Subject: SMML VOL 871 Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 23:38:26 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: Remove Paint: 2: Re: Chicago Sights 3: Paint & Masking Tape - Thank You! 4: I-401 kit question 5: Alternatives to Humbrol Paint Colors 6: Re: Whaling Ship WANDERER 7: HMS Eagle 8: Re: Agincourt 9: Re: HMS Inflexible or Indomitable 10: Re: kit vs. cat... 11: Konig April Fool 12: Bad Joke 13: Stealth "bricks" on USN ships 14: Shangri La and P-51Ds 15: Help in South America Needed! 16: Re: Copyright course 17: Re: Cutting photoetch 18: Revell 1/72 Flower Class Corvette 19: CarrierZ (Is that anything like Battleship X?) 20: Acrylics 21: Cutting Photo etch off fret 22: Re: cutting PE 23: naval bookstores in berlin 24: Re: Notes from Norfolk, ship visits 25: Landing Craft Support(Large) (LCS(L) 26: Re: 2Pdrs 27: Need Book Review 28: 1/700 BBs 29: Re: Chicago Sights 30: Re: Acrylic's 31: Re: Triple Turret Saga 32: Re: Guns -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SMMLcon Infomation & posts 1: SMML Convention -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: International shipping rate reduction 2: Book and models for sale -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: David_L._Miller@ccmail.wiu.edu Subject: Re: Remove Paint: If the paint has been on for years and it is not peeling off, I would sand/fill any runs/chips smooth, sand overall enough to give it some tooth, and then just prime and put on new paint. Dave Miller -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Art Pagsuyoin Subject: Re: Chicago Sights Mike wrote: >> Not sure about hobby shops these days, but by all means try to get to "Articles of War", a superb book store in Skokie. I believe they have a web site with directions and phone number. They have current and rare books, prints, and magazines on military and naval subjects. << Ah, Skokie. I grew up in Skokie after moving from Chicago. The owners and operators of the Articles of War are the parents of my old Ast. Manager when I used work at Stinkos (Kinkos) down the street. Nice people great store.. Unfortunately they are relocating themselves and the operation to New Mexico so I'm not sure of what their status is. BTW.. When I was a kid my friend and I used to go dumpster diving in Lindberg's huge trash containers. I must have had hundreds of motors, partial kits and several Blue Devil destroyers. The destroyers became victims of M-80 depth charges...8( Art -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Felix Bustelo" Subject: Paint & Masking Tape - Thank You! To all of the SMMLers that responded to my question both on and off line - a hearty thank you! I have a lot of info to work with which is always the case with this great forum. Special mention must go to James Johnson for going above and beyond with his excellent and detailed response to this list. I will tell everyone what happens with my Ajax once I get the black patterns on her 507C hull. Regards, Felix Bustelo -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: John_Impenna@hyperion.com Subject: I-401 kit question Hi All, Can anyone tell me how accurate the 2 large scale kits, 1/300 by Yamada and (I believe) 1/250th?? scale by Doyusha of this class are? I have seen the built up kit on the Yamada box top, but can't really tell. I am looking for a fairly accurate large scale kit of this class. Thanks in advance for any help. John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Felix Bustelo" Subject: Alternatives to Humbrol Paint Colors Hello All, I have much easier access to Testors and Tamiya paints rather than Humbrols. I need a match (or close enough) to Light Admiralty Grey (the modern RN version for lack of a better term), which according to a recipe from WEM is: 65% Humbrol # 127 (Satin US Ghost Grey Light) + 35% Humbrol #130 (Satin White). I would rather not mix colors but I will if there is no other way. Thanks, Felix Bustelo (who is eagerly looking forward to the opening of the New York Yankees season today! Threepeat? I hope so). -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Matthew Prager" Subject: Re: Whaling Ship WANDERER Shirley, There are at least four kits of the WANDERER for sale on ebay at the moment. Matt Prager -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "chenyangzhang" Subject: HMS Eagle Hi Roy Eagle did ferry Spitfires to Malta but during Pedastal carried 16 Sea Hurricanes from 801 and 813 squadrons. You might want to get hold of Peter C Smith's book 'Eagles War' which is a comprehensive account of her career and contains several very good photos. Chris Langtree -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "FCR" Subject: Re: Agincourt Hello Duane and to all If you are speaking of WWI HMS Agincourt there is a small correction to do. The ship had seven turrets but they are double turrets not triple. It's main armament was 14 guns of 12 inches or 305 mm. Three turrets in the stern, two amidships and another two in the front. Incredibly, firing fourteen guns at the same time is already something very violent to a battleship but... It's a very beautiful and uncommon ship. Happy Modeling Filipe C. Ramires PORTUGAL -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "FCR" Subject: Re: HMS Inflexible or Indomitable Hello Falk Are you certain that is HMS Inflexible. I am certain that other ship of the same class, the HMS Indomitable wore a camouflage pattern in the Mediterranean. The Indomitable was detached for the Mediterranean operations in early 1915, in the Dardanelles bombings but the ship was disabled by one mine (19th of March 1915) and was send to Malta for dry-dock repairs. About the camouflage scheme I have one profile in the "Jane's Battleships of the 20th Century" and shows only a two color camouflage for the Indomitable. Still, if you want this profile contact me off-line and I will scan it for you. Happy Modeling Filipe C. Ramires PORTUGAL -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: kit vs. cat... Having been a cat owner at one time, I would highly recommend you get a catapult. I am no longer a cat owner. Steve www.classicwarships.simplenet.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Bill Gruner Subject: Konig April Fool It's always nice to see a little humor in the SMML postings, but remember that April Fools' Day is probably not too well known outside the USA, and that the American sense of humor may not be universally appreciated or understood elsewhere. Jokes about deficiencies in model products could be taken seriously, and have repercussions. In this instance, fortunately, enough feedback probably took care of the problem. Adm. Les Newcomb Pacific Front Hobbies -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Bad Joke Having thought about Marc Flake's April fools joke using the ICM Konig kit, I think this was really a big mistake on his part. I am not saying this because I fell for the joke (I did), but because of all the negative repercussions it could have on the manufacturer. The ICM Konig kit is about to come out, and just imagine if people thought it was heavily flawed, having heard this as a rumor. What would that do to ICM's sales? I cant count the times when people have assumed that my company went out of business, or certain kits were out of production, due to bad, dumb, or rumored information. How many other nations celebrate April Fools' Day? Remember, this is an international site, and any non-Americans (non-April Fools) might not understand that this was a joke. As much as some may say it does not hurt a business, it does, and I have had it happen to me, so I would ask that persons think about what they are about to post on a mail group that could potentially reach the entire world, eventually. People have a tendency to change a story or information when they retell it to the next person, and so on. Enough said, Steve Wiper www.classicwarships.simplenet.com Hi Gang, Ok, lets put this to rest NOW. Marc's post has well & truely been exposed as an APRIL FOOLs joke. April Fools is afaik, celebrated around the world, it was first an European custom (of which there are many theories as to the start of it), it was then spread around the world. The British sent it throughout the Empire (including the North American Colonies) & I'm certain other European countries would have done the same. It is NOT something peculiar only to the USA. I'd suggest people do a web search or look thru their local libraries to confirm this. As for the other legimate complaint from Steve & Bill, I firmly believe that most people will see this as an April Fools joke & will take more notice of any reviews that will appear in the modelling press, than any unsubstantiated rumour BEFORE the kit is even released. Anyone who doesn't will soon be corrected I feel. To address Steve's other concern, any post true or false, good or bad may be distorted to fit anyone's view, esp if it's retold enough times. Regards, Shane Anyway, who said the yanks had a good sense of humour, sure as hell wasn't me (ducking for cover very fast now ;-þ). -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Michael John Zwierko Subject: Stealth "bricks" on USN ships >> Touring USS San Jacinto (CG 56) today, noticed that much of the superstructure is covered with soft material applied in a brick shaped pattern (not unlike an old Lindberg kit!). Very noticeable around the stacks, too. The DDG 51 class ships also have this stuff in places to reduce their radar signature. What's it called? << Sir (and others), FWIW, the DD963-class ships have these soft "bricks" all over their superstructures as well. This includes the legs and bracing for the masts and other external items. Material composition is, as I'm told, classified. According to CAPT Potter's "Electronic Greyhounds" book, "...the ships' superstructures are being laminated with radar-absorbent material and ceramic armor. Radar-absorbent mats cover reflective fixtures such as boarding ladders, fuel stations, and replenishment kingposts." I have also seen the capstans wrapped with these mats while underway. These laminated areas have a perforated texture and it affects their appearance. On a model you could represent these areas with a different sheen of paint (possibly a lighter color as well). Compared to the hull paint, the finish of the bricks, from a distance and in certain lighting conditions, appears darker and more matt. Mike Zwierko -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Derek Wakefield Subject: Shangri La and P-51Ds I had a book on the P-51D Mustang with photos of a pony sitting on the Shang's flight deck (looked pretty interesting IMO). I no longer have the book (lost in a move in the late 80s), so I can't provide a title. It said the USN did trials of the Mustang on the Shang to assess it's suitablity for carrier service. In the end, the USN chose the Corsair, as the Stang's performance was only marginally better than the Corsair's, and the Corsair was easier to maintain. The photo showed the Stang in what appeared to be USAAF markings with a bare-metal finish. Wish I remembered the serial, but still...a 51 done up in Midnight Blue...hmm (considering I've got an unbuilt Tamiya 51D sitting on the shelf behind me...) Go Navy! _|_o_|_ Derek "Tiger" (/\)akefield /---(.](o)[.)---\ iscandar@chatter.com o oo O oo o http://www.iscandar-66.org -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: GrafSpee34@aol.com Subject: Help in South America Needed! Hi Can anyone on this list offer some assistance or advice on finding a naval history book published in South America? I tried the usual bookfinding websites, no luck. Or is there anyone here from South America who can have a look around for me? Please contact me directly by email at the above address. Thanks Dave -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "J. Lamontagne" Subject: Re: Copyright course Hi Due to the large amount of traffic here about Copyright I thought you may be interested to know that an introductory course on the subject is available on-line at Virtual Universiy. VU can be reached by visiting VU at HTTP//www.VU.org/calendar.html The cost is US$15.00 Previous courses I have taken there were well presented Cheers, John Lamontagne, Mallorytown, Ontario Canada -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: Dave Judy Subject: Re: Cutting photoetch Art, I found a pair of my wife's small CURVED manicure sissors, and these work great! You can get them right in close enough that you don't have that little nib to " file off" as some directions might suggest! If you don't want to be seen at the cosmetics dept. at the drug store.......bribe your sister into getting you a pair! My wife is still looking for her's.............. Dave Judy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: Andy Hampa Subject: Revell 1/72 Flower Class Corvette Hi All, To those of you who have purchased the new rerelease, do any of these hobby stores have a web sight or an email address? I can't wait untill it is released in the US, I want one now. Thanks, Andy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: "Steven P. Allen" Subject: CarrierZ (Is that anything like Battleship X?) >> According to "Shanrgi-La to Bikini" (the ship's WW2 cruise book) << James, Where did you find this book? Someone I know would like to buy a copy (if possible). Steve Allen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: "James Kloek" Subject: Acrylics Yep, I've had trouble with Poly Scale sticking to resin. This is resin I have cleaned with Easy-Off Oven cleaner, followed by scrubbing with Comet cleanser and a toothbrush, and even low tack tape will still lift small patches. My sense is that this Poly Scale though, I have had better luck with Tamiya paints. I also find Poly Scale very difficult to airbrush, unless the gods of thinning are with you, it glops up and plugs the airbrush frequently. Again, Tamiya paints, as well as Gunze Sanyo are much more forgiving in this regard. On the other hand, Poly Scale paints hand brush very well. Just my experience. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: Kurt Van Dahm Subject: Cutting Photo etch off fret I have used the Xuron cutter for this and like it very much. However, there are some pieces that call for the #11 blade rather than the Xuron cutter but I don't think you will be sorry for getting one for this and many other purposes. I use the same Xuron cutter for cutting off rigging lines on sailing ship models as it can get right up against the knot. Take care, Kurt Van Dahm Westmont, IL NRG member -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: cutting PE >> I was wondering what you use to cut photoetch parts off the fret. I have used a sharp number 11 X-acto blade, but was thinking about purchasing one of the Xuron clippers that is supposed to be specifically for cutting small photoetch parts of the fret. Has anyone had any experience using a Xuron clipper for this? << I have used a knife, but prefer a more chisel like blade. Exacto makes that small angled blade one that is sort of offset and at a wider angle than the No. 11. I have also used very small scissors, they type referred to as corneal or iris scissors. They have a very thin set of blades, about 1 to 1-1/2 long. They work quite well. Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: Jdeur@aol.com Subject: naval bookstores in berlin I will be in Berlin next week and wonder if there are any good naval bookstores (or hobby shops that carry a lot of naval books or general bookstores that have large naval/military sections, etc.) Looking for both new and used material, so could use any suggestions as to stores carrying used as well as new material. Thanks for any suggestions. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Kenneth Perry Subject: Re: Notes from Norfolk, ship visits Are they allowing cameras on board for external pictures now? I visited DDG-66 at Nauticus and they let me take photos anywhere, but CG-71 at Norfolk Navel Station said only on the main deck. Ken -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: "Luke Andersen" Subject: Landing Craft Support(Large) (LCS(L) Shane, I got your email address from Mike Settle. He told me you (Ship Model Mailing List) could provide me some assitance in finding a model of my grandfather's ship from WWII. He was on a Landing Craft Support(Large) (LCS(L)) I saw on some website that Commander has a LCS model (described it as for experienced modelers only). Between my father and I, we are both quite good craftmen and would love to find a model of my grandfather's ship to make as a personal project for the two of us. Can you help? I'm also trying to find out some details about the LCS, any leads? thanks in advance Luke Andersen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: "peter webster" Subject: Re: 2Pdrs Hi, The last part about 25 Pdrs is a little wayward. The 25 Pdr was developed as the 3.45" field gun/howitzer, and even the first shell cases produced for it pre-war were stamped as 3.45". The 3.7" A/A gun, the 3.7" Pack Howitzer are 94mm calibre. For early breech loaders a 3" calibre gun could be rated as a 12Pdr, 12.5 Pdr, 13 Pdr, 14 Pdr, or even a 15 Pdr depending on gun design/weight of shell and national preferences. (Also the British 9 Pdr R.M.L. was 3") Peter Webster -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: "Jana & Pavel" Subject: Need Book Review Dear SMML, I have recently seen the book " The Grand Fleet " Warship Design and Development 1906 - 1922 by D. K. Brown. As this is not freely available in stores I am hesitant to order " sight unseen ". Is there anyone who has a copy that can tell me more. Mostly the info content, plans ete. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you Regards Pavel -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 28) From: "GARY SCHURR" Subject: 1/700 BBs New to shipbuilding and wanted some opinions on Revells 1/720(?) scale USN battleships. Was particularly interested in Pennsy, Alabama, and Arizona. I wondered if there were any on-line reviews or articles. Figured to add some PE and maybe kitbash a little. Also, do 1/720 ships look out-of -place with 1/700 ships. Thanks in advance. Gary -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 29) From: SCALSHPYRD@aol.com Subject: Re: Chicago Sights While in Chicago: Mike, The last I had heard, Rob moved his shop: 'Articles of War' to New Mexico anybody out there have the new address?? Lee Upshaw The Scale Shipyard -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 30) From: John Anderson Subject: Re: Acrylic's Tom see attached photos of my 1/72 scale H.M.S. HOOD of which from the deck up is made entirely of acrylic plastic, i usually sand the acrylic with wet sand paper and then use thick CA glue with an accelerator spray to attach anything to it even allowed me to attach the acrylic to the plywood sub decking also you need to give the glue something to hold on to hence forth the sanding try 150 grit sand paper dry at first making sure to wipe it with alcohol to remove the dust or use water, Good Luck And Good Shooting (famous last words) H.M.S. HOOD 1/72 scale Skipper John Anderson Redwood City CA Hi gang, Some of John's photo's are on the SMML site. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 31) From: Minadmiral@aol.com Subject: Re: Triple Turret Saga >> April told me that ICM's next release will be the HMS Agincourt with seven triple turrets. now you can fire that 21 gun salute! ;-) << Duane, May the fleas of a thousand yaks infest your tent. ((8<)) Chuck Duggie WoodenWalls Listmeister -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 32) From: Minadmiral@aol.com Subject: Re: Guns >> Until the advent of breech loading guns (and even until the post WWII era), light guns were refered to by this means. I don't know why. << Hi; I`m not sure if this relates to the question or not. But it has an interesting ring to it. Napoleonic era army artillary had guns listed in pounds and howitzers listed in inches. Don`t recall which specific countries did this, but strongly recall the British army as one. Could be a hangover from this period? Chuck Duggie WoodenWalls Listmeister -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SMMLcon Infomation & posts The Deadline to pre-register for the SMML convention is April 1st 2000! If you want to attend, please contact us as soon as possible so that we can get a accurate head count. Also, for those who plan on coming to the convention from far away, the special rate on the Hotel expires on April 6th. Hotel arrangements can be found at: http://www.mikedunn.freeserve.co.uk/smml/help/smml_hotels.html The SMML convention date is May 5th and May 6th onboard the USS Salem (CA-139) Ship Museum. For more information, check out the SMML website at: http://www.mikedunn.freeserve.co.uk/smml/help/smml_con.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: CA139JOHNF@aol.com Subject: SMML Convention Hello Fellow Shipmodelers, Ah, Spring. The sun is warm. The birds chirp. The water laps less angrilly on the ships hull. Daylight savings time has arrived. And, its almost time for the SMML Convention!! Just four weeks from this comming weekend. Its gonna happen guys. So if you still haven't made known your intention to attend, please do so. For us locals, this will be a once in a lifetime chance to meet some terrific modelers and other knowledgebles that we would not normally have. If you are comming and know some modelers that are not smmlies, drag them along, the convention is open to ALL SHIPMODELERS. Regardless of scale or era preference. Planning meeting aboard the USS Salem in Quincy for any interested smmlies, this Saturday, 8 April, at 1000. (no phulin) :-)). Let me know if you wish to attend. John Frohock USNSM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Keith Butterley Subject: International shipping rate reduction Hello fellow SMMLies, I have reduced the international shipping rate for one book from $8US to $6US. I have found a way to beat Canada Post at their own game ;-) Keith Butterley http://www3.telus.net/warshipbooks/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Percy, John" Subject: Book and models for sale Hello all, I have a book and some models for sale: First, the Book:"Battleships of World War II", by MJ Whitly At last the real encyclopedia of World War II battleships! With over 250 photographs and detailed line drawings, full technical data, complete coverage of ship design and wartime service record, you can track the moves of battle wagons from Argentina to South Dakota. Don't miss the battleships that were the picture of naval might! 320 pages, may b/w photos and drawings. Cost: $35 The models I have for sale are both being worked on. Just can't stand to look at them anymore. 8) Model #1: 1/700 Tamiya HMS Nelson. Its about 95% complete, with only the small boats (and their launch cranes) plus some small bits to be attached. I have replaced most of the light AA (the 2pds, I believe, but not the pompoms) with GMMs 1/700 20mm Oerlikons w/shields (Not very well done, I'm afraid). In addition, my cat has eaten/broken off some of the masts and 1 of the 4" gun barrels (damn cat!). All of these are easily fixed by an experienced modeler - like Jim Gordon did in his "Recurrecting Tone" article on warship.simplenet.com (great work there, Jim). Other than that, the model is reasonably well assembled (no paint). In addition, I will include the remaining 20mm Oerlikons that remain on the GMM PE set - there enough for 40 more Oerlikons w/shields. Cost: $9 (Model + GMM PE + shipping included) Model #2: Revell USS Forrestal Model is about 5% completed (not painted). Box is a little mushed, but all parts are there on trees. Also included is GMMs 1/600 Naval Ship set (the generic one). I have started to put the GMM PE railings onto the various Forrestal Platforms (again, rather poorly) like the fueling platforms and missle platforms. I have also drilled out some of the "ports". About 70% of the railings are still on the GMM PE sprue set - the rest is untouched and ready to use. Cost: $18 (Model + GMM PE + shipping included) All prices have shipping included (please take that into account). US and its territories only and Payment by money order, please. John Percy mailto:jpercy@clariion.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for having SMML at your home, why not stop by our home at: http://www.smml.org.uk -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume