Subject: SMML VOL 1149 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 22:39:53 -0800 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Capricieux 2: Re: Merchant ship info 3: Blue Ribbon Models? 4: Re: Thinner 5: Surcouf vs. M1 6: Re: Landing craft 7: Allied Landing Craft by A D Baker II 8: U.S.S. Cabot & U.S.S. Oriskany 9: HMS Rodney 1928 10: Re: LACQUER THINNER 11: Submarine Force Library & Museum 12: Re: Cabot 13: Like them big? Here's your chance to get one 14: Polish Navy 1939 15: Re: USS Cabot 16: Re: Soviet vessel questions 17: IJN Hiryu question 18: Re: USS Cabot web links 19: 1955 Ark Royal colours 20: Re: Laquer Thinner and Respiratory Protection 21: Re: Revell 1/350 Emden/Dresden 22: Ship names -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation 1: Mini SMML Con -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: FrederKappes@netscape.net (Friedrich Kappes) Subject: Capricieux Capricieux, La (French ship 4th rate, 1689) was she a frigate? Friedrich The FriedrichFiles http://sites.netscape.net/friedkappes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Wanderer" Subject: Re: Merchant ship info Don, >> 1. Are there any libraries or archives in the UK which may have photos of this ship? << Your best bet would probably be the National Maritime Museum library. They're very helpful, and might have what you need. Perhaps you could also try the Imperial War Museum (?). http://www.nmm.ac.uk/cmr/pic_library.html >> 2. Also looking for a source of convoy assignment records listing ship position, etc. for specific convoy #'s (CU to UC) and (UC to CU) series. << The Public Records Office should be able to help here. You can search their library online before you visit. ADM 237 particularly relates to convoys, containing: "Case files on individual convoys of the Second World War, including papers on the planning, compositions, routes, progress, and fate of the convoys and their ships. Some files include more recent photocopies, translations and other papers as well as the original documents." http://www.pro.gov.uk/ Regards James -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Percy_John@emc.com Subject: Blue Ribbon Models? Anyone heard of Blue ribbon models? Yesterday I was at the hobbyshop, and saw 3 1/1750 models, in clear bags of the french carriers Foch, Clemensau (sp?), and Jeane D'arc (sp?). They looked like neat little kits, and best of all, were only $1.95 a pop. First time I've ever seen them. John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: Thinner >> THANX FOR THE TIP ON THE HARMFUL EFFECTS OF THIS STUFF. I AM CAREFUL WITH VENTILATION, BUT WAS WASHING MY HANDS WITH IT. WHAT IS BEST FOR HAND CLEANING? << You should not do that as a regular thing as the thinner will strip the natural oils out of the skin causing damage. It can also be absorbed into the blood stream through the skin. Lacquer thinners as opposed to turpentine or mineral spirits is particularly bad Occasional spot use is ok, but for general use a good soap or hand cleaner - the type of stuff sold for mechanics, like GOOP it should be available at most stores. Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: mumfordlibrarian@netscape.net Subject: Surcouf vs. M1 I think that you could forget any long ranger engagement between these two. Neither would have much more that a short range finder to work with, and no mast of sufficient height to allow much spotting or director control. In a short-range engagement, the French unit would have it all over the M-1 in terms of volume of fire. In either case, it would probably not take more than one hull hit to put either down. In retrospect, it is hard to find a rationale for either weapon system being more useful in a sea engagement than the more standard 88mm ? 150mm deck gun. Hitting a moving target without a much higher degree of traverse seems unlikely. If the gun is the weapon of choice for sinking merchantmen unworthy of the expenditure of a torpedo, the 8-inch or 12-inch seems overkill. Shore Bombardment ala Dover Patrol would probably require the clandestine Bombardment buoys to mark a known firing position and spotting towers on the shoals in order to use these gun's extended range. It is hard to imagine a sub commander willingly risking his boat for a shoot in such shallow water as there is off the Belgium coast. Paul T. Weaver -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: john.baumann@talk21.com Subject: Re: Landing craft >> Could somebody tell me the dates of delivery of: LCI(L) LCS(L)2 LCS(M)1 LCS(M)2 LCT(R)3 LCP(M) LCA with forward coxwain position? << Friedrich LCI(L) Built under Lend Lease 1942-43. LCS(L)2 These like Fairmile H craft and were originally built in 1943 as LCI (S). Ten were converted in 1944 for D-Day. LCS(M)1 Originally LCAs built between 1940-44. Converted to carry mortar & MGs. LCS(M)1 existed in 1941 as No.1 was lost. LCS(M)2 Again, originally LCAs built between 1940-44, existed 1942: No.28 was lost. LCT(R)3 These were converted LCT2/3s converted probably in 1944 for D-Day. LCP(M) Existed 1943 as No.14 & 17 were lost. LCA Built 1940-44 by many shipyards. Regards, John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: john.baumann@talk21.com Subject: Allied Landing Craft by A D Baker II Anyone know where I can obtain the following book at reasonable cost within the UK? "Allied Landing Craft ofWW2" by A D Baker III (Arms & Armour Press) ISBN 0 85368 687 4. Regards, John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: WestCelt@aol.com Subject: U.S.S. Cabot & U.S.S. Oriskany The effort to save U.S.S. Cabot still continues. The ship breakers have started breaking her up. Time is running out. It is an awful business. She is the world's last World War Two light aircraft carrier. For more detailed information visit www.USSCabot.com. An attempt to breakup U.S.S. Oriskany was started at Mare Island. The breakers defaulted. She was towed down to Texas. The last I heard a search was still underway for a firm that could finish breaking her up. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Richard Price Subject: HMS Rodney 1928 I'm have Tamiya's HMS Rodney sitting on the shelf but about to fall onto the workbench. I would like to build her as supplied however, I'm wondering what the "Light Grey" mentioned in the instructions means in real colour terms? Does anybody have any info. as to the true colour scheme of this time? Richard Price -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Mike Settle Subject: Re: LACQUER THINNER >> THANX FOR THE TIP ON THE HARMFUL EFFECTS OF THIS STUFF. I AM CAREFUL WITH VENTILATION, BUT WAS WASHING MY HANDS WITH IT. WHAT IS BEST FOR HAND CLEANING? << Wear the rubber or latex gloves to keep the paint off your hands. I use the kind that can be bought at any drug store or automotive parts store. If you have ever been to the doctor you have seen them before. It is the kind the doctor always wears when doing examinations. Mechanics use a slightly different kind in order to keep grease and oils off their hands. I prefer the type that mechanics use because they are a bit heavier duty and can be reused more often before tearing. They don't cost much. You can usually buy a box of 50 for anywhere from 6 to ten dollars US. Mike Settle I am not agent #1908 of the non-existent Lumber Cartel (tinlc)tm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Shirley Sachsen Subject: Submarine Force Library & Museum in response to the inquiry regarding SUBFORLIMUS, they are still alive and well. The Assoc. sends out a quarterly newsletter and they now have a website: http:\\www.submarinemuseum.com for $100 you can get a life membership which is equivalent to 5 years worth of annual membership. some recent activities at the museum include receiving an A-1 Polaris missle. and future plans for this year include moving the experimental submarine X-1 from the Naval Academy to the museum grounds. s -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Shirley Sachsen Subject: Re: Cabot the latest and greatest info I have is that yes indeed the Cabot is being scrapped--and that the island was already off of her. Oriskany is heading in a similar direction but as of yet, no torches to the best of my knowledge. for causes that are in a little better shape than either of the above: Ranger in Everett, WA, Midway in San Diego, CA. there are also efforts in the works for Forrestal and Saratoga. and if you'd rather bet on a sure thing, museums already in operation could use your help as well: Hornet, Yorktown, Lexington, Intrepid. s -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Like them big? Here's your chance to get one I just finished a model of the Bluejacket Shipcrafters 1/92 scale Gambier Bay model for a client. It is one of those big wooden monsters with a solid basswood hull. This was first model of this size I have built and I really enjoyed it. The reason I enjoyed it so much was that you have to literally cut and scratchbuild all the parts from plans provided in the kit. As a matter of fact, the only precut part in the whole kit was the hull. It had lots of very nice metal parts for the smaller stuff like chocks, deck wenches and hatches so you don't have to build all those little pieces. It also comes with a very extensive batch of photo etched parts. All in all it was a very satisfying build. Since the model was so big (about 32"), I could have easily spent another year detailing it. I would encourage anyone to build one of these great kits (if you have the room). There are several of them on eBay right now. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. You can now pay using your Visa / MasterCard Flagship Models - Photo Etched Details for Warships -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: PolTexCW@aol.com Subject: Polish Navy 1939 I am trying to locate drawings of small vessals (under 150') in use by the Polish Navy in September, 1939 - river craft, launches whatever. Any advise as to sources will be sincerely appreciated. John Biskupski -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: louellet@uism.bu.edu Subject: Re: USS Cabot "Steven P. Allen" >> Do you know something I don't? Last I heard, the Foundation had a last gasp effort going to save her. Maybe you would rather contribute funds to that than for photos of her end? Golly, but I hope they're successful. << Steve, sorry to say that CABOT is being scrapped right now. The bow has been cut off, the mast has been removed, and salvagable material from the interior has been removed. Some pieces may be going to a museum. The ECOSAT people bid for her and lost to a scrapping company for $185,000. They were successful in delaying the scrapping for many months. The scrap guy was willing to sell, but his price doubled every time he was approached. ECOSAT gave the leftover money to the IronWoman organization which CABOT's former crewmen's association. They started a fundraising drive and got endorsements from notable people including former President Bush. They could not raise enough money in time to stop the scrapping. soapbox on: I believe the scrap guy was determined to scrap the ship and gave outrageous buyout prices to keep people away. He has imported people from India to do the scrapping and some people believe they are actually living on site on the ship or in a construction trailer. I wonder if he is even paying them Minium Wage? So, the only straight-deck carrier left in the world, the only converted cruiser carrier left in the world, the only WWII carrier still in WWII configuration left in the world, and the home base for Ernie Pyle, is being lost forever. If I had won one of those multimillion dollar lottery prizes in the last year or so, I would have gone to Texas and bought the ship myself. I am serious, If I had the money, CABOT would be saved. soapbox off Larry Ouellette Volunteer, USS Salem (CA 139) United States Naval & Shipbuilding Museum Quincy, Massachusetts, USA http://www.uss-salem.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "Poutre, Joseph A" Subject: Re: Soviet vessel questions From: "Steven Sliwka" >> Now, to my Soviet questions. What are the best models out there of Soviet naval vessels? I have been looking at two in particular, the Skywave 1/700 Krivak I/II (are these two ships in one box?) and the other is the Italeri Admiral Kutznetsov carrier. What are your opinions on these kits? What is the level of detail? More than likely I will be adding 'extras' (ie-photoetch railings, etc.) and suggestions on those are appreciated as well. Does anyone know of a source of plans for these ships suitable for scratchbuilding? Hull lines would be essential as with the U Boat plans I've mentioned above. << Steven, For a pretty comprehensive list of all ship models made check out The Ship List Formerly Known as Rajen's: http://www.quuxuum.org/rajens_list/shiprevs.html You'll find Soviet ships under many companies, including Aurora, DML/Dragon, Italeri, Lindberg, Skywave/Pitroad, Trumpeter and Zhengdefu, along with short reviews for a number of them. (More reviews are always welcome.) Search the file for USSR, Russia or Soviet and you'll find a whole bunch. Skywave makes several surface ships in 1/700. DML produces a bunch of subs in pairs, one NATO and one Soviet. Trumpeter produces some Chinese vessels which are basically licensed copies of Soviet ships and subs. Zhengdefu is making a mixture of rescaled copies of Skywave products and some new models of their own, in a variety of scales. HP makes a resin Kirov, and Imperial Models and Kombrig have announced one also. For the Krivak, my version came with only one model. It's well detailed, but I'm hoping for some PE producer to create radars, masts and other equipment for this ship, along with the Sovremenny and Udaloy. (One set for all three would sell very well, I'd venture.) The Kuznetsov is impressive, and builds up nicely. I had some fit problems with the flight deck, but nothing serious. There is no PE kit, though the many radars, crane, and deck-edge netting cry out for a set, and you can do a great deal of detailing with the proper references. Joe Poutre Keeper of the List -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: "Mike Taylor" Subject: IJN Hiryu question Hi all, I'm working on the Aoshima Hiryu and have some questions. The foreward and aft quarter of the flight deck and an area surrounding the entire flight deck "seems" to be steel. Is this correct and should it then be painted gray? The molded planking on the deck runs fore and aft rather than port to starboard as is usual on carrier decks, is that correct? TIA...Mike T -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: louellet@uism.bu.edu Subject: Re: USS Cabot web links To follow-up my post on the USS Cabot and her scrapping, here are the web links to read more about her: ECOSAT's USS Cabot page: http://www.usscabot.com/ Click latest news to read about the progress of scrapping (her island is gone) and to see a picture. The 40mm gun mounts have been removed and sold to museums. The IronWoman organization: http://www.ironwoman.org/ This site hasn't been updated since December 14, 2000, before major scrapping had begun. Sorry to see her go. Larry Ouellette -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: "John Rodriguez Asti" Subject: 1955 Ark Royal colours Hi all: Recently I have bought a Fujimi's HMS Ark Royal like she was in 1955, in scale 1/700, and I have begun to build her. Does anybody knows what colours should I need to to paint her (hull, decks, superestructures, flight deck, etc)?. Any help will be very appreciated. John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: "Victor M. Baca" Subject: Re: Laquer Thinner and Respiratory Protection Hi all Great thread on the respiratory protection. It caught me right in the middle of writing an article on exactly that subject. Laquer thinner or any other sticky smelly model goop shouldn't get on your hands in the first place. In the past, I used acetone to remove resin etc. until I found latex medical gloves at the drugstore. Get them by the box and dispose of after use. They come in different weights from thin membrane for greatest tactile feel to heavy duty paramedic styles. Even better is to call on a safety equipment supply firm if you have one in your area. They offer industrial type devices and are knowlegable about the subject. Your health is important enough to buy the best you can afford. The safety supply firm I use allows customers to try glove samples to assure they'll hold up to thinners and solvents. (Some brands are not impervious to solvents). I believe there are also hypoallergenic types for those who are allergic to latex. I recently had to replace my 1/2 face cartridge respirator and decided to spend the money on a nice 3-M full face unit that allows optional fresh air attachment. This is used with organic vapor cartridges and the optional dust protective pre-filters. The cost was around $100 USD but well worth it. This mask offers great eye protection and full facial respiratory coverage when spray painting or sanding wood and fiberglass. Field of vision with the full face mask is also much better than safety glasses or goggles and it has an eyeglass accessory available. You might look like you belong on a space ship rather than a model ship, but the protection is superb and you'll not even notice the aroma of fumes while you work. Those one-thickness white dust masks held on by thin elastic bands are only good for dust. They'll concentrate paint fumes inside and make you feel horrible after a painting or fiberglassing session. I only use them for sanding balsa and purchase the more expensive variety known locally as "pig noses" because their rubber flapper valve looks like a snout. A painter's hood and coveralls are also often used as I am usually covered with resin, balsa and fiberglass dust (tiny glass particles!) after a hull sanding/shaping session. After working on a project, I brush off the dust that's collected on my clothing and equipment and DO NOT remove the respirator until finished dusting off. This is always done outside in fresh air rather than risk contaminating the house. A customer's wife once said my models were, "to die for" and I don't intend that to come true. Victor Baca Model Ship Journal -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: Revell 1/350 Emden/Dresden >> I tried to buy the Revell Emden/Dresden kit, but unfortunately it seems that it is no longer available. If anyone has this kit for sale , I would be much obliged << Jan, Try Pacific Front Hobbies @ www.pacificfront.com or best to call them @ (541)464-8579. I will bet they have either of the two kits in stock. There are also a couple of good photo etch sets available, but remember cheaper is not necessarily better! Good Luck, Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: ZMzimmerman@cs.com Subject: Ship names Gentlemen could someone tell me what was used before French, Soviet, Dutch, and Imperial Russian warship names, i.e. the United States uses USS, great Britain uses HMS etc. Thank you, Michael Zimmerman -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Btbldr" Subject: Mini SMML Con Nor' Westers and BC'ers Keith and I were would like to guage the interest of SMML folk in British Columbia and north west Washington to have a mini SMML get together? Nothing formal, no agenda, just a chat over some beverages and to talk about nothing in particular at all, but hopefully mostly ship modelling....... Proposed dates are Feb 17 or 18, or Feb 24 or 25 (2001 that is) Location to be determined (but definitely in the environs of Vancouver) and timing etc. Interested folk please let one of us know your level of interest.... Thanks!! regards Malcolm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://www.smml.org.uk Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume