Subject: SMML VOL 1243 Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 05:50:29 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: Yamato 2: Origin of the name Yamato 3: Re: Are there models of... 4: Post Midway TBD's 5: Army Signal Corps Image Library 6: First ship kit 7: C & O 452 - Towboat 8: Re: Origin of the name Yamato 9: Re: Yamato 10: B.Dahleberg/Hobby shops in London 11: Re: USS Wasp - aircraft composition 12: Seeteufel -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation 1: APMA site update & meeting -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Wasp kit & Air Group 2: For Sale 3: Update on Warship Pictorial Series Books -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: dlfowler@apple.com Subject: Re: Yamato The Battleship Yamato is named for the Country of Japan. "Yamato" is the ancient name for the nation and culture. If you won the bet, can I get a cut? If you lost, never mind. Regards, Duane Fowler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Mike Connelley Subject: Origin of the name Yamato Howdy: In the Skulski book, on the first page, first sentence: "Yamato is Japan's oldest poetic name. It is the name of the territory on which the first seed of state was sown, and later becamethe name of the province on the Kii peninsula, in southwestern Honshu, whose capital is Nara." The Kii peninsiula is south of Osaka and east of Shikoku. Cheers Mike Connelley -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Dave Judy Subject: Re: Are there models of... Ned, There are two kits of the Alaska class cruiser....IronShipwright and Classic Warships both in 1/350 scale. As for the 5" 38 DE, Ironshipwright has a Rudderow class DE in 1/350 scale. Dave -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "lcp9" Subject: Post Midway TBD's All Devastators were withdrawn from combat after Midway. I think Saratoga (which was enroute to Midway right after the battle) had the first operational TBF squadron. The remaining TBDs were used as trainers and utility aircraft. In Warship Battle Damage#1 there is a Nov 1942 picture of Hornet leaving for the south pacific with a deck load of extra aircraft. There are TBDs, Ducks, & SBC4s scattered among the F4Fs. This book also lists Hornets Oct '42 airgroup as 36 F4F ; 36 SBD ; and 15 TBF. David -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Ken Goldman" Subject: Army Signal Corps Image Library A BIG thanks to Ed Grune for his heads up on the Army Signal Corps' Hampton Roads image library! I found a picture of my father I had never before seen - and on the very day I plan to begin a book I am working on about his ship and the Sicily invasion. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER unique wood sculpture and fine scale models www.walruscarpenter.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "O'Connor" Subject: First ship kit SMMLies, As I recall, the first ship I ever built was an Aurora Skipjack, followed closely by the old Renwal series of ships ,and some Revell ships. That was in the mid-60's, and I went on, in the late 60's to build Revell and Airfix ships while in Western Scotland, where my dad was stationed at a NATO base at Machrihanish. Our landlord had a son my age, and we both loved ship models. We built and discussed the major naval battles as we knew them (he, Jutland and the Battle for the Atlantic, and me the great Pacific battles of the last great war.). we eventually sunk many of the models at his father's sheep watering pond with bb guns, rocks, firecrackers and fierce imagination. Those were the best modeling days, because we wanted to build and buy, build and buy- no worries about scale, accuracy of camo schemes, PE railing and other such adult worries. It was a fun hobby which helped to teach us the history of the vessels, our countries and to help us develop an appreciation for our heritage. We never did model any of the 18th century warships which might have sailed across the big pond to fight in the colonies, blockade ports and lock the Union Jack against the Stars and Stripes. God help that poor Revell Bismarck kit, though. After we ceremoniously sunk the Hood, the Nazi killer got it!! Think I'll take my son out and buy a few full-hull kits, put on some ballast and find a small pond to go to war in ....... Cheers! Bob O'Connor, in comfortable Central Florida -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: GtLakesMem@aol.com Subject: C & O 452 - Towboat Greetings: I have a model builder friend that is looking for either drawings of the Outboard Drives for the C & O 452 which was based at Port Huron, Michigan or photographs of the outdrives out of water. Any assistance will be greatly appreciated. He is building a model of the PERE MARQUETTE 10 and the C & O 452 for the Port Huron Museum. Al Jackman Great Lakes Memories -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: Mike Settle Subject: Re: Origin of the name Yamato >> I know that this question has been raised before, but I cannot remember what the answer was. Can anybody tell me what the Battleship Yamato is named after. And could the reference be given that backs it up, I have money riding on the answer. << Steve, the following is a direct quote from the Anatomy of the Ship, The Battleship Yamato by Janusz Skulsky: "Yamato is Japan's oldest poetic name. It is the name of the territory on which the first seed of state was sown, and later became the name of the province on the Kii peninsula, in southwestern Honshu, whose capital is Nara. This mystic and especially potent name was given to the largest and most powerful battleship ever built, which entered service in the Pacific War at the beginning of 1942." End quote. OK, inquiring minds want to know - who won the bet? Mike Settle I am not agent #1908 of the non-existent Lumber Cartel (tinlc)tm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: WestCelt@aol.com Subject: Re: Yamato The discussion of the origin of the name Yamato raises the matter of how warship names are picked. Japanesse aircraft carriers and destoryers had names that suited warships. Almost all the Royal Navy's ships have names that befit a man of war. Invincible, Inflexible, Vanguard, Dreadnought, Warspite, Akagi, Shark, Hornet, Wasp, and Enterprise are all fine names. Some how naming a ship after a town or a state does not conjure the warrior spirit, (U.S.S. Newark or H.M.S. Repulse). Anyway, I am musing. Other that picking the names for ships and selecting sponsors wow can members of congress be rewarded for voting for naval appropriations? John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "D.Przezdziecki" Subject: B.Dahleberg/Hobby shops in London The best hobby shop in London (IMO) is Station Model Shop located in Harrow on the Hill, it is slightly out of the way, but well worth a visit. If you need any further info please contact me off list. Regards D.P -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "Harold Stockton" Subject: Re: USS Wasp - aircraft composition I read with some interest about the aircraft composition of the USS Wasp at the time of her loss on 24 August 1942, in SMML 1242 by James Corley. Though these unit's composition may have indeed been present at the time of her loss, there were always a little variance with ANY squadron's official assigned aircraft and what aircraft were really on hand. An example of such a situation concerns the Wasp's airgroup in December 1941. According to Bill Kilgrain's book on "Color Schemes . . ." pp. 154, 155, on that date the Wasp's air-group constituted the following unit's aircraft: VF-71 18 F4F-3 VF-72 17 F4F-3, 2 SB2U-2, 1 SNJ-1 Lt.Cdr. "Mike" Henry G. Sanchez (USNA 1930), aboard the Hornet. VS-71 4 SB2U-1, 13 SB2U-2, 2 TBD-1 VS-72 SB2U-3 In John Lundstrom's "The First Team", p. 550, Rear Admiral Noyes; Commander, Carriers, Pacific Fleet, assumed command of Task Force 18 that was built around the USS Wasp on 19 June at San Diego. Earlier in the year, Wasp's VF-72, along with its 20 F4F-4s under Lt.Cdr. Henry G. Sanchez, were delivered to Pearl on 29 May as a replacement fighter squadron for Hornet's VF-42. As things would work out, VF-72 ended up as the "second" fighter squadron onboard the"Sara" as Ramsey's TG-11.2. Late in June 1941, fourteen new "Fighting Eight" F4F-4s were transferred to the command of VF-72, which was tapped to be Hornet's premier fighter squadron. And on 4 July, ten pilots and the remainder of VF-8's nine F4F-4s were handed over to VF-72's command aboard the Hornet. This action brought VF-72's twenty-seven (27) plane allowance to be raised to a total of thirty-six (36) F4F-4s. The purpose of this discourse is to show how much the different carrier squadrons were moved around during the first year of the war. Concerning VF-71 under Lt.Cdr. Shands aboard the Wasp, which was still at San Diego at this time, the Independence Day shake-up at Pearl had little if any effect on this fighter squadron. The only change to this squadron's established strength resulted in VF-71 having thirty (30) F4F-4s on hand rather than the standard twenty-seven (27) that was normally allowed. Concerning the other squadrons on the Wasp, its entire airgroup flew ashore on 19 June 1941 at San Diego as soon as she arrived there. Rear Admiral Noyes brought his flag aboard the Wasp to form TF-18, and set about restructuring the entire airgroup for the Wasp's upcoming campaigns. Scouting 71 and 72 would lose their Vindicators and Devastators for SBDs, and Torpedo Seven received TBFs. Lt.Crd. Wallace M. Bleakley (USNA 1924), was the Commander Wasp Air Group (CWAG). The exact unit strength aboard the Wasp on 1 June when TF-18 (Wasp, Quincey [CA-39], San Juan [CL-54], seven destroyers and five transports) sailed from San Diego with the following airgroup: (John Lundstrom's "The First Team and the GUADALCANAL CAMPAIGN". p.13) CWAG Lt.Cdr. Wallace M. Bleakley Flew VT-7 TBF VF-71 Lt, Cdr. Courtney Shands 30 F4F-4s VS-71 Lt. Crd. John Eldridge, Jr. 15 SBD-3s VS-72 Lt. Crd. Frank Turner* 15 SBD-3s *(Soon relieved by Lt. Cdr. Ernest M. Snowden (USNA 1932). VT-7 Lt. Henry A. Romberg 10 TBF-1s Utility Unit 1 J2F-5 If we jump to 8 September, just a few days before her loss, R.Adm.. Noyes led TF-18 out of Noumea where the Wasp's airgroup had been replenished. VF-71 pilots flew in four VF-5 F4F-4s in from Efate, and for VS-71 and 72 six Enterprise SBDs with their VB-6 crews. When TF-18 left Noumea on the Eighth, the Wasp's airgroup constituted the following aircraft: CWAG Lt.Cdr. Wallace M. Bleakley Flew VT-7 TBF VF-71 Lt, Cdr. Courtney Shands 32 F4F-4s (28)* (*, number operational) VS-71 Lt. Crd. John Eldridge, Jr. 14 SBD-3s (14) VS-72 Lt. Crd. Ernest M. Snowden 14 SBD-3s (14) VT-7 Lt. Edward V. Wedell 10 TBF-1s (10) Utility Unit 1 J2F-5 At 1320, 15 September, the Wasp turned southeast into the wind for flight operations. Fourteen VS-71 SBDs were launched for afternoon search missions, while four more SBDs from VS-72 were launched for Inner Air Patrol (IAP). After a note had been dropped on the Hornet's deck from one of Wasp's SBDs to inform Murray, CO of Hornet, stressing the fact that Turner, Marine CO at Guadalcanal, needed more support, a relief Combat Air Patrol (CAP) of eight (8) VF-71 F4F-4s soon followed the Wasp's eighteen (18) SBDs into the air. Almost immediately after this latest launch of aircraft, the Wasp landed eight (8) F4F-4s (Russell's and Wright's divisions) and three (3) VS-72 SBDs. Captain Forrest P. Sherman, the captain of the Wasp, quickly ordered the VS-72 SBDs struck below to the hanger deck and that sixteen (16) F4Fs brought up and made ready for take off. Wasp's plane handlers pushed Russell's four (4) F4F-4s aft to "Fly III" abaft of the island for fuel and to make ready to strike below Wright's four. At this point in time, thirty-seven (37) aircraft crowded the Wasp's hanger deck. Forward of the Number 2 (center) elevator sat twelve (12) F4Fs that were fueled and armed, four (4) SBDs in the same condition, and the J2F amphibian was secured without fuel or payload. Directly adjacent to the Number 2 elevator was one (1) TBF that was armed with a torpedo but without fuel. Further aft of this elevator were nine (9) more TBFs in a similar condition as this just mentioned Avenger, as were six (6) fully armed and fueled SBDs. Also, there were four more spare F4Fs hung from the hanger roof, two forward and two to the rear of this center elevator. The hanger crew prepared the twelve (12) fueled and armed F4Fs for movement to the flight deck. It was at this point in time, at 1345, while the Wasp was in the process of coming about to its new course of 280 degrees at 16 knots, that the Wasp's lookouts saw the torpedo tracks that came from the six (6) torpedoes that were launched by Cdr. Kinashi Takaichi's I-16, which had been presented with a classic submariner's "bow shot" of full broadside presentation. And, the rest is history. So, in conclusion, the Wasp had the following airgroup present, and not as stated by Mr. Corley: CWAG Lt.Cdr. Wallace M. Bleakley Flew VT-7 TBF VF-71 Lt, Cdr. Courtney Shands 32 F4F-4s (28)* [*, the number operational, but not counting the four (4) spare that were suspended from the hanger deck's roof.] VS-71 Lt. Crd. John Eldridge, Jr. 14 SBD-3s (14)* [*, not the (18) as quoted] VS-72 Lt. Crd. Ernest M. Snowden 14 SBD-3s (14)* [*, not the (18) as quoted] VT-7 Lt. Edward V. Wedell 10 TBF-1s (10)* [*, not the (15) as quoted] Utility Unit 1 J2F-5 (1)* [*, not even mentioned] Harold Stockton -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Seeteufel The MAFVA journal Tankette (hey, it's got tracks, so it counts as a military vehicle) had an article and 1/76 plan by Vincent Greenwood and Andrew Crutchley for the Seeteufel in Vol.28 No.1. The issue should still be in print so I suggest contacting Gary Williams at mafvahq@aol.com and asking about availability. Regards Robert Lockie Swindon, UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Shane Subject: APMA site update & meeting Hi all, The APMA site has been updated at long last. There's no ship related stuff this time, but a stack of other models & reference photos have been uploaded to the site. Also, we have the monthly meeting this Saturday, which will have a display on Revell kits. Anyone visiting or live in Sydney are welcome to attend. There are details on the site on how to get there. Regards, Shane APMA VP http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm Now PayPal enabled Having FUN making models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Mike C" Subject: Wasp kit & Air Group As you may already know, the first batch of WASP kits has been sent to my distributors. I think I can safely state that it's the most accurate kit of the WASP (CV-7) currently on the market. ;-D I'd appreciate hearing any comments you may have about the kit. I have the composition of the Air Group listed in the instructions using Lundstrom's "The First Team and the Guadalcanal Campaign" (p. 177) as the source. After she left Noumea for the last time on 8 September 1942, she had the following aircraft on board: 32- F4F-4 VF-71 (28 operable) LCDR Courtney Shands (Four of those were from VF-5, flown aboard by VF-71 pilots after she left port) 14- SBD-3 VS-71 LCDR John Eldridge 14- SBD-3 VS-72 LCDR Ernest M. Snowden 10- TBF-1 VT- 7 LT Edward V. Wedell 1- TBF-1 CWAG LCDR Wallace M. Beakley I put as many aircraft propellers (cuffed and standard) as I could on the photoetch. I think I've got 'em covered. Have fun, Mike Czibovic Corsair Armada Productions -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Chris.Evenden@agso.gov.au Subject: For Sale All prices are in AUSTRALIAN dollars and do not include postage Overseas orders welcome. US customers multiply these prices by 0.55 Books Hitler's U-Boat War Vol 2 The Hunted 1942 - 1945 Clay Blair Hdbk $45 US Carriers at War Peter Kilduff Ian Allen Publishing 1981 Hdbk $20 Escort Carriers of the US Navy Stefan Terzibaschitsch Conway Publishing 1980 $45 Battleship Nelson Ronald Careless Arms $ Armour Press 1985 Hdbk $15 Anatonmy of the Ship Series (Hdbk) HMS Victory $50 HMS Endeavour $50 Flower Corvette Agassiz $65 Ships and Aircraft of the US Fleet 13th Edition $20 Norman Polmar 1985 Hdbk, no dust jacket Royal Australian Navy At War $75 Two Volume set, sell as set only G H Hill Australian War Memorial Hdbk Detail and Scale Aircraft Carrier Volumes $25 each America Kennedy Forrestal Enterprise Models DML 1/350 Ingersoll Spruance Class Destroyer $20 Tamiya 1/350 Missourri w/ Tom's Modelworks Iowa conversion and photoetch. $135 Gold Medal Models 1/700 US WW2 Carrier photoetch set $12 Gold Medal Models 1/700 US WW2 Crusier photoetch set $12 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Update on Warship Pictorial Series Books Warship Pictorial #11 Lexington Class Carriers and #13 IJN Kongo Class Battleships will both be shipping to dealers and distributors by Monday. Both books are 72 pages packed with lots of photos, over 100 per book, @ $13.95 ea. WP #13 on the Kongo's has color photos on the covers! WP #12 Benson/Gleaves Class Destroyers is about 1/3 done and will go to the printer in July. WP #14 USS Wichita CA-45 is finished and at the proofreaders now and will go to the printer in July. I have found no color photos of this ship, so I colorized to images for the covers, and they look really good! WP #15 KM Schnellboote is about 1/3 done and is slatted to print in October. WP #16 USS New Jersey BB-62 has yet to be started, but will go to the printer in October. WP #17 IJN Myoko Class Cruisers is about 1/3 done and will print early next year. WP #18 ???? I am giving serious consideration to Arleigh Burke Class Destroyers for this one, also to go to the printers early next year. A quick note about the covers of the IJN subject books (and Wichita). I am colorizing these original black and white photos, using paint chip samples and original color photos for the most accurate color information possible. The results are stunning and rather exciting. I have been requested to compile an entire book of this sort of work. Is there any interest amongst any of you on this mailing list for this sort of a book? Please post your responses on this list only, do not send them to me directly. Thanks, Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://www.smml.org.uk Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume