Subject: SMML VOL 1246 Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 10:33:24 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: Valiant Names 2: Corsair Armada Wasp kit 3: Takao and Atago, Part 1/4 4: Re: Nichimo's 1/200th scale Japanese I-Boat submarine 5: My Paint Problems - Belated Thanks! 6: I Need A Polish Translator 7: Yamato's wooden deck color 8: MB Models & IPMS/USa Nats 9: Takao and Atago Part 2/4 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "David Griffith" Subject: Re: Valiant Names >> Almost all the Royal Navy's ships have names that befit a man of war. Invincible, Inflexible, Vanguard, Dreadnought, Warspite, Akagi, Shark, Hornet, Wasp, and Enterprise are all fine names. << Hello there, And now for my own three ha'pence worth. Regarding the name "Warspite", I read somewhere recently that this name has nothing to do with war or being spiteful but is, in fact, an obscure and ancient dialect term for a woodpecker! So looked at that way, it's about as aggressive a name as all those Flower Class corvettes, "Snowdrop", "Buttercup", "Stinking Hellebore" or whatever! Regards, David Griffith -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: pugs99@att.net Subject: Corsair Armada Wasp kit Hi Folks, I saw a couple of items on the list regarding this kit. Can someone who has gotten one tell me what aircraft come with the kit?? TIA. Regards, John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Gernot Hassenpflug Subject: Takao and Atago, Part 1/4 Hello Shane, I have taken the liberty of translating P38-44 of the "Warhips of the Imperial Japanese Navy , photo collection Vol.10 - the Takao class" on the Takao and Atago. This corresponds to the old Maru Special issue on the two cruisers dating from the 1970's (well, I have the old Maru special on the Maya/Chokai, my next translation project next week, and that dates from 1976). The contents should be perhaps taken with a grain of salt, as I am reading some other more up to date books on the Takao class which describe some of the details slightly differently. But I figure with the popularity of the class - what with the lovely new kits - and reference would be appreciated. Happy modeling, respectfully, G.H. Warships of the Imperial Japanese Navy, Heavy Cruisers of the Takao Class (Japanese Navy Vessels Photo Collection, Vol.10, published by Kojinsha, edited from various 'Maru' issues) ========================================================== P38-44: History and Evolution of Takao and Atago by diagrams (japanese text: Mr. Higashi Seiji) (drawings: Mr. Ishibashi Takao) Summary of events leading to the birth of the Takao class In 1922 the signing of the Washington Treaty allowed the Great Powers to limit capital ship tonnage on the one hand, and on the other hand the moratorium on capital ship construction led directly to the building of the largest allowed warships, the 10.000t cruisers, otherwise known as Treaty cruisers. In Japan the 1923 building program saw the construction of the Furutaka and Aoba classes, followed by the first true Treaty cruisers, the 4-ship Myoko class. These ships, with their superior armament and protection, attracted intense interest from the Great Powers. In 1923, after a revision of the imperial defence needs, the navy set out to construct a fleet around a core of 9 capital ships, 3 aircraft carriers, and 12 large cruisers. To that end, replensihment vessel building and air power expansion programs were launched, which were to run from 1925 until 1930. Unfortunately, the budget was not sufficient, so needs were revised, and the 12 large cruisers to four, as replacements for obsolete vessels. Application was filed in 1925, and approval was gained at the 52nd imperial conference in 1927. This was to be the second batch of 10.000t Treaty cruisers, following the Myoko class. The leadship, Takao, was laid down at the Yokosuka dockyards on 28 April 1927, the second ship, Atago, on the same date at Kure. The third ship, Chokai, was begun a year later on 26 March 1928 at Mitsubishi's Nagasaki yard, while the fourth ship, Maya, was laid down on 4 December of the same year at Kawasaki's Kobe yard. In 1928, after the Takao's had been laid down, the arms control studies committee, headed by Admiral Nomura, submitted its findings. On the topic of the appropriateness of equipment on board ships, in the case of the Treaty cruisers, it laid down that their primary roles should be the escort of friendly convoys, and the attack of enemy convoys, while as inidividual ships with search as their main function, they should equal or surpass their Britsh and US counterparts, and the standard for 10.000t cruisers was to be a speed of not less than 33 knots, a cruising range of 8000 nautical miles at 14 knots, protection against 20.3cm gunfire was to be primarily indirect, then direct, while that against 15cm gunfire was to be both direct and indirect. Performance and offensive armament were to be increased as much as possible over the minimum specified, which consisted of greater than eight 20.3cm guns (high angle), four 61cm torpedo tubes per side (mounted on the upper deck), and two floatplanes. Undoubtedly, these specifications were based on the design of the Takao class, then under construction; in other words, it looks as though they correspond to the requirements met by the Takao class design. The design of the Takao class was presided over by Col. Fujimoto, chief designer of the general staff 4th division, in place of Hiraga, who had presided up until the Myoko class, and can be said to be basically an improved Myoko class. The main points of difference to the Myoko class are as follows: (1) torpedo tubes mounted on the upper deck (2) the ships' vitals, magazines, machinery spaces etc., were shortend by about 1m (length between nos.1 and 5 turrets), in the interests of better protection via the armoured deck. (3) The sides of the magazines were about 25mm (1") thicker at 12.7cm (5") and made of NVNC armour plate, and was tapered in parts. (4) to reduce weight, some parts of the upperworks used aluminium alloy, while the hull used electric welding. (5) as the functions of the bridge were subdivided for tactical reasons, the reuslting structure was exceptionally large. (6) the main gun barrels could elevate to 70 degrees for AA use, and the number of high angle secondary guns was reduced. Diagram 1 shows Atago depicted in as-built configuration. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Ray Mehlberger" Subject: Re: Nichimo's 1/200th scale Japanese I-Boat submarine Hey guyz, Again I send out a request to see if anybody has this kit with English instructions? Mine has all Japanese...and....me no read! Thanks in advance for any help. Regards, Ray Mehlberger -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Felix Bustelo Subject: My Paint Problems - Belated Thanks! Hi Everyone, I just wanted to convey my thanks to those who answered my question about my paint drying up in the bottle. So far, the paint is still good - I just have to poke a hole in the skin that formed on the top to get to the paint. This reminds of a little of ice fishing ;-) I have been caught up with some things and I had forgotten to send a note of thanks sooner. Where are my manners? Regards, Felix Bustelo International Maritime Modeling URL: http://members.tripod.com/~Febus65/imm.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Felix Bustelo Subject: I Need A Polish Translator Hello All, I know that there are a few Polish SMMLies out there. I need someone to contact me off line to help me understand the painting instructions for my Mirage ORP Mazur kit - the twin funneled version circa 1935. Any help will be most appreciated. Regards, Felix Bustelo International Maritime Modeling URL: http://members.tripod.com/~Febus65/imm.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: Dmitriy Li Subject: Yamato's wooden deck color Hello folks, According to Skulski Yamato's wooden deck was "unpainted 'hinoki' cypress wood with a grey tint". Do you guys have any idea how it looks like? I mean what color or color mix can I use to paint Yamato's wooden deck? Thanks Dmitriy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: TechnoInfidel@webtv.net (John Collins) Subject: MB Models & IPMS/USa Nats Greetings: Does anyone know of an e-mail address for MB Models? Rusty White asked some time ago about SMML attendance at the IPMS/USA nationals. I plan to attend. Thanks, John Collins Atlanta, GA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Gernot Hassenpflug Subject: Takao and Atago Part 2/4 Warships of the Imperial Japanese Navy, Heavy Cruisers of the Takao Class (Japanese Navy Vessels Photo Collection, Vol.10, published by Kojinsha, edited from various 'Maru' issues) P38-44: History and Evolution of Takao and Atago by diagrams (japanese text: Mr. Higashi Seiji) (drawings: Mr. Ishibashi Takao) Hinadan-shiki (doll festival dias type) giant bridge structure The Takao class hull dimensions were practically identical to those of the Myoko class, so that they could well be said to be the same class. But although the disposition of the main armament was identical, and the machinery too was the same, one point where their appearance differed radically was the central superstructure, in particular the bridge structure. The bridge structure enclosed a volume three times that of the Myoko's equivalent and the gigantic structure approached a hina-dan in appearance [the doll festival includes a many-tiered dias filled with an array of servants and luggage for the prince and princess(hina) seated at the top]. For tactical reasons, functions of the bridge, such as gunfire control, torpedo firing control, navigation, communications etc., were required to be separated concretely. Needless to say, a full-size wooden mock-up of the bridge was built on Takao's upper deck while she was fitting out in order to determine the final layout. The more than ten storey high tower had the following layout, from the top down: main armament fire position, main armament command position, target observation position, (torpedo) launch control position, navigation bridge, upper bridge, central bridge, lower bridge, high-angle gun deck, upper deck. The Takao class were in particular tasked with a flotilla command role, and the inclusion in the bridge of a communications room, strategy room, recreation room, among others, for use by the associate flag staff, no doubt contributed to the gigantic size of the final structure. The corpulence of the bridge structure was the result of the current general staff inconsistenly trying to meet 100% of the tactical requirements, a design thinking that is also apparent in the later Special Type destoryers, and although the utility was praised while at the same time the effectiveness in battle severely questioned by both foreign naval construction staff and during the peacetime drills, it is a fact that when its practicality was put to the test in the Pacific War showes no particular problems arose. However, from a design point of view, the bridge structure and upperworks should be designed to give the smallest possible target in battle, while from a performance point of view, and for reasons of practicality, an unimpeded surroundings and a compact structure are best. Thus, after some reflection, the following Mogami class ended up markedly more compact, and it is also a fact that when the Takao and her sisters underwent refits, the bridge structure was rendered more compact. Whatever the merits and demerits might be, we should also not forget the fact this huge bridge structure, with the appearance of a castle that became the distinguishing mark of japanese warships and took on a peculiar beauty of its own, attracted a host of naval fans. The Takao class's main guns were different from those of the Myoko class, the guns being of a new type that were a true 8 inches (20.3cm), known as the 50 calibre Model Year 3 Number 2 gun, and the turret of the E Type allowing the guns a maximum elevation of 70 degrees for anti-air use. This idea was copied from the British Kent class Treaty cruisers and was intended to inflict damage on aircraft at long range with the large calibre guns. The hoists from the shell rooms under the turrets were also of a two-tiered type, for normal use and anti-air use, and their speed was increased. Sadly however, the firing system and related equipment, firing speed and loading system used showed clearly that even at the time it was not really practical, and by the time of the Pacific War no effective anti-air shooting could be expected of it. The maximum effective range of the main armament against surface targets was 29.700m, rate of fire 5rpm per gun, penetration against VC armour was 190mm at 10.000m, 114mm at 20.000m, 74mm at 29.300m. The turret differed from that of the Myoko class in using a new type of shield, but the armour of this shield was only 25mm, the same as previous ones, markedly inferior to that used on the US and other contemporary Treaty cruisers, too weak to withstand anything more than shell splinters and machine gun fire. This was the result of a decision that more armour weight could not be added, as the rotating part of the turret already weighed over 160t. Turrets 1,2 and 4 were each equipped with a 6m rangefinder, and a 4.5m rangefinder and direction-finder sight were installed on the top of the bridge. In addition to the main armament's secondary anti-air role, four 10cm high angle guns, two fewer than on the Myoko class, were placed on the high-angle gun deck, one deck higher than the upper deck. Separate 3.5m high-angle range finders and high-angle fire-control positions were installed on either side of the bridge. Initially, 40mm Vickers-type machine guns were fitted, but their performance proved disappointing and they were soon replaced. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://www.smml.org.uk Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume