Subject: SMML01/08/99VOL624 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 02:18:49 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Judging 2: Re: Heller Bismarck 3: Re: West Coast Nationals 4: Re: 1/96 scale aircraft 5: Re: Color and Judging 6: Re: IJN Sub Decks 7: Re: Classic Warships USS Alaska 8: USN Measure 21 Paint scheme 9: 1/96 Aircraft 10: Camouflage 11: Mers-El-Kebir 12: 1/96-100 a/c 13: Heller Contact 14: IJN PC-102 ex USS Stewart 15: Re: Judging 16: Re: 1/96-100 scale a/c 17: Re: West Coast IPMS/US Nationals 18: Re: Judging from the British Perspective 19: Re: Weathered teak 20: ACW shipmodels 21: Re: Teak 22: Teak Decks 23: What a bunch of Hooey! 24: Malta Museum 25: Re: IPMS/US Nationals / Judging 26: Re: Naval Historical Branch 27: Re: Judging Shipmodel Paint 28: Update on Jeff H. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: GMM 1/400 German Warship detail set 2: August Internet Modeler is now live -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Shane Subject: Judging Hi gang, Ha!!, you all thought that just because my back is still healing,you could all get away some bickering about judging behind my back(pun intended) ;-))). Seriously, while I welcome discussion on this subject, please remember that it is a topic where tempers can flare. So please think about what you're about to post & maybe tone it down if need be. Also there are a lot of SMMLies who either don't belong to a club, don't belong to IPMS or don't comptete. As others below have posted, colours on models is really a subjective matter, we can't be sure of the "exact" shade X ship wore, on a given day. All we can hope to do, is get as close as we can, allowing for the fact that we will really never know. Regards, Shane - Thanks for all the good wishes, I'm feeling a bit better now. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: KDur597268@aol.com Subject: Re: Heller Bismarck Thanks all for the responses. Evert: is the beam dimension you posted at the deck, or at the maximum beam point, below the waterline? And that kit by Markus van Beek!!!! Wow! If y'all haven't seen that, go look! http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/4273/maquetasi3.html Evert, what scale is it? Also, Schiffer's website does not list the Herzog book. Is it OOP? Thanks again Ken Durling -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: West Coast US Nationals The selection committee at Orlando reportedly had three contenders to consider for the next West Coast US Nationals in 2001 (Dallas has it for 2000): Seattle, San Diego, and Chicago(!) [Chicago was reportedly allowed to propose due to a dearth of proposals from West Coast cities]. The committee unanimously selected Seattle as their recommendation. The IPMS E-Board will receive the recommendation, but will make their own decision. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys (Who firmly believes that Chicago hasn't been part of the "West" since about 1830!) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: SeaPhoto@aol.com Subject: Re: 1/96 scale aircraft Mic Toole wrote: >> this is a great site that I am really enjoying. My airplane related question is for a source of 1/96 or 1/100 scale aircraft, WW II or modern, (modern being the 1960 CH-46, H-53 etc.) My desires are for an IJN carrier or USN LPH-in r/c. << Check with the Scale Shipyard The Scale Shipyard 5866 Orange Ave. # 3 Long Beach, CA 90805. Their catalog is $6 if you live in the US. He has WWII carriers, a modern Nimitz, LSD and LHD hulls in 1/96 scale. Even has a Yamato hull if you want to do a Shinano conversion. I think he has some aircraft in that scale - SH-60's for sure. If not, he would know who does. Kurt Greiner SeaPhoto Maritime Photography Now with online ordering! http://www.modelersboatyard.com/seaphoto -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: Color and Judging John Sheridan made my point exactly: I wasn't disputing the colors used on the basis of color (color is so subjecting that it shouldn't be a judged item unless it's egregiously wrong). My problem lay in the fact that, as John pointed out, the model was painted incorrectly for the USN camouflage measure that it was purported to represent: Measure 12 (modified). This Measure used Sea Blue (sometimes Navy Blue) and Ocean Gray on the hull, and Ocean Gray and Haze Gray on the superstructure. Photos of the HORNET clearly show her painted in accordance with the directives for this Measure. The model, however, used the hull colors overall, with no Haze Gray on the superstructure, and that was plain, out-and-out, incorrect. It's something that would be judged as incorrect in aircraft or armor, so why not in ships? It's as incorrect as showing CV-8 with late-war aircraft on deck, and should be judged as such. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: IJN Sub Decks For the best information on this subject, I'd contact The SubCommittee list (subcomm@angus.mystery.com). John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: JRuotsala@aol.com Subject: Re: Classic Warships USS Alaska Good morning. Could someone send me the address or E-mail for Classic Warships so I can check on the USS Alaska model? Thank you, Jim -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: William Swan Subject: USN Measure 21 Paint scheme I have just purchased the 1/350 Tennessee and I wish to paint it in the measure 21 scheme. Can anyone advise me what commercially available paints there are to duplicate it? I prefer to work with acrylics. Thanks, William Swan -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Ron Hillsden, Victoria BC Canada" Subject: 1/96 Aircraft Revell in Germany used to make 1/100 aircraft (1984), and they were decent models. I know there was a Sea King in the line. Roskopf Miniatur-Modelle (also Germany) makes 1/100 aircraft as well, but they are not as nice, I don't know my helicopters well, but it looks like they have a MBB 105, a single Huey and possibly a land based equivalent of a Sea Stallion. You probably have to go to one of the sites which acts as a clearing house for collectors of models (just don't tell them you are going to build it!) Ron Hillsden Victoria BC Canada My boat club: http://members.home.net/vmss/ Modelmakers Flags: http://members.home.net/ron-hillsden/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "chenyangzhang" Subject: Camouflage I hate to enter into American disputes but John Sheridan is unfortunately wrong. Colour perception depends on many factors, for example lighting and scale effect play an enormous role. If the judges in this particular contest avoided judging by colour mix I salute them. This shows really good sense. Let me postualte a MS 12 scheme on a cloudy day, shower just finished but surfaces still wet. The same scheme on a sunny day, third day in a row. The difference would be quite considerable. This ignores the different colour perception of each individual person by the way. The only way to ensure realistic colour perception is to find colour photos of the ship you want to model then adjust your paint scheme to the photo. If no colour photos exist the ideal solution is to paint the model in your best estimate of the colour then photograph it in black and white in the weather conditions of the original. Only then will you be able to tell whether its accurate or not. Even then it will probably depend on whoever is looking at it's colour perecption. Chris Langtree -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "chenyangzhang" Subject: Mers-El-Kebir Hi everyone This is not connected with modelling (OK, it is as I am building the Delphis Bretagne). But I am trying to find out the firing sequence and targeting for the battle of Mers-El-Kebir. As far as I am able to ascertain Resolution opened fire first closely followed by Valiant. I think Resolution targeted Bretagne who she hit on the second or third salvo. Valiant targeted Provence and Hood targeted Dunkerque. This allowed Strasbourg to set sail and escape. Hood later half-heartedly fired on Strasbourg but it was too late. Does anyone have any definitive information which clarifies the issue? Chris Langtree -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Aylin Kececi" Subject: 1/96-100 a/c Mike, Try Accurate Miniatures web site: http://www.accurateminiatures.com/main.htm they have 1/100 scale helicopters. or Hannants http://www.hannants.co.uk/cgi-bin/ and try search options. the following is from their home page: Academy AC1634 1999 Injection 1:100 1:100 F-14A Tomcat ... £ 5.65 £4.81 Academy AC1635 1999 Injection 1:100 1:100 F-15A Eagle ... £ 5.65 £4.81 Tamiya TA60025 1999 Injection 1:100 Boeing B-52D Stratofortress ... £25.50 £21.70 80 REVELL RV4029 17/01/99 1:100 AIRCRAFT 1:100 F-15A Eagle was 4.10 ..£ 1.99 £1.69 80 REVELL RV4056 17/01/99 1:100 AIRCRAFT 1:100 I.A.I Kfir C-2 was 4.75..£1.99 £1.69 REVELL RV4013 1:100 HELICOPTERS 1:100 Mil Mi-24F ... £4.95 £4.21 REVELL RV4067 1:100 HELICOPTERS 1:100 Bell UH-1H Gunship ... £4.95 £4.21 REVELL RV4068 1:100 HELICOPTERS 1:100 Bell AH-1G Cobra ... £4.95 £4.21 REVELL RV4069 1:100 HELICOPTERS 1:100 Mil Mi-24 Hind NVA/BW ... £5.49 £4.67 REVELL RV4088 1:100 HELICOPTERS 1:100 Sikorsky SH-60 Seahawk ... £4.95 £4.21 REVELL RV4089 1:100 HELICOPTERS 1:100 McDonnell Douglas AH-64 Apache... £4.95 £4.21 REVELL RV4090 1:100 HELICOPTERS 1:100 Mil Mi-24D Hind ... £4.95 £4.21 DOYUSHA DOY1815 D 1:100 AIRCRAFT 1:100 Douglas C-47 Skytrain USAAF ... £12.99 £11.06 DOYUSHA DOY1825 1:100 AIRCRAFT 1:100 Douglas DC-3 Classic Air ... £12.99 £11.06 DOYUSHA DOY1826 1:100 AIRCRAFT 1:100 Boeing E-3A AWACS ... £33.50 £28.51 Happy modeling, Alpaslan Ertungealp -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "Peter Mispelkamp" Subject: Heller Contact Ken: Its been quite a while since I last needed to contact Heller, but I have to say they always answered my requests promptly and efficiently. In my day, you had to fill in the coupon printed on the instruction sheet, and visit your local postal outlet and get some IRC's (International (Postal) Reply Coupons and send these items off to them. If they still work the same way, you might want to add a couple more because the hull pieces are rather long. Its unfortunate that they are no longer keeping a presence on the net. A few years ago, I did find an email address for them, but it appears to be inactive now. Keep us posted, as I am sure that all of us who belong to the dwindling 1/400 club would like to know that Heller has not lost its dedication to customer support. Now, if they would start to release some new kits, e.g. Ark Royal (WW II), Renown, Repulse, late war KGV, Gloire, Le Fantastique, Tribal class DDs, Belfast, not to mention some Iowas and Yorktowns ... but I guess I am in a state of model-wishful thinking!!! Peter K. H. Mispelkamp -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Jay Schantzen Subject: IJN PC-102 ex USS Stewart I'm looking for plans of the Japanese WWII conversion of the captured 4 stack destroyer USS Stewart. Any ideas? Thanks! Jay Schantzen MD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: ironship@usit.net (Jon Warneke) Subject: Re: Judging Hi Everyone, Well, I judged, and I expressed what was the consensus within our judging group, so now it's time to defend the consensus (BTW, it's long too...). John Sheridan states: >> What a bunch of hooey! Jon, I saw this kit myself at the Orlando Nats and the first thing that hit me was that the camouflage scheme was flat-out wrong. It had nothing to do with room lighting or reflective surfaces. The modeler simply did not use the correct colors on the upper hull/island. They used Ocean Gray/Navy Blue instead of Haze Gray/Ocean Gray which are completely different shade combinations (and colors) of paint. << This is correct, but at the same time, do you know for certain that these colors were used, or is your basis for your opinion what the tech orders called for? Remember, we are dealing with a set of colors developed by the Navy, but mixed pierside from a tinting material and white base (in Norfolk I believe). Also, Ms.12 mod was a "commander's discretion" design, which meant the captain could do just about anything he wanted, including use any color he wanted (BTW, the areas above the funnel were not in 5-H, which also totally invalidates the scheme, but no mention's been made of that). Do we know for certain the the colors were matched exactly? How plowed were the dock workers the day they painted the ship (side note: Does vomit affect tonal quality?). Do we know that the black and white photos of Hornet truly reflect the colors she carried? Do the different factors that determine color reproduce in black and white? How did the colors oxidize as she transited from the Atlantic to the Pacific? There are more questions than answers. Here's another example. The recent National Geographic special on the Yorktown shows footage of her bridge area, and the Ocean grey on the bridge looks much more blue than any sample of the Munsell designation I've seen. Does this invalidate all of the work others have done on paint chips simply because footage shows it to be different? Also, there are pictures of ships that show a "difference" in colors simply due to reflectance of sunlight off different angles. With all of this in mind, simply disregarding a ship based on the hues of colors used is totally without merit (unless of course the colors are blatantly wrong, such as hot pink and lemon yellow). Let's try this. Apply the theory of color having to be exact to the entire catagory, and let's see what happens. First place was a heavily rebuilt Glencoe Oregon, but the buff was not yellow enough, so it's out. Second was a Yamato, but the teak decks were very dark, obvoiusly not teak colored. Out it goes. Third place, that one's obvious. Next in line was another Oregon, but that one's colors are really faded, not the bright colors of the Great White Fleet. See Ya. Next was a Bismarck without yellow/blue/red turret tops (this one's obvious). So, now that we've pretty much taken care of what was the top five in construction quality, what are we down to? A collection of tugs and other small stuff who's construction quality isn't up the the level of the first five kits. So, we go to the head judge (a manufacturer like myself), and say nothing in this class deserves an award. We're quickly told to go back and judge the category properly. Even better, try this. I was talking to the guy who built the Tarawa which won Best Ship and was runner up for the Best of Show. The paint used for that gray was an aircraft color that "looked" right. According to this discussion, he should have been sent packing rather early in the judging than almost winning. >> Here's an example of Hornet's MS 12 Modified scheme at around the time of the Doolittle Raid: http://www.navsource.org/Archives/CV/CV-08_Hornet2.jpg The photo clearly show that Hornet's Island is in distinctly different shades of paint than the rest of the lower hull/superstructure. The model in question, Was painted overall Ocean Gray/Navy Blue from the waterline to the tops of the masts. This scheme does not even follow even the basic recommendations for MS 12 as outlined in SHIPS-2 Spetember 1941 edition. What you're saying is since the modeler got the basic color right (Gray) it shouldn't matter what shade of gray it is as long as it's Gray. Also, since the ship (USS Hornet CV-8) was being modeled in a specific time period (april 1942), I would think that the camouflage scheme at least be correct for the time period being modeled, would you ? << As I've stated before, the shade of gray doesn't matter since the paint was mixed pierside rather than in a common facility. To be completely fair about all of this, there should be multiple shades of the same color of grey all over the ship since I don't believe that the entire ship could be painted from one batch of mixed paint. As for the scheme specifically, it may or may not of been accurate, but it did convey the appearance of being correct. In fact, if this is the scheme that is layed out in the instructions, and the modeler followed it to the letter, what judge can legitimately fault the modeler for it. As judges, we are charged specifically with the responsibility not to judge based on what we "know" the modeler should have done, but rather base our judging on what has been done. Basically, your saying that this kit should not have won anything based on your personal knowledge of this ship. As a judge, I personally cannot be knowledgeable of every ship ever built, and thus have to rely on what I have been taught to be a fair way of judging. Judging is subjective, and there have been plenty of episodes where I didn't agree with the decisions (both as a participant and a judge), but had to accept them. Color is a BIG subjective decision which I do not feel is a fair determinant of the quality of a model. Unless a modeler can definitely prove a color scheme (i.e. photographs, measure sheets, actual chips from each segment of a pattern, etc.), how can a judge make a determination of the correctness of the color? This model suffered from the complexity of itself; the modeler is quite skilled and did an excellent job considering (there was no determinable gap where the upper and lower hulls were joined, a feat over a 27" hull). This kit took third place because it deserved third place, regardless of the incorrect shade of color. Remember, as a judge, you have to judge with the tangible and not the speculatory. Jeff Herne and I have matched all of the USN colors to the 1929 Munsell, and so has Snyder and Short. Why are some of them different when matched to the same reference? Why do some of the colors in each set match different 1929 Munsell books, and others don't match different 1929 Munsell books? Which is right, and which is wrong (both books and chips)? Neither set above is an IPMS sanctioned standard, so which do you choose? Would I feel comfortable with another judge whipping out any paint chart and use it to judge my work before looking at the basics of construction? I can't answer any of these questions satisfactorily for everyone, and this is why I do not consider shade of color a determinant in judging. Jon Warneke I am Elmer J. Fudd, millionaire. I own a mansion and a yacht! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "Aylin Kececi" Subject: Re: 1/96-100 scale a/c Mike, the following is addendum to my letter: Accurate Miniatures ATE3100 1/100 AH-1G Cobra $ 7.99 ATE3101 1/100 UH-1B Huey $ 7.99 ATE3102 1/100 AH-64 Apache $ 7.99 ATE3103 1/100 UH-60B Blackhawk $ 7.99 ATE3104 1/100 SH-60B Seahawk $ 7.99 ATE3105 1/100 HH-60 Nighthawk $ 7.99 I hope this is sufficient. Alpaslan Ertungealp -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: CBNJBB62@aol.com Subject: Re: West Coast IPMS/US Nationals Concerning the possibility of a west coast IPMS(US) nationals it maybe several years before that happens, because at the awards it was brought up that IPMS(US) conventions may make themselves extinct due to their own complexity. Normally they do a section of country per year-east coast-mid west-west coast. For the West coast the chapters that answered for 2001 backed out as to the requirements asked for a convention having 10-15,000 sqft per model display room, vendor areas, hotel capacity for 2500-3000 people and all this work to set it up is done by volunteers of the hosting model club so they did get a response from Seattle in a bid for it and they completed with Chicago in the bids and Chicago won. That's all I know about that. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Peter Hall" Subject: Re: Judging from the British Perspective >>. it was bad enough having to present the trophy 2 years ago in front of an assemblage of hundreds.. to Peter Hall.. to the calls of "Fix, Fix", wasn't it Peter?! << I think we were both stitched up there Caroline. I will not forget seeing young Graham rolling around at the back of the crowd. Hi Graham!!! >> I'll never forget the whinges from the entrant of a 1/96 Scale Type 21 frigate at, I think, Hartlepool (he carefully positioned it so it obscured all other entries), when I gave Gold to a 1/700 Scale, beautifully built and detailed static ... I spent 1/2 an hour pointing out WHY I had made my decision... such as the gaps all over his 5ft long model, and all I got was "but mine's bigger than his!!" No comment... << I remember it well!! What do you mean no comment? I thought that was where you almost asked the chappy to prove it, until you realised it was the models he was talking about!!!! >> Also, at the U.K. Nationals, manufacturers such as ourselves are so desparately busy that we really can't leave the stands to get away and judge! << I totally agree there, its difficult for you to get away for a peek at the other displays,even the ones nearby, let alone go off judging for an hour or two. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: "Peter Hall" Subject: Re: Weathered teak >> Based on the plank I have from the Missouri, the color is somewhere between grimy tan and mouse gray. It is more of a chocolate gray when wet. Does this qualify as primary research? << I'm sorry Kenneth, but I had to say it, if nobody else does, that you have just described Chief Casey Ryback in the movie Under Siege, absolutely perfectly. Hi Peter, Yes, but don't tell me you don't enjoy the scene where Erika Eleniak makes her "appearance". Mistress Lorna -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Suvoroff@aol.com Subject: ACW shipmodels >> Who makes resin/injected/? ACW ship models? Any scale. << Thoroughbred Miniatures make a wide selection of 1/600th ACW vessels, both riverine and blue-water, which are fairly nice; from a modelling standpoint they can be improved. Yours, James D. Gray -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: Suvoroff@aol.com Subject: Re: Teak >> Actually teak is a dark chocolate colour, and it stays that way. << Not on a ship's deck it doesn't. Yours, James D. Gray -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: Suvoroff@aol.com Subject: Teak Decks The REAL question about unpainted teak decks is whether or not the British continued the old custom of daily holystoning during wartime. Does anybody have any knowledge of this? This is what makes the difference between a pale gray weathered deck and a fresh teak color. Yours, James D. Gray -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: "Sctrtrsh" Subject: What a bunch of Hooey! Hey John Sheridan! What are you getting all wrapped around the axel for? Were you a judge? If you were a judge, then bully for you! If not, maybe you should calm a little. It is after all a HOBBY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We have been reminded time and again that even the paints that are marketed as "accurate" aren't! Did you have any models entered? Let's be glad that guys are willing to judge and host a model convention. I was involved with our regional, and it is a lot of work, and judging is no fun, as there are so many excellent works. How do you divide and separate, and judge? It is tough. Give these judges a little slack, and instead of raking them over the coals, kudos and accolades for a thankless job. Mark Krumrey Been there, done that! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: WVeigele@aol.com Subject: Malta Museum Alan Woodward, I am planning a trip to Malta and would appreciate the name and address of the maritime musem there if you have it. I am sure other persons would like this information also. Regards, Bill Veigele -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: CBNJBB62@aol.com Subject: Re: IPMS/US Nationals / Judging Dear Rusty: I got your e-mail today and thanks for being honest because it's a good thing I've been going to contests since 1987 so I'm used to hearing this is a rule I don't know about and all decisions are final. Yes, I agree that I should contact you in private but some asked about sailing ships so I figured what if. I had a good time at the nationals. Craig Bennett -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Re: Naval Historical Branch Hi John and SMML, Was the job posting for the head of the Naval Historical Branch? For some time that has been David Brown. Does anyone know if he has already left the Naval Historical Branch? Unfortunately, his health has not always been good the last few years. Also, is that David Brown (who wrote the book about the Royal Navy in the Falklands as well as others) the same person as the D.K. Brown who wrote the much-discussed book about the design of World War I Royal Navy ships (Designing the Grand Fleet 1905-22)? Or are they different people? I realize I should know, but I don't. Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Re: Judging Shipmodel Paint Hi SMMLies, Regarding the discussion about judging the paint on the ship at the IPMS/USA Nationals, may I ask what the judging rules say about this subject? Is a ship judge supposed to, or even allowed to, base his or her decision on whether (1) the correct color or shade of color was used or (2) whether the pattern on the model is historically correct? If the ship judging rules don't address this, are there general judging rules that do? Perhaps it would help the discussion to have answers to these questions. Once we know the answers, we could still ask whether ship judges should be allowed to base a decision on those factors. My feeling is that the number of people who are truly knowlegeable about the subject of warship camouflage and paint are very, very few (and most are on SMML, right?), and even then there are aspects of the subject about which even they do not know all the answers or about which reasonable minds can differ. I think the odds are not at all good that a truly knowledgeable person will be a ship judge in a given contest, and it is much more likely that the ship judges in a given contest won't have a clue about whether the correct color or shade has been used on a given model or if a pattern on a given model is correct. If the judges don't have a clue (or, worse, if they think they do but don't), I wouldn't want them to base a decision on the basis of the correctness of color, shade or pattern. Nor would I want an othewise very knowledgeable judge to ding a ship model where there is little information about, or where there could be a reasonable difference of opinion about, the color or shade used or about the pattern. Yes, I suppose if somone paints a model of the Bismarck "Fire Engine Red" from keel to topmast, and does a beautiful job of it, it would be hard not to ding them for it, but, in all but the most egregious of cases, I feel that ship judges should be restricted to judging the application of paint rather than the correctness of color, shade or pattern. Let's look at the model that prompted this discussion, which I take it was built from the Tamiya 1/700 Hornet kit. I also take it that one of the beefs about the model in question is that the darker color of her hull pattern was allegedly incorrectly used on the island. If the modeler had been dinged for that, could he not have reasonably pointed out that both Tamiya's instructions and the color artwork in the Warship Profile on the Hornet show the Hornet painted in exactly that way? The instructions and the Profile may (or may not) be incorrect, but should a model be dinged (i.e., penalized) if the modeler follows them? I think not. (And, by the way, I'm not so sure they are incorrect; I just looked at a photograph of the Hornet on 18 April 1942 and it really looks to me like the darker color on the hull is used on the island. Optical illusion?) Sorry to have gone on so long about this.... Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 28) From: "Jeff Herne" Subject: Update on Jeff H. Hello, Just a quick note to let everyone know... Jeff was hospitalized yesterday afternoon, seem he's suffering from severe dehydration and exhaustion. Doctors have had him on an IV for a couple of days now and he is expected to be released this weekend. If you've tried to reach him and haven't been able to, that's why. I've noticed 44 unread emails, I assure you he's not ignoring anyone. When he was first admitted, he was laying there with IV tubes and oxygen hoses, I asked him if there was anything I could get for him. He told me, "an X-acto knife, some superglue, and a ship kit." I guess you can't get the ship modeler out of the man, even in dire straits... Laura Herne While I can't help but smile at this comments I am sure all the list join with me to wish Jeff a quick recovery back to health. Mistress Lorna -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Loren Perry Subject: GMM 1/400 German Warship detail set The Gold Medal Models 1/400 WW2 German Warship set (No. 400-7) does indeed have watertight doors and cable reels, depsite the misleading text in our catalog. It also has crane bases not found in the 1/350 set. The 1/400 set is not a scale-down of the 1/350 Bismarck set, but actually closer to a scale-up of the 1/700 WW2 German Warship set with adjustments and changes made to allow for the various Heller kits (such as the inclusion of doors and reels, etc.) Also, because it is newer than the 1/350 set, a number of minor refinements have been made to the 1/400 Bismarck parts. We aren't always predictable as to how we approach a new design, so never assume anything unless you have actually seen the set! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Bob Pearson" Subject: August Internet Modeler is now live Greetings all, Just a quick announcement that the August issue of Internet Modeler is now posted and features the following on-topic material: - Building a 1/700 Scale IJN subchaser - Building a 1/350 USS Ohio class SSBN - reviews of: Ozmods Daring Class HMAS Vampire Tamiya 1/700 USS Bogue Tamiya 1/350 USS Fletcher Waveline 1/700 USS San Francisco All of the current Snyder & Short WWII paint chips sets PC Patrol Craft of WW2 by Wm J Veigele Eduard, Gold Medal Models, Tom's Modelworks and White Ensign Models PE sets And, last but not least .. ... Mistress Lorna takes a look at Darth Vader. Regards, Bob Pearson Managing Editor / Internet Modeler http://www.internetmodeler.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume