another J/K/N source, plus the paperback on the Kelly. I have a relatively good B&W of DD G-38 coming into Alex after Crete loaded with troops, its nigh impossible to work out what's in the bridge wings though. B turret has a raised lip around the front/side on the gun deck, blast or weather protection from A turret. August 1941, Polish infantry being landed in Tobruk, J/K/N, has 0.5" quad in bridge wings, no doubt, very clear. Same angled shield in front of B turret, Has 2-3 foot 'screen' on B gundeck joining raised platform back to the bridge, could be splinter protection or just the guard rail 'canvassed', same from front of A turret back to forward superstructure. Such is research.......... Douglas -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: dhjonespsm@juno.com Subject: Re: Revell ESSEX carriers... Fellow SMML member Steve Gustafson (and a friend of some 20 years) contacted me off line about my posting regarding the Revell ESSEX kits and shared some interesting details. He had built all these kits over the years (and I must confess I had not) and pointed out an error. I stated that the kit was never modified (meaning the ship itself - not counting the aircraft variations - ASW group or Attack group), but Steve says that this is not correct. On some of the kits the catapult bridles were present and on others they were removed. Unfortunately that is all that was done - there were no changes to radar or weapons fit and no attempts to do the differing bow shapes. Steve also mentioned two additional variations on the aircraft sprues which I was not aware of. In the LEXINGTON kit there was a different aircraft sprue. a set of training aircraft - consistent with her role as a training carrier. Also, in the HORNET kit at one point a special sprue was added to represent the ship's role in the Gemini (?) program as a splash-down recovery ship - a small space capsule was added as well as extra helicopters. Interesting... there is always something new to learn. One too many names typed in.... the Ranger kit was a FORRESTAL variant. Dan Jones -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: RCClem@aol.com Subject: Re: Lindberg Essex Carrier Kit #760M @ 1/525 Dan Jones wrote the following: >> Lindberg also did the same thing as Revell - releasing a kit under different names with no changes to the parts inside. Their version of the ESSEX class (angle deck) appeared as SHINGRA LA, WASP, YORKTOWN, INTREPID, TICONDEROGA, and HORNET. Their kit is listed as 1/500 also, but I believe it is not the same tooling as Renwall's kit. If they hit a "standard" scle it was just luck. Like the early Revell kits, they were designed to fixed lengths regardless of subject to fit into standard sized packaging. << I agree. I have the Lindberg kit # 760M (M=motorized). It does not state the scale. The box says USS Yorktown, but does not state which one. The picture shows 4 twin-gunned turrets on the flight deck. The short history provided in the instructions tells us that this is the CV-10 that was going to be the Bon Homme Richard but was changed on September 26, 1942 to the Yorktown. It states the length to be 888 ft., the waterline beam is about 90 or 100 ft., and the maximum beam to be 147 ft. This scales out to about 1/525. But the pictures in the instructions show a big " 5 " on the flight deck, which I think is the first Carrier Yorktown. Best of all, the decals are for the USS Boxer, CV-21. Go figure. Roger Clemens Hinsdale, Illinois where winter has finally arrived (windy and 8 degF) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: b29@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: Aurora Forrestal question Now that I think about it, I don't think that the Revell Forrestal had F11F's. Those may have been on the later Revell Essex Class SC 27 model. I distinctly remember that the FORRESTAL had A3 Skywarriors, F7U Cutlasses, A4 Skyhawks AND BANSHEES. At least the model that I got had them, and I got one of the first on the market back in about 1957. I think that the Aurora model may also have had some Skywarriors. Paul Jacobs -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: Revell USS Lexington Attention SMMLer's The USS Lexington can be found at the Naval Base http://www.modelshipbuilding.com we also carry the GMM photo-etch for this kit. Thanks Shaya -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: 1/35 Close In Weapon System I have just finished the test shot model of the CIWS and it really looks coooooool! As soon as I finish the instruction sheets we will go into production. I'll have photos posted on my website very soon. The price for the kit will be $59.95 + $3.00 S&H. If you want be notified when the kit is available or want an email photo, send me your email address and I'll send it along as soon as I can. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Steven Rogers Subject: USS Massachusetts prices In reply to Mark's inquirey...The best prices seem to be direct from BWN thru the Navis site. They are a sponser... other outlets would be Squadron and Pacific Front. All are competitive with BWN's site the best! Steve Rogers -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Douglas Martin" Subject: Warship 'books' Folks: - Mainly for UK bods........ There are batches of 'Warship' annuals, quarterlies at: http://www.bookshop.co.uk I suggest you get your snouts in the trough quickly, Douglas (Scotland) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume