Subject: SMML11/06/99VOL573 Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 23:55:10 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: ROCKET BOATS 2: Re: Yamato gun canvas colors 3: Re: Boot Topping 4: Cat-astrophic intervention 5: Re: Maine??? 6: Re: Boot Topping 7: C.A.T.S. 8: Re: Maine Marine Museums 9: Re: Modeler spouses gripes. 10: Re: H-R Products 11: Re: Other models you build 12: Re: Modeler spouses gripes 13: Aurora colors (was Potemkin colors) 14: Re: Maine???? 15: Wife follow-up 16: Re: Feline Menace 17: Sonar Head, Fletcher Class DD 18: Re: LCS (S) 19: HMS Nelson colours 20: USS Oriskany's news 21: Re: tampons and tampions 22: Civil war ironclads - new subscriber 23: Re: H class destroyers 24: Re: C.A.T.S. 25: Re: H&R Ship Fittings 26: Re: Maine 27: Re: HR Products 28: 310' destroyer 29: Re: C.A.T.S./ G.E.R.B.I.L.S. 30: Modeler's Spouses 31: Aurora 1/400 Enterprise 32: Building Your Own Display Cases -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: New 1/350 scale antiaircraft gun detail set 2: International Maritime Modeling Website URL 3: USS Pine Island -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Baker Subject: ROCKET BOATS Data, photos, and plans for ALL USN and most British landing craft and landing ships can be found in the U.S.Naval Institute Press's reprint of ONI 222 ALLIED LANDING CRAFT, which I edited for their co-publisher Arms and Armour Press in the U.K., about 20 years ago; it's still in print. The book is still the most complete source of information on the subject. Best/Dave Baker -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "foeth" Subject: Re: Yamato gun canvas colors If I'm not mistaken, Januz Skulskie mentiones in his book that the covers should be brown during wartime, but those were the barelcovers. I'm not sure if he meant the canvas covers between the turret face plate and the canons. But the main point, if you are building a ten-ichi-go Yamato, you probably need no covers at all. Not sure though! Ej Foeth -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Re: Boot Topping Hi SMML, Speaking of boot topping, it seems that a number of models of German warships of the WWI and WWII periods have a boot topping that is more a medium or dark grey than black. Was it standard German practice in WWI or WWII to paint a ship's boot topping a grey color rather than black? Or are my eyes deceiving me? Thanks, Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "foeth" Subject: Cat-astrophic intervention That incident with my Enterprice wasn't the only thing: I once made a Tamiya 1/32 Tomcat. My very first oilwashed model, which I put on general display around the house. Anyway, one of my cats jumped on the table, and started sniffing at the weird paints. I thought that little could go wrong with the small animal, and if she wanted it off the table, I'd be there to stop her. The cat slowly sniffed her way around the model, as cats tenf to do when they see something new, and arrived at the nose of the fighter...and...Oh horror...bit on the nose! 4 very deep scratches scraping all the paint off! Back to the modeling table for some repairs, after I stopped crying. The cat still tries to bite anything with the same smell. Ah, than our small cat Mouse, which never really got to be properly housetrained. Couple that fact with a special T-72 picture book I've been looking for for a year, and you can guess what happened. Fortunately, I found my next copy rather quickly! The Titanic book below it was never recovered. The cat was repatriated. Cats should be kept out of the modeling room, but so now and then, one of them installs him/her self on my modeling bench on the specially designated cat sleeping area (I gave up keeping it cat free). If you think painting small detail is difficult, try it with a playfull cat attacking the end of your brush! EJ Foeth -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Vincent.McCullough@trw.com (Vincent McCullough) Subject: Re: Maine??? Tne Nautical Research Guild's "Maritime Institution Survey, Museum Listing and Links" page lists five maritime museums in Maine. The Penobscot Marine Museum just opened an exhibit on shipmodeling which, according to Dave Blanchard, editor of the Nautical Research Journal, is being VERY well received. The NRG's web page can be found at http://www.naut-res-guild.org. The link to the maritime institution survey page is about halfway down the page. The page lists 280 or so museums, but in the US and abroad. If you're going to be vacationing or traveling on business, you may want to check the page to see if there are any maritime museums near your destination. Vince McCullough NRG Webmaster Chantilly, Virginia -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Les Case" Subject: Re: Boot Topping >> The purpose of boot topping, quite simply, is to hide the nasty, scummy oil stains that would accumulate at waterline. Boot topping became a necessity with the onset of the industrial revolution and particularly with the move from coal to oil fuel. All that stuff that floats on top of harbor waters tends to muck up the sides of ships floating therein. Black boot-topping hides that. The boot topping itself has to be deep enough to allow for variations in the ship's displacement from light draught to full load. << I don't mean to sound flip, but how did the white boot toppings on some liners-- particularly Cunard's-- hide that unsightly ring around the waterline? And if harbour water was so foul that one had to take cosmetic steps to hide the damage caused by it, why would passenger lines ever paint a ship white all over? Unless I don't understand the definition of "boot topping." Les Case -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: Mark McKellar Subject: C.A.T.S. Reminds me of an old Monty Python skit of a televised amature talent show... Announcer: So what does your cat do? Performer: She flies across the stage and lands in a bucket of water. Announcer: Oh, does she do this by herself? Performer: No, I fliing her. Sounds of mewing cat being whirled faster and faster 'round the performer's head - Mew, mew, mew, mew... Splash! I love my cats but.....there is a limit Mark -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: ALROSS2@aol.com Subject: Re: Maine Marine Museums >> I have this vague recollection of some discusson of a marine museum in Maine on the list some time back.... << There are two marine museums within a couple hours of Portland. Marine Maritime Museum is up in Bath and the Penobscot Marine Museum is up in Searsport. Take 295 N from Portland and get off at the Brunswick/Bath exit to Route 1. Stay on 1 and follow the signs to the MMM at Bath. It will take you about 45 minutes to get there from Portland. To get the the PMM, follow RT1 North from Bath for another 45 minutes or so, heading towards Rockland. Take a left onto Rt 90 to Camden (about 20 minutes, and turn left (North) back onto RT1. Searsport is about 40 minutes up the road. MMM has some great models, including a Gibbs and Cox 1/48 scale DEHAVEN (DD 727). PMM has just opened an exhibit featuring models made by our "professional" group - Maine Marine Modelmakers. If you get up this way, feel free to give me a call (and that goes for any SMMLies travelling in Maine). I'm about 40 minutes north of Searsport in Bangor. Al Ross II (207) 942-6671 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "J. London" Subject: Re: Modeler spouses gripes. Just a thought! I once heard it said that a man with a hobby will never go mad; his wife probably will - but he won't. Mike London -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Vincent.McCullough@trw.com (Vincent McCullough) Subject: Re: H-R Products From the NRG's "Sources" Page (http://www.naut-res-guild.org/sources): H-R Products P.O. Box 67 McHenry, IL 60050 Web Site link: http://www.msn.fullfeed.com/~hracct/ Vince McCullough NRG Webmaster Chantilly, Virginia -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Other models you build After reading about the sci-fi folks using the light sheets to light their models, I was interested to know they were on a ship modeling site. I love to build sci-fi models every now and then. Mostly to escape the technical reality of ship modeling. The object (for the most part) with sci-fi as I see it, is the freedom to do whatever it takes to make it look good and believable (my apologies to the Star Trek guys). I built a model of the USS Reliant (You know, the ship Khan stole in the second movie) which was published in FSM entitled "Super Detailing with Decals". To make a realistic finish I cut up over 800 decals to adorn the hull to give the multi panel effect. But enough of that. I would like to know what other kinds of models ship builders delve into. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ Hi Rusty, Well I'm a mongrel modeller outside of ship modelling, ie: anything that takes my fancy (I'm nearly finished an E Type Jag Airfix 1/32). Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Les Case" Subject: Re: Modeler spouses gripes I don't know from wives, but I think my partner of twenty years is ambivalent on the subject: he doesn't particularly want to participate in my hobby but he says the resulting models are pretty cool; he wonders where I'm going to put all those finished ocean liners (and all those big coffee table books about ocean liners); and I think he finds it a bit annoying that I buy new kits before I've finished building the ones I already have (although he has so far been willing to indulge me when I want to spend vacation time visiting hobby shops in other cities). I suspect, though, what may finally concern him more than anything is the rather obsessive way I tend to pursure my hobby. Hell, sometimes it concerns me too. Let's face it: trying to paint alternating red and white bands on a 1/600 photo-etched life preserver is obsessive. Then again, he may just be less than thrilled by the prospect of booking passage to Europe on the QE2. But you know, if he asked me to give it up, I would. Les Case -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: louellet@uism.bu.edu Subject: Aurora colors (was Potemkin colors) Hello SMMLies, I printed all the Potemkin color information, so I want to say thanks also. Here is my request: What would be the appropriate colors for the Aurora? I have the Russian issues of both kits and can't read Cyrillic. If anyone knows what time frame the ex-Heller kit depicts the Aurora, that may be of help. Thanks in advance. Larry Ouellette louellet@uism.bu.edu Volunteer, USS Salem (CA 139) U.S. Naval & Shipbuilding Museum Quincy, Massachusetts http://www.uss-salem.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: SeaPhoto@aol.com Subject: Re: Maine???? Mark McKellar writes: >> I have this vague recollection of some discusson of a marine museum in Maine on the list some time back.... [Snip] Anyone suggest what where etc...... << The one I was writing about was in Bath, Maine, just down from Bath Iron Works, where the Destroyers are built. I don't have a map in front of me, so I am not sure how far that is from Portand. Kurt Greiner SeaPhoto Maritime Photography Now with online ordering! http://www.modelersboatyard.com/seaphoto -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: Alan Lindstrom Subject: Wife follow-up If I told my wife that I was going to spend 5 hours playing golf on Saturday, or the entire day scuba diving, that would be OK (provided I didn't do it too often), but if I told her that I was going to spend 4 hours on Saturday working on models, she would suggest that I might want to find something more productive to do. Figure that. Alan -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: Joe Costanzo Subject: Re: Feline Menace I hear ya Rusty! My Missour- er, Iowa is currently being reconstructed after being capsized by my cat -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: Alan Simon Subject: Sonar Head, Fletcher Class DD My references show different shapes/sizes for external sonar head(dome) at bottom of hull, forward of Mount 51. Can anyone spare a drawing or at least describe correct shape/size for late '44 square bridge Fletcher (USS Johnston DD557)? Thanks in advance. Alan Simon Atlanta, GA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Re: LCS (S) According to Yves Buffetaut's book 'D-Day Ships' (Conway), the LCS (S) was the US version of the British LCS (M), but based on the LCVP instead of the LCA as the British one was. Armament was stated as being a mixture of 0.5" and 0.3" MGs, rocket launchers and smoke pots and crew six. The book contains side elevation and plan views of the LCVP and LCS (S) - the latter confusingly miscaptioned as LSC (2), a very different beast - but not the LCS (S). The only illustrations I have found are in the ISO Publications book Outlines 7 - Landing Craft, by Martin Brice. This has photos of an LCS (S) (1), which has what appears to be a twin .30 mount on the bridge and forward-facing rocket rails aft of it. The text gives dimensions of 36' 8" x 10' 10" x 3' 6", crew 14, three MGs, two rocket projectors and smoke pots. There is also a photo of the similar (diesel instead of petrol engine) LCS (S) (2), with a twin MG visible on the bridge and a three row rocket pack to starboard of the bridge. Finally, there is a small (1" long) colour illustration of a Mk.1 in what looks like Ms.21, which shows an aft-facing MG mount in the well behind the bridge as well as one in the position described above. The photos are probably (going by the acknowledgements) all from the Imperial War Museum, so an enquiry to their photographic library could well yield useful results. It also refers to 'Notes on the Development of Landing Craft' by R Baker and published by the Institute of Naval Architects, which apparently contains many of the diagrams used in the book. It may even have an LCS (S) drawing.... Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: HMS Nelson colours This scheme (Admiralty Standard scheme A) was covered by Alan Raven in his recent series in Plastic Ship Modeler (1997/1). Steel decks not covered with corticene, semtex or asphalt should be painted B15 blue and topmasts white. However, the panel on the hull should surely be B20 blue (rather than dark grey) on G45 light grey as suggested in the posting? One point does occur to me on this. In the Raven & Roberts Man o' War book on Nelson and Rodney, the authors state that Nelson was repainted in the Admiralty Standard scheme when she was refitted in the US (ending January 1945). Would there have been sufficient RN pattern paint available to repaint the entire ship at the time (from her previous disruptive scheme) or is it possible that USN paint might have been used? Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: roberto paredes Subject: USS Oriskany's news Hi all, I supposed that the Oriskany had been scrapped, but yesterday this arrived on tow to the Valparaiso port (Chile) in route to Texas (the newspaper said it) to be broken up there. My favorite Essex carrier on his last trip :-( and passed in front of my house :-) Does anybody have more information about this? and pictures? Regards, Roberto -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: Re: tampons and tampions Gene wrote: >> Subject: Re: what's modeling about If I don't have all the rivets in the right places and if the tampons aren't in the gunbarrels, so sue me. << I will try to refrain from making any salacious jokes here, but I guess once you let those women aboard your ship, they'll just go leaving their stuff all over the place. (Seriously, both words are apparently derived from Old French, according to my dictionary.) Mike Alexandria, VA USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: Mark Fischer Subject: Civil war ironclads - new subscriber G'day Mate, I am interested in the color schemes of Civil War ironclads. Chief -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: Dave Judy Subject: Re: H class destroyers Guys, how about "Hermes" built for the Greek navy, served the German Navy in the Med. Dave Judy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Dave Judy Subject: Re: C.A.T.S. Jeff, My niece saw your post....she's a cat lover..so's my Doberman!! She wants to come and burn your house down!!!! Should I give her your address?? Dave Judy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: H&R Ship Fittings >> Got an address for HR Products, please? << They have a website at: http://www.msn.fullfeed.com/~hracct/ Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: Maine On the way up to Portland, you can stop at the Albacore museum in Portsmouth NH. Albacore was the experimental submarine with the "body of revolution" shape. Supposedly, she hit 33 knots underwater with silver-zinc batteries. Displayed in a unique way; they built a channel from the river, floated her in, closed it off, drained it and refilled the channel, so she sits up high on keel blocks. Nice little museum, right off I 95 before you cross over into Maine. There is IIRC, another maritime museum, but I thought that was further up around Bath. Tom Dougherty (who NEVER misses a chance to go on board a submarine!) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: HR Products How about a web site? It's at: HR.Products@msn.fullfeed.com Address is: HR Products, Inc. Post Office Box 67 McHenry, Illinois 60051 Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 28) From: WRPRESSINC@aol.com Subject: 310' destroyer On the matter of my involvement with the 310'destroyer kit put out by Bluejacket. As I recall, my contribution to updating the kit was in supplying a new set of general arrangement plans. I don't remember having anything to do with the instructions, but it's been several years so I may be wrong on that. I believe that the plans (which were loaned to me). and from which I drew the plans for the kit, were for the Macleish. I suggested to Bluejacket that the plans should be of a specific ship, but they made a deliberate decision that the plans NOT be labelled in this way. At some point in time after my involvement with Bluejacket, the company changed hands. Alan Raven -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 29) From: Minadmiral@aol.com Subject: Re: C.A.T.S./ G.E.R.B.I.L.S. Hi; Outpost.com has ran a comercial on TV with what appears to be a war (ACW) surplus #10 Parrot rifle, firing G.E.R.B.I.L.S. These seem to stay intact after firing, possibly the lower powder charge. They do not seem, though, to be a particularly accurate munition. Chuck Duggie -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 30) From: jakloek@kodak.com Subject: Modeler's Spouses Count my wife in with Rusty's as a spouse who not only approves, but encourages my pursuit of this hobby. Although she has never said as much, I think she has come to the same conclusions Rusty mentioned about why its a good deal I build ships. Not only does she approve, but over the years she has given me birthday, Christmas etc gifts which include things like airbrushes, compressors, and other tools. A recent gift was the Lacroix and Wells book on IJN cruisers. So if your significant other starts giving you a hard time about the hobby, ask her or him if you should take up golf instead. James Kloek -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 31) From: kenny_II Subject: Aurora 1/400 Enterprise Greeting all, I just acquired a 1/400 Big 'E'. The overall box and condition don't make it a good collectible candidate, so I'm planning on building it. Any suggestions on photo etch, accurizing required, stuff like that? Also, the decal sheet looks scary, mildewed pretty badly. Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Tim Maleck -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 32) From: Felix Bustelo Subject: Building Your Own Display Cases Rusty, I am sure that a lot of us will be very interested in getting tips on how you build your plastic display cases. I brought some plexiglass from Home Depot, hoping to make some "bubbles" for a couple of my models. What do you use to cut the plastic (or do you take it to a hardware store to have it cut?). What do you use to glue the sections together? How do you keep the sections from falling over and keeping them straight when you are assembling the case? I don't have a cat and I doubt that my dachshund can jump high enough to reach the shelves. Cases will help keep the dust off the models and help protect them when I take them to shows and fairs. Thanks, Felix Bustelo Webmaster International Maritime Modeling http://members.tripod.com/~Febus65/imm.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Loren Perry Subject: New 1/350 scale antiaircraft gun detail set Gold Medal Models has upgraded its No. 350-10 40mm antiaircraft gun detail set to include parts for 20mm Oerlikons as well. The set now provides guardrails and gunsights (with crosshairs) for twenty-five (25) 40mm Quad Bofors mounts plus armor shields, hand wheels, gunsights, and shoulder rests for sixty (60) 20mm Oerlikon cannon. Suitable for any 1/350 scale WW2 era warship kit such as Tamiya's WW2 Missouri, Classic Warship's North Carolina & Washington, and many others. Illustrated instructions are etched onto the brass sheet itself. Price is $8 plus postage. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Felix Bustelo Subject: International Maritime Modeling Website URL Hello all, In my rush to get the annoucement, I neglected in including one very important piece of information - the damn address! Here it is: http://members.tripod.com/~Febus65/imm.htm My thanks to those who emailed me to point out this omission - you know who you are. BTW - Check out the latest vote count for the subject of the Atlantic Models 1/600 scale resin kit. One more voter sent an email since I posted the update. Please keep the votes coming in. Regards, Felix Bustelo Humble and Forgetful Webmaster International Maritime Modeling -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: USS Pine Island Is available at The Naval Base http://www.modelshipbuilding.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume