bject: SMML VOL 857 Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 22:43:34 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Ships in Movies 2: Flower Class Corvettes in USN service 3: 2150 DD 4: Re: Here Comes the Navy 5: Re: Fletcher anti skid decals 6: Re: Flag decals 7: Re: Flight deck arrow 8: Re: Washing resin parts 9: Re: Virginia Hobby Shops 10: Re: HO/OO scale 11: Re: CVN 65 Enterprise - Ports on the bow 12: Lindberg PT 109 13: 1:32 PT 109 figures 14: Re: 1812 15: Re: Intrepid Museum 16: Re: Ship ID in Movie 17: Rigging 18: Re: Here Comes The Navy 19: Re: Definition German Battleships 20: CVN65 Enterprise Aircraft 21: Navy ships in the movies 22: US Canadian Frigates 23: Re: Ship Model Kits for Sale (Prices Reduced) 24: Hobby Shops In Virginia 25: "Stand By For Action" 26: Tora, Tora, Tora! 27: Re: 1/72 USS John F. Kennedy, CV 67 28: WSW Derfflinger/Lutzow 29: US Coast Guard Patrol Boat 30: Re: Lindberg PT-109 31: War of 1812 32: Thanks: Marblehead info. 33: Re: Nevada model in TORA TORA 34: Yamato 35: Re: Cross Channel Services 36: Peter Hall's Trenchant model 37: Re: Hobby Shops in Virginia 38: Minic Ships 39: Re: Ships/Movies,US Canadian Frigates 40: HO/OO railroad scales 41: Re: Pearl Harbor update 42: Re: My first resin kit 43: Ships in Movies 44: resin adhesive 45: Re: flight deck markings 46: Richelieu Colours 47: Re: CVN-65 48: Re: War of 1812 49: 1812 and the "Best Navy" 50: Re: HMS Ladybird 51: Dido Colours and book request -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SMMLcon Infomation & posts 1) SMML Convention seminars -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: FS: Ship plans 2: Flags 3: Need to contact -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS Hi gang, As you will have noticed, I added in a new section for SMMLcon. This is only a temporary section, until the first SMMLcon has run it's course. If you have any queries or announcements regarding SMMLcon, I'll put it in there. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Dean_A_Markley@armstrong.com Subject: Ships in Movies I may be old but......does anyone remember a Sci-Fi movie (Japanese?) from the 60s that involved an evil organization with a "supersub", a Japanese supersub and US Navy subs? I vaguely recall the evil guys attacking a US Navy Skipjack(?) with a ray weapon, disabling it and then watching the horrifying crunch as the sub sank below crush depth. The Japanese supersub won out in the end IIRC. Dean Hi Dean, IIRC, that movie's called the Atomic Submarine. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Rod Dauteuil Subject: Flower Class Corvettes in USN service Many thanks to all who responded to my query both on and off list. It proves that SMML is the premier list. I just can't wait to get a hold of one in 1/72 scale now! Rod. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Robert J. Payne" Subject: 2150 DD Hi, Help! How far off is the Revell 1/300 or so Fletcher from the 2150 of Korea era. Want to do a larger scale U.S.S. Laws. Any comments on changing the Blue Devil DD to a 2150? Thanks, bob mailto:gunnns@groupz.net -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: John_Impenna@hyperion.com Subject: Re: Here Comes the Navy Hi All, I guess we file this under a "VCR ALERT" ; Here Comes the Navy will be on Turner Classic Movies 3/31/2000 at 10:00AM John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Fletcher anti skid decals >> Could you please tell us how to obtain these decals? << Yes, you can order them from Duane Fowler (he's a member of this list) at: mailto:dlfowler@uscg.net. Also, for the guys building the 1/350 Tamiya Enterprise, you gotta see the sheet Duane has put together for that model! It contains accurate (and excellent) warning stripes for all the deck elevators along with Desert Storm markings. Very nice! Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ "Yeah I want Cheesy Poofs" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Flag decals >> All this talk about flags makes me think: we could use some - meaning signal flags and pendants, and flag officers flags and pendants, in both 1/350 and 1/700 - from, say, 1900 to the present: USA, GB, Germany, Japan, Russia, Italy(?), Austria(?) << Contact Duane Fowler. I've seen his signal pennants and flag sets and the resolution is amazing. He makes them in 1/700 and 1/350. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ "Yeah I want Cheesy Poofs" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Flight deck arrow >> I bought one of the Trunpeter 1/500 Nimitz kits (don't ask)... Anyway, I'm curious as to what all the markings on the flight deck are for. I know the elevator saftey markings and the landing area stripes, but there are a lot of other lines and a long arrow in some of the photos I'm using as a reference and I'd like to know what they're for. << The long arrow you see on modern carriers is a guideline for the pilots to follow at night or in foggy weather. It guide them safely to the bow of the ship where the catapults are. It also guides them safely past stored aircraft on the flight deck as well. Floating dry-dock has carrier flight deck drawings that may help. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ "Yeah I want Cheesy Poofs" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Washing resin parts >> I've just purchase my first resin kit (CW 1/700 USS Helena) and would like to know if I need to wash the resin parts. What can I use to wash them? And the white metal bits? << As long as there is no noticeable release agent visible on the parts I would wash them. Some folks on this list recommend washing the parts with a mild dishwashing detergent. I have never had painting problems due to release agent or anything else as long as I've been building models. Maybe I'm living a charmed life. The metal parts don't need to be washed either. No release agent is used on them. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ "Yeah I want Cheesy Poofs" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Michael John Zwierko Subject: Re: Virginia Hobby Shops >> I have a trip to Northern Virginia (near Dulles airport) coming up. In addition to a visit to the Washington Navy Yard museum, I was going to check out local hobby shops. Any suggestions? << Steve (and others interested), One good hobby shop near Dulles Airport (IAD) is Piper Hobby of Chantilly. They are a relatively large shop and although they stock mostly plastic aircraft and armor, there is a pretty good selection of ships of all types. They also carry numerous decals and supplies...overall a very well-stocked store. To get there, do the following (assuming you are leaving from Dulles Airport or going toward Dulles Airport on the Dulles Toll Road): 1. Take the exit for Route 28 South towards Centreville. 2. Follow 28 until you reach the turnoff for route 50. 3. Take the second Route 50 exit (50 east). 4. Once on 50 east, get to the left. 5. Go through approximately 2-3 lights. You will see a rather large shopping center on your left. 6. Make a left hand turn at the light where you see a bank/Taco Bell to your left (I think this is Metrotech Drive) 7. Make the third right (you will see a Service Merchandise to your right). 8. You will now have Service Merchandise to your right and a large parking lot to your left. 9. Make a left and drive toward the string of stores that should be dead ahead. Piper Hobby has a large "HOBBY" sign above it (next to a tanning salon and Papa John's Pizza). 10. Tell Stephen (or Laura, or one of the others) that Mike Z sent you:) Hope that helps. Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Dave Swindell Subject: Re: HO/OO scale >> Sorry to burst your first "tenuous ships link", but the "Airfix" engine was actually a "Battle of Britain class" (I'm looking at the kit now ;-) ), in this case decals were provided for the "Biggin Hill". They were very similiar to the "Merchant class". Also, Kitmaster did the train moulds first, Airfix then brought them & later sold them to Dapol, where they're available today. << Hi Shane Oops! should have checked my old catalogue before bursting into print, you're right of course - wishful thinking on my part! I wasn't aware they were second hand to Airfix, but I see the Dapol versions in the railway model shops occasionally. I remember building the Schools class Harrow nearly 30 years ago, and Stephensons Rocket, but then got into building aeroplanes. Ships are a recent return, a Frog? Battle class destroyer and Airfix Mauritania are a couple I built before the trains. The re-release of the Mauritania is a tempting trip down memory lane! Dave Swindell Hi Dave, Know the feeling mate, I'm in the same boat when it comes to Airfix kits ;-). Mind you, you could always buy the Battle of Britain Loco & convert it to a Merchant class loco ;-) Buy the Mauretania, it's not a bad kit, I intend to build my two (+ another one) sometime ;-)) & convert two to the Lusitania "then & now". Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: NAVYDAZE@aol.com Subject: Re: CVN 65 Enterprise - Ports on the bow We had the same on the "Hawk" and yes they could pass lines thru them - however I remember the center one being larger so they could pass a chain thru it if need be (towing?) but they were and are a distintive part of a "super carriers" appearance. That by the way, was my G.Q. station and I hated closing those damn things and it was worse opening them becasue you had to straddle the open port to reach up and secure the heavy cover. Mike Navydaze -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: GrafSpee34@aol.com Subject: Lindberg PT 109 Ha!! I got the same kit at a Garage sale. Its big and impressive. Ok, actually its just big. I reccomend NOT getting a good reference book with plans, such as the truly superb Lambert & Ross book " Allied Coastal Forces ". Don't get it because if you compare the excellent line drawings and hull drafts in that book with your Lindberg kit, you will see how far you have to go to get the hull to the right shape, and how naked and inaccurate and totally pathetic the rest of the Lindberg kit is. If I recall correctly, the big problem with the hull is that the ass end needs to be narrower. To do this, you will need to razor saw tapered sections of the bottom hull out, then reglue the sides to the narrower hull. You will need to make the necessary adjustments to slim the deck's width. Actually just throw out the deck and make a new, lighter version from sheet styrene, with the proper curvature. The good news is that there are .50 cal machine guns and figures and other odds and ends available in 1:32nd scale as parts from plastic Aircraft and Armor kits and as brass castings for the (now defunct) range of 1:32nd armor models. Modelling a boat other than the 109 is easy since I think the kit is already based on a slightly different Elco than the 109-- I think the engine room air intake is the key difference. Again, I do not have the kit in front of me so I might be wrong here. Also Dumas was selling a much better wood (& fiberglass?) in a large scale, (maybe the same scale?) for RC operation. Revell's 1:72nd kit is also very nice. There is a Squadron signal book on US PT boats with nice pictures in it. Good luck Dave -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: GrafSpee34@aol.com Subject: 1:32 PT 109 figures Oh, almost forgot. Airfix sold a line of "multipose" figures in 1:32 scale, which are noticably bigger than 1:35 guys, and can be assembled into different poses. I recommend the US army set, as you can use the helmets. You'd still have to scrape off their M-43 jackets and use putty to add kapok life vests, and but its a better start than your standard 1:35th pre-posed Panzergrenadier. Airfix multipose may be back in production or if not check eBay. D -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Polvi, Henry" Subject: Re: 1812 >> The war of 1812 was pretty stupid anyway (America declared war after the offending orders that lead to war had been rescinded and the major battle was fought after the peace treaty had been signed). << >> Aside from the various causes of the war being moot [impressment, the US "Warhawks" finding out the the Canadians really DIDN'T want to be liberated, sundry Orders in Council, etc.]; there was a war weariness on both sides. From the US side, there was the sad fact that we had very few successes and many defeats. Our successes probably could be listed on the fingers of one hand: "<< War of 1812? Canadians have generally felt "we" won that War, every schoolboy knew it was "us" that burned the House in Washington that had to painted White ever after. This was one hostile takeover attempt that didn't work. Sir Isaac Brock, the general of the red coat land forces at the time is considered a hero (died with his boot on) with an impressive monument just outside Niagara Falls, Ont. Laura Secord is also a legendary figure (venerated by a chocolatier) and the alliances with the Iroquois, guerrilla/uncoventional warfare, etc. makes up part of our history. [Polvi, Henry] Thornhill, On Canada -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: MIKE.LEONARD@customs.treas.gov Subject: Re: Intrepid Museum Dave wrote - >> Apparently the current administration wants to make the Intrepid museum an """"interactive experience"""" and model ships are just not interactive enough. Moreover they take up too much space that can be used for blinky light things that screaming kids can jump up and down on. The majority of the ship models and all of the naval dioramas that were there under the Intrepid's previous administration are now nowhere to be seen. The museum's hangar deck exhibition hall currently resembles a children's playground and video arcade. Although the museum seems a success in briefly grabbing a kid's attention, instead of teaching the Nintendo generation, they are simply catering to them. Pathetic. << I sort of had a similar reaction to seeing the hangar deck of the YORKTOWN at Patriot's Point in Charleston, SC last year. If anybody wants to avoid a bad "interactive experience", by all means steer clear of "Nauticus" in Norfolk, VA. We went there a few years back to see a touring collection of TITANIC artifacts. Everything else was a painful waste of time and money. Mike Alexandria, VA USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: MIKE.LEONARD@customs.treas.gov Subject: Re: Ship ID in Movie >> What was the ship used in 'The Bedford Incident'? << >> The ship was a Charles Adams class if memory serves. << COONTZ-class DLG, as they were designated at the time. They were reclassified as DDGs in 1975 when the other DLG classes were redesignated as guided missile cruisers. The COONTZ-class were terrible 'gas guzzlers' and all were eventually sent to the Atlantic Fleet -- where their lack of sea-legs was less of a problem than it would be on the West Coast. All decommissioned in the early 1990s. Mike Alexandria, VA USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: GUSDOCVILL@aol.com Subject: Rigging The Dai-Riki 9x fishing line is excellent!! Not only is it found in abundance but it is cheaper. I have had luck in going to the local medical supply houses and gotten suture material at a discount. Surgical black silk, 7-0, 8-0 and 9-0, EXCELLENT for doing the rigging of all 1/700 scale ships!! But, by far the BEST is the 10-0 used by ophthalmologists. I have been able to call the ophthalmologists office and talk with their head nurse and gotten some of the 10-0. I have also been able to call the local hospital CSR and gotten some packages of the 10-0. I like this better than the nylon because when working in the SMALL areas of the yardarms and mast, I want the line to STAY down while I get the glue to make it permanent, if that makes any sense to you all. Buying the suture material is expensive, so I have a lot of the fishing line on hand! Yours in Christ, Gus -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: iscandar2@chatter.com (Derek A.C. Wakefield) Subject: Re: Here Comes The Navy If you're in the states, and you have cable, keep an eye out on the listings for AMC and TCM. This movie does show up occassionally when they have their Cagney fests/tributes. I saw part of it very late one night about six months ago (bestgustimate). You might consider checking out their websites for coming features. Sorry, no URLs for this and being off line at the moment I can't check. I've caught a lot of old navy oriented movies on these stations and if you're wise enough to check the listings before hand (which I seldom do) they're great for VCR recordings since they're commerical free. Derek Wakefield -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: GUSDOCVILL@aol.com Subject: Re: Definition German Battleships Have read all the comments about the "proper" name of German battleships. SMML VOL 847, Mr. Allan Plumb summed it up best. My question/comment is this - each country named THEIR own ships what THEY wanted and thought it should be, correct!? Thus, if Germany "labeled" it pocket-battleship, who are "we" to go and challenge that label! I wonder how "we" would feel if some country or group of people/professinals tried to change our LPD to a LST!? All the comments make for good discussion but really guys. . .if Germany "labeled" them pocket-battleships, then they ARE pocket-battleships!!! That is my opinion, and to quote Mr. Plum, "But I don't expect to form a consensus, and don't really care." Yours in Christ, Gus Hi Gus, IIRC, it was the press of the time who dubbed them "Pocket Battleships", not Germany. Germany called them Panzershiffs or "armoured ship" in a rough translation. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: BEN8800@aol.com Subject: CVN65 Enterprise Aircraft I am interested in additional aircraft for the Enterprise. Squadron has the Tamiya sets, set 1 and 2. Set 1 shows 6 jets. Set 2 shows 3 jets and 1 helo in their catalog. Is this all you get with each set are there more aircraft in the sets? Ben -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: Loren Perry Subject: Navy ships in the movies In the film The Bedford Incident, the miniature vessel used in the film was of a Coontz-class USN DDG with its ASROC launcher located forward of the bridge. An Adams-class DDG carries its ASROC amidships. In the film, the Russian submarine is never seen other than a couple of brief shots of its periscope breaking the surface. A British DD stood in for the exterior shots. Considering the storyline, it's little wonder that the USN wanted nothing to do with the making of this movie, so no support was given. The stars included Richard Widmark as Captain Eric Finlander and also featured Sidney Poitier, James MacArthur, Martin Balsam, Eric Portman, Wally Cox, a young Donald Sutherland, and a few other notable character actors. This fascinating 1965 film is available on video from Columbia Home Entertainment, but be advised that it's in black-and-white as was the original movie. Here Comes The Navy is owned by Turner Classic Movies (TCM) available on cable or DSS. It is shown semi-regularly and you can tape a copy off the air. Check your cable or satellite TV guide's monthly movie schedule to find the next showing. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: WVeigele@aol.com Subject: US Canadian Frigates Derek, Other patrol ships besides frigates got names of lesser US cities. During WWII the 361 steel hulled, 173' PCs had only numbers. In 1956 the remaining 102 of them got names of lesser US cities. For a list of them see the book on PCs. Bill Veigele -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: ALROSS2@aol.com Subject: Re: Ship Model Kits for Sale (Prices Reduced) >> Bluejacket Shipcrafters 1:96 USF Constitution Kit # 1018 (solid hull version but milled out to the gundeck level: includes planking set 1018.2). Now that Bluejacket has released their plank-on-frame version of Constitution at $350 I am reducing my asking price still further. List $490 Your price $225 plus shipping << BlueJacket doesn't make a plank on bulkhead CONSTITUTION, only the solid hull version. The POB is from Model Expo. Al Ross -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Bill.Pasenelli@afsb.com Subject: Hobby Shops In Virginia I have found Grandads to be the best in the area for ship stuff. Its in Virginia off the Braddock rd Exit off 495. Sorry I don't have the phone #. In suburban MD there's Nostalgic Plastic which is primarily an aircraft store, it has some ship stuff. Nostalgic Plastic has odd hours (5-9 PM Weekdays ). -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: Kcompany@webtv.net (Marvin Reichman) Subject: "Stand By For Action" I saw "Stand By For Action". It was one the worst movies I have ever seen. Stupid plot and contrived situations The models used in the film were pretty bad. I give it zero stars. You didn't miss a thing. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: "Summers,David" Subject: Tora, Tora, Tora! I was privileged to live in Honolulu in 1971 when the film was shot. It was interesting to go to work with Kates, Zeros and P-40s dogfighting overhead. Yes, there was a full-scale "generic" American battleship next to Ford Island, just west of the Arizona memorial, clearly visible from much of the island. That single battleship stood in for various scenes on various battleships. The Punchbowl Cemetary, the resting place for many of the Pearl Harbor dead, offered an excellent view of the recreated attack on the harbor below. Much of the city turned out to watch them blow the battleship up at the end of the filming. The producers are to be congratulated for the great lengths taken for accuracy in the film: as a modeller, you feel like you've "walked the decks" of a subject ship for a period of time--you can recognize all the details of the Akagi and the Nagato as shown correctly in the movie. Anyone else would have simply flown a Japanese flag from the Arizona/Nevada construct, or used the USS Oriskany for the close-up carrier scenes. Tora, Tora, Tora! was a successful film that motivated Midway's release a short time later. Midway's glaring inaccuracy contributed to its failure as a movie--so yes, the ignorant masses DO care about accuracy! (Do you hear that, plastic model companies?) David Summers -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: Darren Scannell Subject: Re: 1/72 USS John F. Kennedy, CV 67 Richard Quinlan's 1/72 USS Nimitz CVN68 also appeared in SSM in 1986, No 9. He used a SuperShips fiberglass hull that Peter Shreeves produced in Alabama. Peter hasn't advertised for a number of years now and I presume does not produce the hulls anymore. A large scale plug for a project like this can be made from a combination of plywood, plaster and foam. It would be a pretty big project and I would recommend checking out a professional fiberglass shop for advice, or try and find Peter and see if he still has the molds. Regards, Darren Scannell -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 28) From: "Summers,David" Subject: WSW Derfflinger/Lutzow WSW deserves a standing ovation for their 1/700 Derfflinger/Luetzow. The pieces are crisp and sharp and the detail exquisite, flawlessly executed in resin! It shows what can be done with resin--the material's hardness allows ultra thin decks and overhangs that are correct for the scale. See it and you'll never buy another injection model! It's a model that should be purchased just to admire the artistic perfection, even if you're not very interested in the subject matter! As far as painting the Derrflinger in May/June 1916 (Jutland), I understand most horizontal surfaces (main battery tops, vents, aft decks) should be dark gray; the bridge & upper deck floors would be linoleum (reddish chocolate brown) and the aft funnel should be red (per a letter from Falk Pletscher in #17 Plastic Ship Modeler, page 7--light red? the entire funnel?--B&W pix of almost sinking Seydlitz don't seem to have different shade on aft funnel) The model of the Luetzow in the Kuestenmuseum Wilhemshaven appears to have almost black horizontal surfaces, whereas most photos seem to show more of a dark gray. Which is felt to be more accurate? Suggestions? David Summers -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 29) From: Duane Fowler Subject: US Coast Guard Patrol Boat The Lindberg "US Coast Guard Patrol Boat" model is a 95 foot Point Class patrol boat. You canb get plans for it from Taubman's Plan Service as well as photos from various online sources. As to the paint scheme, that's easy - white. Actually, all vertical surfaces would be white and the decks would be deck grey. The mast and other above deck fittings would be Coast Guard Spar. Before 1967 there hull number would be black and start with a W. After that, there would be the racing stripe and the words "COAST GUARD" on each side with the hull number just forward of the stripe. Hope that helps. Regards, Duane Fowler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 30) From: MIKE.LEONARD@customs.treas.gov Subject: Re: Lindberg PT-109 >> I just acquired the 1/32 scale Lindberg PT109. It's big, it's heavy, it has no detail and the figures are a waste. So, what can I do to improve this thing?< H-R does some metal fittings in that scale, sold by Floating Drydock. >> And any suggestions on what figures to use with it that would involve a minimum of modification? I assume DML or Tamiya, but which sets would be a good choice? << Verlinden did several 1/32 (54mm) generic mechanic figures -- bare-headed, long pants, sleeves rolled up, etc. -- that could pass for PT sailors. They may be hard to find as they were among the earliest Verlinden releases. Anything else would require extensive work. Some people have done this model using radically converted Airfix Multipose figures (USMC set and others). Mike Alexandria, VA USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 31) From: "Summers,David" Subject: War of 1812 Today it may be hard to believe, but there was a lot of animosity against England in America during the early 19th century! Freedom, liberty and democracy were the watchwords of the day. There were only two countries, France and America, who had revolted against their monarchies and who were engaged in a world-wide anti-Royalist crusade. On the other hand, the various monarchies were terrified that the revolutionary contagion might infect their countries and took steps to restore the French monarchy. These issues were the primary basis for the Napoleonic Wars, of which the American War of 1812 was simply a backwater campaign. America was Napoleon's only significant ally. The Louisiana purchase was arranged to provide American financing for Napoleon's continental wars. England's compromise with the Americans in 1814 should be understood in the context of the larger Continental War. There may have been parts of New England who felt close ties, but in general England in the 19th century was not "the beloved fatherland" but the hated imperial masters. England continued to raid American commerce after the peace of 1776 and even after the war of 1812. Northern anti-British animosity raged again during the Civil War, when England supported the Confederacy and came within a hair of entering the war on the Southern side (nixed after Lee's failure at Antietam). Public opinion in America regarding England changed only during Woodrow Wilson's presidency. Wilson was a dedicated Anglophile and launched a successful propaganda campaign to turn American opinion toward entering WWI on the English side. David Summers -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 32) From: Fritz Koopman Subject: Thanks: Marblehead info. Just a quick thank you to Steve Wiper, Mike Leonard, and Bruce Wright for their help in revealing the answer to my problem. Thanks Fritz Koopman -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 33) From: "Norman C. Samish" Subject: Re: Nevada model in TORA TORA >> It was briefly mentioned that the massive special effects model NEVADA from the movie Tora Tora Tora is on display at the USS Intrepid museum in NYC. This is correct, but only for the time being. The model will be removed from the museum in the near future, destination unknown to me at this time. Apparently the current administration wants to make the Intrepid museum an """"interactive experience"""" and model ships are just not interactive enough. Moreover they take up too much space that can be used for blinky light things that screaming kids can jump up and down on. The majority of the ship models and all of the naval dioramas that were there under the Intrepid's previous administration are now nowhere to be seen. The museum's hangar deck exhibition hall currently resembles a children's playground and video arcade. Although the museum seems a success in briefly grabbing a kid's attention, instead of teaching the Nintendo generation, they are simply catering to them. Pathetic. << Dave, your note about "interactive" museums was well put, and I agree completely. This fad pretty much removes any incentive for me to visit or support museums that have succumbed to it. Ever since I was a kid the "model room" of museums were my favorite. Sadly, these have largely disappeared. Norm Samish -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 34) From: GAZWE@aol.com Subject: Yamato what are the large portholes on both sides of the hull in way of the after centre 6inch turret below the flying deck -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 35) From: Mike Subject: Re: Cross Channel Services Chris wrote : >> The Merchant Navy class was introduced in 1941 and was named to commerate the brave sailors of the Merchant Navy who had lost their lives during the war. Each of the 35 locomotives was named after a particular shipping line. << Indeed they were....the models of these (UK OO) are now quite uncommon, although this year sees the release of the Rebuilt Merchant Navy engines back onto the modeller railway scene.......and very nice they are too! Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 36) From: Mike Subject: Peter Hall's Trenchant model I'd just like to agree with Caroline of WEM's comments on Peter's build - it looks great!!!!! The photos are good, but seeing the way he's done the sub is best....top marks, mate!!!!!!! Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 37) From: "Vincent Mccullough" Subject: Re: Hobby Shops in Virginia Steve, I believe that the best hobby shop for ship modelers is a place called "Granddad's." It's just off of the Virginia beltway at the Braddock Road exit, so it's pretty easy to get to. The Washington Ship Model Society holds it's meetings there every other month (the last one was there last Tuesday night). The proprietor stocks a pretty good supply of kits, both stick and string and steel navy, as well as a good selection of photoetch sets. He's pretty eclectic, so he's ALSO got a good selection for armor and auto modelers, and trainers. And one of the best selections of paints that I've ever seen. There's a second place, Piper Hobby that's just east of RT 28 (the north-south road that runs past Dulles) on Route 50. Not as good as Grandads, but still a nice shop. If you want more detailed directions, contact me off-list and fill in the details. Vince McCullough NRG Webmaster Chantilly, VA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 38) From: "Lars Orloff" Subject: Minic Ships Back in the 70's, when I was a kid, an English company named Hornby (subsidiary of Rovex LTD in Margate, England) produced a line of fine 1:1200 scale build-your-own harbor sets complete with piers, breakwalls, cranes, storage facilities, cruise terminals, and tugs. These were called "Minic Ships" sets and most included scale ships like Queen Mary, Bismarck, and Scharnhorst. Ships such as USS Missouri, QE2, and SS United States could be bought individually. Unfortunately, the sets were discontinued (at least in the US) after only a few years. I've recently "reclaimed" from my parents the five sets given to my brother and me and thus have rediscovered their value as keepsake toys. I would greatly appreciate any information that can be provided on how to acquire more of these wonderful kits if any still exist. I've done some investigating of both company names but am not making progress. Additionally, if anyone who has any of these sets or ships is willing to sell them please contact me at the e-mail address below. Thanks. Lars R. H. Orloff mailto:haagendazs@worldnet.att.net -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 39) From: Andy Hampa Subject: Re: Ships/Movies,US Canadian Frigates Hi All, Thanks to Mike L., Rusty, Mike S., and Derek W. for all the info. Appreciate it. To Derek Wakefield, I don't know what scale you prefer, but BaD Models has what they refer to as an Ashville/Tacoma patrol frigate in 1/96 scale. I don't know too much about it, but it's worth a peek. Now, to those interested, I found the book with the information I was looking for in my last post. US Warships of World War Two by Paul H. Silverstone. According to this book, the Navy ordered ten frigates from Canada (PG101 -110). Two were retained for US service, PF 1 USS Asheville (ex-HMS Adur) and PF 2 USS Natchez (ex-HMS Annan), but 100 were ordered by US yards. 21 built for Great Britain and 28 later loand to the Soviet Union. The reference is a bit obscure, it doesn't say what happened to the other 51 ordered by US yards or the other 8 ordered by the US Navy. Hope it was educational. Andy PS: The other 8 Canadian Frigates went to the RN as well. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 40) From: "Jeffry J. Fontaine" Subject: HO/OO railroad scales Hi Shane/SMML; I really hate to see this disagreement on what exactly the scale is for HO continuing without my input. Why HO is accepted as 1/87 is beyond me. After conducting a little research of my own, I came across a nice little reference table at Scale Link web page that helps to clarify the issue. I wish to share this with all concerned so that the argument ends quietly with all sides satisfied. While every one that has provided their input seems to feel they are correct, in the end no one is really "right" about the actual scale of HO. The accepted authorities on this subject seem to have agreed that HO scale will encompass a group of scales or ratios ranging from 1/80 scale to 1/96 scale and call that an acceptable limits or tolerance So in the interest of settling this argument I invite you to visit the reference tables located on the Scale Link reference tables page at: http://www.scalelink.co.uk/acatalog/Scalelink_Tables_49.html Or to expedite the matter review the table that I transcribed from Scale Links reference table page on acceptable limits below: Acceptable Limits: Ratio Known as Accepted limits Scale shown 1:152 N – Scale 1:148 - 1:160 2mm = 1 foot 1:100 TT – scale 1:96 - 1:105 3mm = 1 foot 1:87 HO –scale 1:80 - 1:96 3.5mm = 1 foot 1:76 OO – scale 1:72 - 1:80 4mm = 1 foot 1:43 O – scale 1:43 - 1:48 7mm = 1 foot 1:34 1:32 - 1:35 9mm = 1 foot 1:30 1:30 - 1:35 10mm = 1 foot Scale Link's home page http://www.scalelink.co.uk/ if you wish to book mark it. afn, Jeffry Fontaine Bremerton, Washington Where morale has improved since it is not raining at the moment... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 41) From: Marc Flake Subject: Re: Pearl Harbor update Go to http://www.cinemenium.com/pearlharbor/news.html to see four concept drawings of action sequences for the movie. One of them shows a Zero flying BETWEEN the ships on Battleship Row. Encouraging details include cage masts (though there seem to be too many) and ships with two-barrel turrets superimposed over three-barrel turrets. Marc Flake -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 42) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: My first resin kit >> I've just purchase my first resin kit (CW 1/700 USS Helena) and would like to know if I need to wash the resin parts. What can I use to wash them ? And the white metal bits ? Sorry if it's posted before (sure it has !!) << Cataldo, Steve from Classic Warships. You will want to let the resin parts sit out in the open air for 2 weeks. This will help to get the mold release to evaporate. Then wash with warm water and soap, a heavy liquid detergent. The metal is fine, ready to glue. Always test paint a small area to make sure you have gotten the mold release off before you paint the entire model. Have fun! Steve Wiper - Classic Warships -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 43) From: "James Johnson" Subject: Ships in Movies Somewhere I read or saw an item on the filming of "Titanic" that I found interesting. The deck scenes were filmed on one set but were used for both port and starboard shots. Any printing that was seen, including the uniforms worn by the ships crew, was printed normally for shots on one side of the ship. When the scene called for action on the other side of the ship, it was shot in the same place, the printing was reversed, the scene shot, then the negative was reversed so the ship was pointed in the right direction and all the printing was readable. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 44) From: "James Johnson" Subject: resin adhesive Super glue is the best glue for resin with one exception. When gluing together both halves of resin hulls, you may want to use epoxy. I started using super glue for this task, but soon changed my mind. I was using super glue to glue together both halves of a 1/350 cruiser when disaster struck. The two halves of large resin ships don't line up exactly. Some are worse than others, but there is always some miss-alignment. I put super glue (gel) on one half and put the two together. I was lining up the bow stem when the glue "grabbed". The stern was out of alignment by half the beam. I tore the two apart immediately with out damage. If I would of taken 5 seconds to think about what had just happened, I would of had to bandsaw the two apart. From that point on, I use epoxy to glue hull halves together. Any kind will work but IMHO the best type to use is slow acting extra strength. I mix it right on the bottom half, spread it around, then put the top half on. I use small "C" clamps to hold the two together. This has several advantages. This will eliminate most of the bowing that is usually found in resin kits. It also allows time to find the best compromise fit. You can split the difference so that the mis-matches are spread out over the entire model. The main dis-advantage to this is that the clamps can leave a mark. So far, all the kits I have used this method on has had turret bases that the pad of the clamp would fit in. I use pieces of .050" styrene in places where any mark would show. You have to plan ahead. You don't want to put a clamp on top of some fine detail. Wipe off any extra epoxy with alcohol or lacquer thinner and let it sit overnight. The result is a permanent joint with the least amount of mis-match possible. Then you can get out the super glue to attach the rest of the parts. Jim Johnson IPMS 1788 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 45) From: ECammeron@aol.com Subject: Re: flight deck markings All those markings have meaning - from refueling points to ladder locations to ordnance disposal locations. Floating Drydock had a 1970 era listing with drawings of standard flight deck markings. I suggest you contact FD to see if it is still available. If it is not, contact me at ECammeron@aol.com and I'll see if I can find mine. Eugene -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 46) From: "Graham Holmes" Subject: Richelieu Colours Another colo(u)r question. On pages 56-59 of M J Whitley's Battleship Encyclopedia of WWII there are a couple of pictures of the Richelieu after her refit in the US. Does anyone know what colours she(he in French) is painted in? Graham Holmes Columbus OH -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 47) From: ECammeron@aol.com Subject: Re: CVN-65 The three ports were there from the begining. Scale Ship Models in one of its 1985 issues had a crewman from CVN-65 write an article on missing details of the Tamiya kit and these were first on his list. You can put them on without a lot of trouble. The sponson would have been empty (except maybe for aircraft drop tanks) without the Sea Sparrow launcher. Eugene -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 48) From: Allan and Crystal Plumb Subject: Re: War of 1812 >> My "Who won it??" reference was in regards to the Battle of New Orleans that Chris Langtree was refering to. << Ah. >> Yes, I agree wholeheartedly, by all rational criteria, we should have been 13 colonies again!!! The USS Chesapeake, IIRC was one of the least "experienced" ships in the Navy? << And Captian Broke, IIRC, was considered a gunnery expert. No, it wasn't a "fair fight", but I don't remember seeing that in the rules. :-) >> The war really should never have been fought, Britain realized that it would be better to have us as allies and the US government finally realized that Britain, with no Napoleon to worry about could get very nasty in a big hurry if they so chose. << I read a good book about that war a couple of years ago. That some states were for the war and others were very against it almost to the point of secession is not something we are usually taught in history. (Not that I suspect any country is good at remembering such things about themselves.) >> Yes, I was only talking about the Constitutions because, aside from the privateers, as Chris points out, they WERE the Navy at this time. I think it is safe to say that were probably the best ships at that time because, what they couldn't defeat or outgun, they could outrun. << I.e., one of the cases Jackie Fisher might have looked at when he was coming up with the idea for battlecruisers. Interesting, ehh? I was very interested to learn from Brian Lavery's "Nelson's Navy" and (Coleridge's?) "Ships of the British Fleet" that the Constitutions were so MUCH bigger than their opponents. Java, Guerriere, and Macedonian were about 1080 tons burthen, President about 1533. Broadside of 14 18 pounders (and 12s and 9s and carronades) versus 15 24 pounders plus ditto. (I've rechecked my references in the last few days. :-) The only kit I know of of a Napoleonic Wars British frigate is Corel's HMS Unicorn, an 18-pounder 32. And lots of Constitutions. We complain about the spotty coverage of WWI, but what about this war that spanned a generation? I know of the Superbe (French 74) in plastic and wood, and I see there's a Bellona (UK 74) in wood, and bunches of HMS Victory, but not much else of the battleline, either. Hey, reading Horatio Hornblower is probably what got me interested in ships, lo, these many years ago. The metal ones came later. Enjoy. Allan Plumb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 49) From: "James Johnson" Subject: 1812 and the "Best Navy" Let me see, what have we learned? In 1812 the USN had the best single unit ships, but they could have been crushed by the overall might of the RN. The current USN has the overall might to crush any foe, but there are other navies that have better individual single ships? Seems to me that this thread re-appears with this or similar reasoning every so often. At the risk of tearing open this wound again, here are some thoughts I have on the subject. The best navy in the late forties was the USN. It had the most ships, the recently gained expertise on how to run a navy and the experienced personal to do it. This of course was being wound down very quickly. In the early fifties, the best navy, by far, was the Republic of Korea. It had at it's beck and call some of the best battleships, carriers, cruisers etc. in the world. The cost of this? A promise to be the friend of the USA. The American taxpayer would foot the bill for this and all it cost the ROK was it's undying devotion to freedom and the American way. By the late fifties when the Korean "police action" was over, the best navy may have been the USN, but I'm not sure. It's hard to tell who would win a fight if the contestants aren't fighting. In the sixties the best navy was the South Vietnam navy. Again, the only cost to the RVN was their unbridled devotion to the US. It cost them dearly in the long run, but at the time it seamed like a bargain. Similarly, the Falklands Navy was the absolute best in the world and all it cost them was the desire to stay under British rule. The last example of having the best navy at cut rate costs was, of course, Kuwait. The only thing they had to promise was that they would sell the free world all the oil they wanted at usury prices in exchange for getting their country back. The point of all this is that the US (i.e.. the American Taxpayer) has born the brunt of defending the "free world" since the end of WW2. This is not to belittle the contributions made by other countries, but most other countries and their navies have had to defend only themselves and their possesions. The US and her navy has to defend herself, her allies in NATO, her allies in SEATO,and her interests in the Persian Gulf. I could go on for pages about this but I'm afraid I would get too political. The US is currently resizing it's armed forces in the post cold war era. This is proper if it is done correctly. I have grave doubts about the current administration doing this properly. This administration does things to make it's self look good without regard for long term circumstances. Every nation's and every ruler's dream since the beginning of time has been to be the most powerful nation on the face of the earth. The United States is in that position as no other nation/state has ever been, and we act like we don't want to be there! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 50) From: Kdg345@aol.com Subject: Re: HMS Ladybird Sometime in the early 50s I was in Sasebo, Japan. The Ladybird was going to return home. So they decked her out with flags etc. some represented the longevity that some crew had been aboard. She made one circle around the harbor to say goodby and then out to sea. A few days later, she returned, she had been up on the beach too long and was taking on water. Good to hear that someone else remembers her. Ken Groom -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 51) From: "Bob Pearson" Subject: Dido Colours and book request Greetings all, Greetings all, After much vacillation, I finally broke down and ordered the WEM Dido. .. the remastered new casting of which are better than most injection kits. However Dido herself in plain OA gray doesn't appeal to me, therefore I am torn between Argonaut in a two gray and blue scheme and Naiad in a white, green and brown scheme. Are the colours for Argonaut 507A, 507C and B6? Deck pattern? Also is the port pattern symetrical with the starboard one? I have the Raven/Roberts British Cruisers book, but am looking for further references .. in particular the Ensign volume on the Didos. I shall have an inbox review of this kit in the next Internet Modeler. Regards, Bob Pearson Managing Editor / Internet Modeler http://www.internetmodeler.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SMMLcon Infomation & posts The Deadline to pre-register for the SMML convention is April 1st 2000! If you want to attend, please contact us as soon as possible so that we can get a accurate head count. Also, for those who plan on coming to the convention from far away, the special rate on the Hotel expires on April 6th. Hotel arrangements can be found at: http://www.smml.org.uk/help/smml_hotels.html The SMML convention date is May 5th and May 6th onboard the USS Salem (CA-139) Ship Museum. For more information, check out the SMML website at: http://www.smml.org.uk/help/smml_con.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "John Sheridan" Subject: SMML Convention seminars For those who plan on attending the SMML convention on May 5th and 6th, I just thought you would like to see the seminars scheduled for Saturday: Steve Wiper (Classic Warships) - Design and application of Photoetch for Shipmodels Duane Fowler (SMMLie Member) - USS Missouri Photo tour / Making your own Decals Al Ross (Historian, Author) - Small Combatants John Lambert (Author) - The Dreaded Flower Class Corvettes Don Preul (Professional Shipmodel Builder) - Dazzle Camouflage Painting for Model Warships. John Snyder (Snyder & Short) - Camouflage Paint and Application Each Seminar will be approximately 1 hour in length. We will conduct 3 seminars in the morning, and 3 more after lunch. All of the seminars will be conducted on Saturday, May 5th onboard the USS Salem. Now's your chance to rub elbows with some of the who's - who of Ships and Shipmodeling! For more info, check out the convention info at: http://www.smml.org.uk/help/smml_con.html See you at the convention! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: CokerRE@aol.com Subject: FS: Ship plans THE FOLLOWING SHIP PLAN S FOR SALE US Navy general arrangement plan sets Ranger (CV-4) 1/16" scale $40.00 Lexington (CV-2) 1/16" 50.00 Saratoga (CV-3) 1/16" 50.00 Montana (BB-67) 1/16" 35.00 Nevada (BB-36) 1944 30.00 New Mexico (BB-42) 1930s 1/16" 30.00 Oklahoma (BB- ) 1940 1/16" 25.00 South Carolina (BB-26) 1906 1/8" 90.00 Spruance (DD-968) w model photo 1/8" 90.00 Albemarle (AV-5) 1/16" 1943 25.00 Charleston (AKA-113) 1975 1/16" 30.00 plans by others Kitty Hawk (CVA-63) 1973 by Webb 1/16" 25.00 Miami (CL-87) 1944 1/8" by Float. DD 35.00 PT-109, 1943 1/32 scale by Al Ross 25.00 PFC-94 1/2" 20.00 Soviet hydrofoil (#170) please reply off list to PC Coker at cokerre@aol.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Duane Fowler Subject: Flags Hello All, I have been holding off making any announcements due to the fact that I am close to a year behind in sending out some special custom orders and flags. I have seven more countries to finish before I will have an entire set of all the ensigns and jacks of all European countries as well as the US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, and China from 1900 to the present in 1/200, 1/350, and 1/700 scale. It will also include some "temporary" countries like the independent Croatia from 1941 to 1945 and Montenegro from 1918 to 1920. The difficulty has been the number of times that some countries have changed their flags! While the UK has used the same ensign and jack since 1864, Germany has had 9 since 1900. Romania was also very fond of changes. I anticipate that this set will be finished shortly and available from Toms Modelworks. I will break it down into subsets (such as WWI, WWI, Warsaw Pact, Nato, etc.) so that you won't be forced to buy a hundred flags that you don't need. However, for the vexillogical types, it will be available as a complete set. You can currently obtain the Signal Flags and Pennants from TMW in 1/350 or 1/700 scale. There are two separate versions: one includes the US numerical flags, and the other contains the British version. I am also working on a Japanese version and a Soviet version, but please don't put off any projects waiting for it. The Fletcher Class Destroyer walkways, hull numbers, and flags are available from TMW in either 1/350 scale or 1/700 scale for the Tamiya kits, or 1/700 scale for the Skywave kit. For those who have been patiently waiting for decals, I offer my most sincere apologies for the trouble that the waiting has caused. I have been working almost every night until midnight to get everything done and have stopped taking any special orders until I am completely caught up. I have reduced the backlog considerably. Although this is not my "day job" I do take it very seriously in both the need for detail and accuracy as well as good service to the modelers. In that last regard, I am afraid I have been lacking and I am striving to improve. Best regards, Duane Fowler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Bill Gruner Subject: Need to contact I'm trying to contact Felix Bustelo...I have a question regarding your last order, Felix. Thanks, Bill Gruner Pacific Front Hobbies http://www.pacificfront.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for having SMML at your home, why not stop by our home at: http://www.smml.org.uk -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume