Subject: SMML06/03/99VOL476 Date: Sat, 06 Mar 1999 23:58:06 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: HMS Edinburgh Camouflage 2: WEM 600 Professional Range 3: WW-II British patrol craft colours:) 4: USS Kidd 5: Naval and Maritime Museums listings 6: Re: H.M.S. Victory 7: US Destroyer Collision 8: Re: HMS Victory kit 9: That Bismark site 10: Re: Greenwich Maritime Museum 11: basic sub painting 12: Fuso etc 13: Re: Proof-Reading 14: Re: HMS Edinburgh 15: USS Missouri open? 16: Arizona info 17: Re: USN Destroyer collision 18: IJN Yamato and Kaga: best Skywave accessories 19: Re: Arizona propellers 20: Re: Destroyer collision 21: Caroline Carter Re;1:600 parts 22: P-6 Cat's -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: More New Releases -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Michael Eisenstadt Subject: Re: HMS Edinburgh Camouflage Folks: The US National Archives has a nice series of starboard shots of HMS Edinburgh in her Admiralty Disruptive scheme taken from an American ship while Edinburgh was in convoy with USS Wasp and Wichita in April 1942. The photos are clear enough to interpret for modeling purposes. The only problem, there are no photos in the archives (as far as I know) of her port side dating from this period. If interested, order photos number 80G10980 and 80G10983. Good luck. Michael Eisenstadt -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Felix Bustelo Subject: WEM 600 Professional Range Ok all of you 1/600 fans. We are a rabid bunch when it comes to this scale, so what gives?! WEM has been a friend to 1/600 scale models and if we want them to continue providing accessories for these kits we better buy what we beg them to produce. I have pledged to buy one of each set. So folks, and you know who you are, drop Caroline a line and tell her that you want to buy a set as well. Felix Bustelo International Maritime Modeling http://members.tripod.com/~Febus65/imm.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Mike Taylor" Subject: WW-II British patrol craft colours:) I'm doing a few 1/600 Patrol craft but they come without color information. They are: Fairmile D MTB Fairmile B MGB Round Table class Minesweeper Algerine class Minesweeper These are cast metal by Davco, kinda rough,but interesting. Any ideas? Thanks........ Mike T -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Leonard, Michael W" Subject: USS Kidd Jeff wrote: >> As for visiting any of the Fletchers still afloat, only the Kidd in Baton Rouge will give you accurate info on WW2 Fletchers, all of the others have post-war mods (FRAM) to the bridge areas. And my book has 34 pictures of the Kidd, not to mention other ships. ... Unless of course you WANT to go to Baton Rouge... << Good grief, I wouldn't wish that on anybody. Visiting the Kidd last year was the only highlight of an otherwise dismal trip to the New Orleans area. Mike L -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: jpoutre@lehman.com (Joseph Poutre) Subject: Naval and Maritime Museums listings I've seen several postings in here asking about maritime museums in particular locations. I maintain two lists of naval and maritime museums, one US and one international, at the following URLs: http://www.bb62museum.org/usnavmus.html http://www.bb62museum.org/wrldnmus.html Please feel free to access these any time you take a trip. They're organised by state (US) or country (world) and list the address, phone number, website (if any) and any major vessels on display, plus anything else unusual or interesting. Now I don't have every museum in the world (yet) and I don't have all the info for every museum, so if you use my lists, you become obligated to check my entries when you get back and let me know what I'm missing. You are free to copy the lists, though then you won't get updates, and you can print out any part of or the entire list. You may _not_ sell this information, or give it to someone to be sold, since I have the copyright, the info was given to me by volunteers, and is for public use only, not for private profit. Enjoy! Joe Poutre Joseph Poutre, aka The Mad Mathematician N2KOW jpoutre@lehman.com Systems Admin and Programmer, Lehman Bros. Co-Webmaster, Battleship New Jersey Historical Museum Society http://www.bb62museum.org/ Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: LubenLarry@aol.com Subject: Re: H.M.S. Victory I had the great good fortune to visit Victory about 2 years ago. The color she wears now has a distinctly orange cast. Almost a cross between buff and orange. I have a couple copies of the souvenir guide and some pictures I took (it was pouring rain). All the models I've ever seen are yellow. Don't know if the current color is accurate or not. Floquil "Quarter Gallery Yellow" seems too bright. "German Yellow" from the Floquil aircraft line seems better. Pity she's not under 15,000 feet of water so we could really argue about it. Larry Bartlett -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Leonard, Michael W" Subject: US Destroyer Collision I believe Ian was asking about the Radford, the ship fitted with the experimental 'obelisk' mast. For the full story I would recommend the Norfolk Virginian-Pilot newspaper, online at: http://www.pilotonline.com Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: MBishop446@aol.com Subject: Re: HMS Victory kit I'm currently working on the victory to but it's not the plastic kit. The kit I'm doing is from Mantua. A 52"long plank on frame job. I have never built this type of ship before. I needed a challange for once. Scratch building masters of steel navy ships just doesn't make much of an effort as it used too. This kit will keep my busy for the next 5-7 years. Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Morley, James (London)" Subject: That Bismark site Just in response to the message from Douglas Martin about the Bismark website. This is well worth a visit, principally because Markus Van Beek's model of the Bismark in (not easy to tell, but probably 1/92 or 1/150?) is possibly the most amazing work I've ever seen. There is a picture also of it motoring on the water. If I was ever able to build something like that, I wouldn't take it within 10 miles of a pond !!!!!!!! Separately, there is a new 1/350 aircraft carrier wishlist auto-survey on the NAVIS website. Will someone tell the operator that Toms make a 1/350 Essex class carrier already, and would everybody from this list P L E A S E go and do some voting for Nimitz class 1/350 !!! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Kenneth H. Goldman" Subject: Re: Greenwich Maritime Museum Douglas Martin recommended a visit to the Greenwich Maritime Museum on the Thames. I heartily second that. But beware! If you think you are a hotshot ship modeler, their collection of Navy Board ship models will put you in your place. They are truly amazing miniature ships (hardly models) right down to the fully-realized ornamental woodcarvings. I, a woodcarver by profession as well as being a passable ship modeler, was humbled by the sight. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER http://www.wman.com/~khgold/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Scott Gronek Subject: basic sub painting I'm about to start building the Dragon 1/350 scale model of an Ohio-class SSBN, which I'll probably make into the USS Nevada (SSBN-733). Does anyone know what basic hull colors should be used, and if any are available with Model Master paints? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Douglas Martin" Subject: Fuso etc Caroline: Thanks for the Polish info, perhaps when the guys wake up and realise how much of a potential market they are missing out on, collective fingers will be extracted and publication in Lizzies Lingo may ensue. Pictures are one thing, but all the descriptive text and history is lost on yer average punter, what a waste - especially when you consider the ships covered. As far as Fuso is concerned, I ordered my copy in 1997, got part of an order in Nov 98, Emailed Conways on 20/03/98, got a reply on 03/03/99, and the book arrived on 04/03/99. Regards, Douglas -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "Bruce Burden" Subject: Re: Proof-Reading "Peter Mispelkamp" wrote: >> I have been following the thread about the poor editing of some British books. I once got a galley proof of one of my reviews from a UK publisher that was riddled with errors, and have noticed that works coming from the UK are far more prone to "editorial oversights" than those published in the US. << Well, to offer a counter example, Schiffer is very prone to errors. I get the distinct impression that, on the whole, Schiffer really does no proof-reading of the manuscripts they print. So, if you get an author who is very careful and submitts a very polished manuscript, you get a good book. Oft time, however, Schiffer seems to print very rushed, sloppy manuscripts, and the resultant book is riddled with errors. An excellent example of spell-checkers-out-of-control is the Squadron/Signal "in Action" books. Spell checkers are fine and well, but to blithly take their advice on misspelled words is not a good idea, yet this seems to happen a lot. Earlier "in Action" books just seem to not be proofed at all. Bruce -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Tim Stoneman Subject: Re: HMS Edinburgh According to "British Cruisers" (Raven and Roberts), EDINBURGH went through various refits: firstly in March - October 1940 at South Shields when RDF (radar) Type 279 was fitted at both mastheads (this may have been when the whaler bays forward of the catapult were plated in), then in July 1941 at Gibraltar when 6 single 20mm were fitted (2 on B turret, 2 on B gundeck just forward of the bridge and 2 staggered on the quarterdeck. Her final refit was from January 1942, when RDF Types 273 was fitted on a pylon aft of the forward 6" DCT, RDF Type 284 fitted on the forward 6" DCT and 3 sets of RDF Type 285 fitted, one on each HA.DCT. I've seen no indication that she had barrage directors for her 6" guns, with or without RDF Type 283, but she may have had RDF Type 282 fitted to her pom-pom directors as BELFAST did. She may have had changes to her boat and raft stowages. Note also that her mainmast yardarm was lower than BELFAST's. As to camouflage, she wore an overall single-tone (507B, or perhaps changed to 507A?) scheme at least until after her July 1941 refit, but by the time she was sunk, she was wearing a multi-coloured (Admiralty Disruptive?) scheme with what appear to be three colours, probably painted up in her Tyne refit in 1942. There are various poor-quality photos published showing parts of the scheme, taken from one of her escorts after her stern had been blown off, but none that I have found are good enough to give a complete idea of her camouflage scheme (even allowing for the fact that her stern section was at the bottom of the Arctic Ocean at that stage!). Another shot of her in company with USS WASP in April 1942 is also too indistinct to give a clear view. Model Ship Builder ran a 3-part series on building 1:600 scale models of EDINBURGH and BELFAST in May-October 1996, and Model Shipwright number 48 contains an article on scratchbuilding a 32ft:1inch EDINBURGH, in the 1942 configuration - both dodged the EDINBURGH camouflage question by painting her overall grey. Hope this helps - Caroline do I get any commission if you sell another WEM kit? And while talking about fancy colour schemes for cruisers - does anyone know the port-side scheme for HMS TRINIDAD, or her colours - or FIJI's colours come to that? Tim Stoneman -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Douglas Martin" Subject: USS Missouri open? Folks: My contact in Hawaii says the Missouri is now open for tours. Got the paperback book out on the HMS Edinburgh for a wee read after all this webbing info, its named 'Last Call for HMS Edinburgh', shows her head on healing over to starboard - with those famed 20mm A/A guns on view., plus camouflage paint (not a photo). Douglas (Scotland) BTW: If WEM can produce castings of 1/700 gold bars for the Edinburgh, lets ask them to turn their talents to producing 1:1 scale bars.......in gold........for SMML members......... Great idea & I'll even look after the distribution for them. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: Steve Singlar Subject: Arizona info For info on the Arizona specs, check out the following: http://members.aol.com/azmemph/ussaz.htm This line is from the specs page of the above web site. PROPELLERS: FOUR, three bladed, 12' 7" diameter - 1941 Steve -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: Bill Schnakenberg Subject: Re: USN Destroyer collision >> Does anyone know the Name of the USN Destroyer that was involved in a collision last week? Can't even find it on CNN! << It was not last week. It was last month. February 5 1999. The USS Radford collided with a Saudi Arabian cargo ship the "Saudi Riyadh", 25 miles off the coast of Virginia. Go here for photos, video and the story: http://www.pilotonline.com/military/ml0205shi.html Bill The USS Salem, CA-139. The World's only preserved Heavy Cruiser, Quincy, MASS. http://members.xoom.com/ltwes329/salem.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "John Noory" Subject: IJN Yamato and Kaga: best Skywave accessories Hello, I'm in the process of building 1/700 scale BB Yamato and CV Kaga and I'd like to add accessory parts to them. Problem is that Skywave makes 5 or so IJN accessory kits and I don't know which ones are best for the two ships I mentioned. Any advice would be appreciated. Also, are there 1/700 aircraft decals for IJN aircraft? I recall seeing such decals for USN aircraft, but I'd like them for the Japanese ships. Thank you, John Noory -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: Arizona propellers Propellers on the USS Arizona BB-39 As of 1916------FOUR 4-bladed, @ 12ft.1.5in. dia. ea. As of 1931 refit-FOUR 3-bladed, @ 12ft. 7in. dia. ea. I believe that most all ships propellers rotated outboard. Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Minadmiral@aol.com Subject: Re: Destroyer collision Hi; I saw the RADFORD on the news. There was quite a large gash on the starboard side just forward of the 5" mount. Also the 5" mount itself was damaged. It was crumpled and canted to port. Mention was made that the US Navy was considering scrapping RADFORD instead of repairing her. Why not bill the tanker`s owners for the repairs? Or maybe Mr.Bill could take the money from the U.N. "waste" fund. Chuck Duggie -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: Minadmiral@aol.com Subject: Caroline Carter Re;1:600 parts Hi Caroline; Some of the 1:600 weapons listed previously could be used for my scratch built ships, but I still need single/twin/quad 20mm, 37/40mm singles, and the various powered and un-powered 2# and 6# guns for coastal craft. I supose a 3# would be too much to wish for, not to mention the twin .303 mg. On my knees with fingers crossed. Chuck Duggie PS could you list the 1:600 weapon sets with cost and # of pieces per set again? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: Bob LaBouy (by way of Greg Lee) Subject: P-6 Cat's Dear John, I am responding to your note. Anytime anyone mentions catapults, I am interested, though every article I've seen in print about the catapults used for years by the US Navy usually contain as much misinformation as good stuff. If you are asking about the Navy's P-6 catapult, which is a 8" powder driven catapult and used aboard many cruisers and battleships from the early 30's through the end of WWII, I may be of some assistance. I started my quest based on the motivation of Bill Larkins almost 30 years ago and just happened to be in the right place on one or two occasions and have some information, data, drawings and photos of the P-6. There is also one such cat still left, the one aboard the USS Alabama, in Mobile bay. This particular cat was one of those at Pensacola and is on loan to the battleship museum for their display. Not to drive you over the edge, but I've have some items, which may be of interest. The first is an article, which appeared in the '92 IPMS-USA Convention program (though you're not seeing the few added photos) and it's drawings (to 1/72nd scale). While I had a captive audience (I was chairman and editor of the program), I took the opportunity and preached a bit to the "great unwashed" about real Naval aviation and shipboard catapult operations. I've scanned these drawings for you as well, though the quality may be lacking this time around (and they are in a photoshop format, though I'll try to convert them to JPEG for the convenience of email transfer. And lastly, I've copied my favorite, almost classic SOC shot, taken off the fantail of the battleship Nevada (though some think Arizona). Please drop me a note and let me know how I can assist you, if at all and I'll give the old college try. Bob LaBouy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: More New Releases Hi Guys Well, we released WEM K 732 1/700 Town/Southampton Class Cruiser etch today.. at 12.72 pounds with a full and comprehensively designed instruction sheet. The 1/600 HMS Warspite set is going out to customers at this time at 16.13 pounds. The Airfix 1/600 HMS Ajax is here at last and is priced at 5.10 pounds (around $8.16). We ARE designing a nice etched brass set for this kit by the way.. The good news for overseas (U.S. anyway) is that there are now less dollars to the pounds than a couple of weeks ago, so your credit card purchases will be cheaper at this time. Today's rate is 1.60 dollars to the pound, the lowest for a couple of years. The next batch of 1/700 Scale planes to arrive next week are as follows (for ship/diorama work): WEM AS 7138 Cant Z 506 WEM AS 7152 He111 WEM AS 7157 Fiat CR42 Falco WEM AS 7174 Mavis WEM AS 7182 BV222 Wiking WEM AS 7183 Me323 WEM AS 7184 Ju290 A7 WEM AS 7185 Consolidated PB4 Y-2 Privateer WEM AS 7186 SM 82 WEM AS 7187 Dornier Do 17Z WEM AS 7188 Ju52 WEM AS 7189 Arado 234 WEM AS 7190 Arado 196 WEM AS 7191 Douglas Invader Cheers! Caroline Carter, White Ensign Models http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume