Subject: SMML VOL 809 Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 23:37:55 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: R. N. Bolzano 2: Re: What our hobby needs - is a good spokes, er, person 3: Re: BB, CA/CL Floatplanes 4: Re: BWN USS Yorktown 5: Minicraft 1/600 Ocean Liner Models 6: Re: Montanas 7: Re: Postage & Handling Ripoff 8: Re: BB, CA/CL Floatplanes 9: Re: model ship lists 10: Rigging 11: Internet Modeler 12: Re: Spokesperson 13: Re: Sommerville in the Indian Ocean 14: Prince of Wales 15: Tamiya kits 1:350 16: Nicely off-topic 17: Re: What our hobby needs 18: Type A two man Jap. sub. info request 19: Metal Blacking 20: Re: WWII Dutch Navy 21: CIWS 22: Mk 38 25mm drawings? 23: Re: Chemical Treating of Photoetch parts 24: Please Check Spelling 25: Toronto area SMMLies 26: Re: HMS Jupiter 27: a slight diversion 28: Life Rafts 29: Re: search for used books -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Modern US Carrier Deck tie-down set -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Fernando, Yohan" Subject: Re: R. N. Bolzano Catalo: There are 1/700 resin kits of the Pola and Zara from Classic Warships as well as Delphis (I think) that could be used as a starting point for a conversion. I believe the Bolzano was closer to a modified Zara than a Trento. The Classic Warships Zara (which I built last October) is one of their earlier kits, but with a little scratch building added to the supplied parts, it came out quite nice. Yohan Fernando -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Vincent Mccullough" Subject: Re: What our hobby needs - is a good spokes, er, person I'm REALLY burned up about the comment in the last SMML about the Washington Ship Model Society by Edward F. Grune! It is unfair and untrue. The WSMS welcomes ship modelers of all types, whether "sticks and strings" or "steel navy," static or R/C, wood, plastic, paper or brass. We've been doing our best to reach those individuals in and around the Washington DC area who share our hobby. Walk into most hobby shops and you'll find a stack of our brochures (and if you don't, please contact me so that I can get them a refill). It's true that we used to meet in people's homes, and this made it difficult to locate the meeting. However, we now have regular meeting places that alternate on a month to month basis between a hobby shop in Virginia and a church in Maryland. And we have a onsite (http://www.gst.com/wsms) that will tell you where and when we meet. The WSMS has been in continuous operation since 1929, which (we believes) makes it the oldest continuously operating ship modeling society in the US. You don't do that by being a "The Secret Handshake Club." Please, everyone, be careful of uninformed remarks like this. This hobby is fragile enough as it is. You do it a great dis-service by discouraging people from joining the local clubs and interacting with other's interested in the hobby. Vince McCullough First Mate, Washington Ship Model Society AND NRG Webmaster BTW, while FDR was, in fact, a member of the club (as was then Col. George Patton), there is on record that I'm aware of that the club ever met at the White House. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Fernando, Yohan" Subject: Re: BB, CA/CL Floatplanes Mike, At the risk of incurring structural damage, catching on fire, or being blown overboard, planes would normally be stored in the hanger when the aft main guns were in action. In almost any type of battle, the planes would be stored away to avoid them catching on fire anyways. Burning float planes on US cruisers at Savo Island had made them even easier targets for the Japanese in 1942. Yohan Fernando -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "John Sheridan" Subject: Re: BWN USS Yorktown >> Apparently the brass and the resin do not expand/contract at the same rate as a car travels from KC to NPA. The owner said that at some point (B'ham, AL??) he heard a great "sproing" sound coming from the general direction of his display case. When they stopped at the next exit, the brass had seperated itself (and everything on it) from the hull. ALL THREE PIECES!! It was a sad sight, and what was left of the kit looked terrific, too. << I can see where this could be problem with such a large photo-etched part especially if you use ACC cement to bond it to the model. When I build my kit, I will be sure to use some sort of flexible cement or epoxy and bond the flightdeck to .020 styrene before adding it to the hull. This will allow the brass to expand and contract with changes in the humidity so it does not pop loose from the finished model. John R. Sheridan -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Felix Bustelo" Subject: Minicraft 1/600 Ocean Liner Models Hello Everyone, It was brought to my attention by Scott Reigel that Minicraft Models is exploring the viability of producing a line of 1/600 scale ocean liner models. Those of you who know me know that I feel that there is a serious shortage of ocean liner subjects out there and that 1/600 scale is my favorite scale. I think that this scale is ideal for liners, as it provides a nice balance between size and detail. Also, any new liner models in 1/600 scale would nicely compliment those offered by Airfix and Revell and can be detailed with the Gold Medal Models Merchant Ship set. I will be starting another letter writing campaign on my website, International Maritime Modeling, asking modelers who are interested to send a letter to Al Trendle at Minicraft Models that you would buy these kits if they hit the shelves and send suggestions for subjects. I sent me letter yesterday and my suggestions were the Normandie, Andrea Doria and the Liberte (ex-Europa). The address for Minicraft is: 1450 West 228th St, Units 16/17 Torrance, CA 90501 USA Telephone: 1-800-322-3692 Fax: 310-539-2018 Sorry, no email. Perhaps we can get a bloody Normandie kit on the market! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Steven P. Allen" Subject: Re: Montanas Thanks for the URL, Ed. For those who haven't gone to look yet, it will pay you to do so. The design which intrigued me most was the last one--82,000 tons (trial) displacement, 1020 LWL, 330,000 SHP for 33+ knots! WOW! I WANT one! Steve Allen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: John_Impenna@hyperion.com Subject: Re: Postage & Handling Ripoff Hi Rusty, I have noticed that too as I have bought some kits off of e-bay. If the postage seems excessive on an item I want, I usually e-mail and ask if it can be shipped to me USPS priority mail, usually 3.20 for most kits. If the seller refuses and insists on a higher rate than the actual postage plus a reasonable amount for packing materials, I e-mail them back and let them know that I won't be bidding in their auction. This has only happened twice so far. In one case, I let the seller know what I would have bid and it turned out to be higher than the high bid! The point is tell them. Most of the time, in my experience, they are fine with going the least expensive way. John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: Ross Bruce-QBR000 Subject: Re: BB, CA/CL Floatplanes >> When a BB or CA/CL fires its main guns, meaning the aft guns - are the float planes stuck below or put on deck or do they remain on the catapults? << Well in theory the planes would be launched to serve as shot spotters. If it wasn't possible to launch them then they would be struck down to the deck (preferably on the side not engaged if they were say doing gunfire support for the grunts) and secured. If it was going to be an all out firefight they would be jettisoned over the side. Hope this helps, Bruce -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: SantMin@aol.com Subject: Re: model ship lists >> Of course this does not mean that you wouldn't be welcome here. You might even be able to find quite a number of experts here who can answer your questions. << You would be surprised how many of us are members of both lists !!!!!!!!!!!!! Cheers, Bob Santos -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "James Johnson" Subject: Rigging I have discovered a rigging material that is almost ideal. While at the IPMS nats in Columbus Ohio in 98, I saw a product on the table at the Precision Enterprises Unlimited table on my first sweep of the vendor tables. I went back later to buy it and of course, it was sold out. I mail ordered it later from them. It is a 6 mil ceramic wire. This scales out to 2.1" in 1/350, which is acceptable. Now here is the best part, it does not sag!! I pulled 6" out of the package and held it up to a straight edge to measure the droop AND THERE WAS NONE!!!! I have used it on several 1/72 aircraft for antenna wire and it works wonderfully. You measure the exact length with a pair of dividers and break a piece off that length. You then glue it on model with small dabs of white glue and you're done. It is a dark metallic gray and looks great without any paint. The only down side is that it can't be bent very much. The instructions state that it will shatter and produce microscopic shards. As I said, it is available form Precision Enterprises Unlimited. There is no brand name on the package so I don't know the origin of the product. PEU advertises in Fine Scale Modeler. They don't list a web site or e-mail address. Their address is PO Box 97F,Springfield,Vermont 05156 and their phone is (802) 885-3094 after 5 PM weekdays and 10a to 5p on Saturdays. I paid $4.95 for 10' of it about a year and a half ago. Try it, you'll like it. Jim Johnson IPMS 1788 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "Mike" Subject: Internet Modeler Bob wrote :- >> review of the SkyDiver from the series UFO. (hey, its a sub) << Hehehe - that was my excuse as well, Bob! He continued :- >> cast your vote for the cover (hint ..November is the correct month), and article << Looks like I picked the right one BEFORE reading this! But Bob - you didn't say what Krivak review by a certain Listmaster was the right article!!!!! Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Richa5011@aol.com Subject: Re: Spokesperson I agree that having a recognizable spokesperson to represent modeling to the public is a great idea. From a marketing perspective there are significant advantages to having a positive recognition factored spokesman. There are more reasons to avoid a negative recognition factor as was alluded to about the "Boys from Brazil" and the John Malcovich character in a movie, whose title I do not recall, but it had Clint Eastwood as the hero. (Though, personally, I am still strugling to see the wisdom or logic behind Jenny Craig's recent choice as spokeperson...but I digress ) >> To my knowledge and recollection, the only "celebrities" that come to mind who are known plastic modeling enthusiasts are actors Jimmy Stewart & Henry Fonda, and singers Mel Torme & Andy Williams. << Regrettably, Messers Stewart, Fonda and Torme are no longer with us, and though they are doing wonders with digital imaging nowadays, it's just not the same if your spokesman is dead. And let's be honest here, how many people under 40 know who Andy Williams is? Though I have no objection to Ms. Bullock playing this role, should she be willing or coerceable into doing it. One esteemed member of this group cited an occasion where she, pre-stardom, attended a model event. Should any photographs exist, it might be possible to encourage Ms. Bullock to see our view on the matter. I would respectfully point out that there are other candidates that would better suite our needs. One in particular comes to mind: Pamela Anderson Lee! Don't laugh! There is a method behind this maddness. Ms. Lee would be the ideal spokesperson for our hobby for the following reasons: 4. Anybody willing to marry, and stay married, to Tommy Lee can't be too hard to get. 3. She has an extreemly high recognition factor with both pre-teen and teenage males. 2. There are actually models of her available in three mediums: resin, latex and vinyl. 1. She is, afterall, mostly plastic herself anyway. Just my few ravings on this subject with tounge firmly in cheek. Nat Richards -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "Erhardtsen" Subject: Re: Sommerville in the Indian Ocean Chris Langtree write >> However it didn't happen. Churchill and others have a tendency to denegrate the R class battleships (they were old, unmodernised and slow) which is a bit unfair. Taking account of their deffficencies they were effective fighting units and apart from speed out-classed the Kongos in every respect. Given their better gunnery they would have been more than a match for the Japanese fleet and he was right to consider a gunnery action. << All Japanese battleship had there main guns modernise giving them long range. The R class had not (I think one of them had 2 turret modernised). The short rang showed in the fighting against the Italian navy. Superior range and speed can give a one-sided battle, where the Japanese choose the time and place. Erik Erhardtsen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Thomas Janes Subject: Prince of Wales I am planning to build Tamiya's 350 Prince of Wales and would like to do the camo scheme she was wearing at the time of her sinking. I wanted to know if Tamiya's depiction of the pattern was accurate and which colors were used by reference to their Royal Navy codes since I have the snyder and short chips. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Keith Bender" Subject: Tamiya kits 1:350 Before the new year model expo was selling the big Tamiya 1:350s for $39.95. Don't know if still applys now days but it was a good deal. Especialy if you bought 4 or 5 of them. Save on taxes and shipping was only a few bucks. Regards, Keith -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "Phil Gollin" Subject: Nicely off-topic Just a plea for Real Beer / Ale. "Warm Beer" is what most people have brewed and enjoyed drinking thoughout the centuries. What people drink as lager (to the Americans 'beer') is, in it's present incarnation, a rather modern drink, not only is the Yeast in general use for 'lager'-like beers only just over a hundred years old, but history, and common-sense, shows that only since the introduction of the cheap chilling of beers has a beer that tastes so-so at near freezing, but tastes of nothing at room temperature could have been a success. British, and certain continental beers (especially Belgium) are much more like their forbears, and harks back to the time when Beer was often drunk as a safe alternative to possibly un-hygenic water, even by children ("small-beer"). However, it is wrong to think that British beer is really historic, due to the licensing laws brought in during the First World War (to improve productivity and decrease accidents in war work factories) the alcholic content (by Vol) was in general reduced from 6 to 9% down to 2.4 to 4-odd %. Hence any British beer is really only 86-odd years old. Having said that the rich history of Bitters, Heavies, Milds, Pales, Lights, Stouts, Porters, etc.... at least give people a taste of what people used to drink and not just modern pap. By the way, just to wind up some of the more renowned drinkers up, Guiness in no more Irish than many other hang-overs from Colonial rule. The basic type of beer is "London Porter" (because it was drunk by the Porter's in the big London markets - so simple) and was the sort of Beer referred to in Shakespeare's plays as 'Porter'. It was exported to Ireland along with such other colonial exports as 'the Bar'. It is a Bitter Stout rather than a Sweet Stout or Milk Stout. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: What our hobby needs >> B. A celebrity spokesperson << >> I commanded a space station orbiting Epsilon 3, defeated the shadows inthe great war, and became president of the Earth Alliance. Is that enough to qualify as a celebrity ? << Yeah, but didn't you fall into a big hole and die?? Sorta puts a bit of a crimp on the old celebritydom doesn't it?? Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: SJantscher@aol.com Subject: Type A two man Jap. sub. info request Hi All, My buddy and I are starting the process that we hope will lead to the limited production of a 1/96th scale resin kit of the Japanese two man Type-A submarine. The Ko-Hyoteki subs were those employed during the attack on Pearl Harbor, as well as at other times in the war. I am specifically looking for detailed plans and photographs to aid in our construction. I have listed below the books I already have access to that cover in various detail the submarines. I am really looking for overhead (plan-form) drawings and photographs. Any help, posted on SMML or e-mailed directly to me would be appreciated. Also, I know that at least one example of the Type A submarine is on display (I think in Japan, but maybe also elsewhere). If anyone has some photos of that I would appreciate hearing from you. Thank you in advance, Steve Jantscher resources I have Advance Force Pearl Harbor by Burlingame (good read too) Midget Submarines of the Second World War by Kemp Submarines of the Imperial Japanese Navy by Carpenter and Polmar Suicide Squads by O'Neill -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: "John Rule" Subject: Metal Blacking If you are looking for a chemical to blacken brass, try Silenium Disulphide which is sold in hardware stores and gun shops for blackening the barrels of I presume, shotguns. It is very cheap being about $3 Canadian (which is about $1US). It is a turquoise colour and looks as though it would mix well with gin.(let me know if it does). It is probably the same as the metal black sold by a company in UK called Carr's, but for those on the west side of the Atlantic a lot cheaper. John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Allan and Crystal Plumb Subject: Re: WWII Dutch Navy >> Does anyone knows were I can find information and action reports on the web about Royal Netherlands (Dutch) Navy during World War II especially for the early Pacific battles (ABDA). << "Sea Battles in Close-Up", #2 I think, had an article on the series of battles in the Java Sea in early 1942, including some interesting discussion of the command mechanisms (or lack thereof) of the ABDA armed forces. (I of course was looking at the parts about Exeter again.) Allan Plumb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: "John Rule" Subject: CIWS >> Rest assured the Block 1-B CIWS currently being deployed is vastly superior to the older versions. The older marks are also highly accurate and dependable weapons. I have a CD disk released by the Raytheon company that shows the gun in action. With its optical sighting system it's a very effective weapon. You can defend the home fires and not have to keep looking over your shoulder. << Rusty, you should know better than to trust a manufacturer to tell you how good their weapon is. Remember that (in)famous US anti-aircraft tank. I hope you do because I can't remember its name. John Hi John, IIRC, it was the Sgt York AA tank Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: SeaPhoto@aol.com Subject: Mk 38 25mm drawings? Hi Everyone, Does anyone have a source for scale drawings of the 25 mm gun mount Mk 38, used on modern US Navy ships? In building my 1/96 John Paul Jones, this is the only weapon that I have not found documentation for. The gun is made by Boeing, but the mount is made by the Navy at a NAVSEA facility in Indiana. Thanks! Kurt -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: Mike Settle Subject: Re: Chemical Treating of Photoetch parts >> I have been reading with interest the posts on treating photoetch for better paint coverage. Can someone detail the process and what chemicals they use? I am fairly new to photoetch and have only done a handful of models and have had to deal with "those shiny spots". Any help is appreceiated. << A much safer alternative to all those nasty chemicals is distilled white vinegar, the kind you can get at the grocery store. Vinegar is a mild acid, and will lightly etch brass PE. You may have to let the PE stay in the vinegar for several hours. After the vinegar bath, rinse with distilled water. Distilled water is better because it does not contain all the minerals that are found in tap water, which may leave spots after evaporation. Mike Settle -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Please Check Spelling Hi SMML, I can't take it any more! "Somerville" is spelled with one "L," not two. Thank you. Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: Darren Scannell Subject: Toronto area SMMLies Greetings to all in and around cabbage town, I would like to see if I can get 2 or 3 people to join me in my trek to SMML con in May. I am volunteering to be the chauffeur in exchange for your company and sharing of expenses. Let me if you're interested as soon as you can so that we can make the arrangements. If I don't hear from anybody by Feb. 14, I'll just have to take the wife. (I think I'll let you wonder if I consider that a good thing or not.) Regards, Darren Scannell -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Re: HMS Jupiter Hi SMML, I hadn't read that one of the Jupiter's twin 4.7" turrets was replaced by a single one, but, if that is so, it would probably be the one damaged by the Japanese submarine I-60 shortly before the submarine was sunk by the Jupiter on 17 January 1941. I have read some correspondence that discusses that part of the action, but I can't find a copy of it to check which turret it was. If someone can find out which turret was hit, that would presumably tell you which one was replaced by a single 4.7" gun. Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: a slight diversion Found the following, thought you would enjoy: I am the very model of a Newsgroup personality. I intersperse obscenity with tedious banality. Addresses I have plenty of, both genuine and ghosted too, On all the countless newsgroups that my drivel is cross-posted to. Your bandwidth I will fritter with my whining and my snivelling, And you're the one who pays the bill, downloading all my drivelling. My enemies are numerous, and no-one would be blaming you For cracking my head open after I've been rudely flaming you. I hate to lose an argument (by now I should be used to it). I wouldn't know a valid point if I was introduced to it. My learning is extensive but consists of mindless trivia, Designed to fan my ego, which is larger than Bolivia. The comments that I vomit forth, disguised as jest and drollery, Are really just an exercise in unremitting trollery. I say I'm frank and forthright, but that's merely lies and vanity, The gibberings of one who's at the limits of his sanity. If only I could get a life, as many people tell me to; If only Mom could find a circus freak-show she could sell me to; If I go off to Zanzibar to paint the local scenery; If I lose all my fingers in a mishap with machinery; If I survive to twenty, which is somewhat problematical; If what I post was more mature, or slightly more grammatical; If I could learn to spell a bit, and maybe even punctuate; Would I still be the loathsome and objectionable punk you hate? But while I have this tiresome urge to prance around and show my face, It simply isn't safe for normal people here in cyberspace. To stick me in Old Sparky and turn on the electricity Would be a fitting punishment for my egocentricity. I always have the last word; so, with uttermost finality, That's all from me, the model of a Newsgroup personality. Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 28) From: "David Lilly" Subject: Life Rafts Two questions about life rafts on WWII ships that list members might help me with: 1) While reading Ted Brigg's account in "Flagship Hood" of his escape from the Hood, I ran across this passage, "Fortunately before we had left Scapa the ship had been equipped with three-foot-square rafts, which replaced the older and larger Carley floats. There were dozens of these around in the sea and I managed to lug myself half on to one." How and where were these rafts stored? I haven't noticed these small rafts on any other photos of British vessels around this time. Were they unique to the Hood? How should a Hood modeler handle these small rafts? 2) Any suggestions on how to model the flotation netting on American ships, often placed on turret tops. (ex. USS Chicago and USS Louisville during 1943) I've had no success in recreating this stuff, any success stories out there. David Lilly -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 29) From: Minadmiral@aol.com Subject: Re: search for used books Hi; Try here for used books http://www.bookfinder.com/" BookFinder.com: Search for Out of Print and Used Books or http://www.bookfinder.com It tracks ABE AND a number of other sources. It`s great. Chuck Duggie -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Tom & Carolyn Harrison" Subject: Modern US Carrier Deck tie-down set Just and FYI to those of you that build Naval aircraft. We have just released a 1/48 Scale Modern US Carrier Deck tie-down set, both the cross and five point styles. These could be used when displaying aircraft models on a modern carrier flight deck. Set 213 $10. Free shipping if you mention SMML or the Warship site. watch for our 1/350 Bismarck (#3512) and Tripitz (#3519) sets coming out this month $18 each. Tom tomsmodelworks.com Tel/Fax: 408.777.8667 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for having SMML at your home, why not stop by our home at: http://www.smml.org.uk -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume