Subject SMML29/12/99VOL774 Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 00:48:54 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: FRAM Paint scheme 2: Re: FRAM Paint scheme 3: Re: FRAM Sumner 4: Ranger Air Group Colours Autumn '43 5: Titanic to Britannic 6: Re: FRAM Paint Scheme 7: IJN Coral Sea colours 8: Happy New Year 9: Web Site on Japanese Naval History 10: Arkona 11: Re: Paint bottle markings anyone? 12: Carley float straps 13: Kitlink web site 14: FRAM Book 15: Re: USS Chicago -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Book for sale -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "John Sheridan" Subject: Re: FRAM Paint scheme >> More questions on the Jag Gearing. When I paint a ship, I tend to use colors that look 'right' rather than the precise color. That said, I'm trying to find a color that would be good for the horizontal surfaces of the ship. I have about 20 grays in my posession and all seem too light or too dark. Any suggestions? << Try Model Master Gunship Gray for the horizontal surfaces and Model Master Dark Ghost Gray for the vertical surfaces. John Sheridan I am not a Member of the Lumber Cartel (tinlc) and I am not Unit #631 Last last place on earth I would look for the Lumber Cartel(tm) is http://come.to/the.lumber.cartel -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Fernando, Yohan" Subject: Re: FRAM Paint scheme >> More questions on the Jag Gearing. When I paint a ship, I tend to use colors that look 'right' rather than the precise color. That said, I'm trying to find a color that would be good for the horizontal surfaces of the ship. I have about 20 grays in my posession and all seem too light or too dark. << Since you know what shade of gray you are looking for (ie. the one that looks right to you), then you should be able to mix up a batch from the other 20 stock grays you have. Just make sure that once you find the correct shade you want, that you mix enough for the kit in question (or keep very precise notes on how you mixed up the first batch). I almost always end up mixing my own colors and even like to make the same color appear slightly different on two different ships by very very slightly lightening/darkening each batch by varying degrees, which makes notes on mixing ratios pretty impossible in my case (5:1 deck blue + gray , plus an extra 6 drops of gray, plus an extra 4 drops of white...). So I just make sure I mix a batch large enough for the ship I'm working on. Once you start mixing your own colors, the onces straight from the bottle just never look quite as good again! Yohan Fernando -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: FRAM Sumner >> 2. Does anyone else have a FRAM Sumner kit other than the Jim Shirley kit? << Currently no in 1/700 scale. However, JAG Collective's web site shows a FRAM Sumner as a future release. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ "Yeah I want Cheesy Poofs" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Ingebrethsen, Kyrre" Subject: Ranger Air Group Colours Autumn '43 Well, let me start by thanking everybody for their input on the issue. I have allready made contact with the AG-4 association, and Gerald Thomas has promised me an answer in due time. So while we're waiting I thought I'd ask around. I have my doubts if we're ever going to get a definitive answer, as the pictures I've seen up 'till now from the Operation Leader never show the aircraft involved from a modellers angle (which would be - well - an angle showing every aspect of the aircraft, including the inside of the cowling! :-), and since we're lacking pictures we have to trust the memories of the crew involved. And as stated earlier, the camo rarely was the prime concern while right in the middle of the Arctic Sea! What I've been told now is that the aircraft in fact (relative fact, that is) WAS painted in the three tone Blue/Blue/White camo, also shown on one SBD-picture on the AG-4 website (a bit difficult to find, since it's on a pop-up window, but the title of the pic is "Commander D. Woot Taylor thanks pilots and crews of Torpedo Four") in addition to one well documented picture of SBD "19" over the Skerries outside Bodø. (Link found in article "Norway: A Grateful Nation Remembers". Pity it's such a low resolution.) It is also clear that the Insignia had a red outline on that picture, in addition to numbers on the tail and cowling. In conclusion one can safely say that at least the SBD's and TBM were painted as such. And I strongly believe that the Wildcats were painted in the same fashion. BUT I have no evidence... So while we're waiting for some recollections from Mr. Thomas I'll start painting my Aires Interior for the Tamiya Wildcat, get some nice red-outlined Stars n' Bars and practise painting that three tone camo... Now about pictures mentioned by you good people, well that puzzles me. (As it probably do you). Marc, you mentioned the caption under one picture: >> the two-tone scheme was kept for Ranger because the sea blue, intermediate blue, white tricolor would have been inappropriate for the North Atlantic. And the airgroup commander obviously felt that the antisubmarine scheme II would have been inappropriate with all those 109 and 190 things flitting about << Take it from someone who lives in Northern Norway: If any colours are appropriate for the Northern Atlantic, well it's gotta be hues of blue. Of course, a winter storm will give you greys, but in general it's all blue. Not like the Pacific. More like er... the North... >> So, Chris has a photo identified at late 1943 with the two-tone, I've got one in February 1944 with the same scheme. Considering the photographic evidence, then, I'd have to say that aircraft on Ranger used the two-tone scheme during the Operation Leader. There would be no bars nor red or blue outline. << [KIN] Very intriguing, concidering my own "evidence" of quite the opposite! Could it be that not all aircraft were painted in the new scheme? I think we have to rely on Gerald Thomas for this... Watch this space! Kyrre Harstad, Norway. Dark, Cold and Blue. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: John_Impenna@hyperion.com Subject: Titanic to Britannic Hi All, Can anyone tell me which set of photo-etched brass would work best for converting a Revell 1/570 Titanic to the HMHS Britannic? I know there are sets in both 1/500 & 1/600 and the obvious answer would be 1/600 sets, but I was wondering if anyone has attempted this and have actually seen which scale "looks" right. Thanks. John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: FRAM Paint Scheme Well, check your bottles of paint and see if you have either of these: Haze Gray: FS 36270 (26270 for scale effect) Deck Gray: FS 36008 (26176 for scale effect) John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Arthur" Subject: IJN Coral Sea colours Hope everyone had an enjoyable holiday period and you are all ready for Y2K. Could some kind person please advise on the colour scheme used by the IJN during the Battle of the Coral Sea 1942? Specifically the Carrier Striking Force comprising CV Shokaku, Zuikaku, CA Myoko and Haguro, the DD's Ariake, Yugure, Shiratsuyu, Shigure, Ushio and Akebono. Would the oiler Toho Maru have been in similar paint? These are 1/96 scale R/C units so there is scope for accuracy and detail. Much appreciated, Arthur In a brilliant sunny NZ and the fishing is great ! 18 lb Snapper yesterday. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Caroline Carter" Subject: Happy New Year Hi There! An Early Y2K greeting to everyone on the Ship Modellers Mailing List from everyone at WEM... Just to let folks overseas know that it's still holidays here (aint we the lucky ones!)... as some of you are probably wondering why your E-Mails aren't being answered as quickly as usual, and why we're not answering telephones... we will be catching up with E-Mails and orders etc. after the New Year.. tho a few of your orders will go out tomorrow and Thursday.. Christmas Day and Boxing Day are of course Bank Hols in the U.K., so this means that folks were "off" Saturday, Sunday, Monday and Tuesday.. some will go back for Wednesday and Thursday.. most are then off for Friday.. New Year's Day is also a Bank Holiday.. this is a Saturday... so, everyone gets next Monday off as well! Some folks will have had a straight 10 days off work... almost all manufacturing falls into this category. We're just taking time to sort out the VAT returns this week.. but will be back in full action on January 3rd, assuming the Y2K fixes work OK! BTW, Dave had a Tamiya 1/25 Centurion and an Airfix Crusader off me for Christmas..amongst other things, so has got plenty of plastic to play with (Ha! You didn't know he was a closet tankie, did you) Anyways, we would like to extend our Thanks and Good Wishes to Shane and Lorna for their sterling work, and wish them all the best for the New Year. Thanks Guys, Caroline and the WEMblies http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Steven P. Allen" Subject: Web Site on Japanese Naval History I stumbled across this site recently and thought it may be of interest, especially to those who follow Japanese naval matters: http://www2.gol.com/users/billlise/jnp/index.html Enjoy, Steve Allen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Donald Harstad" Subject: Arkona Just purchased a 1/72nd scale kit of the Arkona, by Revell of Germany. Does anyone have a source of information regarding this ship or others in her class? In English, preferably. I accessed the DGzRS pages on the web and found lots of information. Unfortunately, I don't read German. In the box (dangerous, I know) it appears interesting. Has anyone any experience with this kit? Thank you. Don Harstad -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "George J. Stein" Subject: Re: Paint bottle markings anyone? Great idea on marking paint bottles. Now, what has this crew of experts discovered for replacing the inner-lid seals to try and preserve "bottled" paint??? By the way, has anyone noticed the new formula Humbrol enamels seem to lack the shelf-life of previous versions?? I've still got useful tins of the really early "military" paints which, while looking useless in the tin, "restore" to life quite well with sufficiently patient stirring. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Keith Butterley Subject: Carley float straps Hi group, What would be a good source of material to use for carley float straps(tie-downs) in 600 scale? I would prefer to use something more flexible than PE brass, and not as round as stretched sprue. Thanks and Happy Y2K. Keith Butterley -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: DSand47702@aol.com Subject: Kitlink web site I just discovered a new web site for modelers - Mike Hall's Kitlink. It's well stocked with ship models (as well as airplanes and armour) at fantastic prices. Visit the site at: http://www.kitlink.com. David Sandifer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Pletscher-Lenz-Schneider" Subject: FRAM Book Mr. Stefan Terzibaschitsch, the Grand Old Man of Germany's naval authors, as far as the US Navy goes, has re-issued his book on the FRAM modernization program which was first published in 1975. The text - all in German, but there was an English version in Warship International - was not worked over, but 70% of the photos are new. The size of the book is now ca. 21x30 cm. So the drawings could be blown up to 1/700 scale. There are some 170 pages, more than 120 of them with b/w photos (mostly two per page), 7 pages with drawings (which you may already know from Terzi's books on DDs and DEs, but now in 1/700 scale), and the rest is text and some lists and tables. The book is self-published by Mr. Terzibaschitsch, and the prize here in Geremany is some $ 50 to 55 plus postage. For those of you who would like to get a sample, I'd suggest to contact Terzi's "Team Oldenburg" at mailto:USNN98@aol.com Despite the relatively high prize, I think it's worth getting, not at least because of the photos. Falk Pletscher -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: James Corley Subject: Re: USS Chicago John Sheridan sez: >> USS Chicago CA-29 was painted MS 21 in 1943. MS 21 calls for Navy Blue 5-N on all vertical surfaces and Deck Blue 20-B on all horizontal surfaces. << Well, to be accurate, she wasn't painted in 1943....or at least the odds were highly against it! She was sunk on 30JAN43. IIRC, her last yard period was in mid-late 42 (out in early Nov? -- details sketchy in my books), with Chicago returning to the SoWesPAc command in high summer (Yes, January is summertime on the 'canal) and as such, the color should probably be much lighter than standard Ms21 colors. The photos I have show her to be overall dark blue, with no aircraft aboard, but was taken while she was being towed following her torpedoing at dusk on 29JAN43. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Percy, John" Subject: Book for sale Hello everyone, I have the following book for sale: "Navies of WWII: An illustrated history" by Antony Preston. 221 pages, many many pictures, drawings, battle plans. Covers the following topics: The Royal Navy 1939-1941 The Italian and French Navies Naval Operations Sep 1939-Dec 1941 The German Navy The US Navy The Imperial Japanese Navy The Battle of the Atlantic Amphibious Warfare Midway to Okinawa Price: $25 - includes shipping (by US Priority Mail), insurance, and delivery confirmation. Will ship to US and its territories only. Payment is to be by money order only, please (US post office has them cheap). Respond to jpercy@clariion.com if interested. Thank you, and long live SMML! John Percy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for having SMML at your home, why not stop by our home at: http://www.smml.org.uk -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume