Subject: SMML VOL 880 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 00:22:59 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Urban (Military) Legends 2: Yugoslav navy 3: Revell FDR 4: HP Models 5: H.P. Models 6: LCS(L) 1944-1946 7: Re: Big planes on carriers 8: Impact adhesive 9: Re: Directions from Rusty White 10: Harland & Wolff 11: Computer translation 12: How Bad is the Revell 1/301 Fletcher? 13: Vaccuum form packs for sale on eBay 14: H M S Courageous 15: Re: russian instructions 16: Model shops in London 17: Re: battleship bismarck web sites 18: 5"/38 cal mount 19: Re: QM anatomy book 20: 1/300 or 1/350 planes 21: HMS Tracker 22: Mike Ashey's New Book 23: Re: New Orleans 24: HP models 25: New books from Poland -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SMMLcon Infomation & posts 1: SMMLCon -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Latest update -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "James Johnson" Subject: Urban (Military) Legends While reading Roland Mar's reply about the Sale of Essex class carriers, I recalled a story that went around back then. He mentioned that one reason was that transferring weapons to foreign nations could find those weapons used against the transferor against the transferee. He then mentioned the Falklands. This brought to mind a story that I heard back then, before the internet was available to spread half truths around the world in minutes. The story was that the British and French were official allies and so the Exocet missiles, being of French manufacture, were not recognized as hostile. The software was programmed to recognize the Exocet an friendly and to ignore it. This doesn't sound plausible to me. Sounds like an urban legend with military implications (shall we call them Military legends?). This is probably not true, but since we now have the internet, we can spread this story far and wide. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Baumbach, Werner" Subject: Yugoslav navy Dear SMMLies, I would appreciate any information on the yugoslav navy that has some pictures with it. My info is that they yugoslav navy has 4 frigates and 4 submarines and a couple of smaller vessels. As i think one of the frigates is Russian built, there might be an option to get pictures of other ships from that class, any input on the others? Thank you all in advance Regards Werner -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Felix Bustelo" Subject: Revell FDR Roger, I found this kit in the same way, sitting lonely on a shelf, box a little banged up. The owner gave it to me for something like $12-$13 including sales tax cash. I have a review of this kit on my website International Maritime Modeling at: http://members.tripod.com/~Febus65/imm.htm It is basically a good kit, reasonably accurate but a flat bottom hull and some of the details are molded in (like the 20mm AA). Clean it up, use the Gold Medal Models 1/540 scale set (also reviewed) and you should get a pretty nice model. Nautilus Models is planning a resin upgrade with a new island and other items to make it the USS Midway in 1945. I don't know if Jim Corley is planning on some resin planes to replace the kit versions. I am planning to build the FDR as she appeared in the Korean War, so some improved planes from that era would be really nice (hint hint). Felix Bustelo -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Felix Bustelo" Subject: HP Models I will be featuring some of their resin liner models in the coming months on my site, International Maritime Modeling. I don't know much about them or if they come with photo etch, but I guess I will soon! Felix Bustelo International Maritime Modeling http://members.tripod.com/~Febus65/imm.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Pletscher-Lenz-Schneider" Subject: H.P. Models Pavel If you want my honest opinion, you'd better stay off of H.P. Models. If you want to know why, read my article in PSM on their SCHLESWIG-HOLSTEIN. The KIROV is surely a better model and probably one of their best ones. But these models are generally heavy over-priced and their techniques are still behind standard. H.P. is one those model factorers - the only one in the ship branche I know - who have no knowledge about their subjects and are only interested in mass-production and making quick and easy money. This is, of course, his good right. But if you take a look on the models of other so-called cottage factorers, you'll see what difference it makes, to be a ship-lover too. Falk Pletscher -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Luke Andersen" Subject: LCS(L) 1944-1946 I'm trying to find out if there is a model for the LCS(L) 1944-1946. Can anyone direct me where to look? thanks Luke Andersen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: Growlrr@aol.com Subject: Re: Big planes on carriers What I want to know is how they landed a Mach 3 Blackbird on a WWII Essex class aircraft carrier that's firmly cemented to the left side of Mahnatten.... Tongue planted firmly in cheek.... Glenn -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Chris Drage" Subject: Impact adhesive HI All, >> First of all, Chris Drage is fairly famous for his amazing naval dioramas - pick up almost any copy of Plastic Ship Modeler and you are almost certain to see pictures of one of his dioramas. << Modesty prevents me...... but thanks for that vote of confidence. As I have stated on these pages before: what I try to create is a little bit of history - as accurate as the available evidence permits. Which reminds me...does anyone have any pix of Penelope in Skjelfiord in May '40? I have the pix in 'HMS Pepperpot'. Similarly, can anyone confirem the HMS Jupiter was in overall 507b grey during the Norwegian campagn? >> it sounds like what we call 'contact cement' in USA. << Yes it is a contact adhesive but a water based variety. >> Better be very sure you get the placement right the first time, because once they touch, you won't move that rail again. Not even the smallest adjustment. << That's nonsense. The water based variety are very forgiving. What will happen is that when you remove the edge brass fitting you will simply have to gently rub off the dry glue (it has a very rubbery texture when dry) and reapply another new layer of the white adhesive. Look out for Dunlop Powerfix another brand which gives good results although I suspect it has gone out of production now. . Hope that helps. Regards Chris He tao rakau e taea te karo kupu kaore e taea te karo (Te reo Maori) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Directions from Rusty White All right, all right! I have been covered up by emails from well meaning souls educating me where the Mississippi River is located. My wife tells me I can't find my way out of the bathroom. That explains why she always accompanies me on those trips. Hell, all this time I thought she liked me! Only to find out she's afraid I may never return is quite a let down. I hope I can find my way to the Nats. this year. As I recall you drive south until you cross the Mississippi River and it's about 2 hrs further. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ "Yeah I want Cheesy Poofs" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Robert Mosher" Subject: Harland & Wolff Graham - I have to admit I might be more sympathetic to H&W if they hadn't been raising the same cry for over 20 years - I don't know enough to say if the yard is really well or badly managed, but I have heard it before. On the other hand, I think the last carrier they built was the HMS Eagle? It would be neat to get them back in the business and maybe do it well enough to get some more work. Robert M -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "Robert Mosher" Subject: Computer translation I have seen that website used for various translations and it might do just fine for instructions, etc especially since you probably already have a pretty good idea of what it should say - but be prepared for some howlers which can offer great entertainment value. Robert M -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Robert J. Payne" Subject: How Bad is the Revell 1/301 Fletcher? Hello, I have gotten great tips from you guys on the 2150 destroyer I've been looking for. It seems that the Revell 1/301st Fletcher has the 1949 conversion to a 2150 type used in Korea. So how bad is it? Your help is always appreciated. Thanks, Bob -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Vaccuum form packs for sale on eBay Recalling a post earlier looking for plastic for Mattel Vacuum Form machine, I saw some packages of refill plastic on eBay. The URL is: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=307042858 Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. http://www.okclive.com/flagship/ "Yeah I want Cheesy Poofs" -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: WRPRESSINC@aol.com Subject: H M S Courageous The configeration that you also ought to consider is the interim one where she was fitted out as a minelayer before becoming a carrier. Now that is what I call a challenge! As to plans, contact the Maritime Museum at Greenwhich. You should ask for the "as fitted plans". They are EXPENSIVE. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Norman C. Samish" Subject: Re: russian instructions >> with all the talk regarding the Russian icebreaker model and the issues with being able to read the instructions, a chum turned me on to a site that may be of use to all of you with instructions in languages you can't read: http://world.altavista.com/ you can paste in text you want translated, and it'll spit it out in the language you choose. Pretty slick. << Shirley, This computer translator probably has a ways to go before it's very useful. For example, I put your original message above into the translator and translated it to German, then I translated the German version back to English. This is what I got: >> with that whole discussion concerning the Russian is icebreakermodell and the outputs with ability to read the statements put on chum me to a Site, which can be of the use to whole you with statements in the languages, those, you not to read can: http://world.altavista.com / you can stick in the text, which you require translated, and he spit him in the language you to select out. Pretty smooth. << I tried it again by translating the above into German, then to English. This time I got: >> with this complete discussion regarding is the Russians is icebreakermodell and the outputs with ability to read the statements those on chum I to a Site, those can from the use to complete you with statements in the languages be, which are set,can you, in order not to read: http://world.altavista.com / you can in the text, which you adhere translated need and it spit it in the language you, in order to select out. Quite smoothly. << This is interesting but not very useful. It looks like there is a danger that the translated version will garble the meaning of the original phrase. Norm Samish -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: Mike Subject: Model shops in London Well, I've been having a look about this last week or so, and am sorry to say that since Maritime models has closed, there ain't much available :-((( So what do we have ? Hannants can be found just outside Colindale Tube Station (Edgware Branch Northern Line). They do about 60% aircraft (all eras + Eduard PE), 30% transport (cars/trucks/armour), with 10% maritime (all plastic). However, they do seem to stock GMM PE, so there's hope yet. 020 88205 6697 Mick Charles models is found by the southbound carriageway of Kingston Road, between Kingston & the M25 (use http://www.streetmap.co.uk/ and search for Ewell). They have parking close to the shop as well. They are 40% aircraft (mainly R/C), 25% transport, and 25% maritime (plastic kits and items such as Calder & Billings boats), with 10% misc (eg, wood, brass, general R/C gear, general modelling stuff). Hard to get to, but worth it. 020 8393 3232 Beatties. Well, we've heard a lot of horror stories recently about thes closing down / going into recievership. I'm sorry to say that at least 2 of the branches in the South East have closed, with threats over the rest. The stock seems not to be renewed, except for popular areas - that means pick up those maritime kits you've promised yourself for ages, because they'll probably be at sale prices and probably won't be restocked once they've gone. Eg, the main West End branch at Holburn had two large-scale kits in - before Christmas, they had 10+. Smaller scale kits were noticable by their scarcity as well. If anyone knows of any other decent model shops, I hope they'll post them here. They are starting to become as rare as rocking-horse s**t........ :-( Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: Jerry Slagle Subject: Re: battleship bismarck web sites >> Beside the obvious websites are there any other site that I could pursue? << I'm not sure which websites qualify as an obvious one, but you might try: http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/4273/bismarcki.html Hope it helps, Jerry -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: Andy Hampa Subject: 5"/38 cal mount Hi All, I'm looking to scratch build the 5" enclosed mounts on a 1:125 Fletcher. Would anyone happen to know what the demensions were? I have Alan Raven's book which has plenty of photos and drawings but no demensions. Thanks, Andy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: SCALSHPYRD@aol.com Subject: Re: QM anatomy book >> (STILL looking for that damn QM anatomy book) << Chris: Old Guard Hobbies in Detroit has 2 new copies of the Anatomy of the Ship books on Queen Mary as of Monday April 10 2000 Lee Upshaw The Scale Shipyard -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Mark Cuevas Subject: 1/300 or 1/350 planes Hello All, Does anyone here know of or heard of a manufacturer that makes US WWII air force aircraft (p-51,p-38,etc.) in either 1/300 or 1/350 scale? I need them for an escort carrier model that is currently been built. Thanks Mark -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: Dave Swindell Subject: HMS Tracker Hi Filipe, They say great minds think alike ( and idiots never differ ;-) ). I had my Tracker kit out a couple of days ago with a view to doing a diarama with other ships. This stems from reading Paul Kemps excellent book on Arctic convoys, and a stack of suitable kits (well 3 actually) Convoy JW 58 sailed from Loch Ewe 27/3/44 with two escort carriers, one of which was Tracker with 12 Avengers and 7 Wildcats on board. Close escort for the convoy consisted of destroyers Westcott, Whitehall, and Wrestler with corvettes Bluebell, Honeysuckle and Lotus. Main escort consisted of Diadem, Activity, Tracker, Impulsive, Inconstant, Obedient, Offa, Onslow, Opportune, Oribi, Orwell, Saumarez, Serapis, Scorpion, Stord and Venus. A second escort group joined the convoy on 29/3/44 made up of Starling, Magpie, Wild Goose, Whimbrel, Wren, Beagle, Boadicea, Keppel and Walker. The convoy consisted of 50 ships and included the American cruiser Milwalkee which was being handed over to the Russians. Opposition to the convoy was intense, and defense was equally agressive, fighters downed 2 Ju88s, 2 FW200's and a BV138, all of which were directing U boats at the convoy at least 17 of which attacked the convoy. One was damaged by an Avenger from Tracker and sunk by Beagle (U355), one was sunk by Hedgehogs from Keppel (U360) and U288 was sighted and attacked by a stringbag from Activity, a shout on the radio brought in an Avenger and Wildcat from Tracker and they all sank it together. U961 was also sunk by Starling. The convoy arrived at the Kola inlet without loss, and was seen as a major victory. All the ships involved in sinking of submarines were from the second group, which leads me to beleive they were the outer defences of the convoy. From what I've read it seems it was common practice for the carriers to be at the rear of the merchant ships, and one escort at least would be close astern (and probably to port) of the carrier acting as plane guard during flying whenever possible. I was thinking along the lines of Tracker in close company with Bluebell and one or possibly 2 O class destroyers as these formed part of the close and main escort. (and I just happened to have WEM's Bluebell kit and a couple of O class Tamiya? kits in the to build pile, convenient or what?) Camouflage of Tracker poses a bit of a problem. I've got an excellent booklet on Tracker from the Fleet Air Arm museum which shows a stern quarter view of the starboard side, the pattern doesn't match the box pattern, there's at least 3 colours involved. I've also got a photo of Avenger with 3 colour camo on the flight deck, so I'd also like to hear from anyone with definative patterns and colours. The photo's of the O class all seem to indicate an overall light grey. I'm away from home for a few days so I can't check the book for the armament fit for Tracker, but there was variation between ships of the class. I'll get backt o you on that if no-one else beats me to it. Regards Dave Swindell -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: Mike Ashey's New Book "Basics of Ship Modeling: The Illustrated Guide"by Mike Ashey. Published by Kalmbach Books (US$ 18.95). I picked this up today and was very impressed. Steve Wiper is right -- this is a book everybody's going to want a copy of, from novices to professional model ship builders. The 112 pages are divided into five chapters: 1. Building Plastic Kits 2. Building Resin Kits 3. Scratchbuilding & Detailing Superstructure Shapes 4. Working with Brass & Stainless Steel Photoetching 5. Painting, Masking, & Decal Application There is also an 18-page section of color photographs of finished models by Mike and others. Of the hundreds of black and white how-to photos, I recognized very few from his first book. Most highly recommended. Mike Alexandria, VA USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: tom Subject: Re: New Orleans If a person has enough time I think a quick trip to Mobile and the BB Alabama is in order. As I recall it is about 2 hours drive via US10. Alabama allows "self-guided" tours and you can get inside the main turrets and even in the shell and powder handling rooms. Where else can you wrap your arms around a 16" naval shell and try to see of you can tip it over? Tom K -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: "Michiel Woort" Subject: HP models Just meet Harald Popcke from HP models yesterday at Intermodellbau in Dortmund. I can say that Hr,Ms. Java looks pretty good (I didn't measure it yet). He told me that he will bring the Hr.Ms Ruyter and Tromp in a few months and that he remold them. So I think their could be some changes in quantity the new models look good (the only thing what was missing is photo-etch, but I can life whit that). Michiel Woort The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: Damian Pliszka Subject: New books from Poland Hi, There are new books from Profile Morskie series: No. 23 US destroyer USS Porter No. 24 Japanese destroyer IJN Yukikaze No. 25 British battleship HMS Royal Oak. Regards Damian Pliszka Slupsk, Poland -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SMMLcon Infomation & posts SMML Convention and tour notices: http://www.mikedunn.freeserve.co.uk/smml/help/smml_con.html If your coming to the SMML convention on friday, we need to know which tour you planning to attend so that we can get an accurate head count for transportation. Contact John Frohock ca139johnf@aol.com and let him know which tour you plan on attending. If you are going on a tour, you need to be onboard the USS Salem no later than 10:00am on Friday May 5th. We will open the ship starting at 9:00am for those who would like a cup of coffee and some schoozing before departure. For those of you who are not going on either tour; the USS Salem will NOT be open to the public on friday (Crew will be on watch to repel boarders if provoked ) so please do not show-up at the ship on friday unless you are attending the tours. Check out Convention and tour info at: http://www.mikedunn.freeserve.co.uk/smml/help/smml_con.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Felix Bustelo" Subject: SMMLCon Hi John, I am planning to go only on the Saturday - drive up and back from Long Island and I am playing that by ear. If all works out and I do make it, I will schlep the "prize winners" with me. Felix -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Mike" Subject: Latest update Hi again, First, many thanks to those who have mailed in some items for the site - while I may not have them all up as yet, I am working on adding them!!!! And if you haven't sent anything in yet - we welcome all submissions. OK - what's new? Well, we have the Archives up-to-date again, and indexed. PicPost has new images of the 1/72 HMS Hood - now THAT's a massive model!!! - as well as a Fletcher from Rusty White that's already started winning some prizes! Still to come this month - a conversion table from Humbrol paint numbers to 7 other makes, as well as extra photos into the walk-abouts, and a historical look at a WWII battle. Full details are, as always, in the History page. Mike SMML Webmaster Hi gang, After looking at Rusty's Fletcher, he's lucky I'm nowhere near his fingers with a hammer ;-)). Great stuff, well done to both Rusty & John. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for having SMML at your home, why not stop by our home at: http://www.smml.org.uk -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume