Subject: SMML14/02/99VOL456 Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 23:57:52 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: USCG Flower Class Corvettes? 2: Re: Bits for a ship 3: Re: Hobby shops in Paris 4: Re: RODNEY'S 1944 fit 5: Re: IJN linoleum decks 6: Re: HMS Rodney 1944 7: Re: Gneisenau radars 8: Re: White Stuff Again? 9: Books on HMS Suffolk 10: Re Gneisenau Radars 11: Re: Representative ships 12: Re: Bits for a ship 13: USS Enterprise 14: Attaching resin models to a base 15: HMS Belfast 16: Re: HMS Rodney 1944 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: NVTC episodes.. apologies to the group for a long post 2: Snyder and Short Paint Chips/WR Press announcement 3: Re: Aircraft details for Super carrier kits 4: Chapelle's History of the American Sailing Navy Book offer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: James Corley Subject: Re: USCG Flower Class Corvettes? >> I've looked in my copy of "US Coast Guard Cutters and Craft of WW2", and it just lists the names and hull numbers of USN ships that were manned by USCG crews-- it doesn't give any info as to what type of vessel it was. For example, USCG crews were on the following ships: Haste (PG92), Intensity (PG 93), Might (PG 94), and Pert (PG 95). I don't have any reference books that would tell me what type/class of vessel these PGs were. Can anyone help me out? << According to the Victory edition of Ships & Aircraft, these four vessels were Candian-built Flower class corvettes. There were 25 listed, 10 of which came from the UK and 6 new ones were sold to the UK. The photo shows FURY (PG69) and notes her "fat stack" which I'm not sure it is a reference to fatter than normal for USN or FLOWERS (looks normal to me) These ships were fitted with one 4"/50 fwd and 3"/50 aft, no mention is made of DC and the photo is not clear as to whether or not they are there. I could not find any reference to the RN names listed in today's SMML, tho. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: James Corley Subject: Re: Bits for a ship >> I am trying to source enhancement kit(s) for the 1:72 scale Flower class corvette produced by Revell/Matchbox. Could you point me in the right direction please if these still exist. << Try HR Products at http://www.msn.fullfeed.com/~hracct/ He has an extensive line of 1/72 (66 items!), many of which I plan on using on my FLOWER. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Nowfel Leulliot Subject: Re: Hobby shops in Paris >> I am in Paris and will be here for a few days. Can someone recomend good hobby shops here ? In particular 1/700 and 1/1250 ships. I would also like to go to a good nautical bookshop, sugestions ?<< Hello, First a note on 1/700 models : you'll find mainly Tamiya and Revell models in the shops listed below, along with some Airfix 1/600 and the ubiquitous 1/400 Heller models. Here are a couple of addresses with some comments (if any French subscribers have more addresses, I'm interested too) : EOL' (1/700 models) 70, boulevard Saint-Germain 75005 PARIS Phone : 01 43 54 01 43 Metro : Maubert-Mutualite (closest) or Cluny The shop is very easy to find (actually there are three next to other: R/C models, die-cast and plastic models) and has large stocks of plastic kits although the ship models are under-represented. They stock the usual 1/700 plastic ranges. Prices can be a little expensive (with the odd bargain once a century) and the staff sometimes behave as if they were running a Polish food store in 1981. Central Train (1/700 models) 81, rue de Reaumur 75002 PARIS Phone : 01 42 36 70 37 Metro : Sentier or Reaumur-Sebastopol This shop is easy to find also. Although they concentrate on trains, they have large-scale naval models and some 1/700 plastic kits right at the back of the shop. Prices tend to be reasonable and the staff is relatively friendly. Fernac (1/700 models) 17, rue de Maintenotte 75017 PARIS Metro : Etoile Another easy to find shop. Again, also concentrate on trains but have quite a few 1/700 models (mainly Revell). Prices are variable : you can find some things at good prices while others are expensive. They also do mail order and their stocks are often renewed so it's probably worth a visit. Librairie du Musee de la Marine (1/1250 models and books) Palais de Chaillot 17, place du Trocadero 75016 PARIS Open daily _except_ Tuesdays from 10h to 18h Metro : Trocadero This is located at the entrance of the Naval Museum (in the right wing of the Palais de Chaillot when you are facing the Eiffel tower). A very good naval bookshop with good prices (proceeds go to the museum so that's two good reasons to buy from them). Apart from the books, they have a large selection of photographs and postcards. Also worth checking out are sets of affordable plans made by the Friends of the Naval Museum Association, these are usually relatively large (1/100 to 1/200) and cover some of the ship models on display in the museum itself. They also sell a large range of 1/1200 metal models (the only place in Paris that does, to my knowledge). Very much recommended. You can always visit the museum while you're there if you have the time. Librairie Maritime et D'Outre Mer (books) 17, rue Jacob 75006 PARIS Phone : 01 46 33 47 48 Metro : Odeon Not very easy to find (it's in a little side street). This has a large selection of naval books although the prices of imported books tend to be very high, up to 30% more than the Naval Museum bookstore in some cases (note that the price of French books is fixed so you'll find pretty much the same, within 5%, everywhere). Definitely a second choice after the Naval Museum bookstore. Contact me directly if you need more information. Nowfel Leulliot -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: RODNEY'S 1944 fit Well, I haven't done any exhaustive sleuthing, but Raven and Roberts' Man o' War 3: Battleships RODNEY and NELSON_ give her AA fit as forty-four 2-pdr pom-poms (5 x 8, 1 x 4), fifty-six single 20mm Oerlikons, and ten twin 20mm Oerlikons (5 x 2). I wont begin to hazard a guess at to placement of the 20mms. I'll keep checking other sources. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: IJN linoleum decks Check all available references, and be careful of assumptions regarding removal. Remember that by '44 the IJN could ill afford much shipyard time for its vessels. AOBA was among those supposed to have had her linoleum decking removed, yet a much-reproduced postwar photo taken aboard her looking forward along the foc'sl clearly shows that it was still in place. Of course if you need to know the linoleum color, our IJN paint chip set has it.... John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Re: HMS Rodney 1944 Hi Chris The Man of War book on the class lists mods carried out during the war years and contains a decent selection of photos and colour schemes as well as plans of all the superstructure levels. Unfortunately the plans are undated. I have a copy of an article from the UK IPMS magazine by Richard Farrar on turning the Tamiya kit (he says the Nelson is a better starting point than the Rodney as it is a later fit - Tamiya's Rodney is late 1930s) into Rodney 1944. I also have a Tamiya Nelson instruction leaflet which has been annotated by some kind soul with the modifications necessary, although he may well have used the same source. Peter Hodges wrote an article about turning the Airfix Nelson into a 1944 Rodney in an old Airfix magazine annual (No.5). Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Re: Gneisenau radars Warship No. 21 had a useful article on this subject by Erwin Sieche. To summarise, Gneisenau was fitted with a FuMO 22 in an additional tower above the 10.5m rangefinder tower in 11/39. This used a 2x6m antenna on the front of the tower. While in Brest in mid 1941, a FuMO 27 was added to the after rangefinder tower and a passive Palau antenna was probably added on a small frame to the back of the rangefinder tower prior to the 1942 'Channel Dash'. It is probable that there would also have been passive Sumatra antennae on the screen around the foretop platform, although they do not appear on photographs. The small FuMB 3 Bali was probably also carried, with the antenna on a yardarm or atop the foremast. The article contains some small scale (about 10m to 1 inch) plans of the tower tops showing the antennae. Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: ModelerAl@aol.com Subject: Re: White Stuff Again? Greg wrote: >> I have just been doing some rigging, and have been using an accelerator with some zap to speed things up a bit. As we all know, it leaves behind a white powdery substance. I have tried rubbing alcohol to try and move it, but have not had much luck. Anybody got any tips for me? << Try brushing some Future floor polish (Oz equivalent: Super Stride?) on the frosted areas - that should clear them up. Go back over with your preferred clear flat after the touch-ups are thoroughly cured. HTH, Al -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: boris_p@netvision.net.il Subject: Books on HMS Suffolk Thanks to Robert Lockie for his detailed reply on my question! Now, does anybody have the Airfix magazines (Oct 1977 and Jun 1978)? I am in need of the articles on County class and Suffolk. Also, does anybody have the Man O'War book no. 1 on County class? Daniel -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Al Imler Subject: Re Gneisenau Radars The Gneisenau's radars were: FuMO 26 or 27 on the forward control tower atop the rangefinder and a FuMO 27 atop the aft rangefinder (aft of the hanger). I have the Heller Gneisenau but I have not yet checked to see what year it reprsents her. If it is pre-41 there would be no radar atop the aft director from the information I have. Regards Al Imler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Erwin Van Deynze Subject: Re: Representative ships Well, I really woudn't know for the other navies, but one ship that isn't mentioned before, and wich I really would like to see in the list is for the UK a Black Swan sloop, especially the HMS Starling. After all she was Capt. Walker's ship on wich he defined and perfected his anti-sub tactics. Wienne -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Erwin Van Deynze Subject: Re: Bits for a ship >> I am trying to source enhancement kit(s) for the 1:72 scale Flower class corvette produced by Revell/Matchbox. Could you point me in the right direction please if these still exist. << We have been over the detail kits for the 1/72 flower a couple times before (I think this must be one for a FAQ, Shane...). There are some rumours about a PE-set, presumably from Flightpath, I've mailed them before on the subject, but haven't got any answer, so... I have bought some resin sets from Sirmar, but as I stated in earlier postings, they aren't that good, mold misalignement, bubbles and generally worn out molds make this one an second choice at best, and they are expensive !!! I am not aware of any other sets on the market, maybe Task Force 72 has some generic fittings which can be of help ? I reverted to the good old method of scratchbuilding most of the details myself, I am afraid though it will turn out to be a twenty year plan... but with the anatomy book (I know, Aggassiz is a short forecastle flower...) and maybe some of John Lambert's plans, something might come out of it... Erwin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: McKellar Subject: USS Enterprise Hi all, I'm at the point where I have to start thinking about how to paint the flight deck on my Enterprise. Any tips or suggestions? Mark -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Kenneth H. Goldman" Subject: Attaching resin models to a base In answer to Aaron Propper's question about attaching his 1:359 resin Arizona to a dowel on an ash base, here's an effective method: drill completely through the dowel, the lower hull, and the wood base so that a bolt will just slip through. Countersink under the wood base for the bolt head. Cut out a depression around the hole on the top of the lower hull section that will accomodate a nut that fits the bolt and super glue the nut in place over the bolt hole. If the hull half is too thin, make half of the hole for the nut in the top of the lower hull section and half in the bottom of the upper hull. Cut the bolt so that its end is flush with the top of the nut when the whole is screwed together, then take it apart and glue the hull together. After completing the model, you can simply and securely bolt it to the base. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER http://www.wman.com/~khgold/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Henrik Mortensen" Subject: HMS Belfast Hello my onknown friend I am from Denmark, and last year I was in London with my son on 6 years. We visited the battleship HMS BELFAST, and he was very pleased to see it. At his seven years birthday, I bought the ship as a model from Airfix, but there was no instruchtions at all in the box, so we can not build it! I hope you can help us! With friendly greetings Henrik Mortensen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: Shane Subject: Re: HMS Rodney 1944 Hi Chris, I have several battleship books, including R.A Burts "British battleships 1919-1939 (see I got the title right this time :-) ). Alas, I haven't had time to look up details, but a quick glance thru Burt's book does show some drawings of changes to Rodney & Nelson, but no specific drawings for Rodney in 1944, only for Nelson. I'll have another look & see what I can find. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: NVTC episodes.. apologies to the group for a long post Hi Guys, Someone (a SMMLlie in fact... you probably know who you are!) ordered a batch of Naval Video Time Capsule videos a couple of months back... however, they then never sent their card details and I have given up waiting.. the reason I am posting this is that they are NTSC formatted (i.e. North American format) which we only acquire when ordered by someone, are not regular stock and usually one has to wait around a month for them to arrive here. So... we have Episode numbers: ( Note from Shane: Seeing as most new VCRs now have PAL & NTSC(never the same colour twice), these videos may not be restricted to buyers in the USA alone. Just make sure you've also got a TV that can also read NTSC.) 4 Part 4 Colour Camera at Sea. Entire programme comprises of rare coloured film taken privately in wartime by two officers from the decks of HMS NELSON and HMS KENT, plus the iIl-fated destroyers HMS IVANHOE and HMS LAFOREY. Spanning from Home waters to the Far East, Narvik tothe Atlantic and Mediterranean convoy battles, with the only surviving film of the loss of HMS ARK ROYAL and HMS EAGLE, including the rescue of the EAGLE survivors by the HMS LAFOREY and HMS LOOKOUT.Scenes of the lst Battle Squadron and 3rd Flotilla off Malta 1939. The ilI-fated submarine HMS GRAMPUS and HMS BIRMINGHAM on the China Station. Various warships in Norwegian Fjords including HMS COSSACK approaching the ALTMARK.Carriers HMS ILLUSTRIOUS and HMS INDOMITABLE off Madagascar Operation "Ironclad ". Mediterranean convoy scenes of various warships HMS FURIOUS, HMS ARGUS, HMS RENOWN, HMS RODNEY, HMS EDINBURGH, HMS KENYA, HMS HERMIONE, HMS SIRIUS, HMS MANCHESTER, HMS CAIRO, HMS FIREDRAKE, HMS FEARLESS, HMS LIGHTNING, HMS NIZAM, HMS ASHANTI,HMS ESKIMO, HMS KEPPEL, HMS ZETLAND, HMS ERIDGE etc. South Atlantic crossing-the-Iine ceremony on board the HMS NELSON in company with HMS REVENGE and many troopship liners ANDES, ORONTES, STRATHALLEN, AQUITANIA, EMPRESS OF CANADA, STIRLING CASTLE, PASTEUR etc. 6 Perilous Waters. All the events in this programme relate to the Battle of the Atlantic and include many views of Flower Class Corvettes, Frigates, Destroyers etc. A feature on Four-Stackers with the crews sailing via a transport liner to Halifax, Nova Scotia. Commissioning and their return Atlantic voyage. More scenes at Haifax of many warships including "R" Class Battleship and a trtbute to R C.N. The Merchant Navy is much in evidence as also U-boats. And what must be some of the most exciting battle footage ever filmed as Capt. Walker's Escort Group HMS STARLING, HMS MAGPIE, HMS WILD GOOSE, HMS WREN etc., zealously hunt a U-Boat, with some very dramatic scenes of its crew desperately struggling to escape from a devastating depth-charge attack, only finally being forced to surface where the survivors are picked up by the escorts. Their triumphant arrival at Gladstone Dock, Liverpool with cheering Wrens. Landing the U Boat survivors. Admiral Max Horton and the First Lord inspect ships' companies, with interviews on board STARLING. The sudden tragic death af Capt.Walker with his large funeral cortege through Liverpool and burial at sea from HMS HESPERUS, flying STARLING's tattered battle ensign as a final tribute to this legendary figure.. 7 The Hazards of The Russian Convoys. Containing almost all the known surviving archive film this programme must be the only one of its kind ever devoted to the emotive subject of Russian Convoys, and in keeping with the uniquely adopted format of the added realism of real life drama found in the previous episodes of this ongoing series, all the hazards as suggested in the title are set against such a background. Oppressive weather conditions of snow, ice and howling Arctic gales are vividly featured as warships and merchantmen struggle ever onwards in these cold inhospitable Arctic seas, being occasionally complimented by the wry humour of ships crews! German warships and U-boats attacking and sinking allied shipping, with dramatic scenes of helpless survivors being rescued Certainly one of the highlights of the programme is the harrowing views of what was the biggest air-attack ever on any Russian Convoy, being of course PQl8 and filmed primarily from the anti-aircraft cruiser HMS SCYLLA, with further dramatic views of many surviving merchant seamen being transferred to her at sea from the minesweeper HMS HARRIER. This convoy did have the largest through-escort than anything previously attempted, but it must be stressed that the numbers of ships seen throughout this programme are far too numerous to list, as also are all its complete details as itvividly recalls those evocative times 9 Part 9 D-Day Reflections of Operation Neptune. concentrates on the greatest amphibious operation of all time, being of course the allied assault on Normandy. Ranging from the mighty battleship down to the smallest craft of Coastal Forces, almost 7,000 vessels of every description took part in this massive operation, and with so many scenes being covered by various cameramen this programme forcibly makes the viewer aware of its sheer scale and complexity. From the many embarkation ports we follow this huge array of craft as they slowly proceed towards the enemy coast, and though we never go beyond the waters edge it does portray some of the stressful moments experienced by the assault forces on landing, all being preceeded by a heavy naval bombardment. Yet despite the drama of such images there are moments of humour and fortitude, plus other surprises and it would be difficult to list the entire content of this dramatic programme.Certainly it contains some of the finest destroyer footage ever filmed during WWII as many of them are seen lending their support with, amongst others, HMS BOADICEA,HMS ONSLOW, HMS ORIBI, HMS OFFA, HMS ONSLAUGHT, HMS KELVIN, HMS VIRAGO, HMS ULYSSES, HMS URANIA, HMS FAULKNER, HMS UNDAUNTED, HMS ALBRIGHTON, HMS FERNIE, HMS GLAISDALE, HMS STEVENSTONE, HMS IMPULSIVE, HMS KEMPENFELT and the sad end of HMS FURY. Also caught on camera are HMS WARSPITE, HMS RODNEY, HMS RESOLUTION, HMS ARETHUSA, HMS AJAX, HMS SCYLLA, HMS GLASGOW,HMS ENTERPRISE, HMS FROBISHER, HMS SIRIUS, HMS BELFAST. It was a spectacular operation.. These are priced at 27.56 Pounds each, to include air or domestic shipping anywhere... if all are bought, there is 10% discount. Hope someone out there is interested... apologies once again. Best Regards, Caroline Carter http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: Snyder and Short Paint Chips/WR Press announcement We have just had the safe arrival of the first batch of Snyder and Short Paint Chips which we will be shipping on Monday (many thank you's John, they're great!) These are: US Navy WW2 Colour Paint Chips Greys, Blues, Flight deck stains 20 different Colours 10.17 Pounds US Navy Neutral Greys, Greens, and Browns 30 different colour chips. 14.42 Pounds IJN Colour Chips 8 Colours 5.91 Pounds UK and EEC please ADD 17.5% VAT. WEM are pleased to announce that we will be carrying Alan Raven's WR Press titles. Titles are: Fletcher, Gearing and Sumner Class Destroyers by Jeffrey Herne. FLETCHER, GEARING & SUMNER CLASS DESTROYERS IN WW 2. Eighty pages of 12" x 9" size including eight pages in full colour Several fully detailed sets of general arrangement plans plus fittings drawings Eighteen Pages devoted to camouflage patterns Over one hundred photos 19.95 POUNDS AVAILABLE NOW Atlanta Class Cruisers" by Glen Arnold. The book contains new information and many heretofore unpublished photos. The general arrangement plans will be supplied on a separately printed sheet of large size, folded and dropped into the book, and there will be eight pages in full colour showing camouflage schemes, including the Atlanta as she appeared in the spring and summer of 1942.. 19.95 POUNDS AVAILABLE VERY SHORTLY! Flower Class Corvettes by John Lambert. 19.95 Announced for APRIL 99 Royal Navy Camouflage Part One 1939-1941 Alan Raven. 19.95 Announced for June 99. We are pleased to take reservations on any of these titles at any time! Cheers for now, Caroline Carter, Business Manager, White Ensign Models, http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Aircraft details for Super carrier kits >> As the reviewer hints, the standard of the aircraft is abysmal in all of the Italieri Supercarrier releases. I would strongly recommend replacing them with the Skywave USN aircraft sets. << I agree. When I designed the Nimitz class super set I included complete aircraft detail parts for each type of aircraft offered with these kits (except F-18s). The details include wheels, struts. landing gear doors, fuel tanks, refueling probes (A-6) sidewinders missiles with pylons on some. There is enough details furnished with the set to outfit all the aircraft in the kits. I also make a separate set with the same details that will outfit 28 aircraft 1/700 scale. If you wish to see the set, go to my web site on the Warship site. Click on the Flagship Models banner. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Bill & Kaja Michaels" Subject: Chapelle's History of the American Sailing Navy Book offer I've seen a recent reprint of this book at Barnbes and Noble for about $15, so I bought one. My problem: I already had a copy. A couple of years ago, I got a First Edition at a local used book store. I paid too much ($50), but it was hard to find in any shape then. I recently took it back to the store, and they'll only offer me $25 for it now. (Buy low, sell high, it's how they pay the rent-- can't blame 'em!) If I'm going to sell it for below "market value", I'd like to see it go to a good home. That's why I'm offering it here. If anyone wants a First Edition to add to a collection, contact me off list. I'll sell it to the highest bidder over $25. If nobody wants it, the used book dealer will get it back...... I'm only interested in the contents, so the new, cheaper reprint is fine for me. I figrure there might be someone out there on the list who also is collecting these books, hence the offer. Again, send your reply to billkaja@tiac.net, not the list! I'll keep the offer open for the rest of the month of Feb. Bill Bill and Kaja Michaels -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume