Subject: SMML03/02/99VOL445 Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 12:28:00 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Top Secret! 2: Re: Ensign series 3: Re: MTB/MGB/PT/Schnellboat kits 4: USS Enterprise with Spruance 5: Re: HMAS CANBERRA 6: Re: Spare gun tubs 7: Re: Ensign 8: Re: Scratchbuilt 1/2400 9: Otaki QE2 10: 1/700 modern USN rumors? 11: Re: "Flowers of Norway" 12: Re: 1:1200 parts 13: Re: WW1 Subchaser 14: What type of glue to use? 15: Re: Constitution 16: Re: V-108 17: Re: Shinano 18: Re: RN Undubitable paint formula 19: DKM GRAF ZEPPELIN 20: The Classic models HMS Lion 21: Distinguishing between Rodney & Nelson 22: Re: Revell's Constitution & IJN Destroyers 23: Re: Hobby shops in Australia -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Re: Norwegian Flower Class corvettes 2: WTB 1/600 propellers 3: Lindberg Hood for Sale! 4: Re: Scratch-built 1:1200 parts; availability of -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: NEFFD@dteenergy.com Subject: Top Secret! John Lamontagne wrote: >> I don't want to add to the conflagration over Secret subjects, but... during the Falklands war, the Brits took an ex-American submarine (I think it was the USS Stench) << No, it was the "Acrid" (her sister sub). >> and fitted it out with an amazing new weapon that allowed them to immobolize part of the Argentine Navy. This was the Supercooled Nitrogen Applicator Probe (SNAP). It consisted of a side-mounted periscope which, when extended, allowed the sub to sneak up on an enemy vessel and squirt frozen water at the enemy's propellers, thus making it impossible for it to make any headway and sometimes freezing the enemy ship to the jetty. The sub which was fitted with the SNAP nearly fell into enemy hands when the weapon backfired,... << That failure was no surprise to those of us who drove British Sports cars in our youth. The Lucas electrical systems in those cars failed often and regularly leaving us stranded. The SNAP was built by Lucas using an MGA engine reconfigured as a high volume freon compressor for the SNAP system. Once the Lucas electric failed the sub was in danger. (British Sports Car Joke: Q. Why do the British drink warm beer? A. They have Lucas refrigerators) >> but they were able to sneak out of Buenos Aires as a small iceberg and lie low as part of the pack ice further South. The RN submarine was the Undubitable.. << That is correct without a doubt or question. >> and she was painted bile green. << More commonly called Lettuce Green because of the refrigerator equipment >> I have a formula and paint chips for this colour. << Do you have the correct colour chip for the escape iceberg too? I don't have that chip. >> The SNAP can be easily manufactured in model form with a junked refrigerator. << Lucas. It must be Lucas to authentic. Don Neff Novi, MI, USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Torgeson Roger A Subject: Re: Ensign series Malcolm, Ensign # 5 is on the Town Class Cruisers and # 7 is Hood. Yes it's way past time that this series is released again. It's really too bad that in the English speaking world so few books like the Ensign, Man O War, and Leeward series are available. I guess I will have to take up learning to read a second language, now which one, Polish, Russian or Japanese. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Kevin Wenker Subject: Re: MTB/MGB/PT/Schnellboat kits >> Ever seen anyone scratch build in 1:2400? I have a 1:2400 greek Salamis BB that Joe built, looks like a professional job. << I've done quite a bit of scratchbuilding in 1:2400. All modern. About 25 subs and 5 ships. The subs are relatively easy using epoxy putty for the hull. The ships' hulls are done with epoxy putty and the superstructure with shaped styrene. The little fiddly bits (Phalanx, Harpoon launchers, etc) are not scratchbuilt - I usually liberate them from a GHQ kit. I do a lot of wargaming with moderns and in 1:2400, once you get past the Russians and US and Brits, the selection is limited. Especially for minor countries. About the hardest thing with scratchbuilding in this scale is getting started and being willing to make a mistake (if you do, just paint it, put some cotton smoke on it and use it for damage markers :) Kevin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Jens H. Brandal" Subject: USS Enterprise with Spruance Hi folks, I have been thinking about a project which will most likely take me a year to finish (at least), but hope will be able to finish for next years IPMS Norway Nationals: A diorama featuring the Tamiya CVN-65 with a Spruance class escort. Now question is; as I intend to build the CVN-65 as she was fitted out in the kit (early eighties) with the A-7s, would the Spruance DD963 then be escorting the Enterprise? Or any other ship of that class? I know I could fake it, and I can do whatever I please, but it would be nice to know. Also, the Shanghai Dragon kit of the Spruance does not include an ASROC launcher - only the Vertical Launch System immediately forward of the superstructure. The decal sheet contains names and numbers for Elliott, Spruance, Peterson and Ingersoll - would the mentioned weapons system configuration be correct for any of these at the time? Failing that, where can I find a spare ASROC launcher? Thanks for any help - I won't ask for volunteers to help paint those planes :) Jens -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: HMAS CANBERRA >> HMAS Canberra was a county class cruiser & was a RAN ship. She was sunk in the battle of Savo Island. << Actually, to be quite accurate, she was (as I'm sure Shane knows) heavily damaged and finally sunk the following morning by torpedos from the destroyer USS ELLETT, when it was feared that her fires couldn't be brought under control in time for her to withdraw with the rest of the Allied landing force and what was left of the covering force. Actually, USS SELFRIDGE (DD-357) [aboard which my uncle was serving] was ordered to sink her, but the torpedos she launched either failed to hit (a stationary target!) or failed to explode (I've read her War Diary and Deck Logs), so ELLETT was ordered to finish the job. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys Hi John, Yes you are right, just didn't want to bore people :->>. I can also recommend the "Lost Ships of Guadelcanal" (video or book) by Robert Ballard, for those who would like some ideas for dioramas ;-). It's a bit light, but has some amazing pictures. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: tom Subject: RE: Spare gun tubs >> Does anyone have four quad 40mm gun tubs they would be willing to part with? They come on a number of Skywave USN sprues. I don't need the guns nor the shields, just the round tubs. Willing to pay postage plus small fee if necessary. << Yohan: One thing I have done with the overly thickwalled and out of scale gun tubs is replace them with much thinner circles cut from drinking straws. Every time I eat out I keep my eyes open for a different diameter straw, I have maybe 6 or 8 in my toolbox ranging from little stirrers perfect for 40 mm gun directors to big "malt" straws appropriate for 5 inch guns. They can be left round or you can cut out half or 3/4 circles if the gun tub needs an opening... also I have used short curved sections in replacing solid railing... much easier than trying to bend evergreen strip. Best regards, Tom Kremer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: Re: Ensign Hi Malcolm >> This survey left me with the following questions. I have Ensigns 1 2 3 4 6 & 8 , what are the missing volumes content? Possible R-class BB's and Town class CL's! << Number 5 is Town Class Cruisers >> I have Man o' Wars 1 to 7 is this all that were produced? << Number 7 was never printed. Number 5 is getting a little scarce... I saw a mint copy recently going for 50.00 pounds!! Cheers! Caroline Carter White Ensign Models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: Bob Pearson Subject: Re: Scratchbuilt 1/2400 Chuck Duggie writes . . . >> Anyone else here scratch build in 1:1200. My ships are mainly wood with brass and plastic parts, including vacuformed turrets. I built about 1/3 of this club project. Joe Struck and others built the rest. Ever seen anyone scratch build in 1:2400? << Now that you mention it yes .... between 10-15 years ago I scratchbuilt most of the major combatants from WW1, WW2 (my carriers even have aircraft) as well as many modern ships in 1/2400 scale. Easier to do was the entire RCN circa 1980 - not so many ships :-). For building a class of ship I found it worked best to do them as an assembly line type of thing. I used balsa wood, plastic, guitar strings. .. actually anything that I could find. Hmmm, perhaps I have found my first ship article for Internet Modeler . . . now if I can only figure out that camera :-) Has anyone thought about trying to have a naval wargame via ICQ? Regards, Bob Pearson Managing Editor / Internet Modeler http://www.internetmodeler.com/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Mark Seitz Subject: Otaki QE2 Hi folks, I have an opportunity to pick up a QE2 in 1/350 by OTAKI. Does anyone know anything about this kit? Is the scale correct, kit accurate, good fit...you know, the usual lowdown. Also, are they still available retail? Thanks in advance, Mark Seitz -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Les Dorr Jr." Subject: 1/700 modern USN rumors? I see that next issue of Fine Scale Modeler will have their annual new kit list. Has anyone heard any rumors about modern US Navy ships in 1/700, preferably in plastic? Les "Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Tom Dean Subject: Re: "Flowers of Norway" Six of the Flowers were transfered to the Royal Norwegian Navy HMS ACANTHUS K01 - Became RNN ANDENES (1941) survived the war HMS BUTTERCUP K193 - Bcame RNN NORDKYN (1942) survived the war HMS EGLANTINE K197 - Became RNN SOROY (1941) survived the war HMS MONTBRETIA K208 - Bacame RNN MONTBRETIA (1941) torpedoed by U-624 18/11/42 HMS POTENTILLA K214 - Became RNN POTENTILLA (1942) Survived the war HMS ROSE K102 - Became RNN ROSE (1941) Lost in collision with tha frigate Manners North Atlantic 26/10/44 POST WAR - HMS BRYONY Became RNN POLARFRONT II in 1946 HMS SAXIFRAGE became RNN POLARFRONT I in 1947 ** Just as a point of interest, many of the Corvettes were bought up by Norwegian interest at wars end for mercantile use. In many case they were used for whaling, back to their roots so to speak! As to what kit you want to buy to make one of the above, you will have to see which ones best suit conversions and or improvedment if any that were made to these ships and go from there. Unfortunately I do not have any information on these ships refits. Hope this helps a bit. Tom Dean Hamilton, Ontario Canada -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Malcolm Waite Subject: Re: 1:1200 parts Alnavco does a limited range of 1:1200th parts, you can e-mail on alnavco@esva.net. Malcolm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: jpoutre@lehman.com (Joseph Poutre) Subject: Re: WW1 Subchaser A few questions about the Glencoe Subchaser model: 1. Is it still in production? 2. How well does it go together? 3. How accurate is it? Thanks, Joe Joseph Poutre, aka The Mad Mathematician Co-Webmaster, Battleship New Jersey Historical Museum Society http://www.bb62museum.org/ Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Dave Watts" Subject: What type of glue to use? I have just received my first resin model, a Liberty ship from Tom's Model Works. I have always worked in wood or plastic before, so I am not sure what type or brand of glue to use. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Dave Watts (On cold and rainy Cape Cod) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: Dave Judy Subject: Re: Constitution Roger, The scale is 1/96, I have the kit, and it says on the box that I have! Dave Judy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: PulligS@aol.com Subject: Re: V-108 For Christmas we got a new printer and we got the HP-722C. It is supposed to be able to print on up to 100lb paper. I picked it with this paper model in mind. Has anyone printed out this model yet? Any problems with memory capacity etc.? Sam Pullig -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: Shinano I don't believe Capt. Enright had much of an opportunity to observe anything on deck. Recall that the approach was rapid, and Archerfish had to work in carefully. Most of the pursuit was at long distance, and it was unclear until after the war exactly what the Archerfish had sunk! Enright was convinced it was a carrier, but until JANAC, its' identity was unclear. I tried to do some simple research on Shinano a while back, and even the paint job is difficult (well, impossible) to nail down. The ship was built in secret (few photos!) and what pictures exist are B&W. I doubt that much was on her deck, as she was moved quickly to avoid the B-29 raids. Too bad, as it does make for a somewhat boring presentation.... Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: JGordon262@aol.com Subject: Re: RN Undubitable paint formula John Lamontagne wrote: >> The RN submarine was the Undubitable and she was painted bile green. I have a formula and paint chips for this colour. << Many have found the bile green colour notoriously hard to replicate. When the correct shade is mixed, the modeler should begin to feel nauseous. I have achieved nausea through this formula: RN Bile Green: 53 parts green, 27 parts yellow, 18 parts white, 12 parts black, 9 parts red, 9 parts blue, and last but not least, 2 teaspoons cornstarch for the proper consistency. JG -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: "Paul O'Reilly" Subject: DKM GRAF ZEPPELIN I'm building the Revell 1/720 Graf Zeppelin with the kit directions, the book "Sea Eagles" (about the Me109T) and the Schiffer book as references. I have 3 questions. The first is on the color of the flight deck. The box art shows the flight deck to be brown, much like the pre-WW II US carrier decks, but the photos on the box side show a light blue-grey color. Which is correct, if there is indeed a "correct" colour for a ship that was never completed? Second Qestion. The Zeppelin used a catapult system system for launching aircraft. The box side photo depicts the catapult cradle with a Me109 mounted on it in a precariously steep nose-up attitude. I seriously doubt if such a launching attitude would have worked. Does anyone have any knowledge how the system was supposed to have worked? I seem to recall a photo depicting test catapult launching of Me109s from a shore station and the aircraft was in a much flatter attitude and had its gear up on launch. I wish I had that photo now. Third Question. The model indicates the Me109T with wings folded upward. The book "Sea Eagles" states the Me109T did not have folding wings. I presume, though, that the aircraft would eventually have acquired folding wings had the Graf Zeppelin become operational. Is anyone aware of a proposed wing-fold system for the Me109? The Ju87C had folding wings (aft along the fuselage). It's 10 degrees C (about 50 deg F) in Victoria, BC with rain. I don't want to say we get a lot of rain here, but I just let the cat in and she had a live sea bass in her mouth! Paul O'Reilly -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Lee Francis Wilhelmsen Subject: The Classic models HMS Lion I'm reading about Jutland and so I came across the 1/700 Classic models HMS Lion which interested me. I was just wondering if the model is any good. I couldn't find any reviews... Since I'm new to resin would this be a good choice? Best regards Lee Francis Wilhelmsen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: Lee Francis Wilhelmsen Subject: Distinguishing between Rodney & Nelson Hi I recently purchased the book "Jane's Naval history of WWII" by "Bernard Ireland" and couldn't help but notice a few things. First of, it's a good looking book - price is a little excessive, but the contents is good (a few colour photos which I found interesting). There are however a lot of silly errors (I haven't read it yet, but have noticed the errors) such as "The Prince of Wales was sent to Singapore with the old battlecruiser Prince of Wales ..." (page 187) and the following topic of which I am about to address. The author has a tendancy to refer to HMS Nelson as HMS Rodney. I thought I could distinguish the two by the main mast where Rodney's is a lot taller and thinner. Did Rodney have her mast changed at any time or is the book wrong? (Refer to pages 138, 243) Any help would be appreciated Best regards Lee Francis Wilhelmesen Stavanger, Norway -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: "Charles Wegman" Subject: Re: Revell's Constitution & IJN Destroyers >> Tonight, I just picked up the Revell USS Constitution "Old Ironsides" kit. Nose to tail, it is the same length as my Heller Victory @ 1:100, but the Revell detail seems bigger the Heller's. The crew figures almost seem like HO railroad scale. So, it must be bigger than 1:100. Have any of you figured out this one already? << As far as I know (which isn't that much) It's 1/96th, give or take a couple of points. Mine has nested on top of my Le Soliel Royal kit and the boxes complement each other and the overall decor of my "office". My decor theme you ask? Early Spanish model warehouse. Which brings me to a question. What, in your esteemed opinions, are the best references for IJN Destroyers? I've collected approximately 2/3rds of the commercially available 1/700 IJN kits and figure it's time to start floating some "Long Lancers" before I'm unable to walk into my room. Also, who does the best (i.e. most comprehensive and clean) P.E. kits for them? Thanks Shane for taking the time to do this. You're doing a lot of people a lot of good. Chuck Wegman Interplanetary Death Squad Supervisor No. 34 This message composed using 100% recycled electrons. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: "Myhrman" Subject: Re: Hobby shops in Australia >>Are there any Hobby Shop by Internet in Australia? I know only one: NKR Models (http://www.ballarat.net.au/nkrmodel/nkrhome.htm), but it has a few ships in its catalog. << Hello! I stumbled on a 250 page catalouge from a mail order company called Hobbyco during a visit to Brisbane a while ago. The "book" covers most things of what usaly goes under the name "hobby" and also has a selection of all kinds of ship models, from plastic to RC and even 1/1250 scale. I have no information or experience of Hobbyco but they are on-line in the sense that they have an e-mail address, hobbyco@ozemail.com.au Could be worth a try. Best Regards Johan Myhrman Yokohama, cold with some snow in the air -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: Re: Norwegian Flower Class corvettes Hi Kyrre Interesting enquiry... as anybody in the know knows, there is no such thing as a generic, so heavy conversions aplenty if you did opt for 1/350 or 1/72 Scale. However, the Six Norwegian Flowers were as follows (there was also a Castle Class frigate as well..): HMS Buttercup (minesweeper) renamed RNN Nordkyn in 1944 Buttercup was awarded the battle honours Normandy 1944 and Atlantic 1942-1945. HMS Eglantine renamed Soroy HMS Acanthus renamed Andenes HMS Montbretia (sunk in 1942) HMS Rose sunk in collision 1944 HMS Potentilla If you fancy a conversion, John Lambert at Lamkeel@email.msn.com has a load of beautifully detailed plans/drawings. Re readily available kits, yes, we at White Ensign Models have HMS Buttercup in 1/700 Scale, priced 15.38 pounds, post free worldwide, which can be built as either a full or waterline hull variant. It has a large etched brass fret. If you would like to take a look at the kit, click below: http://whiteensignmodels.simplenet.com/butter/butter.htm This ship is about as different from Bluebell, our first Flower class, as it is possible to get, by the way. I am sure that John is able to fill you in on the other 5 flowers if you require. Cheers! Caroline and Dave Carter WEM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Les Case" Subject: WTB 1/600 propellers In order to finish Revell's 1/600ish S.S.United States as a full-hull model, I need two 1/600, 4-bladed props and two 1/600 5-bladed props. Does anyone have some unused 1/600 propellers they are willing to trade or sell? Les Case -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: AllenFW2@aol.com Subject: Lindberg Hood for Sale! I know of someone who would like to sell an unbuilt Lindberg Hood kit. For those of you unfamiliar with the kit, it was a motorized kit from the 1960's. I've got photos of the actual kit posted in the Scale Modeling section of my web site at http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Workshop/2966/Models/Lindberg.html It appears to have all pieces and is in very good shape. If anyone is interested, please e-mail David Gilbert at dbgilbert@yahoo.com Frank Allen "Battlecruiser Hood- The HMS Hood On-line Resource" http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Workshop/2966/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: JohnVCP@aol.com Subject: Re: Scratch-built 1:1200 parts; availability of I am a source for cast metal 1:1200 scale "parts" - such as main, secondary & tertiary batteries (including open 5" mounts), ship's boats, cranes (including some 'goal post' types for merchant ships) and catapults. I can "cover" most ships of most of the major navies that were involved in WW2. ALNAVCO did sell 1:1200 "parts" - primarily 40 mm mounts (quads), TT tubes and aircraft. If memory serves me (at my ages it isn't doing too well!!) they also sold USN 5"/38 mounts - both single and twin. The 5" single mounts were, I think, of a postwar type. I also scratch build in this scale and have been for many years. Regards, John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume