Subject: SMML VOL 1158 Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 05:39:55 -0800 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: Wood for Display Stand 2: Display Stands 3: USSR TASZKIENT 4: Re: wood for display base 5: Re: Tamiya and ships 6: The late great Kirov 7: Submarine Periscope Detection 8: Re: Modern Usn & JMSDF Color 9: Re: Wood for display stand 10: Essex 11: Oregon Air vents 12: Re: ICM 13: Flight deck crown 14: Reply to Congrats for Modeller of the Year 15: Workbench tip 16: Minesweepers 17: Re: Modern USN Colours 18: Re: American DDs at Normandy 19: Tamiya 1/350 Enterprise kit 20: Introducing Myself -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Resin Kits & Books for Sale 2: FOR SALE: 1/200, 1/1250 and Misc. Models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: AandMBlevins@gateway.net Subject: Re: Wood for Display Stand Just a personal preference but I use poplar for display stands. It routs well, sands smotth, takes stain well and is hard enough to withstand bumps. Just as information, I built a model of USS IOWA for my son who was an operations specialist on board her. I had just about finished when he surprised me with a length of teak from IOWA's deck which was being replaced at Norfolk Naval Base. I trimmed the plank and used it as the base for the model. Al Blevins -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Ralph Nardone" Subject: Display Stands >> We had the continuing thread on the finials for awhile but I never saw any mention of wood types for the display stands. << Well, I used a clear length of Poplar for the base on my Tamiya 1/350 WWII USS New Jersey (converted from the Missouri kit). Be careful with Poplar, though, because a lot of the time all you will find are pieces that have a noticeable green color to them. I stained the wood with a Cherry color stain and applied three coats of spray poly. For a project that took maybe all of three hours, it didn't turn out too terribly bad. I cobbled up keel blocks from basswood, and I was done! In the final analysis, use whatever looks good to you. I might use walnut or maple on my next base; Poplar was all I could find at my local home center this time. Hope this helps..... Ralph -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "John" Subject: USSR TASZKIENT Greeting Gang , a friend of mine wants me to build him a ship so I need to know if there are any models any scale of this particular ship it is a WWII Russian Destroyer USSR TASZKIENT I have a book showing some, not a lot, of pictures but a GREAT amount of detailed drawings enough to build from, but I still would like a model before I commit to making a mold and fiberglass hulls Thanks John Anderson West Coast 1/72nd -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: wood for display base >> I am currently working on an Iowa class BB and thought about getting a piece of teak for the display base. After 30 minutes of browsing, I left without making a purchase. Any recommendations for type of wood? << I use a variety of woods, depending on: How I feel; What strikes my fancy; What I have at hand; The nature of the model: Any other factor that arises at the time :-) Let me preface by saying that I am also an armature woodworker and wood turner so I always have a lot of pieces of wood at hand. I've gone fairly formal i.e. a rectangular piece of oak or maple or walnut (or other specie) with a routed edge. I have also used highly figured pieces of Walnut burl slab. In one instance, the USS Holland, I mounted it on a single tall brass shaft over an irregular chunk of walnut burl (it's on the warship website). I have also used pieces of Spalt maple. My first advise is if you have access to a table saw and other woodworking tools, raid a fire pile and fashion a base out of found wood. If not, keep an eye out on Ebay. There are a number of people selling various amounts of many different types of wood. One guy I have bought a lot of walnut and other stuff from is Scot Olsen of Oregon He goes by the nickname "EatWalnuts" on ebay and has a lot of really nice walnut burl pieces (I also scored some fantastic looking almond from him) Other nice species I have gotten are sassafras, Coffee nut wood (your guess is as good as mine!) it is a wood with a strong grain, the color of light coffee, Sycamore, Teak, etc. Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: Tamiya and ships >> As to Tamiya, One of my good friends has talked to them in Japan extensively. He was told not to ask for ships. Mr. Tamiya likes tanks. << For someone who likes tanks, he must not like them all that much! With the exception of a few of the more recent releases, most of their earlier efforts are inaccurate and not the best quality. DML/Dragon kicks their A**!!!!! Of course the Dragon Wagon (Tank Transporter) and Famo both recent releases are major exceptions. >> has been told several times that Tamiya does not want suggestions for new ship models. And that they really couldn't care less what the American market wants, as Japan is their market. << Also obvious given their predilection for German Armor. They have more models of some variants that the German Army actually fielded!!! And if I never see another tiger kit it will be far to soon!!!!! Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Joel Labow Subject: The late great Kirov The March/April 2001 issue of Seaways Ships in Scale has a nice construction article on a Kirov model. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: Joel Labow Subject: Submarine Periscope Detection >> In the mid-1940s tests were done to detect the distance at which a submarine's periscope could be detected. A mast 32 feet high with radar on it could read up to 150 miles. After that point the reading disappeared due to the curvature of the earth. << Hmmmmmm! This work must have been done by the same research facility that gave the USN their infamous 'non-exploding' torpedo warheads! Anyone who has ever stood a bridge watch knows perfectly well that a radar sited at 32 feet above water level wouldn't detect the Statue of Liberty at 150 miles, let alone the periscope of a submerged submarine. In the 60's I was the navigator of a DE.....I still remember that my height of eye on the bridge wing was 42' and that my visible horizon was approximately 15 miles. Our SPS-10 surface search radar, which was sited much higher and which represented much better technology than anything available in WWII, was doing well to detect a supercarrier at 25 miles. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: Mitsuaki Kubota Subject: Re: Modern Usn & JMSDF Color Hi Ulan, According to "Warship Colour" published from Model Art Magazine, the Munsell numbers of JMSDF hull and deck colors are as follow. hull : N-4 deck : N-5 I think hull color resembles FS 26270, so I recommend No. 306 of GUNZE Mr. Color for the hull. (A bit of addition of black would be better.) For the deck color, No. 305 or No. 32 would be better. Best regards, Mitsuaki Kubota http://www.hig.tocolo.or.jp/hmdock/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Ken Goldman" Subject: Re: Wood for display stand Mike Streckert raised the question of what wood to use for model bases. The glib answer is to use whatever you have lying around your shop or whatever species strikes your fancy. If you plan on painting it, then plywood and particle board or flake board work just fine. If you want to actually see the wood, it is best to choose a species that won't detract by being more interesting than the model. Teak is nice, but weathered teak would be even better, because it helps tell the story of the model and, artistically, is closer to being a grayed-down complement to the overall color of the model, which will help the model stand out. If the base is to represent the builder's ways or supports in a drydock, then muting the natural wood tones (graying them down) is important from both the artistic/psychological effect and fro the scale effect. Without getting too involved on this topic, walnut has long been a favorite due to its rich tone when oiled or varnished, and because it is a naturally grayed down brown with varieties ranging from greenish to reddish to purplish. If you plan to make your base from a plank of wood, always slightly hollow out the underside about 1/16" deep so that the board rests on a roughly 1/4" rim rather than its entire underside. Although remanufactured wood, such as plywood, is dimensionally stable, wood planks are not - even after beings sealed with varnish. This could mean that your nice flat base might eventually swell or distort sufficiently to rock a bit. This possibility is pretty much eliminated by hollowing the underside. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER unique wood sculpture and fine scale models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "O'Connor" Subject: Essex Chris, The Essex Class thread ran it's course here months ago- Suffice it to say that the arguments for and against the armoured deck concept ran about 50-50. And we did not lose any Essex class ships to damage- the only one so damaged as to never return to duty was the Franklin-the rest were repaired- most within hours of the attack- to fight on. In later years, they were as versatile a hull design as any ever launched. CV, CVS, AVT, LPH, and anything else asked of the design was accomplished, both with straight decks and angled. They made the transition from WWll piston engined planes to high tech jets (or as much as possible, due to thier size), and paved the way for the Midway, Enterprise and Forrestal designs. They were also good enough to be considered for purchase by the Brits- after they had been retired from USN service, and considered to be obsolete for USN purposes. Must have been SOMETHING good about those wooden flight decks! Bob -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "aa8." Subject: Oregon Air vents Dear List I am still struggling with my Oregon kit. I have a problem. On top of the main turrets there are two air vents which are not included in the kit. Has anyone out there whose been there before me and included these on their model and if they did what did they use? My first thought was to try and cast some thing in resin using the existing kit items as a pattern Any ideas? Also I prefer Mahogany for the bases of models--I already have one cut for Oregon. and finally It was a pleasure to meet all the SMML'ies at Yeovilton on Saturday. I hope you all enjoyed it as much as I did. Regards Andy Jones -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: ICM >> You are right thou about ICM policy of releasing almost identical kits in such a short time,I wonder who is their market researcher. << If you are talking about the ICM Konig and Großer Kurfurst kits, originally there was to be a difference between the two kits, but when production started, the mold with the parts tree for the torpedo net equipment and early mast parts broke. I was told by ICM that it was too costly, and not enough time to retool another mold, so they scrambled to redu the instructions and ship the kit out as we got it. All of this came from the owners of ICM. These things can happen. Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "Robert J. Morris" Subject: Flight deck crown Doug: A 1" crown is right. Checking the plans I have I found 2" for Essex, 2" for Commencement Bay, none for Wolverine, a height above baseline ad center for Casablanca but no actual figure. The Wolverine flight deck is 39" 8". Robert Morris -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Tony Mollica" Subject: Reply to Congrats for Modeller of the Year Shane and Lorna, Thank you very much for your kind words. They really were a 'bolt from the blue', the last thing I expected to see here. The model in question was the ex Skywave (I think) FFG now marketed by Dragon/DML. I think the model itself is unremarkable, it was actually built to 'out of the box' standard in order to qualify an interclub competition. As such, I couldn't modify much other than thin down the mast a little. I couldn't add any aftermarket goodies either, which I found frustrating. I also didn't get the colour mix for the RAN grey quite right. I tried Rusty White's technique for 'water' bases with this model. I think the end result was ok for a first try, but will be better next time. The technique certainly has merit, thanks Rusty. I'll try to get hold of a photo of it, and pass it on in case anyone is interested. Regards Tony Mollica Hi Tony, We look forward to seeing pictures of the model ;-). Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Kelvin Mok" Subject: Workbench tip Workbench tip: Those flying parts I came across a picture of a well used jeweller's workbench and, like everyone else working with small parts, they have a problem with small parts dropping off the table and disappearing. Only in their case its even more pricey. Their regular office sized worktable has a semicircular cut-in to accommodate the body. The cut-in provides extended working surfaces on either side for the arms. On the bench edge are mounted the usual jeweller's vise, strake holder and a couple more special bench fixtures whose names escape me but look pretty useful for modelling work. The bench tip most useful to modellers is a leather hammock stretched between the cut-in extensions. The body can rest right against the leather hammock in comfort to form a debris catch for anything falling off the bench. Leather is used as it is practically fire-proof and jeweller's do a lot of blowtorch work. It is stiff enough to keep its hammocky shape and doesn't fold onto itself. Most of their work material does not stick to leather. So anything falling into it be it valuable gold filings or parts can be easily recovered by tapping on the hammock to bounce debris to the center where it can be picked off. Keeps the floor clean too. I think this is a great design idea. The back and sides of the bench has uprights lined with shelves and parts boxes, all within easy reach. That implies flying parts are not likely to go beyond the confines of the bench. Even if lost at least some fine day that part may yet be found rather than gone forever at the next floor vacuuming. Kelvin Mok -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: CA139JOHNF@aol.com Subject: Minesweepers Hello All, I am building a four stack destroyer converted to minesweeper (DMS10). I have plans bot does anyone know of any pics available for the minesweep gear on the stern particularly the winches and cranes. John Frohock USNSM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: wem Subject: Re: Modern USN Colours Here are the FS numbers you need: Haze Gray: FS 36270 (26270 for scale effect) Deck Gray: FS 36008 (26176 for scale effect) As for the modern JMSDF colours, they'll be included in our upcoming Modern Navies Paint Chip Set.... John Snyder Snyder & Short Enterprises http://www.shipcamouflage.com White Ensign Models http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: VONJERSEY@aol.com Subject: Re: American DDs at Normandy This thread brings to mind a book I recommend to all: " The Ship That Would Not Die". It is about Allen M. Sumner class Laffey DD724, written by her skipper, F. Julian Becton. One of her first missions was to participate in the Overlord invasion of Normandy, where she took a German 10 inch shell to the bow, fortunately it was a dud (Becton thought that the shell, made by the Czech's Skoda works, had been sabotaged). Laffey was thereafter transferred to the Pacific, where she participated in the Philippines and Iwo Jima campaigns. Central to the book, however is her contribution to the Okinawa campaign, where while on picket duty, on April 16, 1945, she was attacked by over 20 kamikazes and bombers and hit by both a total of about a dozen times. Laffey survived that ordeal, and the return trip and display in Seattle. She was repaired and updated and remained in service till 1975 and I believe is now a museum ship in South Carolina. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: PSmith6328@aol.com Subject: Tamiya 1/350 Enterprise kit Hi everybody, Can anybody tell me what era this kit represents without any modifications as I want to build it straight from the box, also what aircraft would have been aboard at the time and does anybody do a better decal set for the aircraft than the kit supplied ones and where can I find colour schemes for these aircraft. Will Lo-viz/HiViz schemes be suitable. Regards Phill -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: "David Griffith" Subject: Introducing Myself Hello everyone out there in Cyberland! I've just subscribed to SMML, and thought I'd just introduce myself so that you can put a personality (if not a face) to my email address if and when I begin contributing. I've been model making off and on since childhood, and "outed" myself about three years ago when I joined Glasgow IPMS, so I now wear my anorak proudly and don't feel furtive and embarrassed when I go into the model shop, as though I was going to buy a porno mag! My modelling interests are fairly eclectic, aircraft, tanks, soldiers and a few ships, although it has to be said that the best thing I've ever done is a ship. This was a plank on frame model of HMS Unicorn (24 gun frigate, 1746). It took two years to do. It is based on the Corel kit, but looking at it, it really is mostly scratch built, and the only things about it that are entirely as the kit intended are the precut ply bulkheads, which you can't see, of course! I counted the knots in the ratlines and there are 1150 clove hitches, each individually tied with two pairs of tweezers. I had production lines going to churn out blocks from boxwood strip 40 at a time. Since then I've started a 1/48 Lowestoft sailing trawler, totally from scratch, but it's been sitting there taunting me for a year or two, so I really ought to get back to it. My current project, which I may well post a few questions about, is the Tamiya HMS Hood, in 1/700. My inspiration forthis came from that unbelievable HMS Nelson that appeared in Navis Magazine last year. One advantage of living in Glasgow, is that we have the original builder's model of this ship in the Transport Museum, although it does, of course, represent the ship "as built" rather than "as sunk". Nevertheless it is still a wonderful primary source and I can now be found lurking there at weekends, notebook or camera in hand. Looking forward to exchanging ideas, information and views with you all. Kind regards, David Griffith -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Sanartjam@aol.com Subject: Resin Kits & Books for Sale Hi SMML, I have the following for sale: 1) Classic Warships 1/700 USS Detroit (CL-8) - resin & white metal - $45 plus shipping 2) Classic Warships 1/700 USS Alaska (CB-1) - resin & white metal - is missing breakwater strip, easily replaced by Evergreen strip - $59 plus shipping 3) "Illustrious" by Kenneth Poolman - published by Kimber in 1955 - 246 pages, 29 black & white photographs - no dust jacket, book in good+ condition - $21 plus shipping 4) "The Royal Navy in World War II" by Robert Jackson - published in 1997 by Naval Institute Press - almost new condition, with dust jacket - 176 pages, many photographs - $21 plus shipping 5) "Merchant Ships of the World: Cruising Ships" by Mitchell & Sawyer - published in 1967 by Doubleday - book in very good condition, dust jacket in good condition but with with several tears and a crease - 160 pages, many photographs - $19 plus shipping Thanks, Art Nicholson -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: webmaster@1250fleets.com (1250 Fleets Webmaster) Subject: FOR SALE: 1/200, 1/1250 and Misc. Models Attention collectors and ship modelers, I have a number of 1:1250 scale, 1:200 scale and various plastic models for sale from my collection. Most 1:1250 scale models are in excellent condition and are still in their original boxes. Some models no longer have their original boxes and will be carefully packaged separately. All of the plastic models listed for sale are complete and in their original boxes. A complete list of items for sale can be found at http://www.1250fleets.com Thank you, Marc webmaster@1250fleets.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://www.smml.org.uk Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume