Subject: SMML VOL 834 Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 00:42:49 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Bismarcks underwater water and motor cooling intakes 2: Re: Visiting the UK 3: Re: HEIAN MARU 4: Re: Aircraft on Lexington 5: Re: warship hulls... 6: Re: Pre-Dreadnought Picture in National Geographic 7: Re: Pearl Harbor Movie 8: Photoetch Techniques 9: Zhengdefu Kits 10: USN book & PE query 11: Re: Model Expo Paints 12: Re: Taiwan submarine 13: Scanning Graphics and Rodney Camo 14: Heller Scharnhorst 15: Re: CA-38 in 1/96 scale 16: Airfix magazine and the Minotaur 17: HMS Ambuscade - looking for resources -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Web site update 2: Looking for Markus Van Beek 3: MODEL SHIP JOURNAL -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "stan s" Subject: Bismarcks underwater water and motor cooling intakes I am building a 1/100 scale model of Bismarck and the only think keeping me from sea trials are the underwater water and motor cooling intakes. Anybody got any building plan or photographic reference on them? A docking plan would answer a lot of questions but I don't think that one exist. Thank you for your help. S.Sturm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: SeaPhoto@aol.com Subject: Re: Visiting the UK Be sure to check out the London Science Museum. Nice 1/48 scale model of HMS Vanguard, among others. Kurt Kurt Greiner SeaPhoto Maritime Photography On board and overhead photography of modern Naval and Merchant ships. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: HEIAN MARU HEIAN MARU was sunk by U.S. carrier-based aircraft. 17 February 1944 was a big day, with the Japanese losting no fewer than 33 marus (source: _Japanese Naval and Merchant Shipping Losses During World War II By All Causes_, NAVEXOS P-468, February 1947) during (IIRC) the big raid on Truk. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys http://www.shipcamouflage.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: Aircraft on Lexington Dan Jones wrote: >> The aircraft is a Brewster Buffalo, as are the ones spotted on the bow. As for the cocooned Vega or Hudson, I think this is an illusion (I assume you are referring to the light shape beside the funnel) which is the other elevator, also lowered. << You're absolutely right on both counts! The Buffalo in question was catching the light differently and appeared smaller than those facing forward--I just couldn't make out what it was. As for the midships elevator, again I was fooled by the illusion of the shape. Thanks! >> As has been pointed out on this list (by you also I believe) white was used on bulkheads below decks to help make the lower levels brighter. << Yep, 'twas me. I mentioned it specifically for that reason. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys http://www.shipcamouflage.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Kevin Wenker Subject: Re: warship hulls... >> Can anyone assist me in locating a fiberglass or polycarbonate hull in 1/8th scale for a New Orleans-class cruiser? Hopefully if available commercially, they would be gel-coated? I have a carbon-fiber road bike to unload in order to finance this project. Any interested parties in a 58cm IBOC Mongoose with Spinergy Rev-X rims, drop me a line. I am specifically interested in building CA-38 in 1944 configuration. Any literature, guidance or other advice would be appreciated! I plan ultimately to have a multi-channel RC control system, complete with bugle calls for air attack and general qtrs. << Don, Scale Shipyard has the hull. Excellent quality. Gel coated. E-Mail: SCALSHPYRD@AOL.COM WWW: http://members.aol.com/seapics/SSY/SSYMain.htm Owner: Lee Upshaw Maybe I should start Lee for a commission. Best Kevin Wenker -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Jeff Arban" Subject: Re: Pre-Dreadnought Picture in National Geographic >> For those of you that subscribe to National Geographic, take a look at the February 2000 issue. They have a feature on ancient Greece. In one of the later pages, they show a replica of an old rowed wooden warship that the Greeks used to defeat the Persians and, later, each other. However, in the background, I swear there is an old steel navy ship with three stacks and at least one turret of some sort. Any clues as to which ship this is? I bet this is the one that is a museum ship near Athens. << That ship looks to be the Averof. It's a cruiser with 4-9.2 inch, 8-7.5 inch, 16-3 inch, and a host of anti aircraft. These stats are from WWII. It has a 9,500 ton displacement, is 462 ft long and a 69 ft beam. It was built in 1910. Had a compliment of 670 men during WWII. I love Jane's Fighting Ships. They have everything!!!! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: Paul Jacobs Subject: Re: Pearl Harbor Movie I have heard that there are two movies in the works about Pearl Harbor. One is the Disney movie, title as yet unknown. The other is by another company and is tentatively entitled "Tennessee." Paul Jacobs -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: RhinoBones@aol.com Subject: Photoetch Techniques I'm about to embark on my first purchase of photoetch parts and I'm certain that I first need to know some basics on installation. Any help with installation techniques, adhesives, painting and forming would be appreciated. I'm particularly curious about how the railings are attached to the deck . . . the mating surfaces seem to be just too small to provide adequate bonding. I'm also playing with the idea of using some common window screen wire mesh for fabrication into funnel screens, gangways and railings. Anyone else try this before? Regards, RhinoBones -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: Zhengdefu Kits Recently I mail-ordered the ZHENYUAN, a Chinese warship from the late 19th Century, made by Zhengdefu. I learned from a few members of this list that the model was, in fact, originally issued as a toy, and it shows. Nonetheless, I decided to try a few more Zhengdefu kits on sale in a local shop. Here are a few impressions: (1) "Class Wasp II Missile Boat" - box scale - model #DF027 - 33cm long. This is a Chinese-made version of the Soviet Osa class from the 60s and 70s, now largely obsolete. I haven't yet tried to determine the scale; it's a bit larger than the 1/150 Poseidon model, though not nearly as finely detailed. Still, with a little work this could turn into an impressive model. Comes with optional motor (forget it!) and plastic display stand. (2) "1997 Chinese New Missile Frigate Stationed in HK" (Hong Kong) - box scale - model #DF030A - 30cm long. Appears to be slightly larger than the Osa, aside from that nothing is given about its PLAN designation. The actual thing is listed as being 65.4 meters long. Weapons said to include "Eagle-8" anti-ship missiles and carries a crew of 40. Also can be motorized. Detail is sparse and heavy but it has potential. (3) Russian Pacific Fleet "Anti-Dive Missile Destroyer Udaloy Class ADMIRAL PANTELEYEV" - again a box scale kit - model #DF040 - 30 cm long. This is actually pretty nice, too, and compares very favorably to the Skywave UDALOY kits. Even the parts numbering and assembly is very much like the Skywave models. Coincidence? Probably not. Also sold as ADMIRAL VINOGRADOV. The real ship is listed as being 164 meters in length, so scale must be roughly between 1/500-1/600 or so. Unlike the missile boats, this one has a flat-bottomed hull like the old Revell kits, so it would look best if waterlined. Optional motorized parts should be trashed. Zhengdefu also have listed some 1/800 US and Soviet aircraft carriers, three box scale IOWA class battleships, BISMARK, and a few other Russian and US ships (SPRUANCE, TICONDEROGA, SOVERMENNY, etc.) which may also turn out to look like larger versions of old Skywave kits. Anybody care to try to determine an approximate scale on the three listed above? Thanks. Mike Alexandria, VA USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: CBNJBB62@aol.com Subject: USN book & PE query Hi Guys I'm writing about two things. A new book has been reissued by the Naval Institute called The Official Chronology of the US Navy in W.W.II by Robert Cressman Naval Institute Press, 2000 is a reprint of a 1955 book that gives a lot of close up detail on navy activity during the war such as little facts. I would like to try Photo etch out for my models. So I am working on the old USS, JP, Jones DD-932 by Revell, I determined the scale is 1/319 what would be a good PE to use for this? I've found photos of her and really need railings for it. Any help would be greatly appreciation. Craig Bennett -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "James Johnson" Subject: Re: Model Expo Paints I spent a good part of the day playing with Model Expo Paints. I ordered some Japanese colors the last time I sent them an order and since there has been some interest among the SMML, I decided to try them. I have Blue Water Navy's IJN Furutaka ready to spray the deck color. It has the linoleum deck so I trotted out the proper bottle and went to work. Everybody wants to thin acrylics with something exotic like windshield solvent, Windex or alcohol. I have found that the current acrylics that call for water as a thinner work better with water. That is where I started. (Model Expo, if you are reading this, here is an idea. If you use it, we can split the profits. Put pure water in a jar, put a drop of something in it so it smells "chemical", list the ingredient as Hydrogen Hydroxide and sell your own special thinner "specially made for our paints". If you think buying 12oz of water in a bottle for a dollar is a rip-off, you can sell water at $1.99 an ounce) I thinned the paint at a ratio of 2 parts paint to 1 part water. This worked, but was too thick. I then thinned it with equal parts of water and paint. This also worked, but was too thin for me. It was to easy to get runs. The margin between full coverage and runs was very narrow. I then thinned the paint at a ratio of 3 parts paint to 2 parts water. This put me in my comfort zone. Some people may want it a little thinner, depending on what they are used to. I sprayed these at about 20-22 PSI. I turned the pressure down to 15-16 PSI and found this to work better than the higher pressure. This is where I plan to use these paints. A 3 part pint to 2 part water ratio with about 16 PSI pressure. I then thinned the paint with denatured alcohol. I use this to clean my airbrush when using acrylic paints. I used a 2 paint to 1 thinner ratio and the paint would not spray! I went to 1 to 1 and it sprayed. The result was satisfactory but not quite as good as thinning with water. Maybe I could have played around and gotten better results, but what would the point be? Water works as a retarder with acrylic paint and that is desirable when you airbrush. When you use alcohol, more of it flashes off between the airbrush and the model. It is possible under extreme circumstances that too much might flash off and the paint might not adhere properly. When I used floquil, if you used dio-sol to thin the paint, some of it would bounce when it hit the model. You could be doing a nice job on the deck and when you are done, find a mess on the bulkhead several inches away. This is why I always thinned Floquil with a 50/50 mixture of dio-sol and retarder. If you use enough alcohol to keep the paint thin enough to eliminate this problem, you will get closer to the model, not as much alcohol flashes off and the paint is too thin and runs. If you stick with water, you have a much wider margin for error. I did this with an Aztec 470 airbrush with the acrylic nozzle in it. (color code: black) If you are painting any acrylic paint, this is a must. Normal tips tend to build up a big glob on the end. You know when this glob decides to let go. Just as you want to give it one last little shot - Bam! Right in the worst spot. They also make a larger acrylic tip (color code: white). I painted my model with this combination and I like it. The color looks just a tad light compared to the S & S chips, but it isn't fully cured yet. I plan on using this paint on all my projects. I hope that they release paints to match all the S&S color chips. Perhaps then I could finally build my Bismarck. But then I would have to decide if the turret tops were painted yellow when she sunk. When I have the painting done on the hull of the Furutaka, I need to do the brass strips. I have a large supply of Detail & Scale color stripe decals. They make them in a number of colors. Every modeler should have a supply of different colors on hand. They are extremely useful. I did the black boot-topping on my California with them. One of the colors they offer is gold. It looks like brass more than gold. The smallest stripes are .01" wide and look like they will work for this project. I'll let you know how it works when I do this. Jim Johnson IPMS 1788 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: Taiwan submarine >> The February 25 edition of the Washington Post had an article entitled "Taiwan Displays Its Feeble Fleet". There was a photo of a 56-year-old ex-USN Guppy diesel sub, one of two in the Taiwanese navy, named Sea Leopard (hull number 792). Don't know if that was the original name or not. << According to Alden's "The Fleet Submarine in the US Navy", Taiwan received two Guppy submarines from the US Navy. They were the Tench class, Guppy II USS Cutlass (SS478, renamed Hai Shih) and the Balao class Guppy II USS Tusk (SS426, renamed Hai Pao). Don't know which one is the Sea Leopard, perhaps one of our modellers with a knowledge of Chinese might help. Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Derek Wakefield Subject: Scanning Graphics and Rodney Camo Thanks to everyone who provided imput on and offlist on the issue of scanning images. I'll pass them along to my friend and see if we can use this to solve the problem. Likewise, thanks to Chris for the info on the Rodney's Admiralty disruptive camo scheme. Go Navy! _|_o_|_ Derek "Tiger" (/\)akefield /---(.](o)[.)---\ iscandar@chatter.com o oo O oo o http://www.iscandar-66.org -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Darren Scannell Subject: Heller Scharnhorst Hi SMMLies, I know this kit has been discussed in the past, but I just got mine and I thought I'd share my thoughts. I dry fitted the hull halves together (of course) and WOW! that has got to be the neetest twist to a piece of plastic I have seen yet! Imagine, The stern is together and fits perfect, then look down the hull from the bow. The bow pieces are pointing outward at approx. 50 degrees! Pull them together and the bottom of the hull forms into this cool looking football (North American Football, I guess oversees it would be a rugby ball) shape about 3 inches apart. It looks and sounds awful, but it actually won't be to hard to glue together straight. The decal sheet is nicely printed with the bow and stern crest and it comes complete with a decal boot topping! in pieces of course. Comes with nice chain too. Didn't take it out of the bag as I'm not going to build for a while, but I also noticed a nice little card in 6 languages that had Hellers address on it for ordering defective parts. Nice idea, hope it works. Well That's all, just wanted to share before I fall asleep. Darren Scannell -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Bill & Kaja Michaels" Subject: Re: CA-38 in 1/96 scale I'd start with the Scale Shipyard. If anyone has a hull, it will be Lee Upshaw. I've seen a number of his other hulls, and they typically have a nice white or light gray gelcoat finish on them. Lee has a website, can't remember the URL this moment. (E-mail me later if you can't find it.) A Cruiser should make a nice-sized RC model, with enough displacement to carry the ectra features you talked about. One word of advice-- keep topside weight down. Scale warships, esp cruisers and destroyers, tend to be very tender and roll unrealistically in any sort of "sea". The more weight you have as ballast low in the hull, the better. Sounds like a great project! Bill Check out my US Coast Guard subjects model list at: http://www.tiac.net/users/billkaja/kitlist.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: Mark Krywienko Subject: Airfix magazine and the Minotaur Can anyone who has any back issues of Airfix magazines please answer me the following ... >> HMS Minotaur class AC Airfix Magazine Oct 1984 pp 78 article << Does this article refer to the WW1 or WW 2 Minotaur Cruiser? If it is WW1, I would be interested in hearing from anyone off list to discuss how I can get a photocopy of the article. Thanks and Regards, Mark Hi Mark, Ummmm, that entry looks familiar ;-) While I don't actually have the issue, IIRC it refers the WW1 armoured cruiser & I think it's part of an article dealing with WW1 cruisers. Regards, Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: "Michael Kear" Subject: HMS Ambuscade - looking for resources I'm building a model of the Royal Navy type 21 frigate HMS Ambuscade (F172) and I'm looking for resources on the net about her. I'm hoping you knowledgeable people can help me. I've done the obvious - searched the WWW for "HMS Ambuscade", and "Type 21" and "Royal Navy" and "Falklands", but perhaps someone on this list knows of a less obvious place to look as well. What I'm looking for is photographs, tales, articles about the ship that will (a) give me more detail for my model building or (b) add to the substance of the web site I'm building about the ship and the model. Or perhaps you served in the ship and would be prepared to help me from time to time answering questions or telling some good yarns about life aboard her. If so, please look into the site I'm in the process of rebuilding at: http://www.healey.com.au/~mkear/tf72.html or send me an email at mkear@healey.com.au Cheers, Mike Kear Task Force 72 - Australia's 1/72 Warship Modellers Windsor, NSW, Australia http://www.healey.com.au/~mkear/tf72.html Hi Mike, Firstly, I can recommend a great book on the Type 21s: Type 21 by Capt John Lippiett, RN. This is part 5 of the Ian Allen series on modern combat ships. It's out of print now, but you may have luck with some of the second book dealers both on & off the net. As for sites, try the following they may lead you to some other sites: Warships1: http://warships1.com/default.htm RN site: http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/ Rule the waves - History of the RN: http://britaininworldwar2.future.easyspace.com/rtw/siteindex.html British Ships: http://www.ships.co.uk/index2.htm RN in pictures 1956-68: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Rob_Jerrard/Rnavy.htm Also, IIRC the Type 21's were transferred to either Pakistan or India, so a look at their respective pages may also yield some infomation. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Mike" Subject: Web site update Hi all, Just to tell you that the site has another update. All the latest back-issues are in, and indexed, and we have a walk-about review of the Fleet Air Arm Show - ship-slanted, of course! To all those SMMLies Lynn & I met - good to put a face to you all! Here's to the next time! Enjoy, Mike SMML Webmaster -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "stan s" Subject: Looking for Markus Van Beek Hi, I am looking for a ship modeler Markus Van Beek in Germany who built a excellent 1/100 scale model of Bismarck. I have a few questions about building the Bismarck which I can believe that he can answer. Can you please help me find him? If you can, e-mail me or send him mine e-mail address. Thank you for your help S.Sturm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Victor Baca Subject: MODEL SHIP JOURNAL Dear Fellow Ship Modeler: MODEL SHIP JOURNAL is launching on May 31st, 2000 and hitting subscriber's mailboxes on June 15th. Inside our pages you'll find everything you've needed and wanted in a quarterly ship modeler's magazine. We devote the majority of our pages to large format photos of prototype ships and finely detailed ship models. Each issue will contain full general arrangement scaled plan sets with hull lines, a short history of the ship and complete photo coverage of the prototype vessel. We also include drydock shots to bring all that hidden detail to full hull modelers. You'll literally be able to build a scale model directly from our pages or add details to that model kit you're finishing or contemplating. MODEL SHIP JOURNAL covers the age of power and features ships of all types. We have articles about steamers, diesel-electric ships, nuclear power and gas turbine propulsion. We'll also look at the role of the naval architects and their engineering drawings that made these beautiful vessels possible. Our content includes warships-large and small, tugs, freighters, offshore industrial vessels, research ships and Coast Guard cutters. Sail will be covered if the ship is from the transition to steam era. MODEL SHIP JOURNAL is the ship modeler's magazine we've all been waiting for. It's a beautifully rendered piece done in black and white on the finest quality paper. The Journal will definitely be a "keeper". The plans and never before published large scale photos alone are worth the subscription price of $30.00 per year for four issues. Two year subscriptions are available for $58.00 and foreign orders outside the United States are available for $45.00 (U.S.) per year. Only 1000 issues of our premiere ISSUE ZERO will be printed as a collector's number. After the first 1000 subscriptions are sold, general subscriptions will commence with Issue Number One. Call our toll-free number to order by Master Card/Visa: (877) 371-0290. Outside the U.S., call: (360) 371-0290. We also accept checks and money orders payable to PHOTOMARINE ARCHIVES (personal checks are no problem). These orders can be mailed to: PHOTOMARINE ARCHIVES Model Ship Journal P.O. Box 28516 Bellingham, WA 98228-0516 If I can answer any questions or if you would like to give your input regarding our new quarterly, please do not hesitate to call me on our toll-free number. The best times to reach us are weekdays before noon, U.S. west coast time; or sporadically on the weekends. This is a busy time for us as we prepare our first ISSUE ZERO, we're putting in long hours at the office, so definitely call--someone is likely to be there to answer your call. We can also be reached by emailing: modelships@earthlink.net. May your models gather no dust. Victor M. Baca Editor & Publisher MODEL SHIP JOURNAL -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for having SMML at your home, why not stop by our home at: http://www.smml.org.uk -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume