Subject: SMML25/04/99VOL526 Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 00:41:54 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: Devonshire 1941 2: Addendum to Devonshire 1941 3: Re: USS Salem 4: Re: Enterprise society 5: What to get for my first resin model 6: Re: Vulcan/ Phalanx 7: Re: CURRITUCK/NORTON SOUND 8: HMS WARSPITE 9: Paints 10: Re: USFS 11: Re: CIWS 12: Re: SMML across America 13: Re: USFS 14: Re: IJN airpower book 15: Phalanx 20mm CIWS guns 16: Pre-war Caribbean Colors 17: Pine Island wooden decks 18: Re: USS Pine Island 19: Ship Shop 1/1250 collection 20: CHEESE CIWS 21: Re: Phalanx 22: Warspite 23: Re: SMML Across America 24: SMML Across America: Sites and Sights in the Washington DC Area 25: Re: USS Norton Sound and USS Pine Island 26: Re: SMML across America -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS Welcome to the ANZAC Day Edition of SMML. "They shall grow not old as we that are left grow old; Age shall not weary them nor the years condemn; At the going down of the sun, and in the morning" "WE WILL REMEMBER THEM." "LEST WE FORGET" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Vimieraa@aol.com Subject: Re: Devonshire 1941 Arrangement of the pom poms was symetrical port and starboard. The position of these pom poms was the same as on the port side of the Shropshire.. Do not use ANY other ships of the class as a reference for the positioning of these mountings on the Devonshire. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Vimieraa@aol.com Subject: Addendum to Devonshire 1941 The arrangement of the pom poms on the Sussex was different in terms of distance from the stern by several feet than on the Devonshire. The positioning of the aft superstructure on the Sussex was further aft by about twentyfour feet than on the Devonshire. Do not use the Sussex as a reference for the positioning of the pom poms. If anybody is interested enough I will detail the differences on the aft arrangements on a ship by ship basis. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: NAVYDAZE@aol.com Subject: Re: USS Salem For Dave Kaplan's comment about the USS SALEM The USS SALEM is NOT the last of her kind. The USS DES MOINES is still in storage and the good people of Duluth have not given up on her for a museum, they just need Governor "Jesse" to sign the bill. The Navy has been really great and understanding in holding her for so many years unlike the NEWPORT NEWS. If you go to http://members.aol.com/kweimer50/mdp.html - there is a copy of the painting if did for them to help raise money by selling prints (ya I gave them the copyright) which they are still receiving funds. However, I did not write the text as it is very inaccurate (talks about the aircraft - she had none those are covered boats on the deck ????) Mike Donegan (NAVYDAZE) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Pieter Cornelissen Subject: Re: Enterprise society >> Unfortunately this accepts US$ Cheques and money orders only. My advice to the US resisdents out there is to buy up all their copies and ship them to << What's wrong with US$ cheques end money orders? Unless you are living in Lybia or Serbia you can instruct your bank to make out an international cheque in dollars (expensive, that's why I try to use my credit card whenever possible) or you can go to the nearest post-office and make up a International Money Order (which takes forever and can only be sent to 'natural persons'). It's a bit hard to order from the Enterprise society, but not impossible. Pieter Cornelissen Delft, The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Louis Costanzo Subject: What to get for my first resin model Well, I'm going to take the plunge and get my first resin model. I want to get something relatively inexpensive, in 1:700 scale, say $50-70. I've been looking at a couple of CA's: the Corsair Armada USS Northampton, and the Accurate image USS Salem. What do you think of these ships? Northampton got excellent reviews on the warships site. What other ships in this area would you reccomend? (CA's and CL's) I have some experience with photo etch but I'm not what you would call a master and as I said before this is my first of this sort of kit. I'm a bit aprehensive about spending this kind of cash on one ship, so I want to make a good choice! Thanks in advance -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Rick Heinbaugh Subject: Re: Vulcan/ Phalanx Rusty White wrote: >> The Phalanx CIWS didn't exist before the Falkland Island war. As a matter of fact, it was because of damage done by sea skimming missiles to British vessels during that war that promoted the US Navy to develop the CIWS to counter cruise missiles and low flying aircraft as a last line of defense for surface vessels. << "US Naval Weapons" by Norman Friedman says they started development in 1970 and a prototype went to sea in 1973. I was trained about the beast in Surface Warfare Officer's School in 1980. On JOUETT, we had a couple onboard (installed in 1980) while the Falklands War was in the news - was it '81 or '82? Maybe that was when the British decided to buy it. BTW, for anyone who has never heard the CIWS in action, it doesn't go "bang" or "boom"... it just sounds like a giant zipper. And it also tends to be louder inside the ship than outside. Rick -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: CURRITUCK/NORTON SOUND My good buddy and partner, Randy Short, has a color photo of one of the AVs (PINE ISLAND?) that SEEMS (emphasis on "seems") to indicate she's in overall Navy Green. She's in a close-in anchorage, so that might make sense, and the ship color does appear to differ from the blue seaplanes moored at her stern. I'm still not 100% convinced, but.... John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: John Snyder Subject: HMS WARSPITE Just a quick note: My WEM 1/700 WARSPITE--ordered at last year's IMPS/USA Nationals--arrived the other day. Hats off to Caroline and Dave--they've done it again. I haven't had time to do a thorough inspection, but I can tell you that the delicateness of detail on this model is jewel-like, from the wooden deck to AA mount splinter shields that are so thin as to be semi-transparent. The sheets of photo-etch are incredible, and will certainly bring a new level to anyone modeling in the "out-of-box" category. The hull, with much detail molded on, is taped to a heavy sheet of cardboard and then wrapped in bubble wrap. Other resin parts are in a separate bubble wrap envelope. Despite the obvious attempts of the postal officials (there was a decided dent in the box that had me more than worried before I opened the box), everything arrived in good order. For anyone with an interest in this venerable fighter, this model is a must. Now, if I only had time to build models.... John Snyder (With no financial interest in WEM, other than sending them MY money.) Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Robert Weilacher Subject: Paints Bad News, My local hobby store owner has informed me that Polly-Scale Paints are being discontinued. This is because Floquil-Polly-S was bought by a company that also owns Testors. He does not know if Testors will have Naval colors or not. Now that both Floquil and Polly-S will be gone, how does one get the correct colors for USN WWII paints? I am not experienced in mixing/matching paints to get a color. What alternatives do some of the SMMLer's employ ? Rob -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: CBNJBB62@aol.com Subject: Re: USFS Dear Steve: Thanks for answer. I don't think that is it's actual meaning, I have a sense of humor too but what I was thinking it may mean is US Fighting Ship or Fleet Ship or perhaps Olympia was for much of her career a Flagship that it may mean for the pomp and circumstance of diplomatic missions and ceremonies that the drum was stenciled that way. Now that evening a friend told me that the USN in 1901 decided to use USS as part of the ships name so it may be an actual title. Freaking ship lol.I would never expect someone to build models and use the historically accurate designations especially USS is the current one and more commonly known. You freaking ship lover Craig Bennett -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Suvoroff@aol.com Subject: Re: CIWS >> The Phalanx CIWS didn't exist before the Falkland Island war. As a matter of fact, it was because of damage done by sea skimming missiles to British vessels during that war that promoted the US Navy to develop the CIWS to counter cruise missiles and low flying aircraft as a last line of defense for surface vessels. << Sorry, this is not true; I remember when my ship (USS Long Beach) was going into the shipyard for repair/refit in 1980, CIWS was already planned for installation. I saw my first CIWS installation in the same period, on the USS Sacramento. Development must have begun in the Seventies if not the Sixties to have reached fruition by 1980. Yours, James D. gray -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: SMML across America Dan Kaplan wrote: >> On the New Jersey side, in Hackensack, lies the USS Ling (SS297). A Balao class sub restored to WW II configuration, it's usually overshadowed by the ships over at the Intrepid Museum and at the South Street Seaport SNIP Finally, should you be wandering up to the Boston area, I believe I read just recently that "Big Mammie", the USS Massachusets (BB59), is in drydock in Boston Harbor for some R & R. If true, I think that would be a very interesting photo shoot. And, just a little futher up in Quincy, Mass. is the USS Salem, (CA 139) the last of her kind. << Dan is right, USS Ling is worth a visit. Actually, she was never converted from WWI configuration, she and her sister ship USS Lionfish, SS298 (Fall River, Mass) were products of Cramp Shipbuilding in Philadelphia. The Cramp products did not enjoy a high reputation for quality; thus Ling and Lionfish were passed over for Guppy conversion. For modelers, these represent some of the few ships still in WWII configuration. If you head up towards Boston from NYC, be sure to stop at the New London Sub Base for the US Submarine Force Museum (which although it is the official name, everyone calls it the Nautilus Museum). The first nuclear sub, USS Nautilus, is there, as well as the sail fo the USS George Washington, our first Polaris sub. Nice little museum with a huge wall of sub models, all in the same scale. Great exhibits and memorabilia of the sub force. The Ultimate sub model hangs from the ceiling: a 1/6th scale Gato class boat with the side cut open. Manned by one foot high figures. They also have a Japanese 2 man sub, and a German Seehund. Not far, along the waterfront in Groton, is a memorial to all who died in the Silent Service in WWII. Large stone tablets carry the names of the over 3000 officers and men lost in the boats. The conning tower of the Gato class USS Flasher (SS 249), the sub that officially sank the most tonnage in WWII, stands there along with small tablets bearing an accurate silhouette, name, and date of each sub lost. Just down the street is the huge light green shed where two Ohio class SSBNs were built side by side, and the last of the 3 Seawolf class subs is now under construction. The "smaller" shed to the right is where the Electric Boat 688 class subs were constructed side by side. Not as much to see there as in years past, when 1-2 Tridents would be rolled out of the building for several months so that the next hulls could be started in the shed. The USS Massachusetts is back at Battleship Cove in Fall River, after an overhaul. USS Lionfish is currently in drydock in Boston for her overhaul. Further up the coast is the revolutionary USS Albacore in Portsmouth, NH, just a 1/4 mile off I-95 This was a diesel boat with a body-of-revolution hull built as a speed and maneuverability test bed in the 50's. She is rumored to have hit 33 knots with silver-zinc batteries. Unique display, they towed her in from the river in a man-made canal, then refilled the canal and drained it. She sits in a depression on blocks, so that her hull is fully visible. Her shape was adopted in the nuclear powered Skipjack class of submarines. Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Erwin Van Deynze Subject: Re: USFS >> Last year at a ceremony for the Spanish-American war on board the USS OLYMPIA, now a museum I observed something interesting. Now all my life I thought that American warships since the Constitution took effect in this country that their names started with USS. Now the band was in period costumes and the drum had USFS OLYMPIA stenciled on it. What does USFS stand for? Is this the only difference in ship names that the navy used? << United Star Fleet Ship? ;-) from a trekkie Erwin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Jon Parshall Subject: Re: IJN airpower book >> Thank you also for mentioning that Evans and Peattie are going to release a book on IJN airpower; I've been wondering about that since reading about their intent in the "Kaigun" introduction and hoping that it would not become a casualty of time.) << Just as an FYI, the ETA on this forthcoming work is unknown. The first manuscript is complete, but it needs some revisions. I found the manuscript to be very interesting indeed. I've also completed several of the illustrations for it already as well. Unfortunately, David Evans is having some annoying health problems at the moment, and hasn't been able to work as much as he'd like. Between that and the normal delays one finds in the book publishing biz, I wouldn't expect this to be out for at least another year. Bottom line; the project is still in progress, but is moving more slowly than we had hoped. While we're on the topic of IJN references, the Maru Special magazines are also a good source of information on their ships. It is also possible to pick up reprints of Shizuo Fukui's original volumes on their battleships and cruisers. They are pricey, like $250 a pop, and I haven't been able to bring myself to buy one yet, but I have been tempted. Another primary references that I rely upon for my site is Paul Dull's "A Battle History of the Imperial Japanese Navy." It contains very good renditions of most of the major battles from a Japanese perspective, as well as good track charts. David Evan's earlier "The Imperial Japanese Navy in World War II" also has a lot of good content, n the form of essays from surviving IJN officers. And I also used John Campbell's "Naval Weapons of World War II" quite a bit as well. Good diagrams and performance data on their weapons and fire-control systems. Jon Parshall Imperial Japanese Navy Homepage http://www.skypoint.com/members/jbp/kaigun.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: Loren Perry Subject: Phalanx 20mm CIWS guns Although the Invincible did not carry any Phalanx mounts to the Falklands, these guns did indeed exist at that time and were not developed in response to this war as was incorrectly stated on this site earlier. The first feasibility contract was awarded to General Dynamics in 1969, and the first closed-loop spotting system was demonstrated aboard the destroyer USS King in 1973. The Phalanx was authorized by Congress into full-scale production in 1977. The carrier USS America received the first Phalanx CIWS installation in 1980, roughly two years before the Falklands War. By 1985, 400 systems were deployed. Later versions were developed and deployed throughout the 1980s. This information is available in World Naval Weapons Systems by Norman Friedman, USNI Press, among other sources. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: Frederick Wagner Subject: Pre-war Caribbean Colors Does anyone know what color scheme was used in peace time by the U.S. Navy in the Caribbean area before we began preparing for WWII? I assume it would be light colors, but I don't know. Thank you Fritz Wagner -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: Loren Perry Subject: Pine Island wooden decks The seaplane tender USS Pine Island made extensive use of wooden decks, although the Revell kit erroneously depicts steel decks throughout. The aft seaplane deck was planked as was the forecastle (01 level) from the rear of the anchor handling gear back to the aft end of the enclosed side deck areas. The enclosed side area of the main deck (level with the seaplane deck) was also planked. All other decks were steel. The seaplane deck also had steel tiedown strips ala' Essex-class carriers of WW2, but on the Pine Island, these strips ran fore-and-aft. The official 1/48 scale Navy model of the Pine Island was on display for many years at the Great Lakes Recruit Training Center (RTC) near Chicago. I attended basic training there in 1966 and was able to photograph it extensively (but only with a Kodak Brownie 110 camera - and I no longer have the negatives, sorry.) I also was able to visit Pine Island's sistership USS Salisbury Sound in the 1950s as part of a scout troop program. The size of the hangar impressed me the most. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Bruce Burden" Subject: Re: USS Pine Island >> I have the Revell Pine Island too but my question is about the ³Depth Charge Racks² (#7) and the large overhang on the quad 40mm on the stern. Could this be correct? << According to the photos of USS Norton Sound and USS Pine Island in "Unites States Naval Vessels", Naval Institute Press, yes, the overhang of the 40mm's at the stern is correct. As for the depth charge racks, the book doesn't note them so equipped. Nor does the USNSM World Aircraft Carrier Lists: http://www.uss-salem.org/navhist/carriers/ so indicate they were equippedwith depth charge racks. >> I have also been told that the ³Main Deck Rear² (#8) should not be steel, but wood, which is more believable considering the source that relayed this information. How accurate is this kit? << I would think wood more likely. For one, I would think it is less slippery than steel when wet, and less prone to rust. Plus easier to replace when damaged. The only advantage I see in steel would be moving the seaplanes around, on thier dolliers, on a steel deck. But, if the deck is slippery... Perhaps the steel deck was installed on USS Norton Sound when she was converted to AVM-1, or a guided missle ship. I can see the advantage to steel decks then... :-) And, apparently Revell issued the USS Pine Island kit under USS Norton Sound as well. Bruce -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: "Leverett L. Preble" Subject: Ship Shop 1/1250 collection Does anyone know what happened to the Ship Shop's collection of 1/1200-1/1250 ships? Were they sold to one collector or one hobby shop? You are right about their attitude. They were not helpful. I suspect it was from lack of knowledge and lack of interest. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Baker Subject: CHEESE CIWS Sorry to dispute Rusty White, but the CIWS most certainly DID exist prior to the Falklands war and had been in development--and later production--for over a decade by 1982. Brits bought a number of CIWS mounts (at around $9 million each) as a result of the conflict. Take a look at a GOOD reference book, Rusty! Best/Dave Baker -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: "John Sutherland" Subject: Re: Phalanx Hi, in vol 525 >> First none of any the British fleet had phalanx guns in the Falkland Islands. They received them at after their return to the UK. Too bad for Sheffield, Coventry, Antelope, and Active. They used Sea dart, Sea wolf Missiles and whatever guns mounted to the ships involved. << Not quite so. The phalanx bit is right, the rest isn't. None of the above defended themselves with Sea Wolf - this missile system was carried only by the Type 22 frigates and one Leander present in the Falklands. Sheffield and Coventry had Sea Dart along with the other Type 42s and the Invincible. (Not sure what the Hermes carried but it wasn't Sea Wolf - probably Sea Dart or Sea Cat). Antelope and Active along with the rest of the Type 21s, the Countys, the Leanders, the Type 12s and the LSDs carried the obsolescent Sea Cat system which never the less was the second highest scoring missile system in that war after the Sea Dart though by sheer volume than capability. The Countys also had the highly obsolete Sea Slug system which achieved nothing. John Sutherland In a murky Wellington, New Zealand where autumn is setting in. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: Marc Flake Subject: Warspite Hey SMMLers: I got my Warspite and she's a beaut. The brass? I've seen spiderwebs that were less delicate. The detail is amazing, there are little racks for the carley floats for Pete's sake. The resin casting? Let me put it this way, the splinter sheilds are so thin they're translucent. The instructions? Tells you what every brass piece is, shows you where everything goes and how to paint it. (My wife chided me for my giddiness over the color guide that's in color "Yeah, look, light gray, dark gray, black." She left out green, teak and mahogony, but that's okay, she has other qualities.) And now I can't stuff them back into their envelope. Let's have a salute to WEM for a truly impessive creation. Marc in Mansfield -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: MDDoremus@aol.com Subject: Re: SMML Across America I hope the Nimitz Museum was good. I visited there ~15 years ago. It had a lot of potential then, I hope it's grown to meet it. Other places in Texas: Seawolf(?) Park In Galveston, home of USS Cavella. Ingleside, near Corpus Christi, a USN Home port. Seems like the Lex is near Corpus also. Some where north of Ft. Worth, Azle(?) they have a B-36 being restored. Not a ship, but an important player in the "Revolt of the Admirals" Some where south (hiway 377) of Ft. Worth "Pate Museum of Transportation." They have some old A/C USN/USAF and RCAF aircraft, poorly preserved and maintained. They even have a minesweeper, you can get a great view of the hull, bring a ladder if you want to see the deck. Housepaint on an F-8U!:>( I assume you've already thought of USS Kidd in Baton Rouge, USS Alabama at Mobile, and Naval Aviation Museum in Pensacola. How about Vicksburg, they have the recovered remains of the USS Cairo(?) on display. For the South east coast there is also Mayport, FL, home port for JFK. Kingsport, GA has a Trident base. And the Yorktown is in South Carolina. Happy Trails Mark -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Michael Eisenstadt Subject: SMML Across America: Sites and Sights in the Washington DC Area Folks: As my contribution to the ongoing "SMML Across America" series, I thought the following, concerning sites and sights of interest to ship modelers in the Washington DC area, would be of interest to many readers out there (wherever "out there" may be!). The Washington DC area has a wealth of places of interest to the ship modeler. First stop should be the Navy Museum in the Washington Navy Yard. It features scores of models of various scales and from all periods of American naval history--from colonial to modern times--including models of the pre-WWI armored cruiser Pennsylvania and battleship Maine, the WWII era destroyer Wainwright (DD 419), the battleship Missouri (BB-63), the aircraft carriers Ranger (CV-4) and Leyte (CV-32), and the modern aircraft carrier Forrestal (CVA 59)--all in 1/48 scale. In addition, a large number of naval weapons are on display in the museum and outside, including naval guns (a 40mm quad, a twin 5" 38 caliber, and a 16" battleship gun), various antisubmarine (ASROC), antiship (Tomahawk), antiair (Talos), and cruise (Regulus II) missiles, a Mk 4 fire control radar antenna, and several types of manned torpedoes (the WWII era Japanese Kaiten II and Italian Maiale) and midget submarines (the Civil War era "Intelligent Whale," and WWII era German Seehund), which are located in the museum annex -- which is a separate building. The Forrest Sherman class destroyer U.S.S. Barry (DD 933) is but a stone's throw away from the museum and is open for viewing by the public. For information on hours and directions to the museum, call (202) 889-9180. The Naval Historical Library is a two minute walk from the museum and is home to a large collection of books on naval subjects, including cruise books of warships from various eras, an extensive photo collection, and bureau of construction & repair camouflage handbooks and supplements (with original camouflage color chips). This library is an invaluable resource for model builders. For information on hours of operation and directions, call the library at (202) 433-4132, and the photo branch at (202) 433-2675. Two of the Smithsonian Museums located on the mall (just a few metro stops away) have displays of interest to ship modelers. The Air and Space Museum has a nice exhibit on naval aviation that includes a restored Boeing F4B-4 biplane, Grumman F4F Wildcat, Douglas SBD-6 Dauntless, and Douglas A-4C Skyhawk, and a magnificent 1/100 scale model of the USS Enterprise (CVN-65) with a complete air wing. The National Museum of American History has wonderful display of American warships in its Armed Forces of the United States exhibit. Nearly all are in a constant 1/48 scale and portray warships from revolutionary times to the nuclear era, with the emphasis on ships from the Civil War, the Spanish-American War, and World War I. Particularly eye-catching are the turn of the century battleships U.S.S. Kearsarge and Maine, and the cruiser U.S.S. St. Louis wearing a World War I dazzle camouflage scheme. It is very rare to see large museum models finished in camouflage, and the complexity and beauty of this particular scheme and make this a wonderful model to behold. There is also an excellent collection of ship models in the American Maritime Enterprise exhibit in the same building, which includes a large number of sail and steam ships in 1/48, 1/96, and smaller scales. Of particular interest to naval history buffs are 1/96 scale models of several WWII era merchant ships, including a T-2 class tanker, a C-3 class merchant ship, and Liberty and Victory ships.(Unfortunately, I understand that the Smithsonian may be closing down one or both of these exhibits in the coming months. This would be a shame!) Those interested in researching particular ships should visit the National Archives II in College Park, Maryland (a 35 minute drive from downtown DC). The cartographic and architectural branch has original plans for U.S. warships dating back over 100 years (and I think there are some going back nearly 200 years), and the still photo branch has photographs of U.S. and foreign warships from various government collections (bureau of shipyards, bureau of aeronautics, department of the navy, etc.). You can xerox the photos on site, photograph them with your own camera using one of the photo stands located in the still photo branch research room, scan them into your laptop, or order prints of the photos you need (these are not cheap and it can take several weeks to fill an order). I have done many hours of research at the archives and consider it an invaluable resource. For general information about hours of operation and directions call (301) 713-6800. To speak to a reference archivist about your research interests, call (301) 713-6779. You may access the National Archives web page at www.nara.gov. While in Washington, visit the U.S. Naval Academy in Annapolis, Maryland (40 minutes by car from downtown DC). Prebble Hall is home to the Naval Academy Museum, the Class of 1951 Gallery of Ships model collection, and the U.S. Naval Institute book store, library, and photo collection. The Naval Academy Museum tells the history of the U.S. Navy and is home to a small number of very nice models. In particular, check out the 1/96 scale model of the U.S.S. Maury (DD-401) wearing her stunning interwar standard light grey finish. This is one of the most beautiful ship models I have ever seen. In the basement, the Class of 1951 Gallery of Ships is a must-see for fans of 18th and 19th century men-o-war (the collection includes both bone and ivory PoW models and wooden plank-on-frame models). Finally, the U.S. Naval Institute Library has a good book collection (which, however, is not particularly well organized and thus is difficult to use) and an excellent photo collection that focuses on U.S. and allied ships. If you are researching a particular ship, the National Archives II and Naval Institute photo collections are vital resources. So that's about it! Happy trails to all you SMMLies who are on the road, and those who have plans to visit the Washington DC area this summer! Best wishes, Mike Eisenstadt -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: "Paul O'Reilly" Subject: Re: USS Norton Sound and USS Pine Island Greetings All, I have a few black and white photo-copied shots of USS Norton Sound just after she was commissioned, Feb 45 or so. I also have a photo taken of the flight deck, if that's what it was called, in the spring of 45 just after the ship had been through a typhoon. The Mariner on deck is laying on its side, missing the outer half of both wings! The deck is wood with the planks running fore and aft, not athwartships like they do on American carriers. I sanded the deck plating off the flight deck and scribed in some deck planking. If anyone wants a scan of the photos send me an email off-line and I'll answer when I get back from my trip in a week or so. Cheers, Paul O'Reilly Victoria, BC -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: Re: SMML across America Kurt, When you get to the Big Apple we will roll out the Red Carpet when you visit the Naval Base Hobbies. 1/2 a block from Bloomingdales. 118 E. 59th St. #405 NYC 212-759-1846 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume