Subject SMML19/10/99VOL703 Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 00:04:58 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: whole lotta shakin' goin' on 2: Lead vs Solder 3: Re: Model Shipwright No.70. 4: USS Alabama camouflage in 1942. 5: Re: General Enquiry re SMS. 6: Re: SMS 7: Re: USS CALIFORNIA references 8: Re: General Enquiry: HMS 9: USS Nashville & Trivia 10: Re: General Enquiry 11: Model firehose & decal req 12: Re: General Inquiry 13: Aoshima/Fujimi kits 14: New Aoshima and Fujimi products 15: Aoshima Tone. 16: Re: USS Alabama camouflage 17: Re: Oil tanker query 18: In the News 19: Re: Lead wire and fly line 20: Thanks 21: Sinkex 22: Fishing supplies - was lead wire 23: HMAS Perth - decommissioned 24: Re: USS California Reference Materials 25: Wind and rain 26: Rivets 27: Brass for Rigging -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Trivia # 10 - Final Question in Round One 2: New 1/192 USN Radar set 3: Liberty ships -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Kenneth H. Goldman" Subject: Re: whole lotta shakin' goin' on Oops. Maybe the quake rattled my brain more than I thought. I should have said we are west-south-west of the epicenter, not south. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER http://www.wman.com/~khgold/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Darren Scannell Subject: Lead vs Solder I don't want to beat this topic to death, but thought I'd add that the article about lead on the museum curators site posted a couple of days ago is excellent. A couple of points to remember is that lead rot is worst in sealed cases with real wood inside (bases). The wood gives off a lot of acetic acid that starts the rot process. Also solder is a mix of tin and lead and this makes it much less susceptible to lead rot. (otherwise they wouldn't use it on military or NASA circuit boards). Rest assured solder on models will last a long time. And it flattens easily for that realistic effect. I personally would choose it over lead wire if I were to seal it in a case. A good electronics shop will carry some pretty fine solder. Regards, Darren Scannell -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "J. London" Subject: Re: Model Shipwright No.70. HMS Polyphemus, the ram turret ship, is indeed the one featured in MS 70. Mike London -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Damian Pliszka Subject: USS Alabama camouflage in 1942. Hi, According to Profile Morskie description about Alabama's painting (Ms 15)there were used colors: All vertical surfaces: Navy Blue (5-N), Ocean Gray (5-O) and Haze gray (5-H). All horizontal surfaces including main deck: Deck Blue. Hope this helps Damian Pliszka Slupsk, Poland "-How do you feel? -Cold sir." SWE1:TPM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "J. London" Subject: Re: General Enquiry re SMS. SMS stands for Seine Majistat Schiffe (I think I have the German spelling right). Anyway it stood for His Majesty's Ship and was used in the Imperial German and Austro-Hungarian navies up to 1918. Mike London -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: John Philip Downing Subject: Re: SMS >> Would you kindly post this message on the SMML. It has perplexed me for a while and I've consulted many books and other references with no success. We all know what HMS, RMS, DKM, etc. stand for. The one I've yet to work out is SMS. Any suggestions?. << If memory serves me right, it means (spelling not guaranteed) Seines Majestiches Schiffe Which is "His Majesty's Ship" in German -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: USS CALIFORNIA references I just got _Blue Water Beat: The Two Lives of the Battleship USS CALIFORNIA_ not long ago. It's got some useful photos for the modeler, and one very useful deck plan showing the location of all the light AA in her late war fit. Photo reproduction is OK, but not great, tending to be a bit muddy. It's a must-read for her operational history. The book is a bit tough to find or order. I ordered mine from Amazon.com, and it took them 6 months to get it. You'd probably get it faster by calling the San Francisco Maritime Museum. Don't forget Myron Smith's _Golden State Battlewagon: U.S.S. CALIFORNIA (BB-44), published in 1983 by Pictorial Histories of Missoula, Montana. I think you can still find copies of this. John Snyder "Strive for excellence but remember, it's difficult to be exceptional in a world where anything surpassing mediocrity is cause for suspicion." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: Ernst-Bernhard Kayser Subject: Re: General Enquiry: HMS Dear Michael, SMS, as for example in "SMS Goeben", is the German equivalent for the British "His/Her Majestie's Ship". The exact translation is: "Seine Majestäts Schiff". I guess the name prefix was given to all ships of the Imperial German Navy during the second German Reich (1871-1918). Historians please correct me if I am wrong. Bernhard -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Jeff J Herne Subject: USS Nashville & Trivia I just got my ISW USS Nashville, and it looks great. Hull is super crisp, and the only downside I can see is a 2 piece hull. I've never been a fan of 2 piece hulls... Jeff's #1 rule of resin engagement: If it's a 2 piece hull in 1/350, then it's built waterline to avoid prolonged swearing and tennis elbow from sanding... I plan to convert her to the Savannah (pre-Fritz X) for one of my museum volunteers, who was a Gunner's Mate aboard the Savvy when she was hit. If you want a mid-late war Brooklyn, get this kit. FOR ALL SMML TRIVIA HOUNDS: This will be the address used for SMML Trivia in all future rounds. While jherne@hotmail.com is a valid account, I cannot guarantee that your emails will be received. My 2 cents worth. Jeff -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Arjun Sarup" Subject: Re: General Enquiry Suggestions? Of course! I reckon it stands for 'Ship Might Sink'. Best wishes, Arjun Sarup Mauritius -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Lisa and Bill Wiseman Subject: Model firehose & decal req First, I want know where Ed is getting a graphite / kevlar fly rod for only $500??. My bride almost brained me when she found out I spent a grand on my Thomas & Thomas. 9ft - 10 wt salt water rod. Second fire hose doesn't lay dead flat; it always has a little "hump". I'm a career Fire Fighter, a graduate of US Navy Damage Control School and have extensive, first hand, almost intimate knowlege of fire hose. The US Navy uses double nylon jacketed hose which has a very pronounced roundness when racked or rolled. I have toyed with the idea of taking the fine lead wire and running it between the bench and a dull (or the back) of an exacto blade to flatten it out just a little. I think this would look more right in 1/350 or larger scale. I like the idea of increasing the center diameter of the reel with plastic rod and using one layer of wire or thread. For smaller scales round wire would be fine if needed. Now a question. Anybody have a quick source for 1/350 decals? Specifically hull numbers. Mine were in their box on the floor under my bench. During hurricane Floyd, my shop was partially flooded while I was at work and my bride just wet vacuumed and mopped up and didn't tell me. I have the Gulfstream OHP Frigate all ready for decals and when I went to get them out and noticed they were all in a big pile at the end of the backing sheet. I had hoped to enter the kit in a local show this weekend. Orderng them from Loren is not an option. Since were on opposite sides of the country, the mail just won't be fast enough. I'm in New York northwest of NYC about 60 miles. Any shops / dealers near me? Northern NJ is also close enough. Thanks Doc Wiseman -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: SeaPhoto@aol.com Subject: Re: General Inquiry Michael D'Silva" wrote: >> We all know what HMS, RMS, DKM, etc. stand for. The one I've yet to work out is SMS. Any suggestions? << Pardon if my german spelling is rusty, but it is Seine Majesties Schiff - His Majestie's Ship, referring to the German Kaiser, who was the monarch of the country at the time before and during World War I. Kurt SeaPhoto -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "chenyangzhang" Subject: Aoshima/Fujimi kits Hi Mike I have the Aoshima Chikuma and its a far superior kit to the Fujimi version. Aoshima bought the rights? to these kits and re-tooled them. It builds into a very nice replica. Fujimi used to be better than Aoshima, their Oyodo was particularly good, but this isn't saying much as neither were anywere near Hasegawa let alone Tamiya. However, with the Aoshima re-tools (particularly the Nagato/Mutsu) things have changed. The upshot is buy the Aoshima kit, replace alot of small items with Leviathan/Skywave parts and etched brass. It looks really good. Chris -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Fernando, Yohan" Subject: New Aoshima and Fujimi products I noticed that on the Upcoming Ship kits page on HobbyLink Japan, among others, it lists from Aoshima the CV Amagi and from Fujimi the O'Brien and the Cushing. All in 1/700. Anyone know more info on these? Is the Amagi just a retooled Unryu/Katsuragi kit or was the Amagi significantly different? I'm also assuming the O'Brien and Cushing are the WWII-era destroyers. All have scheduled release dates between October and December of this year. Any more info to whet the appetite? Yohan Fernando -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Douglas Martin" Subject: Aoshima Tone. Mike: The Aoshima Tone and Chikuma are new moldings, rather than rehashes of the Fujimi kit, and are finer in detail, plus Tone has less 25mm *3s, replaced by 25mm *1s. This looks like a fairly good kit, mind you, I've not checked it out against the Polish cruisers book or AJ Watts plans. Aoshima kits in the 70s were diabolical detail wise, especially the destroyers and battleships, Fuso and Yamashiro being awful (in my opinion) - supermodelers and P/E experts will be able to make good the deficiencies. The problem was they made ships classes you just had to get yer mitts on.......... Buy the Aoshima now, its a better kit, so I believe are their Akizuki class destroyers, Fujimi appear to have ceased their production. Aoshima Tone available in Japan (1800Y), Fujimi (700Y) (Rainbow Ten, Mail order) Aoshima Tone has no 'shutters' in the hull for the torpedo tubes, plus has a fuller stern and a slightly different stem. Individual gun barrels for the 8" main battery. If I ever get it built, I'll be able to see a better comparison........ Douglas (Scotland) PS: Does anyone know if the Aoshima Fuyuzuki have a late war A/A fit? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: Ross Bruce-QBR000 Subject: Re: USS Alabama camouflage >> Profile Morskie No. 18 shows a color drawing of USS Alabama BB 60 as camouflaged in 1942 on the back cover. Can anybody confirm this pattern? << The USS Alabama wore a modified measure 12 with the standard colors from the time of her commissioning into late 1942 when she transitioned over to the Pacific at which time she was repainted into a measure 22 scheme. She would wear that measure until the end of the war. Bruce -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: CBNJBB62@aol.com Subject: Re: Oil tanker query Dear Gentlemen: Thank you for your replies concerning the PRAIRIE with German subs in World War II. Frankly the caption that Paul Beaver wrote went against everything I ever studied about World War 2. I recall reading the Morrison 15 volume history on that war in high school and watching the TV show World at War and the American people were very pro isolationist until Pearl Harbor. I recall reading that Germany used to paint it's warships in the same color schemes as the British to avoid detection by aircraft or ships. However life can be stranger than fiction and I thought I'd ask. Craig Bennett -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: In the News Not exactly a model-related piece, but according to the Naval Reserve Association, a commemorative series of stamps to honor the 100th Anniversary of the U.S. Navy Submarine Force will be released. The official unveiling of the submarine stamp designs will take place at the Submarine Force Museum in Groton, Connecticut on Oct 25th, 1999. Congressman Gejdenson (sponsor), VADM Giambastiani (COMSUBLANT) and postal service representatives will be present. Five stamps will be issued: USS Holland, an S-Class Sub, a Gato-Class Sub, USS Hyman G. Rickover (L.A.-Class Sub), and an Ohio-Class Trident SSBN. Also noted a story on comedian Jonathan Winters in the local newspaper (Washington Post). He served on the battleship California during WW2 and is something of a ship model collector. A color photo showed him standing by a four-foot cased model of the California (pre-war fit) but it didn't identify the source of the very impressive-looking model. Mike L Alexandria, VA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Lead wire and fly line I checked my local fly fishing store and they indeed had a number of diameters of lead wire. While I was there I picked up some stuff called tippet line. This is 8X size and about half the thickness as human hair! The diameter is (get this) .0035! Perfect for 1/700 scale rigging. I've been looking for rigging this thin for years. I HIGHLY recommend checking out your local tackle shop. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://warship.simplenet.com/Flagship.htm "Yeah I want Cheesy Poofs" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: "graham" Subject: Thanks Hi all, I have now screwed the offending lamp/magnifier to the desk. Thanks for the condolences and support . graham -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: Mark McKellar Subject: Sinkex To my Aussie friends, Several months ago some kind soul posted a link to an Australian Sinkex .Mov file. It was a great site and video. Alas, I sent my laptop in for service and it came back with the hard drive erased. Can anyone supply me with that link??? Thanks Mark Where the leaves are red, yellow, brown, gold and all over my lawn Hi Mark, Since it was me who posted the site, I'd better answer your query ;-) The site is at: http://www.navy.gov.au/3_photo/sinkex.htm Shane - where the leaves are green. Plus, the temperature is rising, but enough about me building the Onslow ;-) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: "Jeff Herne" Subject: Fishing supplies - was lead wire While you're in your local hunting-fishing store, be sure to check out some of tools used by fly fishermen (or should I say fisherpersons?). At any rate, I picked up several pairs of super-fine tweezers, small surgical scissors, and a pair of flush cutters similar to Xuron nippers. Although nothing was revolutionary to ship modeling, they cost me considerably less than I would have paid in a hobby shop. I also grabbed some very fine brass wire, which has mysteriously vanished from the workbench... Anyway, Jeff -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: Mark Krywienko Subject: HMAS Perth - decommissioned Hi SMML list, The Royal Australian Navy has decommissioned the HMAS Perth on October the 15th, she spent 34 years in service. Perth is a Charles F. Adams class guided missile and is one of three purchased from the US. Laid down in Defoe in 1962 and commissioned in 1965. She saw service in Vietnam sustaining damage in a number of attacks. Perth will be given to the Western Australia government where she is expected to become a dive wreck. If you are quick you can still see her tied up at fleet base in Sydney for those last pics. Mark -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: cwlam Subject: Re: USS California Reference Materials >> Has anyone here bought or seen either of these books? Blue Water Beat: The Two Lives of the Battleship USS California by George F. Gruner, Glencannon Pr 1996; ISBN: 1889901016 << I have the "review" edition of this book. If you are interested in the history of the ship, then it is a great book. It mainly describes the operational history of the USS California. But it is not a good reference material for a modeler. It contain only a couple of line drawings, and not very many pictures. The pictures in my copy are fuzzy. Maybe the final edition is better. >> On the warship site, the review for the IS 1/350 Tennesee also mentions a Profile Morskie USS California book (which Jon W has informed me the kit *does not* come with - but the Myron Smith Volunteer State Battlewagon one instead). Beyond that though, I haven't seen this book listed for sale anywhere. Is it still available, or is it OOP? << This book is the equivalent of the Myron Smith book with Polish text, and a set of 1/400 scale plans (top view, side view, hull, and various decks and fittings). A pretty good modeler's reference. I brought the last copy from San Antonio Hobby shop in the SF bay area this morning. Several months ago, they had 4 copies. This seems to be one of the few ship related items that sells well. San Antonio Hobby shop is not known for having OOP items. I assume that it must still be available elsewhere. Chung -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: Robert OConnor Subject: Wind and rain To Caroline and all the others who expressed concern over our plight here in Florida over a sweetie named Irene.. she was a bit nastier to us than her older brother ,Floyd, having blown thru the heart of south Fla and then caused quite a stir along the central coast headed North. Now comes cleanup. I sat in the Volusia County Emergency Operations Center all Day on Saturday and was amazed at the damage a storm which was not supposed to hurt us did. Some of the fools of the world went out wading in standing water in South Fla., and met Mr. Downed Power Line. It was not a pretty sight. Seven dead due to electrocution. On a more bizarre note, the coast of North Carolina (aka Hurricane Magnet) is currently feeling the latest of the old girl.Thanks to you all for the concern...Good luck to the N.C.crew-stay dry and keep smiling. Bob O'Connor, in between Daytona Beach and Orlando, where we are drying off and cleaning up. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: Ophelia Subject: Rivets Hey Gang: Problems, problems, and more problems... yeah, the joy of modeling. Anyway, I accidently removed a bunch of rivets off a main gun and it is very noticable (to me at least) but besides that, now that I would like to replace them I have decided that if there is a way to do this then I will add all the missing ones to the bridges and secondary armament as well, which is one of the few details I over looked due to realism problems. Please tell me there is a way of adding good looking rivets to a 350 scale ship (they are the typical Tamiya lumps) so that I don't have to go crazy over this small problem. Ya, I realise this isn't exactly a 'Hood' tragedy (beleive me my lamp is pushed WAY back now) but this project is so far perfect and I would like to keep it that way. Reguards; Mark A. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: Ophelia Subject: Brass for Rigging Hello again; A while ago someone suggested using very thin brass like .008 or .006 for rigging (and wires and cables), has anyone here actually tried this? How did it work out? The reason for this is that I have to add some rigging in between a mess of existing rigging and I don't think I'll be able to add in nylon or sprue without damaging the rest. Has anyone rigged a whole ship in brass? Really curious how it looks. Cheers; Mark A. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Jeff Herne" Subject: Trivia # 10 - Final Question in Round One We've gone back and checked the numbers...I was mistaken in awarding sanartjam@aol.com 2 additional points in Round 8, and the following have received points due to email problems. Keith.Butterly@bc.sympatico.ca - 4 points John.Sutherland@amcom.co.nz - 4 points r2brown@bc.sympatico.ca - 8 points jjrule@idirect.com - 8 points These points are credited in the totals below. ***************************************************************** The following vessels all share a common thread. I have one answer in particular, so saying they all carried 20mm guns, or they all floated, will not suffice. DD-411 - USS Anderson, named for Edwin Anderson of USS Marblehead. DD-386 - USS Bagley, named for Ensign Worth Bagley, first US Officer killed during the Spanish American War. DD-387 - USS Blue, named for Victor Blue, a naval intelligence officer in Cuba. DD-744 - USS Blue, renamed after loss of DD-387. DD-92 - USS Gidley, named for Olympia's captain, Charles V. Gridley. AP-25 - USS Leonard Wood, named for US Army General. DDG-10 - USS Sampson, named for Rear Admiral William T. Sampson ID-2999 - USS Siboney, formerly the S.S. Oreinte, combination cargo/passenger vessel, aquired in 1918. Converted to hospital ship in 1944, scrapped in 1957. Named for the town just outside the Las Guasimas Ridge, site of a battle which provided Roosevelt's Rough Riders with their first combat. What is the common thread shared by all of these vessels? (2 points) **They were all named after Spanish American War people and places** Bonus: Name 4 vessels not listed here that share the same thread as those listed above (1 point each, 4 pts. max.) Possibilities included, but were not limited to: USS Bernadow USS Clark USS Dewey USS Evans USS Hobson USS Lamberton USS Mahan USS Schley USS Selfridge USS Sigsbee Bonus #2: From this thread, what name has been carried on the most USN vessels? (2 pts.) That would be the USS Bagley, whose name has been carried on 5 USN vessels. Correct responses were from: Mike.Leonard@erols.com - 8 points sanartjam@aol.com - 6 points jmalondon@home.com - 6 points sarup@intnet.mu.com - 8 points jjrule@idirect.com - 2 points richa5011@aol.com - 6 points dhjonespsm@juno.com - 6 points brianselzer@bc.sympatico.ca - 5 points Standings through 9 rounds: dhjonespsm@juno.com - 30 pts. sanartjam@aol.com - 29 points sarup@intnet.mu.com - 29 points douglas.j.martin@email.msn.com - 24 points jjrule@idirect.com - 20 pts. raeplus@s-direktnet.de - 20 pts richa5011@aol.com - 17 points YHSAIO@aol.com - 14 pts. brianselzer@bc.sympatico.ca - 14 pts. jmalondon@home.com - 14 pts. KHgold@wman.com - 10 pts. ColinTroup@compuserve.com - 10 pts. john.sutherland@amcom.co.nz - 10pts. tbbullock@thegrid.net - 9pts. mike.leonard@erols.com - 9 pt. technoinfidel@webtv.net - 8 pts. r2brown@bc.sympatico.ca - 8points minadmiral@aol.com - 7 pts. Geoff-smith@cwcom.net - 7 pts. Christopher.Herron@PSS.Boeing.com - 5pt. chuck1155@earthlink.net - 4 pts. cjmhughes@btinternet.com - 4pts. jdcorley@earthlink.net - 4pts. johnsnyder@macnexus.org - 4pts. volker.haeuser@main-rheiner.de - 4pts. jefcat@msn.com - 4pts. KeithButterly@bc.sympatico.ca - 4 points jecham3981@aol.com - 4pts. romoh@singular.gr - 4pts. jpb@skynet.be - 3pts. spallen@wavecomputers.net - 2pts. jowfx@cs.com - 2pts. THenrys@aol.com - 2pts. jaci@Lehigh.edu - 1 pt. Number 10: This is it for Round One., and I saved the best for last. My name is H.M.S. Cybele, and I am neither a vessel OR a shore station. What am I, and what was my sole purpose? (4 points) Bonus #1: Who built me? (2 points) Bonus #2: What was my displacement and my length? (4 points) Good Luck! Responses to: mailto:warships@juno.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Tom & Carolyn Harrison" Subject: New 1/192 USN Radar set Something new for the big scale builders from Tom's Modelworks 1/192 Scale W.W.II US Destroyer Radar's Set # 2007 $8.00 More in this scale to follow, watch SMML for announcements. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: Liberty ships You can find both the Skywave and the Blue Jacket Ship at: http://www.modelshipbuilding.com I have talked to a resin Manf.in the HO line who is coming out with a resin kit of a Liberty Ship about 5' long in the 350.00 kit range. Due out in less than 6 mos. I'll keep you in touch. We will be carrying it. Shaya -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for having SMML at your home, why not stop by our home at: http://www.smml.org.uk -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume