Subject: SMML VOL 1076 Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 00:09:54 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Why Pearl Harbor won't work 2: Re: Pearl Harbor Film 3: Re: White Carrier Equipment 4: Campbeltown 5: Re: Daddy during the War 6: Vegemite Sandwich? 7: PT Boat Books 8: Re: Spray Booths 9: Re: What is an Acoustic Hammer? 10: Zhong Shan 11: Re: Marmite 12: Marmite 13: Re: HMS CAMPBELTOWN 14: Re: 1/8" - !/96 Scale parts 15: Marmite/Vegemite 16: Re: Warship Pictorials #9 and #10 17: Liberty Ship Model 18: Re: spray booth 19: HMS Campbeltown 20: Re: French Destroyers 21: Pearl Harbor explosives on Spruance class 22: Re: Vegemite 23: Re: Colours and Equipment for RMS Queen Elizabeth during WW2 24: Allied Coastal Forces of World War II, Volume I & II (source?) 25: Surprising Hobby Shop 26: Spray Booths 27: Re: Pearl Harbor Movie 28: Massachusetts Colors 29: Re: Pearl Harbor Movie 30: Airfix Schnellboot 31: Re: Acoustic Hammer 32: HMAS Vampire 33: R Class Destroyers 34: Collins class Submarines article SMH 35: Korean Turtle Ships.. HELP? 36: Re: Principe de Asturias (R11) 37: Re: U869 etc -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation 1: Re: SMML Wash DC -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: 1/96 scale parts -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: LYRAD801@cs.com Subject: Why Pearl Harbor won't work Hello, As I said before, Pearl Harbor will probably be an incredibly mediocre. Just look at the producer. Sure he can spin a camera around, make people have epileptic spasms, blow crap up, and finish the day with a cheesy theme song, but he's just not the sort of guy to make a movie like this. The attack on Pearl Harbor is a very sensitive topic. Why throw in cheap sentimentality? A love story? This isn't some Japanese guy giving an American the "finger". No, this is the attack on Pearl Harbor! War isn't supposed to be entertaining. You shouldn't the just sit there like "Ohhh... look at the ship blow up!" like it was some kind of 4th of July fireworks show! For a topic like this, you need to be serious and accurate. Oh, And did I mention earlier that the film's producer also did "Flashdance."? Who in the world decides the Hollywood chain of command, anyway? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: Pearl Harbor Film >> -- The Japanese fighter strafing civilian autos that came out of its dive at about 3 (that's "three") feet off the road. << Glad you brought that up- first, for those who didn't see the trailers. Alan exaggerates - it was closer to 2 feet altitude. Seriously, both I and my teenage sons immediately said that the Japanese fighters were depicted way too low- well under 100 feet in altitude, probably at 40-50 feet. This as they flew over the hilly terrain- one twitch at that altitude and you're dead. Since they are still completing post-production, I suppose there is a (very small) chance that Hollywood will correct the Spruance destroyers with computer graphics. Of course, in "Men of Honor", we had the Soviets operating what could only be interpreted as a Sturgeon class submarine hull with bow planes. Unfortunately, at the time when the H-bombs were lost, the November class was the only operational Soviet nuclear sub, with the Victors about to come online. Ahh, Hollywood! With so many people out here who would and could offer free, accurate advice, they would rather pay someone hundreds of thousands of dollars to do it wrong ("they'll never know..." But we do!!!). As for the explosions on the Spruance class destroyers Mike mentioned, this is almost certainly CGI (computer generated images). Either that or large, impressive and harmless types of explosives used in many movies for many years. Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: MDDoremus@aol.com Subject: Re: White Carrier Equipment Back in the late '70's the USAF did away with "yellow" gear. Someone had found that the yellow showed up very clearly in infrared recon photos. So all of the ground equipment, containers and various other bits we designed had to be painted Olive Drab (gloss?). It's kinda curious that the USN is just now switching and to white which may be as visible in the IR spectrum as yellow. Mark Doremus Eden Prairie, MN -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: Campbeltown Martin Foley asked: >> I have a Revell Cambeltown, can anybody tell me anything about this model, and can I do anything with it as it is a little on the crude side. << Step 1 - sand off the wooden planks that cover the main deck! These ships had steel decks. Step 2 - get the phenomenal Gold Medal Models photoetched brass set to turn this ancient kit into a beauty. I've got two of these in the works. One will end up as USS John D. Ford and another as HMCS St. Croix. Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: SantMin@aol.com Subject: Re: Daddy during the War An interesting sidelight to the email from Belgium. After D-Day my Dad's ship spent time in Antwerp unloading (a Liberty ship, and as I remember, more than one trip). He told us that every night he would put on an overcoat, fill all the pockets with canned food, and visit a family he somehow got to know. They never forgot him and stayed in contact for years after the war. Cheers, Bob Santos -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: Vegemite Sandwich? Mark said - >> My friends thought I was nuts to eat such a substance, but I did enjoy it, spread on buttered toast. Now if there was a source here in Wisconsin for Vegemite and Steak and Kidney pies...............Makes my mouth water just thinking about it. << Try the Australian Catalogue Company: www.eOZe.net based out of Marietta, Georgia. They list vegemite, marmite (found in many US supermarkets in the "gourmet" section), promite and a host of other 'delicacies'. MWL -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: PT Boat Books Dave cited - >> Victor Chun's book on U.S. PT boats is good too, since it has nice original Elco factory drawings and good close up photos. Also the USN museum at Fall River MA had at one time a very nice inexpensive softcover with several PT plans in it called "The Mosquito Fleet", I think. << "The United States Mosquito Fleet" by Bob Ferrell (Published 1977 by the PT Boat Museum). Cost a whopping $3.50 back then. You can try writing them at: PT Boat Museum and Library, Post Office Box 109, Memphis, TN 38101. See also www.ptboats.org --- they list this title for $13.50 but not sure of availability. There is also a lot of PT boat info at "Knights of the Sea" --- http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/4017/ Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "lcp9" Subject: Re: Spray Booths Another low tech solution I've had much success with is a modified cardboard box. Choose one large enough for the project in question. Lay it on it's side and cut out a part of the top sized so that you can cover the hole with wax paper or saran wrap. This lets extra light in so you can see what you're doing. cut out the back and secure a furnace filter in the hole. This catches and holds the overspray so it doesn't bounce back into your respiratory track. Mount a fan in a window (blowing out of course) & place this contraption in front of the fan. Mount the stuff to be sprayed on a piece of cardboard so you can turn it as required to spray all sides. There are many dire warnings against using unshielded electric motors this way, the potential exists for sparks to ignite flammable vapors. But we're all supposed to be using acrylic paints these days anyway. Success can be measured by what you smell, I don't get paint fumes or overspray in the house using this method. David -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: AandMBlevins@gateway.net Subject: Re: What is an Acoustic Hammer? I believe it was an electronic device designed to detonate mines by sending a pulse through the water. Further the deponent knoweth not. Al Blevins -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Mike Leonard" Subject: Zhong Shan Mike Upton asked - >> I am looking for some information on a ship portrayed in a Trumpeter kit, ITEM#03503. "Zhong Shan Gunship". This kit looks like an escort or gunboat type vessel and inspite of cheesy boxart it looks like a great little kit. Does anyone out there know anything about the Zhong Shan, or have a lead where I might try and look for information? I was specificly wondering if this gunboat(?) was British built or built somewhere else than China and if so what country and did the country of origin use this class of vessel? << Haven't seen the Trumpeter version of this ship yet. I do have the Zhengdefu kit, which is rather toylike in many ways, yet might have some potential if some decent reference material surfaces. Even the doors are cast separately (approx. 1/150 scale?)! Anyway, Zhengdefu has this to say: Originally named YONGFENG. Built in Japan in 1910 by Mitsubishi. Carried eight guns of various calibers. Length: 62.1m Beam: 8.9m Speed: 13.5kts Crew of up to 140 men. Renamed ZHONG SHAN in 1925. Sunk in action with Japanese forces on the Changjiang River, March 1938. Mike Alexandria, VA USA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: Marmite I believe that this stuff is not from any meat source, but a yeast extract. I was told that many years of disinformation have lead to this falsehood. After tasting it, I would believe just about any story I heard on the subject. Actually all things considered, I do think that Marmite would make a good marinade for steaks. The taste is like highly concentrated A-1 sauce. The most humorous thing about Marmite, is the name of the company that makes it. "Sanitarium". I believe that is where you will need to go if you consume to much of this stuff! "Never Again" Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "O'Connor" Subject: Marmite SMMLies, Is it true that the New Zealanders are actively trying to subvert the resin casting industry by using marmite, poured into the ship molds, and allowed to cure for a day or so in the sun?? I've heard that marmite makes a great weapon- a replacement for chem/biological warfare as a foodstuff, and hardened, makes a great replacement for those hard to come by rocks. Has anyone tried to test the radar reflective qualities of the stuff? Maybe a new stealth material.... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "John Snyder" Subject: Re: HMS CAMPBELTOWN While a bit heavy by current standards, it's still not a bad kit. The one thing that you will certainly want to do something about is the planked main deck: these ships had steel decks. Also, Gold Medal Models makes a lovely photo-etch detail set for the kit. John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises The Paint Guys http://www.shipcamouflage.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Ron Hillsden" Subject: Re: 1/8" - !/96 Scale parts Start at http://members.aol.com/ssyweb/SSYMain.htm since it appears you are in the USA.I believe they carry more lines than they have on their web page. Try to pick up a copy of the two widely circulated British model ship magazines - they are full of ads for fittings! Ron Hillsden Victoria BC Canada Club: http://members.home.net/vmss/ Flags: http://members.home.net/ron-hillsden/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Norman C. Samish" Subject: Marmite/Vegemite I think there are a lot of vegemite (http://www.ozchannel.com/vegemite/vegemite.html) and marmite lovers (http://www.nz.com/NZ/Culture/Food/Marmite.html) around. I learned to like marmite on bread and butter when I was in England in the 1950's. A little goes a long way. These substances are full of salt and Vitamin B and are reputed by sailors and students to be great hangover remedies. They are also useful as shoe paste and fabric dye. You can buy some at: http://kiwishop.com/cgi-local/shop.pl/page=KiwiClassics.html/buy=1/SID=9789188497/item=13. Either costs US$2.74 for 500g, plus US$9.20 air mail postage, 4-10 days shipping time. Enjoy, Norm Samish -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: DRPREUL@aol.com Subject: Re: Warship Pictorials #9 and #10 Hello All in SMML Land, Steves work on these two books is outstanding again. Photo reproduction is as good if not better than some of the original photos. I do a lot of research at the Nat. Archives and at Naval Histoical Soc. I pay $1.00 apiece for a photostat copy and anywhere from $4 to $20 apiece for photos. $12.00 is a steal for the price of one of these books. A must for every modeler and history buff. Hope Santa brings you all the models on your Christmas list Happy Modeling Don Preul........J&D Productions LLC -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: tom dean Subject: Liberty Ship Model Hi Gang: Making this enquiry on behalf of an old "Boot Neck". He has a small but growing collection of warship minatures. He recently went for a ride on the Liberty ship when it visited Toronto in the summer. He brought some lovely pictures into the navy club a few weeks back for all to enjoy. What he asked me to do is to find a minature or very simple kit of a Liberty. He was hoping to find one around 8" to perhaps 10" that he could work with. This would take him out of the scales he use to. I can't find anything that fills the bill. He lives in an apartment and has no real modeling experience so couldn't handle a larger kit. If anybody knows of something that would be appropriate please let me know. Tom Dean Hamilton, Ontario Canada -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Richard Baker" Subject: Re: spray booth Decembers issue of finescale modeller has a section on how to build your own, a lot cheaper than a pre made one. www.resolution.ic24.net -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: Joel Labow Subject: HMS Campbeltown The Revell 'Campbeltown' is a standard 1930s USN 4-piper that was merely repackaged as Campbeltown but which doesn't show any of the changes that the RN made to her, either upon her initial 1941 refit or prior to the St. Nazaire raid. Doing the kit as USS Buchanan (DD-131) prior to transfer or changing her to her initial RN 1941 cofiguration wouldn't be too big a job (primarily shortening her #4 funnel) but the work involved in making her into the St. Nazaire configuration would be IMHO herculean! I believe that Iron Shipwright makes a 4-piper in St. Nazaire configuration in 1/350 scale. There is an AOTS by Al Ross on her in all her configurations, but unfortunately out of print. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Clifford Franklin Subject: Re: French Destroyers Further to my previous post on French flotilla allocations, here is the information I have on the divisional allocation of torpilleurs: 1st Flotilla: Le Palme, Le Mars (T12), Bordelais 2nd Flotilla: Fougueux (T21), Frondeur (T22), L'Adroit (T23) 3rd Flotilla: Le Fortune (T31), Forbin (T32), Basque (T33), Brestois, Simoun (T33, later T61) 4th Flotilla: Bourrasque (T41), 5th Flotilla: Boulonnais (T52), Brestois (later 3rd Flotilla), Foudroyant 6th Flotilla: Simoun (T61), Sirocco, (T62), L'Alcyon (T63), Mistral (T63), Tempete 7th Flotilla: Tramontane (T71), Typhon (T72), Tornade (T73) 10th Flotilla: Epee (T101), Le Hardi (T102), Casque (T103), Fleuret (T103), Lansquenot (T104), Mameluck (T105) unknown: Cyclone, Ouragon, Trombe, La Railleuse Each flotilla had unique funnel band or bands allocated by the French Admiralty. I have no information on those worn by the torpilleurs, but the allocations for the contre-torpilleurs are as follows: 1 DCT 1 white band on 2nd funnel 7 DCT 2 white bands on 2nd funnel 2 DCT 1 black band on 2nd funnel 8 DCT 2 black bands on 2nd funnel 3 DCT 1 yellow band on 2nd funnel 9 DCT 2 yellow bands on 2nd funnel 4 DCT 1 green band on 2nd funnel 10 DCT 2 green bands on 2nd funnel 5 DCT 1 red band on 2nd funnel 11 DCT 2 red bands on 2nd funnel 6 DCT 1 blue band on 2nd funnel 12 DCT 2 blue bands on 2nd funnel For the torpilleurs, I note that the French publisher Marines Edition will shortly be putting out a monograph on the Bourrasque class, and that may well have the information desired. This system of funnel bands and pennant numbers had been introduced in March, 1939. The numbers were initially white blocked with black, but this was changed in early 1940 to red blocked with black. The system remained in use until November 1942, when events at Toulon put an end to it. The numbers were later resurrected in late 1944, but in a small, American style, and were red, changing to white in May 1945. cheers Cliff Franklin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: "Donald Hinton" Subject: Pearl Harbor explosives on Spruance class >> I know that the USS MERRILL and two other decommissioned Spru->cans were moored together in Pearl recently but PLEASE tell me they didn't actually set real explosives on these ships!! << Yes, they did set explosives off on the mothballed ships in Pearl Harbor. I was on Ford Island when they set the main, huge explosion off in the mothballed fleet. I was later an extra on one of the ships that was "blown up." The actual damage was superficial--some minor burn marks--far less significant than the major corrosion the ships are suffering from. The ships are in really sad shape from being mothballed. Remember, the film was fully supported by the US Navy and the other military services on Oahu. Don Hinton -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: isublett@home.com Subject: Re: Vegemite For those of you in the USofA who can't live without it, the Whole Foods chain of health and organic food stores sells Vegemite - which I think would make an excellent bottom paint. No barnicle could stick to it long. Now I must put in "grin" before someone takes offense! Pirie Sublett -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: Ken Hoolihan Subject: Re: Colours and Equipment for RMS Queen Elizabeth during WW2 Hi Michiel, I am finishing a model of the QE in early 1941 at the moment. It is based on the Airfix 1/600 kit plus the WEM brass and many scratchbuilt details. The only good reference I can suggest for you is the book "Queen Elizabeth At War". I don't have it in front of me (I am in the office, the book is at home) and I can't remember the author or publisher. I will contact you offline with that information. The book has many good photos plus sketches made during the war of some details such as paravanes, AA towers etc. The QE underwent progressive upgrades to it's AA armament during the war and unfortunately the book does not provide plans of any of the layouts. You will just have to work it out for yourself from studying the photos. However, "Anatomy of the ship Queen Mary" has an excellent drawing of a wartime configuration of the QM. This is a useful guide to the QE to some degree and in concert with the photos from the QE at War book should provide what you need to make a good model. There were three colour schemes; 1940 - overall grey, natural wood decks; 1941 - black hull, grey superstructure (507B I believe) and natural wood decks (interpreted from photos); late 1941 - 1945 overall grey (507B or a lighter shade), decks ?? I chose the 1941 scheme because it is more colourful and there is less AA, radars etc to add. Hope this helps. Ken Hoolihan Wellington New Zealand (home of Marmite) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Ned Barnett Subject: Allied Coastal Forces of World War II, Volume I & II (source?) >> Is that "Allied Coastal Forces of World War II, Volume I & II" from the Naval Institute press? << >> Volume 2, which covers Vospers and ELCOs. Volume 1 covers the Fairmiles, HDML, and the WWII 110' SC (SC 497 series). << Ned replies in frustration ... Al (and all) - I've tried abe.com; I've tried bookfinder.com; I've even tried Amazon and BN.com - no luck on these books. ANYBODY have (especially) Volume 2 for sale? Anybody know where I can get (especially) Volume 2? Ned -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: Ned Barnett Subject: Surprising Hobby Shop I just found one of the most remarkable hobby shops - and it's located in the basement of an ACE Hardware store in Berkeley, CA. It's got the latest releases, but also kits from those days before dirt when Airfix and FROG were exotic rarities, and Artiplast and Supermodel were the leading manufacturers from Italy. Lots of rarities - sitting on the shelf (making me wonder where they got them) - plus lots of new stuff. Some interesting ships (not enough, but some Japanese oldies from before they standardized in scales). Even that LVT that I've been looking high and low for (at least one of them - the LVT-5A). It's on University, right before University dead-ends in the university. If you're in the bay area, check it out (assuming you can find a parking space in Berkeley). Ned -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: Ned Barnett Subject: Spray Booths Rusty (and all) - I built my own spray booth back in the late 70s, pretty much along the lines of what Rusty describes here - a bit more "finished" because I had carpentry help, but basically the same thing. I built it so I wouldn't come down with "Olive Drab Lung" - at the time, OD was my primary paint color (this was my pre-ship modeling period). Spray booths are a good idea, even if you paint (as I now do) in the garage ... however ... WARNING Be sure the exhaust fan motor is SPARK-LESS ... some paint fumes are explosively flammable, and lots of electric motors spark. You do the math. Rusty - If you haven't checked, please do so, man ... hate to lose you like that (boom) ... You can get sparkless exhaust fan motors from the places that sell electrical appliances (light fixtures, etc.) - they cost more than garage sale prices, but not a lot more. The difference, in my opinion, is worth it to have a booth - cuts down on Ocean-Gray Lung - but not blowing up is also something worth considering. All the best Ned -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 27) From: LtBarry22@aol.com Subject: Re: Pearl Harbor Movie Hey all! Hopefully I did this the right way, and you get to see it... I completely disagree with the gentleman who was "a bit angry"... about the possible use of real Spruance-class ships in the upcoming movie "Pearl Harbor". I also saw the trailer for this incredible-looking movie this last weekend during a showing of "Unbreakable". If the boats were going to be scrapped, why not blow them up!!!??? Why would it be better for some shipyard to cut and rip apart a ship, instead of showing it going out in a blaze of glory??? I completely understand if someone is worried about the "glorification" of war and death. But, if your worried about that, then we should never make war movies to begin with! The tanks they used in Saving Private Ryan were actual T-34s, with sheetmetal used to make them look more like Tiger tanks... The reason they didn't use actual Tiger tanks, isn't because they didn't want to, but because there are not that many of them left! Now, if these Spruance-class ships were going to be put into a museum, I would completely agree that the use of them in a movie, just to blow them up would be appauling. But, this does not seem the case! These ships were "supposedly" going to be scrapped, and so I think it's better that they are shown in their glory, doing what they were built to do. I mean no disrespect to anyone, my grandparents fought in the European Theater and at Pearl Harbor and throughout the Pacific. I can not think of any better way of honouring their's and their fellow servicemen than by a film that tells it like it was. Not just some clean-cut John Wayne movie (I love John Wayne movies though)... PEACE THROUGH STRENGTH Barry Morrison -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 28) From: RLSPENCE40315574@aol.com Subject: Massachusetts Colors Hi All; Doing research on my BWN Mass. Want to do her in measure 12-graded.Ships data from Fall River says ocean gray on hull and superstructure,navy blue overpainted on hull on july,1942. BWN says blue? at the waterline,with ocean gray above the blue. All vertical structures painted haze grey. Official navy sites are different from both. Can anyone help? thanks, Ray Spencer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 29) From: Marc Flake Subject: Re: Pearl Harbor Movie Mike: This movie was discussed in April. Here are excerpts from some of my updates: "To represent Battleship Row, the Navy has moored three or four mothballed destroyers, the Whipple and Holt have been identified as two of them, near the battleship Missouri. Filming has started with Zeros, Vals and Kates buzzing the retired warships. They haven't even bothered to remove the hull numbers." "This will be by the same guys who made Armageddon, who are promising more of a "love interest" than was seen in "Tora, Tora, Tora!" If they're idea of romance is exemplified by Armageddon, I may loose my lunch." "I've also read some quotes where Brukheimer (or whatever his name is) says the sinking of the Oklahoma will have the battleship 'jumping and twisting' out of the water when it is hit. (Shades of Shamu)" BTW the music they are playing is from "The Thin Red Line" The same composer, Hans Zimmer, is scoring "Pearl Harbor." There is a website that has been following the production, but it's not very helpful now that filming has ceased. Go to: http://cinemenium.com/pearlharbor/ Look at it this way. Michael Bay is out to tell a love story that includes two of three historic WW2 events that will interest us ship aficianadoes (probably mispelled, but I'm not looking it up). The three events are the Battle of Britain, Pearl Harbor and the Doolittle Raid. While filming scenes in Hawaii, Bay was heard to shout "I don't care about history, this time we kick a$$!" I think you can count on our heroes shooting down more aircraft each than were shot down during the actual attack. The penultimate scenes were filmed on the Constelaltion, which actaully launched a B-25 or two from its deck. The Lexington down in Corpus Christi was used for scenes of a Japanese carrier--launching a fake Zero or two (while moored!) There have been some model shots of tripod and cage mast ships. I believe it was Ken Goldman, who advised the list to adopt a wait and see attitude. I agree and would add that you shouldn't be expecting a documentary. This is at its very heart a love story picture that uses some of our recent national mythology as a canvas. I'll definitely be reading the reviews before shelling out any money for this one. Marc -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 30) From: Douglas Subject: Airfix Schnellboot I'm wondering if any of those folks who've bad-mouthed the Airfix E-boat could spare one of the torpedoes if they're not gonna build the kit.....I lost one for my boat, and I'd be happy to re-imburse for postage. Thanks, Doug Bauer Poway, CA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 31) From: "denis keegan" Subject: Re: Acoustic Hammer This was a Bow-mounted A frame, hinged in the vertical plane. At the outboard (Apex of the A frame) end of the bracket was what can best be described as a Bucket. The weight (Hammer) was dropped into the bucket, which had been lowered into the water just ahead of the bow wave, ensuring that the crash of the hammer was transmitted through the water ahead of and all around of course, the ship. This very loud sound would then explode any Accoustic Mines far enough away from the ship not to cause any damage to the Minesweeper. There are excellent drawings of this device in John Lambert's Plan Pack of the Roundtable Minesweeper. Crude device but apparently very effective. Denis K -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 32) From: "Peter Chant" Subject: HMAS Vampire Some help from the Australian fraternity please. I am about to make the OzMods Vampire and in SMML 1056 Shane confirmed that Humbrol 31 was accurate enough for the decks. But as for the hull? I have some good pictures I took of her this summer in Sydney so my questions are: 1. Is the green/grey she is wearing now in the Australian National Maritime Museum the "real" present day RAN shade? 2. Has the RAN been using this colour all the time since Vampire's 1972 rebuild? Thanks Peter Chant Plymouth UK Hi Peter, Ahh you misread my post mate ;-). Humbrol 31 is the colour for the hull & superstructure (well, at least it's the colour I'll be using ;-) ). As for the present day colour of the Vampire, it's the same colour she had when she decommisioned (it was a very sad day :-( & one I was honoured to witness) & the RAN was at least using this colour between the period of 1980-1986 when I was working at Garden Island, so I "assume" this to be the case for the 1970's as well. AFAIK, the RAN is still using the same colour. But as I haven't had a chance in the past few years to get up close & personal with any RAN ship, only looking at them from a distance & in magazines I can't confirm that. There was an article in the IPMS(UK) magazine that stated that RAN ships used USN colours during the Gulf War, but I have yet to confirm if this was the case. help this helps Shane - who must really get down to Sydneu & take some pictures of the Vampire -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 33) From: "leigh crutchley" Subject: R Class Destroyers My Father served on the HMS Rapid during WWII. Does anyone know of any kits or conversions for the R Class of destroyer? Thanks Leigh Hi Leigh, AFAIK, there are no kits of the R class DD. In 1/700 your best bet is to pick up the Tamiya (Ex Skywave) HMS Onslow & perform surgery on it to get an R class DD. I also recommend White Ensign's O/P class DD PE fret & their range of RN accessories (I have them for my future Q class conversion) You also need to get the Alan Raven Ensign on the O-Z Class DDs, which is excellent, albeit hard to find. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 34) From: "Simon Wolff" Subject: Collins class Submarines article SMH Hi you all.. Having bought the Saturday edition of the local Australian newspaper only on Sunday, the Sydney Morning Herald, then choosing to glance through it this Monday (ostensibly to look for work) did I see a rather long article on RAN's Collins Class submarines. Which have been the victim of much vitriolic criticisms over the last few years. In the article on these submarines, by a David Lague, some balance is redressed (well maybe). If you still have the issue dated Saturday 25/26 go to '2 News Review' and have a good read. The article is also an inditement of the political bosses involved...(their usual shenanigans) but why is that of any surprise. The article makes for quite interesting reading... what caught my eye first off was: "It was these dummy Mark 48 torpedos that (HMAS) Waller fired at the United States Navy Los Angeles-Class nuclear submarines during highly classified war games in the Pacific off Hawaii earlier this year. The official reports on those exercises are top secret but enough people in the submarine world are now talking about them for some of the detail to have leaked out. What has emerged is the Waller proved to be a silent and deadly submarine stalker, a crucial capability for a conventional submarine. "The first the US subs new about Waller was when they heard her torpedos running" a navy submarine expert told the Herald." PLEASE - hope this does not lead to a mass debate on whose submarine is better......... ha ha ha ha ha ha ha and ha ha ha As to how accurate, taking account the media's dubious reliability for accuracy, the whole article is - would be interesting..... bottom line its good to read something positive about these subs, with all the rumours and criticisms what was moral like for the crews one wonders?????? Go the silent service!!!! Simon -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 35) From: "Simon Wolff" Subject: Korean Turtle Ships.. HELP? Hi you all.. Does anyone out there, know of any books/references/articles in any publication on 'Korean Turtle Ships' from 15th Century naval warfare?????? Any information/drawings/dimensions would be very welcome..... Simon -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 36) From: Cataldo Torelli Subject: Re: Principe de Asturias (R11) Hi Bob, I'm also considering to scratchbuild her, so I'm collecting all kind of information, plans and photos. I'm still looking for info on the 1990's refit to accurate her the most I can. I'm even considering to try to make a resin kit (Yes I know, I must be crazy, but I'M STILL THINKING ABOUT IT). Please, ask me about all that spanish stuff you need to deal with. Also, we can share our data. I will be glad to do it. Have you tried these links?: http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/asturias/index.html Interesting data and photos in English. http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/3223/index.htm Unofficial site in Spanish. Click on "Lista oficial de buques" (Official ship list). http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/2776/ Unofficial site in English/Spanish. http://www.enbazan.es/ They built her. I hope you find them useful. Best regards, Cataldo Torelli. Madrid, Spain. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 37) From: john.baumann@talk21.com Subject: Re: U869 etc >> During WW2 German submarines definitely carried cargoes of mercury across the Indian Ocean to Penang to help Japan's war industries etc…… << Response: If SMMLies are interested, I penned up the results of some research that Fred Charlton & I dug up some years back. Primarily, we discussed whether the Germans shipped or flew) Panzer Tank & Jet parts out to Japan by Blockade Runners or Submarines. Would anyone be interested in seeing this (Copyright) article? John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: DRPREUL@aol.com Subject: Re: SMML Wash DC Hello All in SMML Land, I will be in Hawaii from Nov 30 to Dec. 9th installing 300 - 400 crew members on the Akagi model at the Arizona Memorial. The model will be dedicated on Dec 5th. eventhough it has been there for 3 1/2 years. I will be back in town in time to be able to go to the SMML conv. on the 10th. Hope to see alot of you there. Happy Modeling Don Preul........J&D Productions LLC -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: DRPREUL@aol.com Subject: 1/96 scale parts Hello All in SMML Land, J&D Productions is coming out with a full line of parts in 1/96 scale. A full list of what will be available will be posted shortly after the 1st of the year on our website, www.jdproduct.com ie. 20mm, 40mm twin and quad, 5"/25s open, 5"/38s open,etc. plus a complete line of deck fittings, ie. W/T doors, portholes, bitts, chocks, winches, etc. We will also be producing 1/192 and 1/96 scale hulls, both in RC and static display. Look for our posting after the 1st of the year. We will be updating our site on a weekly basis. No catalogs will be available at that time, maybe in the future as our product line increases. We will also be handling all of TOM FREEMANS naval prints and some of his originals. Hope Santa brings you all the models on your Christmas list Happy Modeling Don Preul........J&D Productions LLC -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://www.smml.org.uk Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume