Subject: SMML VOL 1247 Date: Sun, 13 May 2001 06:11:04 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Takao and Atago Part 3/4 2: Good Hobby Shops in Las Vegas? 3: Re: Corsair Armada Wasp kit 4: Re: I need a polish translator 5: USS Seawolf - Ratcliffe Kits 6: Tamiya's 1/700 Mogami and her sisters 7: Re: Yamato's wooden deck color 8: SMS Scharnhorst Colours 9: The Fairey Swordfish in US markings. 10: HMS AGINCOURT (1844) PLANS and Chinese Battleships 11: Tugboat accident on the Delaware Canal -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation 1: IPMS USA Nats -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Gernot Hassenpflug Subject: Takao and Atago Part 3/4 Warships of the Imperial Japanese Navy, Heavy Cruisers of the Takao Class (Japanese Navy Vessels Photo Collection, Vol.10, published by Kojinsha, edited from various 'Maru' issues) P38-44: History and Evolution of Takao and Atago by diagrams (japanese text: Mr. Higashi Seiji) (drawings: Mr. Ishibashi Takao) Installation of two catapults In the Myoko class, torpedos that could withstand the impact with the sea surface when fired from the upper deck were not available, so the tubes were installed on the middle deck. This was not the most desirable arrangement from a protection point of view, so for this reason the Takao class carried the Type 90 61cm torpedo which could withstand the impact, fired from twin trainable Type 89 tubes mounted on both sides of the upper deck underneath the high-angle gun deck. Further, from considerations of avoiding as much as possible damage through torpedo warhead detonation from shell or bomb hits, the upper deck was extended slightly outboard, and the tubes were placed as far as possible towards the edge. When the tubes were trained outboard, the warheads would be completely clear of the ship. Reloads for the two twins tubes on each side were provided, and this could be accomplished in about three minutes. In peacetime two reloads per tube were provided, in wartime this was increased to three, and to try to to prevent detonation of the warheads an armour shield was installed for each. The general trend for Treaty cruisers at the time in the US and elsewhere was to do away with torpedo armament altogether. In Japan too, at the time of the design of the Myoko class, the friction between chief designer Hiraga who vehemently opposed the mounting of torpedos, and the general staff who demanded them, was one of the reasons why Hiraga eventually resigned from the design bureau. Although this led naturally to a demand for increased torpedo armament in the Takao class, but, just from the point of view of protection, the number of tubes per side was reduced to four in order to try to decrease the chance of warhead detonation. The aircraft arrangements were almost in the same place as for the Myoko class, but two catapults were installed, one on each beam, and three aircraft, one three-seater, and two two-seters, were to be carried. A hangar aft of the rear mast could hold two planes and spare parts. Circular shiels were placed around the searchlights, but later removed. Boats carried were one 12m motor boats, two 11m motor boats, two 11m motor launches, three 9m cutters, one 8m motor barge, and one 6m motor barge. AS mentioned before, the vitals of the Takao class were shortened by 1m compared to the Myoko class, and the armoured deck concentrated over these. The side belt around the areas of the forward and aft magazines was 127mm NVNC plate, a section of which was tapered, while the belt in the region of the machinery spaces was 102mm NVNC plate, angled at about 12 degrees. This was the thickest armour among the contemporary Treaty cruisers. Horizontal armour was made up of the armoured middle deck of 34mm NVNC, with the sections over the magazines being 46mm thick. From the lower edge of the belt downwards, two 56mm thick DS steel bulkheads in the shape of bulges formed the underwater protetion. DS steel was used to a large extent in the hull construction, replacing the earlier common HT steel. Other innovations were the application of light alloys in parts of the upperworks, and the use of electric welding. These were all techniques aimed at reducing weight, but the ships' standard displacement on completion was still 11.500t, some 17% over the designed displacement of 8.950t, showing a decidedly poorly overseen design process. Further, the Takao class design saw the first use of the metric system, replacing one based on the foot, and standard displacement was abandoned in favour of trial displacement. As a result of the torpedo tubes being moved to the upper deck, accommodation was somewhat improved over the Myoko class, and improved ventilation was provided in view of envisaged operations in the tropics. As mentioned previously, facilities for their roles as flagships were also installed. The arrangements of the machinery spaces was as follows. The forward boiler rooms, 1 to 3, had two boilers each filling the entire width of the ship, while aft, as there was a bulkhead down the centreline of the ship, rooms 4 to 9 had one boiler each. The main engines were installed one each in four engine rooms arranged in two columns left and right, aft of the boiler rooms. They output 130.000 hp to four screws, for a maximum designed speed of 35.5 knots. On trials, Takao achieved 35.5 knots at 135.500 hp on a trial displacement of 12.175t. That speed would probably not be achieved on the full load displacement of 14.075t. Takao was launched on 12 May 1930 and completed on 31 May 1932. Her sister Atago was launched on 16 June 1930 and completed on 30 March 1932. In addition, Chokai and Maya completed on 30 June 1932, in Dec 1932 the four ships made up the newly constituted 4th Squadron of the 2nd Fleet. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Ned Barnett" Subject: Good Hobby Shops in Las Vegas? Hugh There are no "good" hobby shops in Las Vegas. What there are here include: Two different "Hobby People" shops mainly catering to build-them flying models Hobbytown USA - the closest I find to a "good" hobby shop, but a bit thin on ship models - it's on Sahara at Decatur Impact Hobbies (or something like that) on Rainbow near Spring Mountain - they have a line on old collectable kits at retail rates, but few ships. I've picked up some bargains there (a 1992 model of a Liberty Ship for $25) but the pickings are slim Dansey's - near me on N. Nellis Blvd. a block from Bonanza - mostly car racing stuff, but at least as many ship models (but no resin or after-market) as Hobbytown USA Wish I could give you good news. There is one decent railroad-only shop, if you like model railroads, too. It's on Boulder Highway in E. LV. Ned (marooned in the Desert for his 11th summer - and it's 104 and rising ...) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Loren Perry Subject: Re: Corsair Armada Wasp kit >> I saw a couple of items on the list regarding this kit. Can someone who has gotten one tell me what aircraft come with the kit?? TIA. << No aircraft come with the Corsair Armada 1/700 WASP kit. They are available separately from Hasegawa and Fujimi, among other sources. Loren Perry -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: WVeigele@aol.com Subject: Re: I need a polish translator Dear Felix, You might ask the editor of Okrety Wojenne, Jaroslaw Malinowski, at okret@katowice.pl. If you are not familiar with the journal you should check it. It is an excellent journal with many fine articles and wonderful photographs and line drawings. Modelers would find it very useful and interesting. Bill Veigele www.astralpublishing.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Chris Neel" Subject: USS Seawolf - Ratcliffe Kits Howdy - I've just seen the 1/700 Ralph Ratcliffe Submarine kits built by Mr. Tom Dougherty on the SteelNavy Site - Can someone tell me where these kits are available from? I'm especially interested in a 1/700 Seawolf. Thanks! Chris Neel Victoria, Texas -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Henry T Chen" Subject: Tamiya's 1/700 Mogami and her sisters Dear fellow SMMLies, This has troubled me for years.... I have built Tamiya's Mogami class cruisers many times.... The bridge looks awfully small compared to photos of these ships... Did Tamiya make an accurate bridge of these 4 ships? If not, Anyone out there have any experience of modifying them???? Thanks, Henry -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Ken Goldman" Subject: Re: Yamato's wooden deck color If you are using real wood for the deck, ammonium hydroxide "weathers" it a nice silver gray. Otherwise, a wash of RLM gray over a light tan or sugar maple color results in a fair approximation of gray-weathered wood. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER unique wood sculpture and fine scale models www.walruscarpenter.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: nd.ward@virgin.net Subject: SMS Scharnhorst Colours What was the colour scheme for the Scharnhorst/Gneisenau at the beginning of WWI, ie at Coronel and the Falklands? My first plastic kit was the Airfix Renault Dauphin - I can still remember the opaque windows through over application of glue - I just had to use that tube up! 1 kit - 1 tube! My first warship was the Airfix HMS Cossack, and my father initiating me in the use of sellotape for masking the waterline. I also remember making several EAGLE ( 1/1200?) waterline models of destroyers must be around 1966, anyone else remember these? Dave Ward - ex MN engineer officer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Harold Stockton" Subject: The Fairey Swordfish in US markings. On page 55 of Stefan Terzibaschitsch's book on "Escort Carriers...", there is a photograph of USS Prince William that is dated on 7 August 1943. On the PW deck are nine SBDs, what appears to be a "stripped" J2F Duck and C-47, a single OS2U-3 on wheels, and two Fairey Swordfish in definitely US period "star on ball" national markings. Does anyone have any more information about when the USN operated these obviously Canadian built Swordfishes? As the airgroup for the PW at this time was VC-64, with eleven FMs and four TBFs, the only rational that I can come up with was that RCAF Swordfish IIs or IIIs were "seconded" to the USN to help bolster the ASW capability of the PW as it operated in its aircraft transport assignments at that time period. As an aside, on page 50 of the same book there is a photograph of the USS Altamalta (CVE-18) with a deckload of what appear to be P-51A Mustangs. Also in this same photograph is a single Swordfish with indistinguishable national markings. Concerning the issue that arose over the USS Wasp's airgroup at the time of her loss, as it related to the official assigned numbers of aircraft over the actual numbers present, there is a very interesting photograph in Terzibaschitsch's book on "Escort Carriers...", on page 70. The "official compliment of the USS Liscome Bay (CVE-56) was listed as being eleven FMs, two SBDs, and nine TBMs; all from VC-39. Well, the photograph on page 70 of the above mentioned book shows an airgroup of two FMs twenty-two SBDs, twenty-two TBFs, and one SNJ. Some interesting points about this photograph, which was taken about six weeks after this vessels official commissioning. With such a crowded deck, with every capable aircraft with folded wings doing so, the two FMs are peculiarly absent from having their wings folded. From this simple fact of an overcrowded flightdeck, and non folded wings on the two so-called FMs, these Wildcats were most probably non-folding wings F3F-3s and not FMs. Any comments? Harold Stockton -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Kerry Jang Subject: HMS AGINCOURT (1844) PLANS and Chinese Battleships Hi All, About a week ago, I received photographic copies of the original builders plans held by the National Maritime Museum in the UK on a ship named AGINCOURT. The plan set was extensive, including lines, GA's, etc... a scratchbuilder's dream set. The AGINCOURT plans are dated as Chatham in 1844, with annotations dated 1869, and a plan of the rig dated 1894. The ship is an early steamship, single screw, with four large bore cannon/rifles - two mounted on the poop and two on the forecastle. She has a tall thin funnel and can obviously be fitted with sails. She looks a bit like WARRIOR. A very cool set of plans!!!! My library does not cover the Vicorian Era, so if anyone can supply any history, background on this ship would be very helpful! For those of you interested in the Chinese Navy, I recently received a photocopy of a long out of print book that is excellent: "China's Struggle for Naval Development 1839-1895" by John L. Rawlinson. Harvard University Press: Cambridge, MA, 1967. It is an in depeth analysis of the early Chinese navy and is an excellent accompanying volume to the new book just published by Chatham on the subject (or should I say the new book is an excellent accompaniment to this older volume). I was out-of-town last week and missed a number of SMML posts -- I was told someone was trying to contact me on the Chinese ship drawings (Ting Yuen/Chen Yuen in 1:100) and John Tennier and I were working on. I hope to start a model of this ships soon either in 1:200 or 1:350 later this year. Cheers and thanks, Kerry -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Craig Bennett Subject: Tugboat accident on the Delaware Canal Hi Guys I've seen on the news that a tugboat on the Cheaspeake Bay /Delaware River Canal was sunk while towing a barge of liquid sugar due to a tow cable getting caught in the tug's propeller. Possibly 3 men have died. The canal was closed to shipping because of this. While a salvage ship was being sent to recover the tug from Baltimore. Has any one ever travelled on this canal? Would it be a scenic ride? I believe it was built in WW2 to protect shipping from U-Boats. Craig -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Ed Grune Subject: IPMS USA Nats Hello SMMLies A few months back, I was trying to get together a sense of the list as to who would be attending the Nats and what would be out preferences regarding getting a meeting space for a "informal" SMMLCon. The frst IPMS Nats SMMLCon at Orlando was held at lunch - overlooking the scenerey around the pool. The second IPMS Nats SMMLCon was held in one of the seminar rooms. The scenery wasn't as nice - but we got a change to meet one another and talk ships. I was in touch with the people at Chicago about grabbing some space - but haven't been back in touch lately I didn't get much response as to the list's preference on a meeting location. I think I got a total of five responses (including my own). Here we are again - a little under two months before the Nats. What do we want to do, meet over lunch or try to get a meeting space? For Tom Gardner from JAG: Is JAG going to supply the nifty SMML name tags again? For Rusty Look for me to do judges training & OJT. I couldn't do it last year because my convention jobs took precedence. While on the subject of the Chicago Nats. Didja notice that there are no seminars or speakers on ship modeling? The U505 tour fell through and nothing replaced it. Is there someone out there who might volunteer to the Chicago committee to put on a brief seminar on our part of the hobby. [Tom - you're excused because you stepped forward last year.] Ed Mansfield, TX -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://www.smml.org.uk Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume