Subject: SMML27/08/99VOL650 Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 00:34:59 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: First ship model 2: Sanding tool 3: General rants... 4: Re: Trivia 5: Warship Profile No.6 - Prinz Eugen 6: USS Higbee DD-806 7: Sci Fi 8: SMML Convention 9: Ship named after woman... 10: Re: Destroyers named after FEMALES? 11: Tirpitz deck camouflage 12: S-boot colour schemes 13: SMML Meet/Convention 14: HMAS Australia 15: Really off topic 16: Naming USN Ships -WOW 17: Sea Tiger 18: Off Subject 19: USS Sir Winston Churchill 20: Re: Texan firing for effect 21: Re: Take a Bath 22: Texans, football, meat pies, kangaroos and Holden cars 23: Re: USS John Wayne 24: Tamiya 1/350 PoW vs. KGV 25: Destroyer named for woman 26: Re: Convention 27: Re: PSM 20 reviews 28: Re: Italian Camouflage of WWII - Dardo 29: USS Hopper 30: Peacetime Hood Colors (Colours) 31: Bismarck Question 32: Falk Pletcher 700er Treff 33: Escort camouflage during Operation Cerberus 34: Texan, firing for effect 35: Fellow sufferers 36: 1/350 Enterprise etc.. 37: Liberty Ship/Victory Ship deck details 38: Naming of US Navy ships -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: NVTC PART 11... AT LAST!! (and ICM 1/350 Hood news) 2: Books for Sale 3: Re: White Ensign's Warspite set -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Satin, Michael N. (SHEP)" Subject: First ship model Fellow (?) Ship Modelers: I have a confession to make. I am a bit of a fraud. I have been a member of this list for some time now and have enjoyed it immensely! What I do not have is much (if any) experience in ship modeling. I have been an aircraft modeler for many years and have built a couple of small ship models on and off, but never really gotten one of the big ones going. The good news is that this list has really stirred my interest. Over the last few years I have collected several ship models and some good reference and "hints and tips" materials (in addition to my constant diet here!) My question to you all today is: What should I start? As noted, I am not an inexperienced modeler, just an inexperienced ship modeler. My choices are(in 1/350): one of each of the Tamiya battleship pairs (have the CW conversion for the MO to the IA); the Tamiya Enterprise (CVN-65); the BWN Enterprise (CV-6); the IS Nelson; the TMW Arizona (1941 fit); the Heller 1/400 Illustrious; and the Hasegawa 1/450 Akagi. I have brass for each model either with the kit or from GMM. All things considered, have I bitten off more than I can chew? If not, what do you all think I should start with(I really respect the people on this list!) Please don't shun me now that I've fessed up! Thanks!! Michael Satin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Doremus, Mark" Subject: Sanding tool Ken asked about sanding in tight places. I found a gadget at a local home improvement center, it may also be available at auto parts stores. It's about 3/8" diameter and has a 1/4" nose that is a bundle of glass fibers. According to the package it can have the sanding power of 400-1500 grit sand paper, based on the amount of pressure applied. It extends and retracts like a mechanical pencil. Unfortunately I don't have a product name or manufacturer with me right now. Since it is glass fiber based, take care with the debris since they will contain glass particles. I've used this with good results roughing up the torpedo dimples on Revell's Lionfish. Mark Doremus Eden Prairie, MN -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: John Sheridan Subject: General rants... >> Now, this SMML convention aboard Salem....I have one question. With this many "shipheads" in one place at one time, what do think the possibilities are of getting up steam and having some real fun? << Well, we still have some Navy Black in the fuel tanks......... But unfortunately, we still have some retired snipes that continue to slither about the machinery spaces. They just love to take things apart. >> Contrary to Mr. Arnold's babbling (he's been staring at monitor for far too long these days), I will gladly attend the convention. I'll be the guy walking around the big target painted on his chest....why not turn it into a model show as well? John, you've got space, right? << We have plenty of space onboard the SALEM for a show. This would definately be one part of the SMML convention. BTW Jeff, we have the center 8" gun in turret three all ready prepared for your arival...heheheheheh. John Sheridan @ Microscale Decals http://www.microscale.com If I'm talking Decals, then i'm talking for Microscale, Otherwise I am speaking for myself. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Rick Heinbaugh Subject: Re: Trivia >> For those of you who like trivia questions, which destroyer was the ONLY one ever named for a woman? << That would be USS HOPPER (DDG 70), named in honor of Rear Admiral Grace Hopper. A major mover and shaker in the computer world, she was involved in UNIVAC I, responsible for COBOL (though now we'd say that's a mixed blessing), and from the time she christened the first computer "bug" (a real dead one in a mechanical relay) in the old days to her last days in the early '90s was aggressive in forcing computer professionals to look forward in their thinking. Another mixed-blessing legacy she left us was the phiilosophy that "It's easier to beg forgiveness than get permission", or words to that effect, a favorite of junior officers and the last thing a staid senior officer wanted to hear. Rick -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: KDur597268@aol.com Subject: Warship Profile No.6 - Prinz Eugen Hello all - Coming up blank in my web search for Schmalenbach's Warship Profile on Prinz Eugen. Dunno if this is an unusually hard publication to find, but would appreciate any leads or suggestions where to look. Thanks Ken D -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) Sender: Tom Detweiler Subject: USS Higbee DD-806 Return volley, Dave's trivia question-- She was the USS Higbee, DDR/DD-806, named after Lenah S. Higbee, Superintendent of the Navy Nurse Corps and Victory medal/Navy Cross holder. We all fondly nicknamed her the "Leapin' Lena", because like most USN ships of the time she was not stabilized and did the DD Rock & Roll in heavy weather-- Sea Legs were an essential, quickly gained at sea! The Higbee was a Gearing class destroyer commissioned in Jan. 1945 and saw considerable action towards the end of WW2 including shooting down Kamikaze attacks as part of Carrier Task Force 38. She spent her later career in Destroyer Squadron 9 in the Pacific, was FRAMmed in the 60's, and served during Korea, and again in Vietnam, when I was aboard her for 3 years as an IC2. She had quite a long and illustrious career, and was the only US ship successfully bombed by a NVA Mig, in early 1972-- which blew the after gunmount to pieces and killed a bunch of US sailors, nearly sinking her. She was repaired and served for 5 more years, finally being decommissioned in 1979 after a career of over 35 years-- quite a record of service for the old lady, and some of the best defense money ever spent-- as were most of the Gearings. Sadly, she too was sunk later as part of a Gunfire exercise. Makes me ill, to think of such an end to a grand career. We who served aboard her are proud of her accomplishments, and to that end we have a website, which you can visit too, at: http://home.att.net/~steve.gardner/homepage4.htm There is a bunch of history, ship's log, and a LOT of pictures of her as both a DDR and DD, which Gearing- heads like me will want to check out for their building projects. Please visit, and sign our Guest Log Book. Now that my own JSP Gearing FRAM is underway, along comes the JAG Collective with another, and even better one apparently -- but I want to build one in 1/350 now, any FRAMs in that scale out there yet? PS-- We are a "Navy Family" again, too-- my daughter Jenny, a QM, will be aboard the USS Caron, DD-970, a Spruance class destroyer. Any suggestions as to the best 1/700 and 1/350 scale Spruances would be appreciated muchly. Shane, I can't tell you how much pleasure and information this SMML newsletter has given me over time. If we can make a contribution or donation to your efforts, how can we voluntarily do so? Thanks to ALL of you Tom Detweiler/ IC2, USN 1968-71 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: Lisa and Bill Wiseman Subject: Sci Fi >> Nice idea though, what about a Imperial Star Destroyer in Ms 22, or a starfury in Western Aproaches... or Mountbatten Pink? << Actually, I just finished the "Phantom Menace" Trade Federation Battle tank in SS Panzer Tri-color. I always wanted to do the NCC-1701 D in MS32. Retreating to my galaxy far far away....... Doc Wiseman -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Peter Sketchley" Subject: SMML Convention Hi all, I think a convention on board USS Salem is an excellent idea and a very good reason to visit the USA and wallow in naval history for a week or two. Regards Peter Sketchley Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Jeff Herne" Subject: Ship named after woman... Good trivia question Dave, But I got ya' on this one, without having to look it up... :-) The only USN warship to be named for a woman is the USS Higbee, DD-806, was a Gearing Class destroyer. She was named for Lenah Higbee, who I believe headed up the Red Cross during WW1. Higbee saw action in WW2 as a radar picket, and several cruises post war. Regards, Jeff -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: Re: Destroyers named after FEMALES? Hmm.... you've got us stumped there, Dave! Assuming we don't count the legendary figures of Isis, Juno, Terpsichore, Undine, Venus, Virago, Cassandra, Medusa, Melpomene, Ophelia, and Phoebe, I can only think of: Blanche, Boadicea, Diana, Imogen, Constance, Mary Rose, Rowena, Rosalind, Sybille, Verity, Violet, Sylvia, Cynthia, Regina Maria, Vasilissa Olga, and Santa Catharina. I know.... GOT IT!! Battleaxe... named after our only female Prime Minister! Cheers! Caroline and Dave Carter, White Ensign Models http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models PS Re "Robert Lockie's Time Zone" query from our Texan friend, it's currently British Summer Time (BST), which is one hour off Greenwich Mean Time (GMT)... which, of course, is where all this zoning thingie started, and where longitude is "zero", and strange folks actually take time out to "follow the line"... Hi Caroline, Ummm, Battleaxe, do I dare................ ;-)) Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Tirpitz deck camouflage Chris That 'giraffe spot' camouflage was covered in an article by Mike Williams in Scale Models July 1983. He also provided some nice drawings and notes on the work needed to convert the 1/350 Tamiya example to the 1944 configuration, including the locations and shapes of hull damage from the September and October attacks with Tallboy bombs. The article includes port and starboard camouflage schemes (light and dark grey) and the deck scheme (light and medium grey). Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: S-boot colour schemes Kevin I have just been trawling the last two weeks' SMMLs and found your post on the above. I do not claim expertise on the subject but in general, the Kriegsmarine found that a light grey (I have seen it described as very light, almost white) was the ideal colour scheme, as the boats operated mostly at night. Apparently they were almost invisible, particularly when the round-bilged hull tended to keep the wake down, unlike the British hard chine boats. Decks and other horizontal surfaces, I believe, were dark grey. Some S-boote were camouflaged, as witness the photos and colour profile in the old Profile book by Hummelchen but plain schemes do appear to have been most common. I think fellow-SMMLie Mike Cooper may have done some work on the subject as well (couldn't resist that after he somehow tricked me into this military vehicles mailing list idea ;<)) Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: CA139JOHNF@aol.com Subject: SMML Meet/Convention Hello fellow list members, WOW! I had no idea that the idea would have such an enthusiastic response. The idea seems to be ready to take on a life of its own. I have discussed this with the Director of the Museum and he is very receptive to the proposal and wants a plan given to him so I'd better get busy! (mumble.....like I have lots of spare time......mumble). I will have to enlist the local members to help make this a reality. I believe this could be really neat especially if we keep the planning right here in the list. I must throw out some basic ideas that I have been thinking about. This is an international event that is open to anyone who wishes to participate either in person or by posting a model for display. If a participant cannot attend, watch the list because I plan one taking pics of all who do and posting them (John Sheridan, help me out here). We can work out the details of shipping a little later. This is not a competition. but a chance to meet or participate with like minded individuals. Enough for now, please, those of you who are interested in participating, please let all know by posting to the list or e-mail me direct. All will be answered. To those that already replied, many thanks, I look forward to meeting all aboard the Salem. John Frohock USNSM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Max Loosli Subject: HMAS Australia >> Oh BTW, do you hear that sound off Sydney Heads - that's the sound of rightous indignation coming from HMAS Australia, as she slowly raises herself up to deliver up a broadside from her 8 12in guns. Sure she may only have been a battlecruiser, but she was Australian & that makes up the difference ;-)). << Hello the list, Funny how things happen .... I've just spent the last week thinking about HMS/HMAS Australia! I was wondering about her sinking (scuttling, ceremonial laying to rest ?), does anyone know how it was done? Was it with explosives or by opening seacocks (or whatever)? Anyone have an idea of her current condition, the right way up and recoverable, perchance? Yeah, I know, as if .... ! By the way, lets have less of the 'only a Battlecruiser'! Pleased to hear that others 'do' SF, as well as Armour (the tracked and wheeled kind, and I am subscribing to ThinkTank), I feel less odd .......... Regards, Max Just going to the workroom to rationalise the four immediately current projects with the next six I've got in my head. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: Felix Bustelo Subject: Really off topic I see that I have hit a nerve with the Texans in out group. I don't have anything against y'all, just a little good humoured fun. BUT, regarding sports teams..... well, I will take the Yanks over the Rangers in any series (my, my how soon you folks forget 1998 when the Yanks swept the Rangers). I am well aware that this may back fire come October, but I like the Yank's chances. Regarding the other teams - I don't real care too much about the NL and as for the Mets, a lot of New Yorkers were fans in the late 1980's when they were good and the Yanks were not, but I stuck with them. Afterall, I am a ship modeler, so I am somewhat of a masochist. The Stars, weren't they a Minnesota team not too long ago? And for the Spurs - I am happy that the "Admiral" finally got his ring, but they Knicks weren't supposed to be there and they beat the odds and also managed to win one game. Also, there are a few Aussies playing in Major League baseball, so I guess cricket maybe loosing its appeal ;-) Hey the Texas and New York were sister ships, so that says something about these two great states. Now, let's get back to discussing ships models and other more important topics. Cheers, Felix Bustelo who is no longer ducking for cover in the Subway because the torrential rains this morning flooded most of them! PS - To any Texans that make the SMML CON, I would be honored to have a round or two with you. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "Doremus, Mark" Subject: Naming USN Ships -WOW Folks, WOW, I expected a little fun with this but not all the stuff in the last two lists. It's even more political (and you guys are more cynical) than I thought. I agree that you should be dead to get something the government uses tax dollars to build named for you. It's beginning to sound like Georgia where every bridge is named after the state or county road commissioner that built it. To add to Nat's list. USS Strom Thurman -- The USN's first wind powered ship in over a century. It's commissioning will cause the citizens of South Carolina to demand that the USS Constitution be de-commissioned so that their boy has a chance at being the oldest commissioned ship. USS Albert Gore -- this ship could never get lost, the QM could just send a gang to the fantail and haul it back to port on it's internet cable (or was that a fable?) AGR XX- USS Ross Perot -- Uses huge ears as listening devices, but says what ever it wants to anyway. While 3 USN ships are named after English citizens (No I don't know the other 2), Churchill was made an honorary US citizen by John Kennedy. USS Hopper DDG-70 is named for Grace Hopper RADM USN, but the news release claims that there was another ship, before WWII named for a woman. Mark Doremus Minnesota, former home of Dallas Stars and current home of Jesse Ventura (copyright) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: "Millen, Alan R." Subject: Sea Tiger Hey All, Just watched "Operation Petticoat" last night, and recalled all the posts re: doing Revell's fleet boat as the Sea Tiger. My question is, should it be done as seen in the movie, i.e. a late/post war fit, or as the movie purports it to be, an early war fit? Or am I thinking too much? Alan R. Millen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: b38cch@webtv.net (Clifford Holley) Subject: Off Subject It seems obvious to me that naming US Ships after people living or dead has never been a good idea and i'm not certain that the "Fish " have not voted at least recently. (a) >> I'll freely admit that we Aussies have yet to really succeed in real football, ie: soccer for you North Americans. But in league & union we do pretty damm good - apart from that small country next to us, who really enjoy beating the crap out of us at union. Just pray, that we don't encompass gridiron as a nation, otherwise you'll be in for a real shock << Do pray that they learn to play with helmets(:-0) (b) Another off subject. Do any of you old "salts" know how the IJN personal hygiene was conducted? Did they have Iowa type bathing facilities? Cliff..... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: Ed Grune Subject: USS Sir Winston Churchill >> Burke and Hope definately deserve to be honored for their service to their country. Yes, Hope is a limey by birth -- but we adopted him. << >> How do you get around the Winston Churchill? << Sir Winston too was a Limey by birth, but of an American mother. So I guess that makes him a half-breed. Furthermore, he is one of but a few people who have been honored with dual citizenship -- UK and US. I guess that makes him one of us too. Ed Mansfield, TX -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Marc Flake Subject: Re: Texan firing for effect Shane: Ah, yes, the HMAS Australia, a BATTLEcruiser, whose sister ship Indefatigable was the first of many Commonwealth battlecruisers to blow up under fire. Fortunately, Australia wasn't there. Where was she, back home? And the Texas was the most powerful BATTLESHIP of her time. I'll take 10 14" to 8 12" anytime -- not to mention the armor plating. Further, I'll have to admit, the sporting analogies don't seem to equate down under. But where's your Alamo . . . who's your Davy Crocket? Some two-legged tank named Ned Kelly? And what's all this I hear about the "original Crocidile Dundee" involved in commiting some vile crime against a defenseless woman? I guess we all have skeletons, so, this weekend, I'll go to my favorite haunt, the Outback Steakhouse and order the Special (my favorite dish) in your honor, Shane. Marc Flake Mansfield, Texas (Where it was 106 today, shew, by golly, it is too hot to fight.) Hi Marc, Gee, only 106 degress F - nice temperature, just about right ;-). As for the Australia, I did say she was a Battlecruiser, but when a battlecruiser is manned by Aussies, we're a match for any battleship ;-þ. BTW, according to my refs, she was involved in an accident with HMS New Zealand & had to withdraw from Jutland. As for our Alamo, well it was in a little place known as ANZAC Cove, where a man called Simpson is more my style of hero, rather than the aforementioned "heros" & I use that term VERY advisedly. Hope the steak turns out fine, Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: YHSAIO@aol.com Subject: Re: Take a Bath The only USN destroyer named after a woman? USS Hopper (DDG-70) named after Admiral Grace Hopper, one of the pioneers of modern computing and also the originater of the term "bug" for computer problems. I also believe that the Hopper has or had a female CO, but don''t quote me on that. What's first prize, a copy of Combat Fleets of the World? :-) Yunchi Hsaio -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: Ross Mac Donald Subject: Texans, football, meat pies, kangaroos and Holden cars You know Shane, Even you mexicans/cockroaches/crows/sandgropers and *blanch* Taswegians must agree with us mighty canetoads that watching grown men play full contact football in FULL BODY ARMOUR is pretty ridiculous, especially when they have to rest every 30 secs and talk about it and then go off because they haven't a sufficient range of skills for the next play. Back to modelling - I've engaged myself in this silly project where I am modelling the entire 3rd Naval battle of Guadalcanal (12-14 October42) in 1/700 scale (should've picked a smaller, less significant battle!) and details of the destroyers are one of the most difficult bits of missing info. About this time the IJN were fitting twin 25mm mounts as secondary armament and beefing up their depth-charge suites - but which ships? Most of my info treats them in class lots, but nothing specific. Any leads? Rossco Vegemite eater Hi Rossco, Mighty Canetoads?????????? - Surely you jest ;-)). Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: "Doremus, Mark" Subject: Re: USS John Wayne The Duke's Navy and Marine movies are: Fighting Seabees -- USN They were Expendable -- USN Sands of Iwo Jima -- USMC Operation Pacific -- USN Flying Leathernecks -- USMC The Wings of Eagles -- USN In Harm's Way -- USN Interesting sidelight, the website I got this from went on and on about Wayne trying to enlist for W.W.II service and being turned down (age, health and marital status). The Biography series (normally friendly to the subject) on one of the cable channels claims he asked for 4F status because he was 34, had bad feet and was married with two children. Either way, he was more valuable to the war effort in Hollywood than in the service. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Kenneth Davis Subject: Tamiya 1/350 PoW vs. KGV I am planning to buy either the 1/350 Prince of Wales or King George V from Tamiya. I was wondering which kit was more accurate for the ship in the period depicted? I am relatively new to ship modelling and plan to buy the GMM PE set to dress the kit up, but I don't want to have to do too much surgery to portray the ship accurately. I look forward to hearing your recommendations. Thanks in advance, Kenn -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: PASO34@webtv.net (Andy Greer) Subject: Destroyer named for woman The USS Hopper is the only USN destroyer named for a woman(currently an Arleigh Burke DDG-70). Read Sea Classics lately? "I'll never reach my destination if I never try so I will sail my vessel until the river runs dry" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: Growlrr@aol.com Subject: Re: Convention J Herne writes: >> Contrary to Mr. Arnold's babbling (he's been staring at monitor for far too long these days), I will gladly attend the convention. I'll be the guy walking around the big target painted on his chest....why not turn it into a model show as well? John, you've got space, right? << Contrary babbling indeed! I believe I said you WOULD attend - That, you literary neophyte (look it up Jeff) would indicate you are in agreement - not disagreement, which would of course be "Contrary". As for babbling - damn - my eyes are bleeding again - to be continued.... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: dhjonespsm@juno.com Subject: Re: PSM 20 reviews >>Subject: PSM No 20 Parte the Second Shane writes> Well I finished of reading this issue, & I'm still impressed ;-). etc. << To Shane: Thanks very much indeed for the kind reviews of PSM 20. As you know I do this as a part time project and there never seems to be an advertising budget. I suspect that many ship modelers that would enjoy the magazine have still not heard of it so I certainly am grateful for your help in spreading the word. It is very much appreciated. I am not pleased with the graphics quality in this issue and I am relieved to find that most readers that I have heard from (including yourself) have enjoyed the issue in spite of the printing glitch. We are working on this problem and expect to see the photo quality back to normal with Number 21. I was trying a new composition method, and was working with a new printer - the result was a unwelcome surprise - very grainy photos. PSM 21: Ray Bean was at the Nationals in Florida and has submitted a great selection of photos of the models. I will be publishing some of these in #21, which brings me to the first request. If any SMMLies were present at that show who are familiar with who built any of the models competing there, I would appreciate your contacting me off list. Ray took few notes (and lost those that he had) so I have a beautiful group of photos of a variety of models and no idea who the builders are. Help..... Question: I recently got a copy of a book called "No Surrender" - which is a first person account of service aboard the cruiser HMS Exeter, from pre-war, through the Battle of the River Plate, and Exeter's loss after the Battle of the Java Sea. There are several photos in the book, one of which is looking forward from the bridge, taken after the River Plate battle, showing A and B turrets with large block letters EX on both turret tops. My question: was this marking was also present on the top of Y turret? When would the EX markings have been painted on A and B (and Y?) turrets? Does anyone know?. Daniel Jones Plastic Ship Modeler magazine Hi Dan, You're welcome. To all those who may worry about such things, my only connection to PSM, is that of a subscriber, etc, etc. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 28) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Re: Italian Camouflage of WWII - Dardo Hi, In general, and off the top of my head, I think the port and starboard sides of Italian patterns of WWII usually did not match. With respect to the Dardo, I don't know if she carried more than one pattern, but in June of 1943 she carried a pattern in which the port side definitely did not match the starboard side. See page 120 of Bagnasco & Brescia's "Classi Freccia/Folgore, Maestrale, Oriani: parte prima," which is also Volume 14/1 of series that postdated the Orizzonte Mare books. If you want, Yohan, I can mail you a copy of this pattern; unfortunately I can't scan it and e-mail it. Best regards, Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 29) From: Stuart Robottom Subject: USS Hopper >> For those of you who like trivia questions, which destroyer was the ONLY one ever named for a woman? << Would that be the USS Hopper? The crew mentioned something like that when I went on a tour of her earlier this year (I bought a hat to prove it!!!). They also mentioned how she ran aground while berthing in Adelaide and damaged their bow sonar -- they berthed stern to shore for the rest of their tour of Australia! Still looking for a model of an Arleigh Burke... Stuart robottom@deakin.edu.au http://www.deakin.edu.au/~robottom/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 30) From: "James Kloek" Subject: Peacetime Hood Colors (Colours) I'm just back from three weeks away, and catching up on back SMMLs. I read the thread on the Hood, and her colors around the time of her sinking. I have the Italeri kit, which has Hood in her prewar configuration (early 30's I think). Did she wear the same colors then? Or was it a lighter gray? Also is there anything glaringly wrong on the Italeri kit which needs fixing? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 31) From: "Peter Mispelkamp" Subject: Bismarck Question A few days ago, someone asked whether there was a difference between the two foreword and the rear AAA director towers on the Bismarck. The answer is yes. The foreword ones were protected by a dome, while the aft pair were left uncovered. Heller got this wrong, as did almost every other firm that ever modeled the Bismarck and Tirpitz. In fact, I can only remember the Revell 1/570 and perhaps the Tamiya 1/350 kits as being correct. FYI, the forward pair of AAA directors on the Prinz Eugen were only given their domes after she arrived in Brest. Peter K. H. Mispelkamp -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 32) From: Martin Aigner (by way of Greg Lee) Subject: Falk Pletcher 700er Treff Several months ago a "700er Treffen" was announced to take place at Leipheim on Oct. 16. I wrote to Mrs. Fieguth as directed, but have received no additional information. Is this meeting still on, and if so, where exactly at Laupheim? I am spoiling to meet some real live shipmodellers. Sincerely, Richard Aigner -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 33) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Escort camouflage during Operation Cerberus I managed to find references in four of my books to the escorts used during the 'Channel Dash', as follows: MJ Whitley, German Destroyers of World War Two: p118 shows Z5 Paul Jacobi in two tone grey vertical surfaces with false wake at stern p119 shows a Type 35 torpedoboot (photo reversed, I think) of 2nd Flotilla alongside Prinz Eugen, with two tone hull sides and a dark chevron on the bridge side HT Lenton, German Warships of the Second World War: p89 shows the same photo of the Type35 as above, but the opposite way round, and identifies it as T11. p88 shows T1 in the same scheme from a different angle, although it does not identify the date or location. Koop & Schmolke, Die deutschen Zerstorer 1935-1945: p22 has a port side drawing of the scheme worn by Z4 Richard Beitzen which looks identical to that carried by Z5 during Cerberus so both ships may have been painted the same way during that operation. Jung, Abendroth & Kelling, Anstriche und Tarnanstriche der deutschen Kriegsmarine: p93 has the same photo of Z5 as the Whitley book. Robert Lockie Cambridge UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 34) From: "Edward F Grune" Subject: Texan, firing for effect Marc, You've got to look out for those tricky Aussies. I think you left yourself open on that one. You know that they're a nation of convicts, while we here in the Republic of Texas are just a nation of criminals. On top of that they're bragging about a game where grown men go running around a field chasing a ball with sticks. Oops, that sounds dangerously like Lacrosse -- I don't want to upset any of our neighbors to the far north ;-) BTW Shane -- do the men still wear dresses when they play field hockey? What to the women wear, pants? -) Ed Mansfield Republic of Texas Hi Ed, Well, since the women wear short skirts & tight tops, do you think I really care what what the men are wearing ;->>>>>. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 35) From: "Satin, Michael N. (SHEP)" Subject: Fellow sufferers A note to our friends in New York, I've been reading with interest, and no little amusement, the thread between SMMLies from NY and Texas. I sympathize with the New Yorkers. If you think USS Texas gets more press than USS New York, try being from Iowa!!!! Michael Satin (transplanted from the rolling hills of Ioway) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 36) From: "Morley, James (London)" Subject: 1/350 Enterprise etc.. Thanks to the posters re: the aircraft for this monster. Do I take it then from the resounding silence on the other question that everyone thinks I'm completely nuts to contemplate back-dating the island to the old beehive structure?? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 37) From: "Edward F Grune" Subject: Liberty Ship/Victory Ship deck details A few days back someone posted questions regarding deck details on Liberty Ships and/or Victory Ships. I think your message may have been missed among the battleship trivia threads. So here is some belated assistance: The Warship Website has some very good walkaround photos of the Jeremiah O'Brien and Red Oak Victory posted at: http://warship.simplenet.com/liberty.htm and http://warship.simplenet.com/Victory.htm. Ed Mansfield, TX -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 38) From: rickl@efortress.com Subject: Naming of US Navy ships Back in the first half of the century the Navy had a definite structured scheme for naming its ships. Destroyer type ships were named for heroes of the Navy and Marine Corps, members of congress and inventors who made contributions to the Navy. That tradition was broken with the naming of the USS Canberra to honor the Australian cruiser and the naming of the CVB-42 for a president (Franklin D. Roosevelt). Both were justifiable - to honor a gallant ally and a President who was as much our (the Navy’s) President as we were ‘his’ Navy. Then came the Forrestal, JFK, Glenard P. Lipscome, L. Mendel Rivers, Richard B.Russel and the entire Nimitz class. While the naming of naval ships for politicians may be proper in some cases the current method of naming ships to gain favor with certain politicians or political groups unduly erodes the traditions of one of the nation’s most hallowed institutions. The naming of the Navy’s capital warships after individuals, however deserving, causes more appropriate names to be given to lesser ships or, worse, no ships. Its too late to rename the Reagan (any sailor knows its bad luck to rename a ship) but why not name CVN-77 Coral Sea or Intrepid or Yorktown or Midway. Honor the sailors who actually placed themselves in harm’s way. They deserve it more than any politician. There are plenty of airports or buildings that can be named after politicians. Naval tradition is too important to continue to allow it to be cheapened by allowing its ships to be named in such a haphazard and politically expedient manner. Rick Lundin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: NVTC PART 11... AT LAST!! (and ICM 1/350 Hood news) Hi Guys, I have just spoken with Roland Smith, who authors the "Naval Video Time Capsules" range. We are shortly taking stock of the long-awaited last title in the range. PART 11 "British Pacific and East Indies Fleet Part Two" We don't have a list of the actual contents as yet. This is available in either NTSC (North American) format, or PAL (almost!) rest of the world. It is available at 25.73 pounds in the U.K. and E.U. to include air/1st Class shipping, and taxes and at 27.56 pounds ($43.82) for the rest of the world, includes shipping, sent airmail You might like to check out this range if you haven't already, as, for purchases for 4 or more of these titles, there is a 10% discount. Re the forthcoming ICM 1/350 kits, I have a message straight out of the Ukraine this morning for all interested SMMLlies. The ICM 1/350 KONIG will be out first, in NOVEMBER this year. Following this will be the GROSSER KURFURST some time later. Re the Hood kit, and I quote: "1/350 HOOD to appear next year... probably NOVEMBER 2000". Just so as you can get your modelling priorities sorted out in the meantime! All My Best Caroline Carter Recovering from a lightning strike in the garden yesterday, which took out the apple tree, and a consequent 12 hour loss of power... a strange sulphurous smell hung around for ages... Great to be back.. gearing up for the WEM "specials" this weekend! (and, talking about natural events, did you know that, per square mile, Britain has more tornadoes/twisters than any other country on earth? I didn't!) http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models White Ensign Models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Books for Sale I have the following books for sale: Japanese Warships of WWII by A.J. Watts (Ian Allen 1966/Doubleday1970): $27.00 plus shipping (many photos and plans, 400 pages inc. index, no dj) Royal Navy Warship Drawings by Norman Ough (David MacGregor Plans & Neptune Publications 1975): $21.00 plus shipping (small scale plans of Daring, Dorsetshire, Warspite 1931, Marvel, Cadiz, Hedingham Castle, and Penelope, photos of ships and models, 16 pages long) Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: Re: White Ensign's Warspite set Hi Leif >> I just bought White Ensign's photo-etched set for Airfix Warspite 1/600 (WEM PE 614). While impressed by the fret itself I'm less so with the instructions. With the set came one page of General Instructions and one page with instructions specific to Warspite. However, there are no references to parts 5, 9, 10, 18, 21, 23, 30, 39, 45 or 51, so I have some suspicions that one page could be missing from the instructions. << Unfortunately, there is NO decent excuse from ourselves for the above as far as we are concerned (!). We confess that these were somewhat incomplete.. the story (and the remedy) follows! We were asked by a number of folks to modify the WEM 1/700 WW2 Queen Elizabeth Class into a specific 1/600 scale set to beef up the Airfix 1/600 Warspite. This is not an easy job for any Airfix subject as we have to get around the various kit's inaccuracies by modifying the "accurate" parts which have been drawn for the 1/700 Scale WEM kits (or rather, Peter Hall, the designer, has to!). Dave, my other half, was dead set against doing ANYTHING for such a minority interest scale as 1/600, due to the large investment required with prospect of only a very long term return (the reason the PRO 600 and PE 600 sets are here for the 1/600 scale modellers, is because I think it is important to go some way down the road with minority interest.. long terms, that interest will hopefully grow, and of course, they're so bloody grateful.. aren't they Felix!!..) Dave was also so tied up with doing kit instructions for our own kits, that he said, yes, we would do the necessary research, throw it all at Peter Hall, but Peter would have to do the instructions for us, as Dave didn't have time, and, with several hundred pounds already tied up in design, phototooling, and etched brass sheet, we couldn't wait several months before releasing the brass, as customer pressure for release was rising already.. so, Peter gave it his best shot! However (and I'm sure he won't mind me saying this!!), as brilliant an etched designer he might be, his lack of experience in the instructions department definitely showed! Peter IS an extremely good modeller (he has a ROOM full of trophies and shields that has to be seen to be believed), and he gets things done.. with Peter Hall around, the impossible has become possible (just to make you know how much we really appreciate you old chum!!!). However, we never end-to-end proofed these, I confess....feedback from Felix Bustelo was the first we received, and I passed said comments on to Peter. For the next set, he took most of these comments on board...the 1/600 HMS Belfast fret, released soon afterwards, was a vast improvement, and the latest instructions, for the 1/600 HMS Hood fret, are light-years ahead of the first (I think even Peter was also pretty pleased with the end result on these, as well as the fatter cheque!!!). Re the Warspite PE, Dave is producing an amendment to this sheet, which will include a full plan and profile view with numbered parts shown, as well as reference to the parts not illustrated. The different doors and hatches are numbered, though we do not provide the location points for these..thsi won't change.. however, reference will be amde to them. They are the "cherry" on the cake.. we didn't have to include them.. some modellers will choose not to use them, and the modeller has more than enough for 3 or 4 ship builds in fact! Another concerns the Single Oerlikons (same applies to the Rodney/Nelson fret in 1/700). We simply provide an extremely large number of these, enabling the modeller to research the particular fit they want to portray the ship, and position the 20mm's as appropriate (with a lot left over for other modelling purposes). Anyhow, if any of you out there would like a 1/600 Warspite "Miscellaneous and Amendments" sheet when Dave finishes it (already have Leif's address!), please E-Mail me, Caroline at mailto:white.ensign.models@dial.pipex.com with your full name and address, and we will mail you one when it is finished. All My Best Caroline Carter Owner and Web-Mistress Sat in front of the 'puter, staring at a screen, contemplating the WEM Specials, whilst dearest other half goes off flying over the Brecon Beacons with a mate.. Grrrrr!! http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume