Subject SMML15/01/99VOL426 Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 23:29:26 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: Tssessarevich model 2: Getting Ship Plans 3: Nelson paint scheme 4: Re: Diver Dan 5: Re: CA 6: Royal Navy of WWII in Color 7: 1/72 Walrus 8: Re: USS Honolulu/Phoenix 9: Re: PT109 10: WW2 USN DD camouflage measures 11: RN deck colours WW2 12: Re: Signal flags 13: Re: Sightseeing near Detroit. 14: Re: Tender and subs 15: Re: hull red 16: Re: Sightseeing near Detroit 17: USS Montrose fate? 18: Re: PT-109 and APDs 19: Good book buy!! 20: Re: Diver Dan 21: Re: IRCS 22: New subscriber 23: A rookies USS Honolulu (1.1" guns) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Clearence Sale at the Naval Base 2: New website. 1250 Fleets -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Pletscher-Lenz-Schneider" Subject: Re: Tssessarevich model I just was told that NNT Modell + Buch Versand is on the net. Their e-mail address is: NNTModell@t-online.de Falk Pletscher -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: BILL HENSLER Subject: Getting Ship Plans Anybody know where from the National Archives where I can write or send e-mail to get their catalog for Ship Plans. The two ship plans I want to purchanse are the USS FLINT, an improved Atlanta class cruiser, and the USS MICHIGAN, a South Carolina class battleship. Thanks Bill -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "FERNANDO, YOHAN" Subject: Nelson paint scheme Micheal, The 1/700 Tamiya Nelson shows instructions for the Admiralty disruptive scheme I think you are looking for. It is different from the Rodney's. It also shows only one side of the ship. I assumed the other side was the same (but had no factual evidence for this. US schemes were different on port and starboard. I have no idea of RN practices). I would scan the instruction sheet and post it somewhere or send it to you but I don't have the sheet handy (all my old boxes and instructions are in storage at my parents' place). Yohan Fernando -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: CaptainOD@aol.com Subject: Re: Diver Dan Where's the web site for Planet X Magazine? Bob O'Donovan -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "FERNANDO, YOHAN" Subject: Re: CA >> CA = Cruiser Attack. It was the designation for a heavy cruiser. I know it was used from after WWI to about the 1970's when the all gun cruisers were retired. << CA actually stood for "Armored Cruiser". This was used before and during WWI. When heavy (Treaty) cruisers began to be designed in the 20's they were seen as the successors to the then-current armored cruisers so used the same designation. Yohan Fernando -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Dimitrios Apostolopoulos Subject: Royal Navy of WWII in Color Hello All: Does anybody know if there are any color prints of Royal Navy ships of WWII? I have made a request to the IWM, but maybe someone out there has found something in a private collection... I have a copy of the NVTC video #4, but that's about it. Dimi -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "arthur" Subject: 1/72 Walrus I am having a problem locating a 1/72 scale Walrus Amphibian for the Achilles, in Godzone. Could some kind person please point me in the right direction overseas. Many thanks, Arthur Down from 43 to 28 and raining for the first time in a month. Note from Shane: It might be best to reply to Arthur off list. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: Cadman Subject: Re: USS Honolulu/Phoenix First off, thanks to all that responded for the info, on this cruiser. I have decided to build this kit (Jim Shirley Productions 1/700 Honolulu CL-48) as the USS Phoenix CL-46 instead. I found some photos of the Phoenix as she appeared in Sept. 43 that appear identical to the late 43 refit of Honolulu. I will probably use the Corsair Armada kit for an earlier version of the Honolulu when congress (the wife) releases funds to start that project, further funding has been denied until previously approved projects are completed. I probably should wait until my plans arrive from The Floating Drydock, but I have noticed that the 5" guns that are in the Skywave weapons set are too tall to fit in the forward gun tubs on the above mentioned Cruiser. Is the Skywave 5" gun the correct one to use, or does it just need modified? Also one of the photos that I found of the Phoenix has a camo pattern that I'm not familiar with. Can anyone identify this camouflage measure at this link: http://www.navsource.org/Archives/CA/CL-046_Phoenix.gif One another note, The Floating Drydock doesn't list any plans for the USS Helena CL-50, does anyone know where I can get some? I would like some full size prints other than the ones included in the Classic Warships kit of the same. I have read some other readers concerns with JSP kits, and think it is only fair to relate my experience with the company. When I purchased this kit (Honolulu), it had the wrong hull (New Orleans), a call to Jim Shirley Productions got me the correct replacement and I was told I could keep the other one. It arrive a week after the call and other than that I'm pretty satisfied with JSP. Cadman's Home on the Web http://kc.net/~cadman/index.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Re: PT109 The page reference for the drawing of 109 in Lambert & Ross's Allied Coastal Forces II is 150. There is a deck plan and starboard side elevation. Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: WW2 USN DD camouflage measures There was an excellent series of articles in Scale Models magazine in the early 1980s by Del Palmieri on USN camouflage, which included in the June 1982 issue a breakdown of the final wartime camouflage assignments for major vessels. Assignments are available for all PACFLT ships and the system was that odd-numbered squadrons were painted in Ms21 and even numbered ones in Ms22. In theory, Atlantic Fleet ships followed the same system after 03/1945 although many still wore Ms22 or Ms32/3D until routine refits. I can copy the pages and send them to you if you can indicate which fleets and which periods you are interested in as the series ran to at least 18 parts. Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: RN deck colours WW2 Wooden decks seem generally to have been left unpainted. I only have one colour photo that I can recall, of Nelson just post-war, on the cover of Warship 28, which has scrubbed bare wood decks but horizontal metal surfaces in dark blue grey (probably B20). Most articles by authoritative sources that I have read support bare wood being used. Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Ernst-Bernhard Kayser Subject: Re: Signal flags >> I found the national and international signal flags and their definitions on the US Navy web site: http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/communications/flags/flags.html . It only mentions the flag's individual meaning. I would like more than one answer to this so to verify the answer. << Hi SMMLers and hi Rusty, Check out these two web-pages: http://terra.org/sailing/pennants/pennants.html http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknowhow/flags.htm The first one explains how to spell clear text words with signal-flags. From the second you can get a general idea about the code-meaning of two-, three-, four-,.... up to seven-flag signals. There are a couple of examples given for two-flag signals that might be useful for a modelling project. As mentioned on the US Navy webpage on signal flags, warships use different (secret) codes when signalling amongst each other. Even in cases where secrecy is not necessary the usage of the international code seems to come in dialects. For example in the novel "Away All Boats" it is stated that US landing craft returning wounded marines to the mother ship were flying flag V(icktor) (; international meaning: "require assistance".) Odd..., I would have bet my money on flag W(hiskey) instead: "require medical assistence". Furthermore, I found it remarkable that in the US navy numerals are represented by special flags instead of the internationally used pennants. Does anyone know: (1) Were these in use during WWII? (2) Do other navies use them too (maybe all NATO navies)? (3) Did other navies develop their unique sets of signal flags too - how about the imperial japanese navy? To add another country to the growing list: The modern german navy does it like everybody else we have heard of so far. Underway the flag is set at some high gaff in the mast. It is two-pointed and horizontally striped black, red, gold, showing an eagle on a coat of arms in the middle. In the harbor or moored elsewhere a small jack flyes at the bow and a larger ensign at the stern. (No flag in the mast). Jack and ensign are set in the morning and taken down again at sunset. In the fast patrol boat squad where I had to serve my time (national service was/is(?) compulsary in Germany) the evening flag parade was an exciting event for one reason only. In the rare case when the watch of a neighbor boat would forget to take down their flags in time there was a race to capture these flags. A captured jack or ensign was held for ransom. It was worth at least one bottle of beer for each man on the boat. Besides the nationality flags the Germans fly a special flag (Kommandantenwimpel) whenever the commander of the vessel is on board. For an ordinary commander this is a long narrow white two-pointed pennant with a small "iron cross". Officers with higher functions such as division commander, flotilla commander, and so on have more impressive flags. This is all I can remember Have fun, everyone Bernhard -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Darren Scannell Subject: Re: Sightseeing near Detroit. >> I'll be leaving soon for some graduation work in Ann Arbor, MI, so are there any worthwhile museums, etc in the nieghbourhood? << Don't know about Naval, but the Ford museum is pretty cool. Darren Scannell -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: PulligS@aol.com Subject: Re: Tender and subs SMML has just this type of site to post photos. http://warship.simplenet.com/ Then press SMML button Then Pic Post. then follow instructions. You sign on much as you do here but the days messages are posted as one message This site covers steel warships and modeling ships in plastic and resin. Good sight. I know some of the others on this list are also on it. Sam Pullig -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: Dave Judy Subject: Re: hull red Check your nearest auto parts store. they usually carry red oxide primers, some are too brown.. but some are more to the red, looks good to me!! Dave Judy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: Mike Settle Subject: Re: Sightseeing near Detroit >> I'll be leaving soon for some graduation work in Ann Arbor, MI, so are there any worthwhile museums, etc in the nieghbourhood? << If I'm not mistaken, the Henry Ford Transportation Museum is in Detroit. It would definitely be worth a visit. Mike Settle -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: CBNJBB62@aol.com Subject: USS Montrose fate? I have a request. Does any one know the fate of USS MONTROSE-APA-212. I have the Revell Germany kit of it. I have the DANFS edition of her history. It stops in 1968 as the ship returned from Vietnam. It seems that in 1969 she was decommissioned and stricken a year later using Paul Silverwell's US WARSHIPS since 1945. Oh for the guy who remarked about the ships with hull numbers on turrets. The ships involved were the cruisers Chicago and Tuscaloosa in 1936 not the Iowa's in the 50's. From the book American Cruisers of World War II. Sincerely Craig Bennett -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: PT-109 and APDs We're still shooting for the end of the month to release USN Paint Chip Set 2, 30 chips of the greens and browns you'll need for those amphib force ships and PTs, plus the neutral grays that were introduced in 1945 to replace the purple-blues, with Mountbatten Pink Dark and pre-war flight deck mahogany thrown in for good measure. We'll keep SMML posted with particulars on the final release. Retail will be $21 + $1.50 postage (domestic). That said, we have a question for all assembled (as assembled as a worldwide e-mail group can be): We were planning to release the RN set next, 27 colo[u]rs, probably about the end of June. However...we will have 8 IJN colors in hand by the end of this week (a case of having been loaned the chips and having to get the paint matching done to return the originals in a timely manner). We were planning on doing the IJN, Reggia Marina, and KM chips later this year. Releasing the IJN now might--repeat might--delay the RN set a bit. Recommendations? John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: "Phil Lord" Subject: Good book buy!! Check out http://www.hamiltonbook.com for a good buy on Bernard Ireland's "Jane's Naval History of World War II' --$31.50 + 3.00 per total order (not per book) shipping charge. Amazon.com has the same price but charges a little more for shipping. Search for item # 216372. I just paid $41.50 for my copy at Border's two days ago [:-( Hamilton also lists other titles from the Naval Institute Press at a nice discount, though most are of historical rather than a technical/paint/model building nature. If you haven't seen Ireland's book, it strikes a nice balance between informative text and striking photos. Black and white ship photos, (some color too), abound, and many of these might prove useful to modelers for revealing details of armament or general ship layout. While some of the battle photographs are familiar, many were new to me, and seem to have been selected because they put the viewer right into the thick of the action. One particular shot (Pp 178-179), looking out from the open bridge of HMS Euryalus over her 3 forward turrets trained to port, especially stands out. Also scattered throughout the book are color warship profiles, with many ships rendered in camouflage schemes. I'd never seen HMS Rodney in "green" before (Pp 242-243)! My only disappointment, minor and purely personal, is that the book lacks a photo of Captain Frederick "Johnny" Walker, the U-Boat killer, though a photo of one of his ships, HMS Starling, and another of his Second Support group, HMS Woodpecker, are included. I have no connection with Hamilton Books, or Amazon, other than being a happy customer! Phil Lord -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: CBNJBB62@aol.com Subject: Re: Diver Dan For Gordon