Subject: SMML23/07/99VOL615 Date: Sat, 24 Jul 1999 00:07:34 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: 1/500 Destroyers 2: Re: Bismarck 350/400 3: First Ships 4: First model 5: Re: First Model 6: My first ship model 7: My First Model 8: Re: First Model 9: Re: First Ship Model 10: Re: First model 11: Re: First Shipmodel 12: First ship model and why ship modelling 13: Re: first ship model 14: Re: First Ship Model 15: Re: First Ship Model 16: Re: First Model 17: Re: What got US into ship modelling! 18: Re: Your first model - Mistress Lorna asks! 19: Re: First Ship Model 20: First model 21: Re: Your first model - Mistress Lorna asks! 22: First model & first ship model...hmmmm 23: Re: first ship model kit 24: First ship model 25: Your first model - Mistress Lorna asks! 26: First Model 27: Your first model - Mistress Lorna Asks 28: Re: Lionfish/Drum/Tigerfish? 29: Re: USS Hornet's CIC 30: My first ship model 31: Re: First Model 32: St. Louis Lattice Work and First Ship Model 33: Victory Ship Colors 34: Re: Marines Magazine 35: MY FIRST SHIP, ETC. 36: First models 37: Re: Your first model - Mistress Lorna asks 38: Re: first ship model 39: My First Model 40: Tamiya 1/700 USS Enterprise CV-6 41: first ship model 42: The 1st model poll 43: First models 44: First Model -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Jim Shirley Ships 2: LCVP's and the USS Olympia 3: AIRFIX 1/72 E-BOATS 4: Warship Update -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS Wow! What a great response to my question. I love to hear people tell of their early modelling experiences and what drew them to the hobby. Keep em coming. It's fascinating Mistress Lorna -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Katz, Gene S" Subject: 1/500 Destroyers First, thanks for the responses to my items for sale; still sorting thru them, I haven't forgotten. Second, any input on the 1/500 DDs (as advertised in PacFront) insofar as detail level, quality. Price is attractive, but you also get what you pay for. Polish Burza, Cossack, and H & I RN type are the ones. Thanks, Gene -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "joseph w. reyna" Subject: Re: Bismarck 350/400 Ken, et al SMMLers/ies/ettes, Something else to consider when deciding whether to go with the 1/400 BISMARCK (I personally feel the Heller kit stacks up just fine with the Tamiya kit) - HELLER also produces the KING GEORGE V (early configuration, more resembling the PRINCE OF WALES) and the HMS HOOD battlecruiser. Imagine staging in 1/400 a display of the Heller POW and HOOD vs. the BISMARCK and PRINZ EUGEN. Yup, you'll need PLENTY of room, but they'd look awfully good. Then, or course, Heller also has the SCHARNHORST and GNEISENAU, which, along with PRINZ EUGEN and Heller's Z-class destroyers, Torpedo boats, and S-BOOTS, could display the "Channel Dash". I could easily see myself knocking out a wall or two just to display these items, .......oops, wife is glaring at me right now, better switch over to the Barbie website FAST!!!! Cheers! Joe Reyna For goodness sake Joe, get her involved in modelling quickly!!! It's a darn sight cheaper - next time anyone wants to feel comfortable about buying another kit hop to one of these sites and take a look at the prices. Some of them could keep you in resin and p/e for a good six months Mistress Lorna -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: crofoot@bfm.org (Crofoot, Christopher) Subject: First Ships My first ship was the venerable Revell USS Arizona. I picked it up for a song at a dime store that was going out of business. Why ships? I'm an Army man myself but ships (the best of them at least) express a visible grace and line that other subjects can't match. There's also the romantic notion of the travel to destinations "out there over the horizons." Plus I enjoy the challenge of a subject so large packed into such a small scale...oh...yeah and I hate painting figures so naval dioramas are not a chore but a delight! Chris Go Army beat Navy! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Donald Bridge Subject: First model Relying on my dodgy memory it was either the Airfix H.M.S. Daring or the Frog H.M.S. Tiger (I received them both at about the same time, some time in the late 60s I think). I then proceeded to make a diorama out of them, scale did not seem so important then! Since then I've gone through what seems to be the usual building planes & armor phases before coming back to ships. These days I still mostly build in 1/700 or 1/600 of anything that was around after 1970. The only disappointment I have is that no one builds kits of anything I've been afloat in or broken, sorry searched. But merchant vessels and Customs cutters (unarmed) do not seem that popular. Don Bridge Sarajevo -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Katz, Gene S" Subject: Re: First Model Howdy Y'all If I can peer back through the fog correctly, the very first was a Revell PT Boat (109?). The Revell Missouri was probably next, followed by Aurora Atlantis, Renwal North Carolina or Washington (I forget). Largest ship model was the Sterling American Scout for radio control. I had a Strombecker DD (USS Hobby?) that was wood with a packet of dry glue, but I was really too young for it. I recall my father having a fit over my buying the Revell PT with my savings, probably $2, such an extravagant expense. Ships have been in my blood (and paychecks) ever since. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Joseph Poutre Subject: My first ship model I have no idea what I built first. Maybe the Revell 1/720 Enterprise, back in the late 1960s. All glue spots and strings, with only a black waterline for a paint job. Others followed, and I went on to custom vans, then armor, then abandoned the hobbyi as a teenager. Growing up, I always loved the sea, so I guess that's why I've come back to ships. My first ship after renewing my interest was the IJN Mutsu, bought to build as the Nagato, the only Japanese BB to survive WWII intact. After only a few years, it looks rather pathetic and in need of a rebuilding, but that's part of the learning process. Joe Joseph Poutre, aka The Mad Mathematician N2KOW Trustee and Co-Webmaster, Battleship New Jersey Historical Museum Society http://www.bb62museum.org/ Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Humber, Thom" Subject: My First Model My first model was indeed a ship model: the Monogram USS Missouri, around 1/600-720 scale or so. Not a very expensive kit, but my parents didn't have much money and I thought it was the coolest thing I had every seen. I "earned" this kit, as a budding little eight year old modeller, by writing a one page report with a brief history of the ship. My mom decided that if I was going to build the ship, I should know a little something about it; as well as work on my composition skills. If she only knew that now I spend at least 3 months, minimum, doing research for my next project. (That history minor at university did help!!) As I recall the finished product did not, to my dismay, look anything like the box art. Where were the railings?...the rigging?...all of the REALLY cool details that I saw on my friends tank and airplane models (and on the box for that matter)? I made the best I could of it, however, except maybe the .5 inch wavy black boot topping and the VERY bright fire engine red hull below the waterline. (I had no concept of scale!) But it did open the door to modelling, and sparked my interest in nautical/naval history. What a neat idea, Mistress Lorna. Not only does it allow others to share, but it also allows us to reminisce and remember happy times of modelling in our youth. You're doing a good job holding the reins. Tell Shane he is in our prayers and we hope he gets better soon. Thom Humber Fountain, CO (Eagerly anticipating autumn, and the cool temps that it brings.) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Vincent McCullough" Subject: Re: First Model Mistress Lorna: I am AMAZED how many people can remember their first model. For me, that was almost 40 years and many moves around the United States ago, during which all models gradually vanished (moves are a great opportunity to clean out). Anyway, I KNOW that I built at least three ship models back then: Revell's Arizona, the "see through" SSBN (George Washington? Ethan Allen?) and some aircraft carrier. But I couldn't begin to guess which was first. More recently (MUCH more) I got back into modeling doing "stick and strings," and then added steel navy. I'm currently working, more or less simultaneously, on a 14 gun privateer (wood) and Iron Shipwright's 1:350 Liberty Ship (resin). Hope Shane's doing better. Tell him he needs to take it easy on the gymnastics! Vince McCullough Chantilly, VA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "J. London" Subject: Re: First Ship Model My first ship model: This really strained the old brainbox. I was a 14 year-old schoolboy in wartime England (no plastic ship kits then) and got a second hand copy of a book WATERLINE SHIP MODELS by E.C. Talbot-Booth (still have it). In it was a 1:1200 plan of the T&J Harrison INANDA of 1925 which I, for some reason, liked. So I scratchbuilt it out of cardboard. I am still building to this scale 57 years later though cardboard was long ago replaced by more solid materials and have about 350 merchant and warships in my collection. I now use a combination of polyester resin (a.k.a. car body filler) and plastic card and am currently working on the STOCKHOLM, you know the ship that rammed and sank the ANDREA DORIA back in 1956. I already have a model of the latter. Mike London -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Jean-Cyrille WAAG" Subject: Re: First model Hello Lorna, My first ship model was the old Airifx E-boat during the seventies as I always been a fan of the Kriegsmarine. Jean-Cyrille -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Fritz Koopman Subject: Re: First Shipmodel I seem to recall that my first plastic shipmodel was the Revell USS Massachusetts that I picked up durring my first visit to the ship back when I was about six. It ultimately met its fate in Redds' Pond in Marblehead MA with the imaginative use of 4 M-80 firecrackers. Propably still on the bottom out there. My first wood ship model was the Scientific brand HMS Bounty (precarved hull type) built later on the same year. This wound up on the top shelf of my book shelves in my room. I rediscovered the model while visiting my parents house two years ago, Still on the shelf in my old room, not having moved in the twenty years since I put it there. The acumulated dust and cobwebs almost thick enough to erase any semblance to being a ship. Unfortunately the stuff just would'nt come off (especially the dust coating the rigging) despite my best efforts, and I had to pitch it with little ceremony. Best Regards Fritz Koopman -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Jens H. Brandal" Subject: First ship model and why ship modelling It may not be my first ship model, but the earliest I can remember is buying the Airfix Bismarck while on holiday many years ago. It was assembled in a day, and I went out to play with it in a small pond by my grandmothers house. When I came home I painted it dark grey, black and red. This was before I had heard of masking, so the boot topping was painted freehand with a no. 4 brush... Why ship modelling? Being a mechanical design engineer, I have an appreciation for form and function of mechanical objects. Aircraft are my primary object of affection, but ships, military vehicles and cars are areas of interest. I like building models of ships because I admire their elegance and purposeful lines, and this applies to aircraft, tanks and cars too. Simple as that :) Jens -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "Fox, John" Subject: Re: first ship model As far as I can remember, my first ship model was Aurora's USS Bainbridge back in the early to mid 70's. She was still rated as a Guided Missle Frigate then. Shortly thereafter I built Aurora's USS Iowa and USS St. Paul. The nice thing about Aurora's kits were the flat bottoms. You didn't need a stand for them! I had most of my models up until the time I went into the Navy in '81. Then my parents moved and got rid of all my stuff. (At least they gave me their new address) I still have pictures of them though. My first kit that I used references and aftermarket stuff and scratchbuilding was Skywave's Fletcher that I built as USS Kidd in '92 or '93. John Fox Lindenhurst NY -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: SeaPhoto@aol.com Subject: Re: First Ship Model Hello Lorna, First, thank for doing such a great job in Shane's absence. My best wishes for a speedy recovery. Having had back problems in the past myself, he has my sympathies! My first ship model was the Revell USS Constitution, started by my brother. Somewhere along the line he lost the masts, so I turned it into a working pool model, first mounting an electric motor and airplane propellor on the stern, turning it into perhaps the first electric powered sailing frigate. Later, she became my test bed for other advanced technology experiments, including retrofitting a shaft and traditional ship propeller, a remote wire control and other goodies. The fun of playing when you are 11! By that time, she had gained additional armament from other ship and tank models, as well as a marine company of Roman troops care of Atlantis. Kurt Greiner SeaPhoto -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Mark L. Shannon" Subject: Re: First Ship Model I'm finding this a bit of a stumper as to which was first. (never had to worry about that for another part of my life) I've narrowed it down to: Pyro (?) "Admiralty Brig" Pyro (?) "Half Moon" Pyro Prinz Eugen (my brother built the Bismarck) (1/1200 (or 1/2000 scale) or Savanah (I think the same kit available from Glencoe) With my father's help. Anyway, I've always had a weakness for the "wooden walls". Early WWII ships (up to Guadalcanal, after that it was just mop-up ;{)), and the working stiff boats. Mark L. Shannon The early bird gets the worm, but it's the second mouse that gets the cheese. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: NAVYDAZE@aol.com Subject: Re: First Model When very young and a Cub Scout, our "troop" went aboard the USS HELENA. As they had no model at that time they all gave us a model of the USS ST. PAUL which was tied up along side. I have been building them ever since and lately doing a lot of aircraft models also. Both have been very helpful with my paintings. Michael Donegan NAVYDAZE - Naval & Aviation Art -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: Re: What got US into ship modelling! Well, Chaps and Chapesses, Quite a long story really. Caroline(me) first! Back ca. 1969, my brother and myself built and painted (possibly quite badly..) aircraft models.. and hung them from our ceilings. Every last penny of pocket money was saved for this purpose (I seem to remember we got two shillings a week each, which had to also buy stamps for the collections!) I found after a while, that aircraft tended to be a bit "samey".. So, I thought I would have a go at an Airfix Hotspur, as Airfix were amongst the cheapest at that time (and still are!).. my mum thought the model was brilliant anyhow and kept it till I was in my twenties.. It took me ages, and I remember my brother trashing my pride and joy in a fit of pique... then I met Dave C. and White Ensign Models some 19 years on (Dave started WEM over 15 years ago after he reckoned that the newly-released GMM etched brass sets would do well over here in the U.K...) and the interest took off once more... and, as many of you know, I confess that my interest now borders on the obsessive (so the other half tells me anyway!!) We have a variety of 1/2-finished ship models sitting here, and a few built models, all plastics, but we haven't completed one of our own kits, although I am determined to get this 1/700 Bluebell finished before I die.. From a Sir Winston Churchill (the STA schooner we met on) to a Fujimi Kongo.. also a variety of aircraft (Dave's first love which he started doing at about 6 years of age) which are being (massively!) super-detailed at this time by Dave, who, when he finds the time, is a top-notch modeller (much better than me it has to be said).... 'cept he's seriously colourblind so can only build successfully in shades of grey!! Anyhows, it's been nice reading everyone's posts... and I would be interested to know what got Lorna's own interest going in WWI aircraft modelling anyhow..go, on, Lorna, tell us!! Cheers! Caroline C. White Ensign Models Hi Caroline, Would you believe it was 'Rilla of Ingleside' by LM Montgomery which tells the story of WW1 through the eyes of those who stayed at home - I think I was 11 at the time. I had to get the atlas out to work out where all these battles were being fought, then of course realised that the atlas doesn't show small villages etc so had to go to the library borrow some books and somewhere in one of those books I saw an Albatros (D.III I think) and thought wow! Got interested in early aviation and WW1 but it wasn't till Shane dragged me into a model shop to get some wargaming stuff that I realised there were kits of these wonderful things. I thought only ships, late aircraft, cars and tanks were kitted - not anything interesting ;-) I can still remember the feeling of "you mean I can have my own Albatross? Lead me to it!" From wanting to build an Albatross to now having close to 100 kits in the stash, my own work area, shelves full of reference, regular WW1 modelling list reader, becoming editor of our club magazine and a whole network of friends met through the net - I LOVE THIS HOBBY :-) Mistress Lorna -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: Re: Your first model - Mistress Lorna asks! Actually, I confess that I read the above incorrectly at first.. "Your First Mistress-Model Lorna asks!" Cheers CC (sorry Lorna, couldn't resist!) WEM It's ok Caroline. BTW when will the Model Bikini Caroline be released :-) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: Jon Parshall Subject: Re: First Ship Model Mistress Lorna: I was in fifth grade and I bought a kit of the Japanese heavy cruiser Haguro. I just thought she looked so incredibly *boss* with her big superstructure and 5 main turrets. And her funky re-curved bow. That one innocent act sealed my doom. Jon Parshall Imperial Japanese Navy Homepage http://www.skypoint.com/members/jbp/kaigun.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: hpetersen@zebra.net (Dr. Hazel Petersen) Subject: First model Hi all, First model was a model of the Wright Brothers' plane at Kitty Hawk. Second was a model of the human heart that opened up. Pretty cool for a 5th grader. Third, and first ship model, was the Revell (?) CSS Alabama. You know, if you stuff the hull full of toy pistol caps and set them off, the historical reenactment of the Alabama's sinking is pretty realistic. Unfortunately, my mother saw it and her reaction was pretty realistic too. Almost grim, one might say. Glenn Merrill Mobile, Alabama -hot and humid, but what else is new? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: "Arjun Sarup" Subject: Re: Your first model - Mistress Lorna asks! Hello Lorna, Mine was the Scharnhorst, thanks to my Mom who brought it back from England to India. She happened to choose the model, and it was "Wow!!!" when I got it. Studies took a back seat for a few weeks. (Okay, studying was already a bit low on priorities, so it slipped a few points further.) Best wishes, Arjun Sarup Mauritius -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: "Jeff Herne" Subject: First model & first ship model...hmmmm My remember my first model as being a 1/32 Revell F-4U Corsair. Upon completion, it was promptly secured to a 1/32 'carrier deck' fashioned from a piece of scrap wood paneling from Dad's shop. If I remember correctly, I got into trouble for using the power saw without permission... That was some time ago...since then I've added about 1100 (that's right) 1/72 WW2 a/c models to the collection, part of which is on display at the Teaneck Library in Teaneck NJ. Serious ship builds (the last 4 years) today number about 50 or 60 thus far, the Pearl Harbor Projekt will no doubt add to that.... First ship....the Lindbergh Bismarck, the real bad motorized one. Dad was a model railroader at the time, and our only hobby shop was 2 hours away. I saw it on the first trip, and 3 months later (an eternity for an 10 year old) Dad bought it for me. I remember building it, then spraying it with gray automotive primer and Testors red...I think she met her demise like her full size sister, rolling over and sinking to the bottom of the swimming pool. The memories you can dig up with one question....thanks Lorna. Jeff Herne -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: SantMin@aol.com Subject: Re: first ship model kit Wow, every one of you guys started out on a plastic model!!!!!!! Makes me feel old. My fist ship model kit was most likely during or just prior to WWII and there were no plastic kits back then! My first kits were wood, or paper, and then during WWII when there was a shortage of everything, many kits had molded peanut shell and glue hulls and balsa superstructures. Cheers, Bob Santos -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: jmaine@golden.net Subject: First ship model About first ship models. . . I bought my first ship model on Christmas Eve in 1961 at the age of nine. My older sister and I were bouncing around the house, wanting desperately for it to be Christmas Day, and generally driving my mother nuts. She suggested, very firmly as I recall, that we go outside and, since we had a little leftover holiday money burning a hole in our pockets, we headed for the local five-and-dime. Once there I beheld a sight I'd never seen before - a couple of shelves full of newly-imported Eagle ship kits from England. Battleships, cruisers, aircraft carriers, all in brightly coloured little boxes. After much looking and weighing of alternatives I bought the Lutzow, for 50 cents, mainly because of the wonderful picture on the box-top (I'd never heard of the ship before). It showed her in a silver-grey livery boldly crossing a beautiful, turquoise-coloured sea (I remember being very impressed). My sister, possibly with some encouragement from me, bought the H.M.S. Ajax (and even talked the cashier into letting her buy it for only 38 cents, which was all the money she had - well, it *was* Christmas Eve!). Neither of us had too much success in building these little models (1/1200 scale small parts are really, really small and fragile, especially when being handled by impatient kids!). All the same it opened up the world of military history and naval warfare for me. The back of the instruction sheet, which was relatively large, had a complete chronology of the ship and for the first time I read about ocean raiders, sea battles, torpedo bombers, etc., etc. I was hooked. I went on to build a lot more Eagle kits, and then Airfix and Revell kits later on (and a whack of aircraft models along the way). Much later, I got into 1/700 for a while but now I've come full circle and find myself building mainly 1/1200 plastic kits again, including some old Eagle stuff whenever I can get a hold of it. I guess you never forget your first love. . .! And thanks to Mistress Lorna for the great job - and Shane, get better soon! John Maine Kitchener, Ontario Who wishes Airfix had taken their 1/1200 Naval History Series more seriously (and would maybe re-issue them too, darn it!) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: "K. Hagerup" Subject: Your first model - Mistress Lorna asks! My first ship model was the larger Revell Arizona, built when I was around eight years old (nad a veteran aircraft builder for about three years). It was followed by a succession of sailing ships, culminating with the Revell 1/96 Constitution. It remained my pride and joy until my teenage years. Ken (Still plodding away on Amati's Type VII U-Boat) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: Terry Godwin Subject: First Model My first ship model was built in the late 40's or early 50's. It was a scratchbuilt all balsa model of a US destroyer. It was built from a photo. If memory serves it was about 30 inches long and not to any particular scale. I won a local model contest with it. I also built and still build stick model airplanes. I am just completing a 1/96 scale Sumner class destroyer that is semi-scratch with way too much detail. This was my first ship while in the navy. It is RC but I am becoming very reluctant to put it in the water because of the fragile detail. I collect 1200 ship models and also continue to build stick model airplanes and have a large model railroad. It all keeps me busy and make retirement worthwhile. Terry Godwin Englewood, CO -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: "Matt Melchert" Subject: Your first model - Mistress Lorna Asks Hi. I can't remember my first ship model as a kid. I built the Nautilus and Skipjack (Scorpion? memory fails me) submarines, maybe from Revell, and several several teeny tiny ships from Revell as well. More recently, I built Tamiya's 1/700 HMS Nelson back in 1994 for a D-Day exhibit our model club put on at the local library. It was supposed to represent the Nelson during shore bombardment during the Invasion. Loved building it and especially making the waves out of acrylic gel. It made a nice change from the aircraft I usually build. By the way, my next (ship model) project idea is to get Revell's 1/720 Arizona and convert it to USS Pennsylvania using the Tom's Modelworks PE sheet. I was born there (Pennsylvania, that is!), so I thought it would be somewhat appropriate. Has anybody tried this? How good is the Revell 1/720 Arizona, and how hard would it be to convert it? Cheers, Matt Melchert The Waikato Polytechnic Hamilton, New Zealand -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 28) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: Lionfish/Drum/Tigerfish? More sub questions! Great! >> More of my question though revolves around the "frog eyes" Revell added to the stern tubes. They might actually represent the correct thickness of the stern but just look wrong. Did you sand them down wholesale or try some other cutting and filling route? << I used initially coarse (200 IIRC) amd worked my way down to 600 as I got the bulges down. Take your time, and carefully inspect the work from a few angles as you go. You end up with a pretty decent stern shape. >> Other silly sub questions that might have already been answered: Did the hand lines stay rigged at sea or were they only erected for in port use? << In port only. Only lines (early war metal pipe, later heavy gauge wire) around the conning tower forward gun deck and aft "cigarette" deck stayed rigged. The line and posts wre stored in lockers to reduce underwater noise >> Do you sub experts actually drill out all the limber holes? How do you keep the edges sharp when you do it? << Yeah, I do. It's a real pain in the a**, but it looks really good when you are done. Here's where you need to do your research. Electric Boat and Manitowoc built boats had the sideways D-shaped openings that run along the very bottom of the light side plating, just above the pressure hull. Portsmouth, Mare Island and Cramp boats wre built to Gov't plans, and had the rounded slots for freeflood. Just to make it more complicated, skippers would have more freeflood holes cut in their sub to speed diving times (allowed trapped air to flow out and water in between the false upper deck and the pressure hull). Consequently, late in the war, a few EB built boats had the D-openings and the rounded slots. To make the holes, I drill an opening slightly smaller than the finished one, and use a file to carefully shape it to the sideways D. Slots you drill two holes and file out in between. Sand off all those Revell limber hole outlines in the plastic. This process of making the limber holes is VERY, VERY tedious... One guy in the SubCommittee who owns an R/C sub business actually made a photetch template for the sideways D-openings when he was building a Lionfish conversion to postwar radar picket Migraine II config. I tried to get him to produce one for me a few years later, but he couldn't find the masks... Of course I and others would greatly welcome such a photetch freeflood template (Are you listening here, Rusty???) if some kind soul produced one for sale. I would even help with scale drawings, etc. >> Did anyone ever figure out the correct color for the Tigerfish (Operation Petticoat)? << Basically, Pepto-Bismol pink. BTW, the submarine used for the movie was the USS Balao. >> My goal when I started this project was to model the USS Drum (Battleship Alabama Memorial). << OOPS, Drum is a Portsmouth boat, anchor on starboard, >> Revell did an Electric Boat, anchor to port, and I'm too far along to go back and rework the hull. << Don't you just hate that when it happens? >> I think I'm going to get me the Nautilus conversion for my birthday and do the Gato. << Which one; early as built, mid or late war consfigurations?? >> But if this project doesn't start coming together soon, I may just paint it pink and call it the Tigerfish. << Then it has to be a Balao- but IIRC, that was also a Portsmouth boat, anchor on starboard.... >> As for the gurgling sound, I have to get the electrical modelers to come up with a sound chip to go in the display base. << You may make your own gurgling sound before this is over. After all that needs to be done to correct the Lionfish kit, are there any questions WHY it has taken me over a year to do a conversion to a late war Balao (USS Blenny) for the WWII sub vet? I had to build the conning tower because I started in pre- Nautilus models conning tower days..... Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 29) From: louellet@uism.bu.edu Subject: Re: USS Hornet's CIC "Michael C. Smith" wrote: >> Just visited the Hornet this past weekend, and for those of you that haven't been there, you won't believe the good condition of the ship. I was fortunate to get a semi-private tour of the engine room (featuring some equipment from the Franklin (CV-13) and the Oriskany (CV-34)) and the CIC. Now any old museum ship has a CIC, but have you ever seen one that has all the equipment and lighting working? It was like being in a WWII movie - or more accurately a 1950's movie - the CIC dated from the late '50s. << If you get to the Boston area, be sure to visit the USS Salem in Quincy. We are fortunate to have a former crewman and plank owner who helped set up the SALEM's CIC back in 1949. He comes aboard most weekends to show anyone who will listen how all the equipment worked. All the equipment is functional but cannot be turned fully on due to Navy and FAA regulations. But we can, and do, energize the radars and repeaters, start the main antenna rotating, and show a sweep and target on the primary air radar. Bill Anderson has updated all the status boards to reflect day to day operations of the US 6th Fleet (Mediterranian) in 1959. He has labeled all the equipment, painted the decks, plotted SALEM's typical cruise through the Med on the navagation table, and has a scrap book on display with (previously classified) photos of the CIC in action in the early 1950's. Larry Ouellette louellet@uism.bu.edu Volunteer, USS Salem (CA 139) Hot and Humid Quincy, Massachusetts http://www.uss-salem.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 30) From: louellet@uism.bu.edu Subject: My first ship model My first ship model I don't remember my first model but I do remember buying my first model with my own money in the late 1960's or early 1970's. I had a whole dollar (4 weeks allowance) to spend at the local hobby shop (now long gone.) The kits didn't have price tags, so I kept bringing every kit I was interested in up to the cash register to find out the price. I soon figured out those numbers at the end of the item code of Revell kits and brought the USS Massachusetts up to the front. It came to $1.03 (3% Mass. tax) and I didn't have the extra 3 cents. The owner said don't worrry about it and I took my purchase home. I think I stopped by a few days later to pay off my 3 cent loan. Later ship kits incuded a Nautilus, and a Lindberg LSD that I floated in the bathtub to see how a well deck worked. I just picked up another LSD from eBay at a good price. This one isn't going into the tub. Larry Ouellette louellet@uism.bu.edu Volunteer, USS Salem (CA 139) Quincy, Massachusetts http://www.uss-salem.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 31) From: "Joe Norris" Subject: Re: First Model My first model ever was a Monogram U.S.S. America (CV-66). I weighted it so I could float it in the swimming pool. :-) Joe Norris -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 32) From: "James Kloek" Subject: St. Louis Lattice Work and First Ship Model A couple of years ago I built the Corsair Armada Phoenix/Honolulu kit, which are also Brooklyn class cruisers. The lattice work between the funnels is the searchlight tower. Tom's Modelworks (I'm pretty sure) makes a photoetch fret for these cruisers which includes this tower. I bought it from Bill Gruner at Pacific Front at the same time I bought the kit. Check with Bill if he still has stock. The kit and the brass built up to a really nice looking model. My first ship was actually ships. One year (in the mid-fifties) Revell marketed something called "The Admiral's Fleet", which was a big box containing a carrier, a BB (the Missouri I think), a cruiser (Baltimore class), a destroyer, and a sub (maybe the Nautilus). I bugged my parents sufficiently until they gave it to me for Christmas. After my 20 year hiatus from modeling, when I got back into it again, the first thing I tried was a Hasegawa long hull Essex. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 33) From: "Steve Sobieralski" Subject: Victory Ship Colors Does anyone know what colors Victory Ships were painted as launched during the WW2? My impression is that they were painted a medium (haze?) grey overall. Were they painted naval colors with deck blue decks or in some other scheme? Any info would be appreciated. Steve Sobieralski -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 34) From: kenny_II Subject: Re: Marines Magazine Jean-Cyrille, Thanks again for all you help, feel free to let me know if I can return the favor. Tim For the SMML record, Jean-Cyrille has gone way beyond the call of duty in helping me get this magazine and I wanted to say thank you publicly for the assistance. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 35) From: Baker Subject: MY FIRST SHIP, ETC. For Mistress Lorna's survey of first ship models: My first ship model, bought in 1947 (and still in a box in my sock drawer) was a 1:1200 Comet Metal Products LCIL; my father tried to get me to take it back on the grounds that $0.35 was too much to pay for so small an object. Then, in 1947, somebody gave me a book entitled HOW TO BUILD A MODEL NAVY by a man named Gilmore, and I was off into a life of crime. Something like a thousand 1:600 waterline models were churned out by the time I'd finished the first two years of high school--none of them very good, alas, but at least all scratch built. We used to blow them up by drilling a hole and inserting one Chinese fire cracker . . . Then I turned to 1:1200 scratchbuilding. Then I got married and stopped. Then I got old and have enough trouble seeing the parts in a 1:350 kit. On the minireview today of the latest book by David Brown, the author's comments about RN ship design are absolutely authoritative and exhaustively researched BUT, David has a marked bias against all things of U.S. naval design, possibly born of frustration that, no matter how hard they've tried, the Brits have never managed this century to produce contemporaneously as good a ship in any combatant category as the Americans. Hope the Web Master is feeling better spinally; been there, and know full well that it is no fun at all. It's also hard to build models while lying on your back, although with forebearance from one's wife, it IS possible to build plastic kits while recuperating in bed from an operation. Cheers/Dave -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 36) From: Denis & Marilyn Campbell Subject: First models Reading Felix Bustelo's reply to this thread made me think back to my boyhood. I also grew up in the Caribbean, Kingston Jamaica - during World War 2, when we could not get things as inconsequential as model kits (I don't think there were very many kits even in existence). I believe I wrote about this before in a post to SMML, but I used to make stern paddlewheelers out of my father's cigar boxes (we make cigars in Jamaica too, Felix) powered by rubber bands. Guess I was about 10 at the time. Later, I graduated to balsa gliders and rubber powered aircraft and, after came to the US, I made Revell's SS United States as a gift for my wife's father - which got him interested and he built three R/C boats - all Sterling kits, including the uss Missouri, about 4 feet long. I also built Revell's USS Constitution which is still in my playroom downstairs. Then, years of aircraft including 1:24 models of the three combatants, Spitfire, Hurricane amd ME109. Last year, I read an article about a model of USS Hornet in Fine Scale Modeler and asked for the kit for Christmas and my wife got the Tamiya 1:700 CV8 Instead of the Hasegawa CV12 - for which I was happy, because I made it to represent Doolitle's Tokyo raid in a sea of acrylic gel. It was on display at a local library for awhile so I am quite pleased with it. I guess that was my first REAL ship model and, now, I am well into Tamiya's 1:350 Missouri (had to buy a new airbrush today as my 20 year old one quit on me yesterday). This does not mean I only do ships now - will get back to aircraft someday, and I also make miniatures with my wife (that's miniatures, not babies) :>)) Felix, I gather you now live in New York - and I now live in Massachusetts. Do you find yourself every winter (having grown up in the Caribbean) saying something like, "what the he** am I doing here freezing my buns off!"? By the way, love your web site Denis Campbell Avon MA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 37) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: Your first model - Mistress Lorna asks As I recall, it was in the early 50s, my father bought a 3 ship kit, possibly a Battleship, cruiser and PT boat. The 3 came in one box. Any idea as to who produced it? Did Revell do something like that?? Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 38) From: Allan Plumb Subject: Re: first ship model In the early 60's I built some of those 8" long sailing ships ("Brig of War", etc.). (Along with planes and tanks - they were my rewards for good grades on report cards.) The first specific ship I can remember was the Airfix 1/600 Victorious, in about 1966-7. Why? I guess C.S. Forrester and Hornblower got me interested in the Napoleonic era. Not sure why I'm interested in modern ships, but oh well, here I am... Allan Plumb (Houston TX, 90s and muggy) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 39) From: "Hughes Family" Subject: My First Model Dear Mistress Lorna, My love of things nautical began with a model of a Cleveland Class Cruiser build for me by my cousins, I was about 6 (1970). At about age 9 I built by myself the Revell USS Arizona and then on to the USS Constitution. From then on it was any ship kit I could get my hands on. I stopped building during college and into my twenties, extra money was spent on beer (misguided youth), then a wonderful wife came along and then an old, in need of repair, pain in the #%** house. When we had our first child 5 years ago I started back into model ship building (to help keep my sanity). What a difference in the quality, detail, fit and accuracy of today's models. I love the fact you can now build ships all in the same scale! Instead of all ships, whether it be a destroyer escort or an aircraft carrier being 16 inches in length! If memory serves me correct the Cleveland cruiser and the USS Arizona, after serving as test beds for any new technique (weathering/battle damage/camo schemes) were sunk by enemy BB fire loong ago. Jeff -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 40) From: Michael Eisenstadt Subject: Tamiya 1/700 USS Enterprise CV-6 Folks: Is there anyone out there who can provide a quick rundown of the major steps needed to accurize the Tamiya 1/700 USS Enterprise CV-6 to accurately depict her as she appeared in: a) the period that the kit purports to represent -- I assume 1942 or so, and b) late 1944 -- early 1945 when she wore her sexy measure 32/4Ab camo scheme? (Calling John Snyder!) Did anyone ever write an article on accurizing this kit, a la the Larry Gertner piece on the Hasegawa USS Essex that was published in IPMS Quarterly years ago? Any help is appreciated. Thanks! Yours truly, Mike Eisenstadt -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 41) From: Brian Selzler Subject: first ship model In the mid 50's I remember my friend's older brother would build ship models and set them out in his backyard and shoot them to pieces with a BB gun! Well this seemed cool but, though my parents wouldn't let me have a gun, they did agree to start getting me models for my birthday and Christmas. I think the first one was a Revell Haven, I guess they thought a hospital ship might inspire me to pursue a career in medicine. Alas, all it did was inspire me to build more models. cheers, Brian Selzler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 42) From: "John Sutherland" Subject: The 1st model poll Mine was one of the Airfix early 4 - Cossack, Hotspur, Ark Royal and Warspite. Got all four around the same time (mid 60s) - no idea which was first. Still have them. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 43) From: KDur597268@aol.com Subject: First models Very interesting to dredge the answer to this one up! I clearly remember my Dad building the big Revel Cutty Sark (what? HO scale?) when I was little, and I was allowed to "help." I probably built some model planes and cars back then, but the first big model I built, or remember building was the "Kearsarge." Was that Revell? Anyway the civil war picket ship. Very cool model, and I clearly remember reading about the tug of war between the paddle wheel and screw powered ships of similar class to the Kearsarge/Alabama, but I don't remember their names. Screw decisive winner, towing paddle wheeler backwards at 2.5 knots. I too am primarily an a/c modeler, but am veering back towards ships - good to remember that I started with them! I was building mostly stick and tissue a/c at the time, didn't get into "fine scale" plastic modeling of a/c until I was an adult. When I was a kid, planes were supposed to FLY! Ken Durling -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 44) From: Mark Sloan Subject: First Model My first ship model was actually a Christmas present for my little brother, a 1/700 kit of the Japanese battleship Yamashiro. I had received something he wanted so we traded. I was ten years old at the time, and now, 975 1/700 ships later, I'm still going strong. Mark Sloan -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: Jim Shirley Ships The Naval Base has a supply of these kits: 1/700 scale resin kits. USS Oriskany 1960's 5 kits 135.00 USS Sumners 1960's 6 kits 35.00 Duxford motorboats 7 kits 45.00 USS Chicago 1960's 6 kits 85.00 USS Cimmeron AO-177 5 kits 95.00 USS California Cagemast 3 kits 85.00 C-3 Cargo 4 kits 45.00 USS San Francisco 4 kits 65.00 USS Sims DD-409 4 kits 35.00 USS Porter DD-356 3 kits 35.00 USS Arizona 3 kits 85.00 USS Arleigh Burke 4 kits 75.00 These will not last long goto: http://www.modelshipbuilding.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: LCVP's and the USS Olympia Hello fellow Shipbuilders, We have two ship models that have been re released by their manufactures in a very limited supply. Only 5,000 kits were made of these classic ships both can be found at Naval Base Hobbies. Goto: http://www.modelshipbuilding.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: AIRFIX 1/72 E-BOATS KREIGSMARINE. You can now find these kits at The Naval Base $39.95 We match any price on the Web or Mail Order. Plus the new Heller 1/400 sale German WWII Torpedo Destroyers. $9.50 http://www.modelshipbuilding.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Rob Mackie" Subject: Warship Update The following items have been added to the Warship (http://warship.simplenet.com) site Building the Lifelike 1:350th IJN Battleship Yamato by Jim Gordon Preview of the Iron Shipwright 1/350 German Battlecruiser Seydlitz Rob Mackie Warship http://warship.simplenet.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume