Subject: SMML VOL 1241 Date: Tue, 08 May 2001 15:18:10 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: RN Camouflage Vol 1 & 2 2: Hobby stores in the London area 3: Are there models of ... 4: Rai-Ro Tools for Modelling (punch+die) 5: Making Steel Plates for hulls out of Lithoplate 6: Photographic Review 7: Re: HMS Tiger 8: Re: Nichimo's 1/200th scale Japanese I-boat 9: First Plastic Model 10: USS Wasp - aircraft composition 11: Re: P-61 and perspective and a seeteufel 12: Re: John Currie/HMS Tiger 13: Morning Edition 14: Origin of the name Yamato 15: Re: Paddle-to-the-Sea 16: Re: alternate plastics and misc 17: Nichimo and Doyusha addresses needed 18: Re: Memorable ship kits 19: Re: Run Silent 20: Re: My first model 21: Re: Modeler's wives 22: Re: P-51, P-61 who cares? 23: Re: VC-10 24: Re: Miscellaneous -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation 1: Washington DC SMMLcon -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Tim Stoneman Subject: RN Camouflage Vol 1 & 2 Notwithstanding the recent heated debate (war?) about camouflage of 'J'/'K'/'N' class ships, SMMLies with copies of Vol 1 or 2 of Alan Raven's Camouflage books might be interested in my comments to the author, and his reply: I wrote: "A few comments which may, or may not, be of use/interest, and a couple of apparent lay-up errors from the printers: Vol 1 page 15. GURKHA also had HFDF on the tripod. (Photo in Peter Hodges & Norman Friedman, 'Destroyer Weapons of World War 2' (London: Conway, 1979.) Vol 2 page 3. I believe the vertical stripe (seen in black or white on a number of single-funnelled destroyers) signified a divisional leader ('half-leader'), but have no primary-source evidence of same - H T Lenton 'British Fleet and Escort Destroyers Volume 2 (London: MacDonald, 1970) has a note to this effect on page 109. Vol 2 page 7. WOLVERINE appears to be in the same unofficial scheme as shown on p38 of Vol 2. Vol 2 Page 8. SALISBURY appears to be in the same WA scheme as shown on p48 of Vol 2. Vol 2 Page 43. I have seen one photo of OBDURATE in the 'Profile C' scheme you have drawn, taken from the starboard bow, but it seemed to be a censored version of a photo from the same angle with an apparently identical background (I think in GG Connell's 'Arctic Destroyers'), in a scheme which seems to equate to your 'Profile B'. Are there others of her in the 'Profile C' scheme? Vol 2 Page 51 has a fine photo of an early destroyer, which appears to be an Admiralty leader, but the caption doesn't identify the ship. From the camouflage scheme, I guess she may be CAMPBELL or MONTROSE - any chance of confirming which ship she is please?" Alan Raven's response: >> Thank you for your letter about Volume Two of Camouflage. Please feel free to post your comments on SMML. Wolverine and Salisbury; will be the subject of an errata in Volume Three. Blasted Printer was to blame, although it was MY responsibility. Things happen. Vertical stripe on funnel; I believe that you are correct, but I have not YET been able to obtain confirmation that I could rely upon. Am still trying on this point. Did not know about the Gurka, but should have done, my mistake, it will teach me to stick to camouflage. On the Obdurate; would be interested in seeing the photo in question. [TJS Comment - Sadly, I believe the photo was in a book I once drew from a library.] Unamed destroyer; I have the name somewhere in a file; used the picture to show a type of practice. There will be others like this in Volume Three and Volume Four, but not many. Hundreds of ships, hundreds of letters, God knows how many interviews, hundreds of documents, page after page of notes, thousands of photographs, and STILL on-going. << Tim Stoneman -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Björn Dahlberg" Subject: Hobby stores in the London area Hello everybody. I've planned a trip to London 1-4 of June. I seek help to find some desent hobby shops in the area. Can anyone of you help me? Sincerely Björn Dahlberg Navigator on the newest SAR station in Sweden. www.rswaxholm.org (sorry only in swedish yet, but we're working to become more international. In the mean time visit www.ssrs.se/english.htm) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Ned Barnett Subject: Are there models of ... The USS Alaska / USS Guam? A 5" 38 - equipped DE from WW-II (not a post-war mod)? Just read Ed Stafford's book - Little Ship - Big War ... it was inspirational; first, about his experiences in a DE (a follow-up to his SUBCHASER book, also recommended), and second, his perspective on seeing the Alaska and calling her the most beautiful ship afloat. This I've got to build Thanks ned -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Uwe Besken" Subject: Rai-Ro Tools for Modelling (punch+die) Hi, some days ago somebody had a question about punch and die sets. Here is the homepage from Rai-Ro which have such a set too. But I do not know how it is, maybe somebody else know it. You find it on Seite 27(page 27) for 119,- DM. They do not tell a (german)word if they will send their articles to other countries and what it will cost. Please ask them via email. http://home.t-online.de/home/rai-ro/haupt.htm Uwe -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "nickbalmer" Subject: Making Steel Plates for hulls out of Lithoplate Hello, Seeing the recent correspondance on scale thickness steel plate leads me to make the following suggestion. I build early armoured cars and tanks using old printers lithoplate. This material is about 5 thou thick, and is very rigid. I can cut it with a scapel blade, and glue it with superglue. I have made myself several punches etc. with which it is possible to form "rivits" into the plates. It will fold into boxes and other shapes. Because of its combination of thinness and rigidity it is superior to plastic card for gun shields, open bridges and those places where plastic card tends to be over scale thickness. Alan Clarke a very gifted maker of scratchbuilt aircraft, who lives nearby originally brought lithoplate to my attention and taught me to anneal the plate. Basically you wave the plate back and forth a couple of times through a candle. This causes the plate to become less rigid, so that it can be formed into curves. The plate can then be rubbed or rolled over a hard wood former to produce the complex curves required. Alan skins complete 1.36 scale aircraft in this way, plate by plate with all the countersunk rivets pressed into the skin. I have produced complex 1930's style mudguards etc. This material would be ideal for ships hulls. It works well stuck as a laminate onto plastic card on larger models in say 1.35 scale. It is not that easy to get. I spoke to a local printer and have probably enough to see my future modelling career out for free. Regards Nick Balmer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "chenyangzhang" Subject: Photographic Review Hi Edwin I bought copies of the photos you refer to. They show the colour schemes I describe not the ones in Alan Raven's book. You need to look at the filter or overlay the AWM applies on these photos to stop reproduction - this distorts the views. As these particular photos are available on the AWM site (albeit in distorted form) I am happy to post the prints of these photos on the SMML website. I think you'll see what I mean. Chris Langtree Hi Chris, We'd be happy to post them, provided the AWM (or any other copyright holder) has no rule against it. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Peter Chant" Subject: Re: HMS Tiger Kingkit is always a good bet for out of production kits, they are showing the Matchbox Tiger in stock. http://www.kingkit.co.uk Peter Chant -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Ray Mehlberger" Subject: Re: Nichimo's 1/200th scale Japanese I-boat I got this kit, a while back, very inexpensively...at a contest... in the vendor's room. Unfortunately, I do not read Japanese...and the instructions are totally in that language. This is a motorized kit with the electric motor etc. I plan to build the thing as a static model in a sea scape. However, there are a lot of drawings, on the instructions, that seem to be telling you special stuff you should do. My question is this.....has this kit ever been released with English instructions? If so...and if anybody out there has that version...would they be kind enough to scan the instuctions and send me them? It would be ever so much appreciated by me. Thanks in advance for any help. Regards, Ray Mehlberger -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: David_L._Miller@ccmail.wiu.edu Subject: First Plastic Model I have found this thread very interesting. My first plastic ship model was the USS Nautilus, put out by Lindberg. This model was followed shortly by the Chris Craft sports cabin cruiser by Sterling. Both were retained in my collection (which eventually included about 90 models) until I left for college. The collection disappeared a few years later. I really enjoy the reissues of these early kits, showing us just how far we have come, and also for pleasant memories. I particularly enjoyed the reissue of the Flying Saucer model by Lindberg (I bought three of them!) Dave Miller -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Fernando, Yohan" Subject: USS Wasp - aircraft composition Hello, In expectation of receiving my Corsair Armada 1/700 Wasp (any week now), can anyone tell me what aircraft she was operating at the time of her loss? My guess would be F4F's, Dauntlesses and... Avengers? Were the carriers still operating Devestators for torpedo squadrons after Midway? Thanks, Yohan Fernando -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Gernot Hassenpflug Subject: Model Art 561 Warship colour: missing table translations I hope this is useful to some of you. If you have questions, please email. Falk Pletscher asked me to translate the following two tables, if there are others, let me know and I will do them too. Cheers. Table on p.14: Top: Yokosuka Navy Arsenal boiled linseed oil (amani-yu) No. 2: 40% turpentine (teremen-yu, or terebin-yu, from terementina-yu or terebentina-yu): 3% dryer: 2% white zinc oxide powder (shiro-aen-fun): 53% charcoal or carbon black (shou-en): 2% 2nd from Top:Kure Navy Arsenal boiled linseed oil No.2: 21% turpentine: 0.9% dryer: 4% white zinc oxide powder: 42% charcoal: 1.1% whitewash (go-fun): 21% ethylene (sei-yu or sei-yu-ki or echiren ): 10% 3rd from Top: Sasebo Navy Arsenal boiled linseed oil No.2: 48% turpentine: 2% dryer: 2% white zinc oxide: 46% charcoal: 2% Bottom: Maizuru Navy Arsenal linseed oil No.2: 29% turpentine: 1.9% dryer: 1.1% white zinc oxide: 66% charcoal: 1.1% Table on P.39: Number : Common Name : Revised Munsell Code : Notes 1 : grey (kai-shoku) : N-5 2 : dark grey (an-kai-shoku) : N-4 3 : white (haku-shoku) : N-9 : marked as N-9.5 4 : light yellow No.1 (tan-kou-shoku) : 10YR 9/1 : a warm style (dan-shoku-kei) of pale (tan-shoku) 5 : light yellow No.2 : 2.5Y 9/1 : as above 6 : dark blue (an-sei-shoku) : 7.5BG 5/2 7 : light blue No.1 (tan-sei-shoku) : 7.5BG 8.5/1.5 : a cold style (kan-shoku-kei) of pale (tan-shoku) 8 : light blue No.2 : 7.5BG 7/2 9 : light green (tan-ryoku-shoku) : 2.5BG 8/1.5 : a cold style (kan-shoku-kei) of pale (tan-shoku) 10 : black (koku-shoku) : N-2 11 : silver (gin-shoku) : 12 : red (seki-shoku) : 7.5R 5/12.5 13 : blue (sei-shoku) : 2.5PB 5/6 14 : green (ryoku-shoku) : 2.5G 4/5.5 15 : yellow (kou-shoku) : 2.5Y 8/ 16 : brown (cha-iro) : 7.5YR 5/6 17 : red-orange (seki-tou-shoku) : 10R 5.5/14.5 Table on P.39 is for JMSDF after 28 August 1957. Before that they used a combination of the existing US colours on lent ships, and the old IJN nezumi-iro (mouse colour). The note for white means that N-9.5 is used when white markings are applied to ships. Gernot Hassenpflug -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Ken Goldman" Subject: Re: P-61 and perspective and a seeteufel I appreciate Rusty's good humor as much as his fine modeling ability. English literature would be the poorer if not for typos and the occasional use of an oddly appropriate wrong word. That is what gave us Sheridan's "Mrs. Malaprop" in THE RIVALS - not to mention Norm Crosby's hilarious monologues. I find that my own typos often are a serendipitous source of names for alien creatures in science fiction stories. Getting back to ships, does anyone out there in SMML land have detailed information of the German Seeteufel midget submarine. The Roessler book and the U-boat Net have sparked my interest in this unusual vessel, but I've only seen two rather dark and grainy photographs. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER unique wood sculpture and fine scale models www.walruscarpenter.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "D.Przezdziecki" Subject: Re: John Currie/HMS Tiger John writes: >> Does anyone know of anyone who supples the Matchbox 1/700 HMS TIGER, it is out of production at the moment. << Hi John, I do have Matchbox Tiger, the not so good news is that it has no box and hull halves are glued and deck fitted.It can be taked apart thou and all the parts and instruction are there. I got it in this condition for "what if" project which I latter abandoned. The better news is that you can have it for nothing (well p&p costs only), so if you will not have any luck with other sources, let me know. Regards D.P -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Peter Samolinski" Subject: Morning Edition Hi Gang: I hope this works...they had an excellent program on the breaking up of the Cabot on National [US] Public Radio this morning; if this page comes up okay just scroll down to "U.S.S. Cabot" and listen to the segment. http://www.npr.org/programs/morning/ Pete -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: WRPRESSINC@aol.com Subject: Origin of the name Yamato I know that this question has been raised before, but I cannot remember what the answer was. Can anybody tell me what the Battleship Yamato is named after. And could the reference be given that backs it up, I have money riding on the answer. Thank you. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: GKingzett@aol.com Subject: Re: Paddle-to-the-Sea Ah, memories. This is the first book I can remember, maybe 1945. The story of the little Indian in the canoe made me want to follow him. He started in Canada, near Lake Nipigon and went east, eventually to France. From North Dakota, Minnesota and Wisconsin I finally followed him to the sea, but went the other way, to San Francisco, in 1962. He drifted, I hitchhiked. I found a copy of the book at the Wisconsin Maritime Museum in 1999. It is still in print, published by Houghton Mifflin, ISBN 0-395-29203-4. And just as inspiring as I remembered. Gary -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: CA139JOHNF@aol.com Subject: Re: alternate plastics and misc Tim Brooks talked about various types and sizes of plastics for modeling purposes. Locally there is a plastics supplier that makes all kinds of stuff as a job shop. When I was picking up some my employer ordered from them I saw the scrap bin. After asking (I was told to help myself) I had more sheet and rod plastic (mostly styrene) than I could use. Look in your phone book and give a it try, look for suppliers of plastic like acrylic and plexi. As for the foam board. I guess my secret is out. I use a brand called GatorFoam. It is used by professional architectural model builders. I get a couple of sheets of the 1/4" stuff for about $20.00 for a 4'x4' sheets. Purchased at a graphics supply store. This stuff is great especially for modelers working in r/c where topweight is a major consideration. It is much lighter than wood but cuts, sands and paints like wood only easier with no grain. When finished it looks like metal. Great stuff and very easy to use. Did the superstructure of a Baltimore class CA in 1/96. First model, It was a carrier, back around '53 or '54. Seems to me it was the Wasp. All I remember was it has about jillion little guns on it. I was only about six and Mum helped build it. OK,OK, she built most of it. Boy I loved that thing. Next was the Revell SS United States. White plastic, painted in black and red, cool. Last I saw of it was the tide took it and it went to sea on its own. I was short and afraid of water over my head. Sad, but at least it had a better fate than its prototype. (thats model RR talk for the real thing). I remember a ten piece model kit(?) of a four stacker with a snap in wheel on the bottom. Anyone else remember it? Hawk Models?? John F USNSM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Hub & Diane Plott" Subject: Nichimo and Doyusha addresses needed Does anyone have current addresses for Nichimo and Doyusha? Please let me know. Thanks Hub Plott -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: Memorable ship kits >> I mentioned briefly my Nautilus diorama - just the ice-covered North Pole with the sub implied by the title name. Made me want to build a real Nautilus (and now Lindberg's out with a faux-Nautilus if I aspire to real major conversions ). << Hey Ned, if you want a really good and accurate rendition of Nautilus, SSN-571, I recommend the Combat Subs kit in resin. Finishing a build up of it right now, along with another CS resin "nifty-fifties" kit, SSGN-587, USS Halibut, compete with Regulus missile. Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: Run Silent >> As a film, it was no where near as good as the book; and having developed a bond with the narrator character (Rich Richardson) in the book, I was sorry to see what they did to him. I guess they needed to do a lot of story condensing to make that book into a movie. Sigh. << Amen to that. I reread that book periodically, along with the two sequels. In fact the continuation of the WWII story in "Dust on the Sea" is every bit as good as "Run Silent...." Yes, the movie is good for shots of fleet submarines, but the mangling of the characters and their motivations was unforgivable. The human story in the book is as good as the submarine aspect. BTW, I have corresponded with Capt. Ned Beach, who is also a member of the SubCommittee. He is truly a wonderful gentlman. Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: "jmsr1990.in" Subject: Re: My first model My first model was the Revel Bismark which I built when I was 6 years old in 1973. My modeling interests were inspired by reading. The first time we were allowed to go down to the library in 1st grade the teacher let us each check out one book. The book I checked out was titled "Sink The Bismark". That one book had me dreaming of Bismark, Hood, Rodney, Norfolk, Prince Eugen, etc. The book only had a couple of photos and they were of poor quality so my imagination was just running wild as to what these huge ships really looked like. Anyway my birthday was shortly after that and my parents bought me the Revel Bismark, probably because all I would talk about was that book. I did not even know ship models existed so you can imagine my wide eyed joy when I first gazed upon that beautiful model (it seemed perfect then). I have been in love with warships and books ever since. I like to build them and read about them equally. I am rambling on. Goodnight gents. Jim -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: Mike Settle Subject: Re: Modeler's wives >> Uh Oh!! I am not even sure where there is a jewelry store!! I could be in big trouble - thanks for the tip!! << You guys should have gotten a wife like mine. While not actively encouraging me to go to the hobby shop, (I work at one part time, anyway), she does encourage and support my model buying and building. And in addition, she is allergic to gold. Really. It discolors her skin when she wears it. She also can't wear a watch for some reason. Every one she has ever had will stop after a day or two. She can wear silver, though, but I still get off pretty easy. Let's not talk about shoes, though. Mike Settle I am not agent #1908 of the non-existent Lumber Cartel (tinlc)tm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: Mike Settle Subject: Re: P-51, P-61 who cares? >>> I'm probably even older than you are! We had P51's when I joined the Air National Guard in 1946, but they were called Mustangs, not Black Widows. <<< >> Yeah, Ken Goldman already pointed that one out. I'm going to start sending him all my mail first :-). Hey! I'm a ship guy. What do you expect! << It is just a good thing for you, Rusty, that you didn't state your first model was an F4U Wildcat or an SBD Corsair. :-) Mike Settle I am not agent #1908 of the non-existent Lumber Cartel (tinlc)tm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Michael Bartel Subject: Re: VC-10 >> My first model was not actually built by myself, but my father. It was the Airfix VC-10 in BOAC markings, and the event may have prejudiced my opinion, but I think the VC-10 is the most beautiful subsonic airliner ever built. << Absolutely right. There will never be another airliner like the VC-10. I equate the VC-10 vis-a-vis today's Airbus look-alikes to finding a dark-haired Middle-Eastern beauty in a sea (sky?) of California bleach-blondes. And, all the major plastic models of Victor Charlie One Zero do it justice - the Airfix kit, the Frog/Novo kits, and the Welsh Models kit. What a shame it came five years after the 707 and DC-8. The VC-10 was actually better than both of them, but by the time it was introduced, the major airlines had their fleets of Seattle and Long Beach products in place, and the 747 was only six years away. Just goes to show that timing really is everything. (Oh, those lucky RAF blokes- they are the only ones who get to fly the VC-10 now.) Mike Bartel IHP -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: ECammeron@aol.com Subject: Re: Miscellaneous Monogram had a Missouri, Shangri-La, Chicago, Hobby and LST-608 in balsa. All 16" long and so much fun, back in the late 40s, early 50s. Strombecker had a Gambier Bay, Buckley and PF Tacoma in white pine (?). Not a lot of detail, but to a 9 or 10 year old, they were neat. The Monogram kits sold for $1.00 or $1.25 and the Strombecker kits for $.69 or $.79. Talk about inflation. Eugene -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Chris Hughes" Subject: Washington DC SMMLcon Hi Guys, I was over in DC a couple of weeks ago and went to visit Chris Mikesh at Nostalgic Plastic. What a nice bloke he is! He came out to the Metro station to collect me and dropped me off again afterwards. I'll certainly call there next time I'm over in the USA. I was at Duxford yesterday, saw a book on restoring vintage aircraft on one of the stalls - author was Robert Mikesh - Chris's Dad. No mean modeller himself and an expert on restoration and conservation. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://www.smml.org.uk Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume