Subject: SMML VOL 1031 Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 23:57:39 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: A really big decal job 2: Bermuda exhibits 3: Re: Sovremmeny and GMM Russian photo-ecth set 4: French Navy 5: Re: CVAN 65 Enterprise 6: British X-Craft Minisubs 7: Re: Secratery Class Cutters in the Atlantic 8: Re: Battle of the Atlantic 9: Electronic Greyhounds 10: Re: German secret weapons WW2 11: De-Gausing Cable on Chidori/Otori type IJN Torpedo Boats 12: INS Pola 13: HMS Belfast's Walrus 14: Hoga 15: U.S.S. Indiana BB-1 16: Re: Electronic Greyhounds 17: Book Of Condolences - U.S.S. Cole Web Site 18: Re: ORP Dragon 19: Re: Russian ship models 20: Haze Gray & Underway USS Cole (DDG 67) 21: Re: Screws 22: KONIG CLASS DAMAGE -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation 1: Club listing 2: Re: James River Tour -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Re: USS Sims 2: Re: PSM update -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Poutre, Joseph A" Subject: A really big decal job http://defence-data.com/current/page8720.htm Jeeze, it's hard enough to put a few decals on a 1/72 scale plane. 1/1 must be a nightmare! Joe Poutre -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Poutre, Joseph A" Subject: Bermuda exhibits From: Rod Dauteuil >> I know this may be a long shot, but does anybody know if there are any ships or naval displays in Bermuda? I'm heading down there next week (to get away from this New England autumn) and it would be nice to see a British warship for a change. << Follow this link to the Bermuda section of my Naval and Maritime Museums list, International edition: http://www.bb62museum.org/wrldnmus.html#B In a nutshell, there are a couple large forts, many small emplacements, several wrecks around the island and in the harbors, and the Royal Naval Dockyard, which has been turned into a shopping center. There is always one Royal Naval vessel there, though I don't know if it's accessible to the public. If you go to see HMS Vixen (via boat - she's underwater) try to go at low tide, since part of her emerges then. I'd love to get back to Bermuda myself. Lovely place, lots to see, and plenty to do. Joe Poutre -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "FCR" Subject: Re: Sovremmeny and GMM Russian photo-ecth set Hello Bill and list I already built one Sovremmeny class destroyer (DML/Skywave model) with the GMM photo-etch set. You sure use the railings, you can also use some life-rings, ladders and depending of the version of the ship that you built the radars (remember that there were three different configurations of the main mast radars). Unfortunately there no masts for this class. You can see my model in the SMML home page. Compliments. Filipe C. Ramires Lisboa, PORTUGAL -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "chenyangzhang" Subject: French Navy Hi John Try La Royale en 1939 at erso.wanadoo.fr/bertrand.daubigny/MnHmPg.htm. This is an excellent site on the French Navy of the time. Chris Langtree -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: CVAN 65 Enterprise Hi Nuno, Welcome to SMML. I'll provide a bit of information as I served in USS BAINBRIDGE in 1967 and we escorted ENTERPRISE in the Tonkin Gulf. Her air wing did NOT include F-8 Crusaders at that time. It did include F-4 Phantoms, A-4 Skyhawks, A-1 Skyraiders, A-3 Skywarriors, A-6s, RA-5 Vigilantes, and S2F Trackers. I don't know the squadron numbers offhand, but the F-4 squadron was the "Silver Kings", their insignia a silver chess king on the rudder, with a yellow V-shaped flash. And one of the A-3 Skywarriors was all-black with small insignia; this bird operated at night, leaving the ship at dusk and was back aboard before daylight. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys http://www.shipcamouflage.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Bruce Simard" Subject: British X-Craft Minisubs Gentlemen, Just a short note to advise you of a relatively new kit. Several weeks ago I recieved the Pit-Road kit # SP-28, the Royal Navy midget submarine. This kit is 1/72nd scale resin, and retails for approximately $ 54.00 U.S. Since it is now in production on my bench, I thought I would pass on first impressions. In a word, Great !!!!! The casting is in grey resin, and is excellent. Very little clean up is needed. The parts fit, (what few there are), and no warpage. Also included is wire stock to make the anti-cable fouling guides,and of course the various periscopes and snorkel. The molding is extremely crisp, one of the best I've seen in a long while. This beauty just screams out for painting,highlighting, and countershading. A 1/72nd scale diver is also included for those so inclined. Overall this is a sweet little kit, and well worth the money. Mine was purchased though Pacific Front Hobbies, who also informed me this could be the start of a series,depending on sales. If their quality stays the same, it would be great to see the German Seehund, Italian boats, etc. I've also heard there will be a plastic kit coming from Japan on the 2 man midget sub in 1/72nd scale, has anyone seen this, impressions? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: dlfowler@uscg.net Subject: Re: Secratery Class Cutters in the Atlantic Hello, Just wanted to mention that the USCG Secratery Class Cutters (327 foot high endurance cutters) participated in the Battle of the Atlantic and that the USCGC Hamilton was the lead ship of that class. The camouflage system used by some (but certainly not all) of the Secrateries was Ms. 16 which used Thayer blue and white. There is a rather dramatic photo of the USCGC Campbell on patrol in Ms.32. By the end of the war they were all in Ms. 22. At the beginning of the war most had a total of three large guns which were mixed between 3"/50 and 5"/38 open mounts. As far as I know, no two ships were alike. Most had had the aft gun removed so that they could handle a J2F Duck. By the end of the War the armament had changed considerably and at one time the USCGC Taney had four enclosed single 5"/38 mounts (painted in Ms. 21, I think) while the USCGC Duane had all the large guns removed and installed quad 40s in their place. Regards, Duane Fowler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: WVeigele@aol.com Subject: Re: Battle of the Atlantic The accounts of various US ships that entered the Battle of the Atlantic offer insights. However, they overlook the first US Navy vessels specifically designed for and among the first to enter the battle. They were the steel hulled, 173", 450 ton PC Patrol Craft. The US drafted old WWI vessels and private yachts to help fight the U-boats. They were not successful. The PCs replaced them. They were the first new USN ships built to escort convoys and hunt U-boats along the Eastern seaboard while larger ships were being built. They saved convoys and sank U-boats. Later the PCEs, DEs, and DDs entered the fight. An account is given in a Sea Classics article (Veigele, Wm. J., "They Filled the Gap - Saga of PC Boats," Sea Classics, page 46, Vol. 32, No. 1, February 1999.) and in my book PC Patrol Craft of World War II -- A History of the Ships and Their Crews. Details of the book's contents can be seen at: www.astralpublishing.com. Bill Veigele -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Dave Shirlaw Subject: Electronic Greyhounds From: Kenneth Perry >> Does anyone out there know where I can obtain a copy of the out of print book Electronic Greyhounds? << The book is out of print, you may be able to find a copy at: www.abebooks.com or www.bookfinder.com The author, Mike Potter, is finishing off a history of the Leander Class and then will be doing a history of the Arleigh Burke Class as a companion to Electronic Greyhound for USNI Press. Dave Shirlaw Editor, Seawaves Magazine www.seawaves.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Kelvin Mok" Subject: Re: German secret weapons WW2 >> It's ISBN 0-87364-345-3 on page 51 had an article about flying saucers developed by the Germans. << This is off topic but I had always wonders about the popularity of the saucer as the preferred configuration for an advanced (alien?) spacecraft. What are the engineering advantages that would make this a superior solution to interstellar flight, or in the case of the Popular Mechanics article, as a superior bomber?. The configuration looks inherently unstable and over-maneuverable on the horizontal plane. Kelvin Mok -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Mike Hall Subject: De-Gausing Cable on Chidori/Otori type IJN Torpedo Boats Hi all, In the middle of doing a late war Chidori Torpedo Boat, and all the pictures I have shoe early-mid war fit with no de-gausing cable. Kojinsha drawings show a late war fit WITH de-gausing cables, but no photos to back it up. What are you collective thoughts? Mike Hall -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "John Rule" Subject: INS Pola If I remember correctly, Pola was never camouflaged. She was painted light grey with wood decks and in typical Italian style was painted with diagonal red and white stripes on the forward part of the main deck, for air recognition purposes. Her sister Zara was similarly painted, with only her sisters Gorizia and Fiume receiving camouflage. Gorizia's pattern is known but only one very obscure photo exists of one side of Fiume's experimental camouflage. I suggest, Cesare, that you try to obtain the out of print books in the Orizzonte Mare series which were published in Italy and helpfully for you are in Italian. Best of luck. John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: SAMI ARIM Subject: HMS Belfast's Walrus Hello, Does anybody have any info regarding the colors of the Walrus aircraft onboard the cruiser Belfast during the timeframe of late 1942 and 1943. Belfast was wearing a four color tone camo scheme at the time and I know that the Walrus had some type of two (?) color camo. I need to find the scheme for the aircraft too. If anybody can lead me to some direction I would appreciate.Thanks in advance. Regards Sami Arim -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Mike C" Subject: Hoga Hi SMMLies! Does anyone know if the tug Hoga (YT-146) had any sisters? Specifics would be appreciated. Also, I should know better, but...Do yard craft in general get the "USS" designation added if they're named, or are they under different jurisdiction? Thanks, Mike Czibovic -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "David Mullins" Subject: U.S.S. Indiana BB-1 Hi, All! I need to locate plans for U.S.S. Indiana BB-1 for after her modernization with a cage mast. Someone recently posted a source for plans of this class of early BBs, but I misplaced the website address. Plans in 1/192 scale would be preferred, but anything would be a big help. Thanks!!! David Mullins Amarillo, TX USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: Jtennier@aol.com Subject: Re: Electronic Greyhounds Ken: I know a few months ago the maritime museum in San Diego had a few copies of the book. Can't remember the price, but perhaps one of the local list members may be able to cruise by and check it out for you. I also think they may have an e-mail contact. It's and excellent book, perhaps one of the best books written about ship class development. Cheers John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: "Robert J. Bartolacci" Subject: Book Of Condolences - U.S.S. Cole Web Site Scarcely a month after the loss of the submarine Kursk, we now face the loss of an unknown as yet number of our own countrymen due to the terrorist attack on the U.S.S. Cole, DDG-67. This is the link to the site set up for condolences and messages to the families and ultimately the crew of the Cole when communications are restored. All sailors are brothers, and all face the same risks. Please take a minute, visit the site, and remember their sacrifices with a message to let them know we care and won't forget them... http://www.hazegray.org/features/cole/ Bob Bartolacci -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Re: ORP Dragon Hi Lars and SMML, There was an article in the Winter 1997-98 issue of "Warships" (a journal published by the World Ship Society) called "The Polish Cruisers Dragon and Conrad" by Marek Twardowski. The article contains a line drawing and a wartime photograph of each ship, and states that the Dragon's armament was five 6-in guns, three quad 40mm guns, eight single 20mm guns, and torpedo tubes. If you are not able to get a copy of the article, I can copy and send it to you (or you could get a copy of the actual issue from the WSS). I understood from an article in Fine Scale Modeler (the last new kit report a/k/a "the fantasy list") that Mirage was going to make 1/400 kits of the Conrad and the Dragon by December of this year. Has anyone heard anything about this? Regards, Art Nicholson PS: The armament I listed above for the Dragon was for January 1943; the armament for May 1944 was five 6-in guns, a twin 4-in mount, eight 40mm guns and twelve 20mm guns. Hope this helps.... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: Watrtrck@aol.com Subject: Re: Russian ship models I would be very interested in hearing more about this Polar Bear company doing the 1/400 sub kits. Anyone got a lead on them? Thanks Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: "Robert Fish" Subject: Haze Gray & Underway USS Cole (DDG 67) Attention On Deck,----- May we please take moment to pay our Condolences to the Crew Members of USS Cole at this time. Thank you very much. http://www.hazegray.org/features/cole/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: john.baumann@talk21.com Subject: Re: Screws From: "Clem Jensen" >> There is a place called " The Prop Shop " in England that has almost everything. I understand that they now have a US rep. That's all I know. Do a search or ask around. << Prop Shop Address: The Stable Yard, Alscot Park Preston On Stour Stratford-Upon-Avon Warwickshire CV37 8BL Business Type: MODEL MFRS-TOYS & HOBBIES Tel: 01789 450905 Info from Yellow Pages Establish contact first as a lot of model businesses in the UK have ceased trading). Good Luck, John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: "Fred Liedel" Subject: KONIG CLASS DAMAGE Was hoping someone may have references to battle damage caused to any of the Konig class sustained at Jutland. Was not so much after the amount of hits scored on any of them, but where the actual hits occured and the damage caused. Thanks Fred Liedel -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Kurt Van Dahm Subject: Club listing Here is an entry for the 3 Chicago area scale clubs. Great idea to do this whoever came up with it! Kurt Van Dahm Dear Fellow Ship Modelers: Did you know that there are three (3) Chicago area scale ship model clubs and that we are all looking for new members? The clubs are the Nautical Research and Model Ship Society of Chicago, The North Shore Deadeyes and the Midwest Model Shipwrights. We are three diverse clubs; both in interests and in our meeting place locations, though we share some members between all three clubs. We meet on different nights of the week and during different weeks of the month so that one clubs activities do not interfere with those of the others. All skill levels are welcome. We also have an annual joint meeting of the three clubs with well-known featured speakers. The following is a short bit of information about each of the clubs. Please feel free to contact any or all of the contact people listed for each club. The Nautical Research and Model Ship Society of Chicago club was formed in 1928 and has met monthly for most of these years. Our members are interested in static scale models of period sailing ships, steel Navy, and steam-powered ships, tugs and inland water boats. The varied interests of our members make for some very interesting discussions and presentations at our meetings. We publish a quarterly 12 to 16 page newsletters called The Fife Rail. We welcome anyone with an interest in scale models of ships and boats. We meet on the second Saturday night each month at 7:30 PM in the Boardroom at the Bridgeport YMCA in La Grange at the NE corner of La Grange Rd. and Ogden Avenue. Please call President Kurt Van Dahm at (630) 968-3189 or kurtvd19@voyager.net for further information. The Midwest Model Shipwrights meet on the third Wednesday evening each month at 7:30 PM at the Ship Chandler store at 518 E. Northwest Highway in Mt. Prospect. We publish a monthly multi-page newsletter named the Forecastle Report. We welcome anyone having an interest in scale models of ships and boats. Please call Bob Filipowski at (847) 394-0757 or e-mail at Bfilipowski@Valspar.com for further details. The North Shore Deadeyes meet on the first Tuesday evening each month at 7:30 PM at the Lutheran Church of the Accession at the SW corner of Willow Road and Sunset Ridge Road in Northfield, 2 ½ miles east of I-294. We publish a monthly multi-page newsletter and welcome all modelers with interest in scale ships and boats. Please contact Richard K. Williams, M.D. at (847) 559-8535 or e-mail at shipdoc@mcs.net for additional information. We hope that after reading a little bit about the three clubs you might want to attend a few meetings of one or more of the clubs. Each of the clubs is a bit different in how we conduct meetings, etc. but we all have several common traits that we feel will appeal to prospective members. The expertise of our members ranges from the rank beginner to the professional modeler. Each club's members have widely varied interests in ships and boats. Each club is also made up of friendly modelers who will welcome you. Each club's members are very willing to share their knowledge with you and others and to learn from you also. We hope to see you at future meeting. Please feel free to contact any or all of the contact people listed for further information. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Preston L Hassler Subject: Re: James River Tour Count me in!! Skip Hassler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: USS Sims I am working on my next series of books, one of which is a book on the Sims class destroyers. I have been able to find over 150 photos of ships of that class. I did not see any white counter shading under the overhangs when these ships were painted in their 1942 Ms. 12-mod. This book will another photo album on the entire class, and will contain 64 pages of great photos of all the ships, including some really good on board shots I recently found. One questions answer that has always hounded me was if the Sims herself had a Ms. 12-mod camo? You will find the answer in my book when I publish it, hopefully about March, next year. Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: dhjonespsm@juno.com Subject: Re: PSM update Hello, I am late as usual - too much mandatory overtime at my "real" job with only two free weekends in the last four months. All writing and layouts are compelted, just finishing the cover art. PSM 23 is at the printer on Monday. Apologies to all for the delays. Dan Jones -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://www.smml.org.uk Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume