Subject SMML26/01/99VOL437 Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 23:56:32 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Various 2: Two 1/400 Heller's Richelieu? Re-packaged or Modified Version? 3: Re: Gun calibre 4: Enterprise References 5: Re: Dio Sol 6: Re: Floquil Marine colors on sale 7: Re: "Plink's" non-scale "free-runners" 8: German Catapult Ships (conclusion) 9: Injection molded Liberty Ship? 10: Re: Paints 11: Re: RN destroyers 12: Re: How to obtain any color in the universe 13: Cruise Ship? 14: 1/32 PT Boat photoetch 15: Re: German Catapult Ships (continued) 16: Re: Re: helo hangers RN 17: Re: Books 18: Naval Gunnery Fire Control Systems in WWI and WWII 19: Re: Ships's vehicles 20: Status of Floquil 21: Falklands lasers 22: Re: Gun Calibre 23: USS Oregon colors 24: Re: IJN Haruna 25: Re: Skywave IJNS Oi 26: Re: Nichimo IJN Takao 27: Re: Falklands colours 28: Military technology secrets!! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Wanted to buy 2: USN Set 2 paint chips 3: Quartermaster Models 4: Re: Nautilus Models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS Welcome to the Australia Day edition of SMML, I hope all those who celebrated Australia Day had a good time. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Shane Subject: Various Hi gang, I've got a couple of questions for you. First off, a fellow APMA member would like to know where he can find stbd views of the RMS Olympic in dazzle camo in WW1. I would like any info pertaining to Russian Delta III SSBNs colours, in particular whether or not they were painted in one colour overall or not. I also just aquired the Dragon(DML) 1/350 USS Ingersoll in a club raffle. What's it like? Shane (basking in 25-30C degree sunshine, five minutes drive from the beach & three minute walk to the lake) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Roy Man Subject: Two 1/400 Heller's Richelieu? Re-packaged or Modified Version? Hi: I saw two boxes of 1/400 Heller's Richelieu (& also same for Prinz Eugen), distinct with different box design & code number. Could anybody please tell me that are they being re-packaged or modified with new parts? If they are all modified version, which parts of the kits are changed? Your information and help is much appreciated! Regards, Roy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Nuno J. V. Rubim" Subject: Re: Gun calibre The gun calibre is the diameter of the bore mesured over the lands of the rifling (intervals between the grooves). The total length of the bore is the sum of the length of the powder chamber (wich has a greater diameter), the concordance cone lenght's and the rifled section's length.(There are smoothbore guns !). It is the total length of the bore wich is designated in calibres,not only the rifled section. Nuno Rubim Portugal -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Colin Ritchie Subject: Enterprise References Hi guys, As some of you will remember, my wife gifted me the Tamiya Enterprise for my Xmas, (no my wonderful wife is not available for hire!), I've been trying with no real success to track down a copy of the "Detail and Scale - Enterprise" on this side of the pond (UK), so have any of you got a copy you'd be willing to part with. Or do you know anywhere that might have one on the shelf, many thanks Colin Ritchie Aberdeen (Dull, overcast dry 7-9C, overlooking the airport as I am the sky is full of Tornado's and Nimrod's Yum...) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Dio Sol >> Use only Floquil's thinner, Dio-sol, for thinning any of the various Floquil lines of paint. This includes their older Xylene-based lacquers as well as the newer acrylic enamel formulations. Dio-sol works well with any of them. Dio-sol is expensive, so I use it only to thin paint. I use inexpensive lacquer thinner from the hardware store for cleaning chores. << I have used Dio Sol for years. The reason I like it so well is that it thins Lacquer and enamel based paint. I had no idea it would work equally well in Floquil's acrylic colors. The reason I never tried acrylic paint is having to keep two different thinners on my work bench. I guess their line of acrylics is lacquer based like auto acrylic paint. Now that I know this, I'll try them. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Floquil Marine colors on sale Apparently since Floquil has decided to discontinue their Marine colors line, Model Expo has put all Marine colors on sale. Check out their web site. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: Les Pickstock (Les Pickstock) Subject: Re: "Plink's" non-scale "free-runners" Hi Plink What you describe is usually known as a free-runner. There are many variations on this. If you'd care to e-mail me I'd be happy to send you some articles from old "model boat" magazines as well as some suggestions for fittings. Les Pickstock "I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full frontal Lobotomy" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Pletscher-Lenz-Schneider" Subject: German Catapult Ships (conclusion) SPERBER, BUSSARD and FALKE After the Lufthansa had gained good experience with flying boat operations from catapult ships, the Luftwaffe, too, ordered its first catapult ship, designated as SP-I, at H.C. Stulcken Sohn, Hamburg, in 1937. It was assigned to operate aircraft in shallow and narrow waters and was fitted with a Heinkel catapult. Aircraft could be stowed on rails abaft of this catapult and on a projecting part of the upper deck at the starboard quater. At the stern were the usual landing sail and a swing crane installed. On 26 Nov. 1938 it was commissioned as SPERBER (sparrow hawk). When war broke out, SPERBER was ordered from her station at Grossenbrode to Hornum/Sylt, just like the Lufthansa catapult ships WESTFALEN, SCHWABENLAND and FRIESENLAND. It soon became clear that the facilities of SPERBER could no longer meet the requirements of handling newer types of planes quick enough. So still in 1939, construction of a more capable catapult ship, the type SP-II was started. For the time being, four units were planned, scheduled to be ready one a year, starting from spring 1941. Yet the first two of them could not be ordered before 1940 at Schichau, Konigsberg, because the slipways had first to be cleared by the Kriegsmarine. These new ships were 40% larger than SPERBER. So they could mount a larger and more powerful Heinkel catapult. Crane and storing areas were coinciding with that of SPERBER, but the projection at the quaterdeck was no longer necessary because of their greater beam. The first ship, BUSSARD (buzzard), was commissioned on 1 May 1942 and the second, FALKE (hawk), followed on 22 Nov.1942. The last two ships were never laid down because of lack of yard capacities. BUSSARD differed from FALKE in that she was partly rivetted, while FALKE was completely welded. Both were stationed in the Skagerrak, resp. at the Norwegian west coast where the Lufthansa ships already served as bases for BV-138 planes. Launching them by catapult allowed to tank them fully up which increased their endurance from 6.5 to 18 hours and their range from 1250 km to 3900 km. It also made aircraft opearions independend from sea conditiones. From Feb 1945 SPERBER was stationed at Kopenhagen where she was also training pilots for catapult night operations. All three of the Luftwaffe's catapult ships survived the war in fully operational condition. FALKE became a Soviet prize, and there were rumors that she was renamed AERONAFT. More probably, however, she was rebuilt into a (nameless) tanker or salvage vessel. BUSSARD became a US prize and was later sold to Heyen, Gent. Until 1950 she lay at Antwerpen. In summer 1950 she was bought by Boele & Oosterwijk N.V., Rotterdam and rebuilt at N.V. Scheepswerven v/h Zn., Popendrecht into the suction dredge AHOY. As she still retained her crane, she also could be used as a salvage vessel. In a similar way SPERBER was used as a floating crane at Wilhelmshaven until at least Nov. 1949. Oddly enough, despite their seize and charakteristic appearance, their final fate is unknown. That's the story as I took it from the book of Jung/Wenzel/Abendroth, Die Schiffe und Boote der deutschen Seeflieger 1912-1976. For data and small plans, you should see the book of Groener, Die deutschen Kriegschiffe 1815-1945, Vol.7, pages 152-155. Falk Pletscher -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Dave Watts" Subject: Injection molded Liberty Ship? Does anyone know where I can purchase a plastic model of a Liberty Ship? I would prefer it to be 1/16"-1 scale or smaller. I saw somewhere that Skywave was coming out with one, but cannot find out anything more. Enjoying the beautiful spring weather on Cape Cod. Dave Watts -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Kurt Van Dahm Subject: Re: Paints Badger Air Brush Co. will have a Marine line of paints in the hobby shops sometime in February based on their Model Flex Acrylic paint line that has been very popular with the RR guys. The Floquil colors have all been covered by the new 56 color (initial offering) Model Flex Marine Paints, Badger line as well as several colors suitable for tug boats and other marine vessels. The Badger acrylic Model Flex paints are very nice to work with and they do not require primer (though it is still a good idea to always prime your surface) and their pigments are very finely ground for a scale like coverage. Also, all are a dead flat finish so no worry about reflectance reducer. Kurt Van Dahm Westmont, IL -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Re: RN destroyers As I recall, the black areas at the top of the masts (to conceal soot staining) were overpainted light grey so as to make them less conspicuous during the conflict. The paint either wore off or was indeed stained by exhaust fumes and by the time of the loss of Sheffield, the upper parts were already a slightly different shade of grey to the rest of the ship. As to the laser weapons, I remember reading that a device called the laser dazzle sight (LDS) was fitted on the bridge wings of those destroyers and frigates assigned for service with the Armilla Patrol in the middle east during the Iran-Iraq War, when it was felt preferable to use a non-lethal (well, not directly lethal) device for deterring close range attack. It is usually covered up when photographers are around. Some of the ships which had been in the Armilla Patrol were sent to the South Atlantic still with the LDS and I believe that at least one managed to splash an A-4 Skyhawk by blinding the pilot on final approach. Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: How to obtain any color in the universe Well, I'll have to throw this one at the gentleman at Dunn-Edwards Paint who is doing our color matching; he knows the trade. One possible thorn I can see, however, is that the printing trade uses inks rather than paints. Another possible thorn would be the need for absolute industry consistency--yesterday, today, and tomorrow--in the formulation of the yellow, cyan, and magenta tinting media in order that a formula concocted today yield the same results in the future; I'm not sure one can depend on that, but I'll ask my paint man. More later on the subject. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: Cruise Ship? I have someone building th S.S. Homeric anybody know where to find some info. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Torgeson Roger A Subject: 1/32 PT Boat photoetch Does anyone know if a company called Coastal Forces located in Bangor Maine is still in business? They had listed a 1/32 scale photoetch set for the Lindberg / Dumas PT boat kit I would like to have. I seem to remember Al Ross was involved with the company. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Kenneth H. Goldman" Subject: Re: Subject: German Catapult Ships (continued) This is better than an old-timne radio serial. Keep it coming. Thanks. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER http://www.wman.com/~khgold/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "Kenneth H. Goldman" Subject: Re: Subject: Re: helo hangers RN Regarding the previous two post on the topic of unofficial ship's vehicles, this seems to have been/to be more or less standard, though unofficial procedure. In 1943, my father's APA was about to sail from Oran when a French officer drove up in a jeep. He went into an administration building. The officers on deck looked at each other and came to a wordless agreement. The order was given to swing out the cargo boom, hoist the jeep aboard, and then get the hell out of there. They figured the jeep was made in America anyway, so they were just returning it home, so to speak. The jeep was repainted gray and served the ship well throughout the war. My father even got to drive it in San Francisco. To this day, he occasionally wonders if that French officer is still looking for his jeep. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER http://www.wman.com/~khgold/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: CHRIS DRAGE Subject: Re: Books Bill and others: Many thanks. I will get onto my local library to trawl it in and thus have preview it. Regards, Chris He tao rakau e taea te karo, tena he tao kupa kaore e taea te karo.... (Te reo Maori) (Sorry Shane - you'll have to research that one. There is a prize of ten modelling tips to whoever works out what it means...!) Note from Shane: If you reply to SMML, I'll post the reponses :-)) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "João Andrade Guerra" Subject: Naval Gunnery Fire Control Systems in WWI and WWII Hello SMML: Can someone sugest material (books, websites, ec) describing Naval Gunnery Fire Control Systems in WWI and WWII? We have extremely complete descriptions and analysis for guns and for the armour protecting ships but almost nothing regarding the way those guns were controled. What is the point of knowing all the weapons (and their performance) that were mounted in YAMATO, for example, and not knowing what was the probability of actually hiting a target? The battle of Samar seems to prove that big guns are not enough, you must hit the target with them! Even the simple list of the fire control directors (and their type) that equiped a certain ship is normally non-existant yet we know with detail all there is to know about the guns that were controlled by them. In ship kits the situation is the same with sometimes glaring errors in the size and position of those directors. The old Yamato/Musashi kit from Tamiya has 2 normal-sized Light High Angle Type 94 directors each side of the funnel but 2 miniature ones in the front of the bridge. As far as I can tell their size is just wrong. Perhaps it is my fault that I do not know where to look for this information but I sure hope someone in SMML-land can help me. I am basing my comments about Yamato on the Anatomy of the Ship book. Thanks in advance Joao Andrade Guerra Airfix Magazine did an excellant series on RN Directors in the 60/70s. Check out my index of magazine articles at ModelerAl's site at: http://www.up-link.net/~modeleral/ Shane ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 19) From: "arthur" Subject: Re: Ships's vehicles RN Standard ships vehicle in my day was a Mini Moke. Small, versitile, and could be man-handled at a push. I would not be surprised if this has not been extended to a Land Rover for ships big enough to carry them. Arthur NZBG Where we go from drought to flood in 3 quick days and the driveway shovel is in operation- no not for snow, but onions- millions of them. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Jeff Herne Subject: Status of Floquil Hi gang, This is an excerpt from our upcoming ship club newsletter, written by our President Nick Starace. "In view of the rumors and conjecture surrounding the current status of the Floquil paint line I thought I would try to clarify the situation. From what I’ve heard around the modeling community and talking directly with The Testor Corporation I have been able to determine the following facts. The Testor Corporation which is owned by the RPM Company, has marketing responsibility for all RPM’s art and craft products. If we look at miniature paint only, there are four Testor Corporation subsidiaries: Testors, Model Master, Pactra and more recently Floquil-Polly S Color Corporation. Floquil-Polly has not gone out of business! When Floquil became a part of the Testor family it was decided to restructure the Floquil line to better fit the synergy of the multi-product lines. As a result, two major changes were implemented. First the Marine Colors line of Floquil paint was discontinued. This was due to a lack of market activity and because there was significant color duplication with paints offered by the new sister companies. Underlying this was the industry trend away from oil-based paints to non-toxic acrylics. Secondly, the Flo-Stain line was dropped for similar reasons as above. As some of you know, preceding the takeover, the Polly S line had been eliminated in favor of the new upscale Polly Scale line. Therefore, any of the discontinued paint that you might find on hobby store shelves is merely residual stock that will not be replenished. So if there are colors that you might need to match on an existing model or one in progress, better get to your local shop for that last jar. All, however, is not lost. Chances are you will be able to find an equivalent color within the Testor family. For example, those of you involved with US Navy ship modeling may be disappointed to hear that the commonly used Haze Gray #818594 (5-H), previously of the Marine Color line, is no longer available. In checking with the manufacturer I was told that Model Master II French Dark Blue Gray #2105 is equivalent. I cannot attest to this from personal experience. Another example, the commonly used Anti-Fouling Red #818614 can be replaced by Polly Scale Italian Camo Brown 2, #505286. Hopefully it’s better than the Floquil Anti-Fouling Red which does not dry dead flat as an anti-fouling should." Hope that clears up the confusion... To those of us in the "Color Police", namely Special Agents Snyder & Short, the loss of Floquils Marine colors is no great loss, since their accuracy has at best marginal to begin with...Snyder & Short's research confirms this beyond a doubt. Jeff Herne Accurate Image Models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: Baker Subject: Falklands lasers For Mr. Eisenstadt in regard to his question about the use of lasers during the Falklands War: The device in question is called DEC and was intended only to dazzle a pilot's eyesight -- NOT to blind him nor to do any physical damage to the aircraft. It was quite low-powered and was simply pintle-mounted in the bridge area on both sides of the ships that were equipped with it. You can read about it in Norman Friedman's Naval Institute Guide to World Naval Weapons Systems. A.D. Baker, III, editor COMBAT FLEETS OF THE WORLD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: William Aldorfer Subject: Re: Gun Calibre As a general reference, I recommend "The Big Gun - Battleship Main Armament 1860-1945" by Peter Hodges (USNI, Annapolis 1981 ISBN 0-87021-917-0). The text is primarily dedicated to developmental and dimensional data but, for it's slim size, gives a reasonable overview of external and terminal ballistics. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: JVT7532@aol.com Subject: USS Oregon colors I'm getting ready now to paint some of my subassemblies on the Glenco Oregon that I'm building and I want to do it in the white buff scheme with red bottom, would like to use Floquil or Modelmaster line as I have most of their colors in my paint rack. Does anyone have an idea which paints will fill the bill? I will consider others if they are the right color though. And just what color is the bottom anyway? Deep red? Are the colors semi gloss or flat, some photos I have seen although in black and white show some sheen to the paint. Thanks for the help. Jon -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Mark Knowlton Subject: Re: IJN Haruna >> I just bought the 1/700 Hasegawa BB Haruna (kit No.111) and I discovered that according to the instructions sprue J is missing. As far as I can tell this sprue is just used in Haruna not the other ships in this class (Hiei, Kirishima and Kongo). Is there a problem with my kit or is this sprue missing in all the Haruna kits from Hasegawa? If this is the case I can always build the kit as the Kongo in 1944. << I have the Haruna both in waterline and the Special Full Hull Edition and they both have the J sprue. You might try contacting Marco Polo and see if they can get you a replacement. Mark Knowlton -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: "Michael Quan" Subject: Re: Skywave IJNS Oi Yunchi Hsaio wrote: >> I just got Skywave's 1/700 Oi. Nice kit, but there is a problem. The torpedo tubes are unshielded and I have no idea where Skywave gets their information. The model appears circa 1941 and I am assuming at this time almost all IJN ships had shielded deck mounted torpedo tubes. To compound matters, you have to buy Skywave detail sets to get the shielded tubes. Can any IJNophiles shed some light? << After some research of publications, it appears almost all sources depict the Oi (& sister ship Kitakami) with shielded quad torpedo tubes. However, it must be noted that many sources almost all differ in their depiction of details of these twin cruisers, be it in their aft deckhouse or bridge. The exception is the drawing of the Oi in Warships of the IJN, 1869-1945, by Jentschura, Jung & Mickel, page 107 which shows Oi with unshielded tubes, c. 1941. But don't worry Yunichi, Skywave's next release is of the Kitakami as a torpedo cruiser which I suspect will have the shielded tubes! Mike Quan Garland Texas (sunny and snowless!) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: Michael Connelley Subject: Re: Nichimo IJN Takao >> I just picked up two Takao class Nichimo kits. I know the molded on railings make it look bad, but the basic shape of the hull doesn' look right to my eye at least. If anybody has any experience with these I'd like to know. I know Skywave is going to do the Takao and Atago in 700th scale, and I'm sure they'll be great. << Hello: I have the 1/500 Nagato kit and the hull isn't right either. I have the Monograph Morskie book as a referece, and it seems that the bow is too high from the waterline, the bow is too wide around #1 turret and curves too much towards the bow (it should be straighter). The beam is also too small and the stern is much too narrow. The molded in railings look tacky, and the deck details are all wrong. Perhaps this gives you a place to start looking as to where your hull has gone astray. On the Nagato there are several things which make the hull look very "wrong". Cheers Mike Connelley -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: CBNJBB62@aol.com Subject: Re: Falklands colours Dear Mike: I am not a RN veteran of the Falklands war but I a few books on it. I have the Leo Marroit book as well as the two books on the Type 21 and 22 frigates. The impression I have is that the RN repainted it's ships light gray to reduce visibility but since they use macks for gas turbine engines they release hot gaseous exhausts they probably paint them black to conceal burn marks from the heat releases. A LSAT photo from the book OSPREY-MEN AT ARMS SERIES. 134-Naval forces has a few color photos of the conflict and the smoke stack is similar on the LST. Sincerely Craig Bennett -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 28) From: CBNJBB62@aol.com Subject: Military technology secrets!! Hey Guys An interesting question has been brought up indirectly about military technology. A person asked a question about laser technology. We should be careful as what were asking as it may reveal something that isn't normally made available. Take a look at the IPMS (USA) constitution they specifically look out to be sure nothing is printed to endanger national security. I'm not a worrier but because of Monica Lewisky anyone's email can be read by any one on the web if their good enough at operating a computer. CYA. Why not stick to just published public information. Well, that's my two cents. Craig Bennett -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: JAY1476976@aol.com Subject: Wanted to buy I am seriously interested in buying several glass encased 36 -40 inch truely museum quality wood and metal ship builder models of 1930 - 40 era freighter or cargo vessels. They must be reasonably priced. If you can provide please contact me at above E-Mail giving full details. Thanks....Jim -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: John Snyder Subject: USN Set 2 paint chips USN Set 2 is ready to ship. 30 chips covering the greens and browns used by the amphibious and PT forces, the 1945 neutral grays, plus Mountbatten Pink Dark, and pre-war mahogany flight deck stain: Prewar: Mahogany Flight Deck Stain 1942: Mountbatten Pink Dark; Browns 1A, 2A, 3A, 4A; Greens 1A, 2A, 3A, 4A 1943 (early greens): Haze Green 5-HG; Ocean Green 5-OG; Navy Green 5-NG; Deck Green 20-G 1943 (revised greens): Pale Green 5-PG; Light Green 5-LG; Haze Green 5-HG; Ocean Green 5-OG; Navy Green 5-NG [the revised greens are more olive than the early greens, and continued to use Deck Green] 1944: #1 Green; #2 Green; #3 Green; #4 Brown 1944-5: %46 Outside Gray (neutral Pale Gray); #37 Outside Gray (neutral Light Gray); #27 Haze Gray 5-H; #17 Ocean Gray; #11 Outside Gray (used on subs); #7 Navy Gray 5-N; #4 Deck Gray 20 USD $22 + $1.50 postage. Dealer inquiries welcome. As always, we highly recommend reference to Alan Raven's series in Plastic Ship Modeler for clarification on the development and use of these colors during WW2. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys (Now to get those IJN chips painted up....) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Graham Holmes" Subject: Quartermaster Models Further to my post the other day, I wish to correct the list of models that Quatermaster has available. In my eagerness to let you all know, I mistook 'in preparation' for 'ready'. The only models that Bob has ready are the 1/48 scale 5"/38Cal single turrets in both single and double knuckle configurations. The 40mm guns are about half complete, and as you are all aware, they are complex items that will take a while yet. Apologies for the confusion. Graham Holmes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: James Corley Subject: Re: Nautilus Models >> After looking at your product line, I thought, why doesn't Nautilus Models produce an upgrade set for the 1/700 scale Hasegawa Essex class carriers (based on the old article by Larry Gertner in IPMS Journal)? I bet there would be a lot of demand for such a product! What do you say?!<< I thought it would be more helpful to modify the kits that look less like the actual ship first! We have considered the Waveline series, but are trying to stay bigger for the most part for now. Maybe next year. JZ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume