Subject: SMML VOL 946 Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 03:17:31 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: D'Entrecasteaux & Pre 1900 HMS Ships 2: Re: PT Gun Tubs & PT 109 Color 3: IJN Sakura DDE 4: Graf Zeppelin Air Wing Update 5: 1/300 nichimo shinano 6: Re: Hunley 7: German Colors 8: Re: Royal Oak 9: Re: cases 10: Re: Lineoleum 11: Re: PT-109 12: LST plans 13: Need help with my USS Iowa conversion.... 14: Need help with my USS Iowa model.... Part 2 15: Need help with my USS Iowa model.... Part 3 16: King of all pet peeve’s with Tamiya’s 1/350 scale ship kits 17: Need advice on how to do a ship model 'preview' 18: Hobby shops in Taiwan 19: Re: WW1 Subchaser 20: HMS Trafalgar and Oscar - Dragon 1/700th 21: Re: Linoleum -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: GMM's PE set for ICM's 1/350 Konig - progress report -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: RhinoBones@aol.com Subject: D'Entrecasteaux & Pre 1900 HMS Ships I'm about to order the 1896 French Armored Cruiser D'Entrecasteaux and thought I would first ask the SMML collective whether anyone knows the history of the ship or, just as importantly, the English translation of the name? There aren't many kits available from the 1890's era, therefore, the D'Entrecasteaux will become a personal center piece. On the same theme . . . from my travels around the modeling world there seems to be a serious lack of English ships from the 1880-to-Dreadnought time period. The only HMS ship that I recall seeing from this period is the HMS Benbow. There are of course quite a few kits available of English built ships which were purchased by Japan, China and some South American countries, but I've seen nothing of the English navy itself. Am I missing a source or is there a black hole in the timeline of the British navy? Regards, RhinoBones -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: ALROSS2@aol.com Subject: Re: PT Gun Tubs & PT 109 Color << I have my doubts that the 109 boat was ever painted green. I say this due to the fact that when the 106 boat was reasigned from Ron 5 to Ron 24 on February 15 1945, it was painted a light gray. As all the boats in Ron 24 were painted a dark green, this stood out like a litter of black puppies with one white pup. The 106 boat and the 109 boat were both in Ron 5." >> Donovan's book PT 109 describes the boat as dark green. From whom he got this information, he doesn't say. The 109 boat was lost in August 1943, 18 months before the 106 boat was transferred to RON 24. One might ask how many times the 106 boat had been repainted during those 18 months. Al Ross -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "FCR" Subject: IJN Sakura DDE Hello list In all my IJN models that I have to built I have one small destroyer of the Matsu class, the Sakura (from Fujimi). I don't know much about this class and I realized that Tamiya also have the same model but with differences, at least in the stern. The Fujimi model have one square stern and the Tamiya model have a round one. What is the correct one??? Also the Fujimi model is quite poor and I believe that there might be some wrong things on it. Does anyone knows anything about this? Thanks in advance. Compliments. Filipe C. Ramires Lisboa, PORTUGAL -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Peter K. H. Mispelkamp" Subject: Graf Zeppelin Air Wing Update Hello again. Current standings are: Bf 109T Ju 87C Fi 167 Me: 4 3 3 Bob O'Conner 2 2 2 Doug Brown 2 2 2 Ned Barnett 3 3 3 Bill Colby 3 3 3 Jeff Healy 1? 1? 1? Totals: 15 14 14 As you can see, we are still just over 25% short of our target of 20 bags per aircraft. We are so close, I can almost smell them - but we are still so very far away. Bob, thanks for confirming your quatities. I would like to ask the rest of you who are on the list to please confirm your quantities. Those of you who are sitting on the fence now is the time to act. I have sent WEM an email asking about the price for 20 bags of each type. My gut feeling is that the 109T's and Ju 87C's will cost about the same as the their existing late war counterparts, while the Fi 167's should cost about the same as their Fairey Swordfish - but this is only a guess at this time. As soon as I hear from WEM, I will let you know via SMML. BTW, I have seen two Graf Zeppelins on Ebay in recent days! Sincerely Peter K. H. Mispelkamp -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: twdebord@pop.fuse.net Subject: 1/300 nichimo shinano i am looking for a nichimo 1/300 shinano. maybe someone can help me if any one in japan knows any thing about this kit. or if it is still made there please let me know. i would like one built or unbuilt thanks wyatt -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: Hunley >> For those SMMLies who have built or are contemplating building the CSS Hunley, she is being brought up soon. Somehow I got on a mssg list giving accounts of the diving on her. It seems there is a lot of detail that << WM Blackmore (Cottage Industries Models) has a Hunley kit with full interior and cutaway hull which was for the time (about 2 yrs ago) as accurate as he could make it based on dive info to that time. He will probably update once the Hunley is raised. Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "BearKat_Ind" Subject: German Colors In the Scharnhorst class of battleship, all the colors appear to be aluminum in texture in content as they apply to the hull above waterline and upper deck structures. This is the pre-camoflauge color scheme and is also referenced as being silver by the British when they sank the Scharnhorst in the North Sea. These determinations are based upon color photographs of the ship while in dry dock for repairs (color print) and historical archieves of those who served. Also, the Scharnhorst kit from Heller show the pre-war configuration, the hull needs to be modified at the bow with bondo to close the the anchor chain assembly and the hull needs to be re-shaped at this point; also there is a third mast at the funnel that is higher than the other two and a cable with international flags is also shown from bow to stern, this is the 1943 configuration. These modifications will have to be scratch built. The photo-etch from Gold Medal is a bit tricky but after three or four mistakes, one learns by trial and error how to assemble the photo-etch kits to get it right. The railings look appropriate on this model, plastic is far too heavy a construction. The ship is in modules, ready to be airbrushed, coloration now is the major obsticle. Have over 240 hours in the Scharnhorst and want to get it right. Any help would be appreciated. Jack -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "chenyangzhang" Subject: Re: Royal Oak Hi Murph It seems that 2 batches of torpedo pieces were recovered then as the source which gave details of the Jan 1940 pieces is pre '73 and refers to different pieces. As for Prien, he was prepared to let the propaganda department use him and in the words of another U-boat captain, you don't write your story they write it for you. Falsification of logs was also not unkown (re sinking of Athena). Chris Langtree -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: SantMin@aol.com Subject: Re: cases >> A friend of mine, Dan Turner, makes all of my cases, usually from cherry. Dan takes a somewhat untraditional approach to construction that I really like because it results in an extremely solid case, one that may minimize the possibility of disasters like that which befell Bob (major condolences, my friend). << Thanks Al, but that cannot happen to me again, I never use real glass any more. Now all my cases since are made up by me making a solid wood (usually walnut) bases and a local plastic fabricator glueing up solid plexi tops for me. Works well, and it won't shatter. Cheers, Bob Santos -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: Lineoleum OK Dave, here's the short course on lineoleum, taken from a book on 20th century building materials put out by the National Park Service. My soon-to-be-ex-wife wrote this portion of the book. Englishman Frederick Walton invented lineoleum in 1863. Basically, linoleum is made up of ground-up oxidized linseed oil, pigment, and ground cork or wood flour, calendered (pressed with heated rollers) into sheets with a burlap (originally linen) backing. Early manufacturing was greatest in Europe, and English and German manufacturers competed in the American market early on. Because of the darkness of the ground oxidized linseed oil and ground cork, brown linoleum was the easiest to make, requiring little pigment. But yes, other colors were in use LONG before 1945, including solid colors, marbled linoleums, inlaid linoleums of intricate design and patterns, etc. The industry distinguished the various linoleums largely by thickness, with the so-called battleship linoleum available in four thicknesses: 0.250 inch battleship; 6mm (0.235 inch) battleship (heavy); 0.187 battleship (medium); and 0.142 battleship (light). It was the 0.250-inch material that was recommended for shipboard use. In use into the 1950s, linoleum was superseded by vinyl flooring and vinyl-asbestos tiles. Of course, the very materials that make up linoleum make it quite flammable, which was why most navies quickly stripped it from interior decks. There are still a couple of manufacturers of linoleum, mostly used these days in historic restorations; I believe they are in the UK, possibly Scotland. Does that give enough of an answer? John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys http://www.shipcamouflage.com and also... P.S. Preservation Services Historic Preservation and Materials Conservation -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: PT-109 According to Al Ross (Al - feel free to chime in here...), PTs 103-117 were painted in Standard Navy Gray #5, with Standard Deck Gray #20 decks. Some were repainted in the field in an overall green version of Measure 13. Shameless plug: you can find the two grays in our US Navy Set 1 paint chips, and all the greens in our US Navy Set 2. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys http://www.shipcamouflage.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Melea/Mike Maynard" Subject: LST plans Happy Father's day! I asked for help last week in locating a set of plans for a WWII LST, the plans must include the off set lines. The plans are for a vet that wishes to build a model of his ship but has no internet capabilities. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks Mike M. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: cccccccccc ccccccccc Subject: Need help with my USS Iowa conversion.... Hi Everyone. Well here is my fist post (and definitely not the last) and I think I'll get right to the point, I need a bit of hard to find help. Right now I'm in the process of converting Tamiya's USS Missouri, to the USS IOWA as she looked in January of 1944. I just bought the required conversion kit to modify the USS MISSOURI to that of the Iowa as she appeared early in her career. Right now, I have every reference for the Iowa Class, and in particular BB-61, in print (and a few that are out of print): but I just need one more thing that has been a bit elusive. I'm trying to find Line drawings/Ship plans for the Iowa as she appeared in January-May of 1944. If there are no such drawings available for this time period, then plans for the IOWA before this period of January 1944 (I'm assuming there's got to be at least something available, for the ship at least as she looked when commissioned in early '43?). I've already visited every possible web-site that deals with ship modeling/fitting, etc; and either they don't have the date range I'm looking for or a big enough scale. As for size of plans I need, I need something thats at least 1/350 scale or preferably bigger (like 1/192 scale). CAN ANYONE HELP ME OUT?? If you have plans for this hard to find combination of date range and the particular size I need: great. If you don't need the plans you have, I'd be willing to buy your plans for a reasonable price (or perhaps you could either scan the plans you have or Xerox them, and of course I'd reimburse you for what ever the cost to you would be), or if you don't have what I'm looking for on hand, but could tell me where I can locate them, please get in touch with me ASAP as my project is currently on hold until I know what I really need to do and how to do it properly. Thanks a lot everyone, even if you just took the time to read this post. Courtney -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: cccccccccc ccccccccc Subject: Need help with my USS Iowa model.... Part 2 Well perhaps you've just read my other post about the plans I need to do my USS IOWA-1/350 scale, January 1944- into a masterpiece. But of course as soon as I sent the previous e-mail to be posted; I thought of more questions ;-) I plan to build the ship as she would appear in Dry-dock, and would like to have a 'pavane' chain attached on her bow (hope I spelled that properly). Any ideas on how I could best simulate such a small chain, and also how should I modify the Tamiya kit to accept the chain on the bow. Are there any chains, in the proper scale though, that can be bought from ship model supply/accessory stores, that anyone can think of? If I can't buy a simulated chain, I was thinking of using thin-to medium thickness black or grey thread. Any suggestions, opinions or comments would be helpful Thanks a lot, Courtney -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: cccccccccc ccccccccc Subject: Need help with my USS Iowa model.... Part 3 Well perhaps you've just read my other post about the plans I need to do my USS IOWA-1/350 scale, January 1944- into a masterpiece. But of course as soon as I sent the previous e-mail to be posted; I thought of more questions ;-) I want to have three scout planes on the fantail, two ready to go on the catapults, and one stored behind the #3 turret. To simulate the third plane, as it would be stowed, I need to simulate the canvass covering that would go over the cockpit windows. Any ideas on how to do this?? But the hardest thing about all of this is that in such a small scale of 1/350, it's hard to realistically simulate a canvass covering (like the fabric used, but especially where the rope is 'threaded' through the ringed 'eyelets'. How would you simulate these metal rings in 1/350 scale??) Any suggestions, opinions or comments would be helpful Thanks a lot, Courtney -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: cccccccccc ccccccccc Subject: King of all pet peeve’s with Tamiya’s 1/350 scale ship kits Probably the king of all pet peeve’s with Tamiya’s 1/350 scale ship kits, is how the decks are separated. Need suggestions, opinions or comments on how to have a seamless transition of all three deck sections. I want the model to show absolutely no seam lines where the deck sections meet. One way of solving this I was thinking about would to fill the two gaps with supper glue in layers, until the dried glue barely rises above the plastic decks. Then what I would do is to take a Metal Ruler and a scriber, and scribe simulated planking's, where the glue is; using the ruler to keep the planking lines lined up from the plastic deck, over the filled gap, and then continuing over the next plastic deck. What do you think? What about doing all of the above, but instead of super-glue, using putty? If you have experienced building any of Tamiya's 1/350 scale battleships, and have successful results that leaves no seams visible, this is what I would most desire and really appreciate. Any suggestions, opinions or comments would be helpful Thanks a lot, Courtney -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: cccccccccc ccccccccc Subject: Need advice on how to do a ship model 'preview' One thing that would really help before I start to paint and glue parts permanently on the current kit I'm working on, is to assemble the kit as she would finally look, structurally. Kind of like a preview of what the kit will eventually look like, sort of a 'test-shot.' I saw this great idea when Lorren Perry (of GMM fame), showed a model he was working on, in the Tamiya Modeler's magazine. He was scratch building a conversion of the Tamiya's kit of the Missouri, and turning it into the USS Iowa (just like I'm doing); as the Iowa looked when she was first commissioned in 1943. In one picture, the 'complete' model was assembled, but it wasn't painted at all, and I don't think there were any photo-etched items on the kit in this picture. All you cam see is where the modifications that were made to the original Missouri kit, and the bare plastic parts in a 'buildup' configuration. This is how I'd like to run a test preview, of how the kit I'm building will eventually look, structurally complete. (I think that by doing this, I'll get a lot of motivation to hang in there, when working through long stretches of building the kit.) But the real interesting thing about the kit in this picture (I think the model was in the April '86 issue of the Tamiya Modelers mag.) is that I couldn't see any scotch tape, that most people would use temporarily to join the parts; to see how the parts will eventually fit in there permanent place. Anyone have any ideas on how this can be done; to have a preview of what the kit will look like structurally, without using any tape or permanently gluing the unpainted parts in place?? If you can offer some tips this would really help me get a better idea of what the final kit will look like, and also point out any potential problems I'll have to figure out/solve / fix, before I permanently finish the kit ( as I'll be lucky if I finish the kit by this upcoming Christmas ;-). Thanks a lot, Courtney -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: Duane Fowler Subject: Hobby shops in Taiwan Hello All, Well I find myself on the road again and am in Tauyuan, Taiwan. While I have spent a good deal of time in Taipei, this is my first time in this area and was wondering if any of the international SMMLies would be familiar with any hobby shops in the area. I took a walk this afternoon and did not spot anything. However I did not want to get too far from the hotel since I neither speak not read Chinese. It is somewhat frustrating because one is always sure that just on the next block is a hobby shop. While I have never been accused of having an overly large cranial capacity, I am even more challenged here than back in California. This weekend I may be off to Singapore so any leads to hobby shops there would be appreciated too. Best regards, Duane Fowler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: Jeffon10@cs.com Subject: Re: WW1 Subchaser For Ned There is a WW I sub chaser kit by Glencoe. It's 1/74 th scale and originally issued (as I recall) in the 1950s. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: thorstenwahl@t-online.de Subject: HMS Trafalgar and Oscar - Dragon 1/700th Hi gang, any ideas regarding the accuracy of DML´s T-class sub? I think the tail is WAY off (depth planes) and the screw should be shrouded. Thanks to Caroline and Peter for the info and idea. Other than that, what else would I have to correct? This is meant as a practice job for WEM´s 1/350th scale HMS Trenchant kit which I´ll get at the UK Nats. On the same note - since it´s included in the box - what´s the story on the Oscar? Ain´t got the slightest idea or references about that, so any help/hint/idea welcome. Folks, thanks for listening Thorsten, IPMS (UK) x1602 ´At least we don´t name our ships for our mothers-in-law.´ USS Reuben James to HMS Battleaxe -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: "Francisco Javier Chaves Salarrullana" Subject: Re: Linoleum >> When was this material invented? Do the materials used in its composition account for its usual brown color, or is this a coloring? Did it come in other colors before 1945? << Hello all. Just a few words about linoleum. Linoleum was invented in Great Britain in 1863 by Frederick Walton. It's a burlap of canvas coated by a mix of oxidized lineseed oil (Latin: linus + oleum; linen + oil), powdered cork, powdered wood, rosin and in some cases adding pigments to create colors and paterns. This is done under conditions of high pressure and temperature, being laminated and being stored in the form of rolls, that must be at least at a temperature of 21ºC for a minimum of 24 hours, before being laid as pavement to avoid formation of cracks on its surface. Powdered cork cannot be used in the lighter shades of linoleum, because is cork what dyes it in that red brown color, withuout pigments having to be added. Its very sensitive to humidity, and to be protected may be coated with varnish, resin, or waxed. It can be glued or screwed to be laid on the suface to be covered, and can be cut to the shape needed. As the rolls have a width that may vary depending on the manufacturer, and usually the surfaces to be covered are larger than that widths, there are some joints that have to be protected against water or other wheather agents with those brass stripes or other sealing systems. This is what I can say about linoleum, and I hope that can be useful. P.S. Any one can sell a Federal Standard FS-595 C color book or chip fan? I really need it!!!!! Thank you. Best regards. Francisco Javier Chaves Zaragoza (Spain). -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Loren Perry Subject: GMM's PE set for ICM's 1/350 Konig - progress report Gold Medal Models' new photoetched detail set for ICM's beautiful new kits of the SMS Konig and SMS Grosser Kurfurst is progressing smoothly. Test samples etched in brass arived here yesterday. With the exception of a few inadvertant omissions (since corrected), the fret turned out perfectly. Samples of all the brass parts were fitted to the plastic kit parts and the match is excellent. The design work for the instruction sheet was completed earlier today and the finalized artwork departs for the printers on Monday. The new set's release is now planned for about three weeks from now. For more details, go to the What's New section on our home page: www.goldmm.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for having SMML at your home, why not stop by our home at: http://www.smml.org.uk -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume