Subject: SMML VOL 1283 Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2001 21:13:50 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Taiho color scheme 2: Request (more like a desperate plea) for Liberty ship help 3: Re: Lycra thread for rigging 4: A-1H Skyraiders 5: DELICATE PHOTOETCH 6: Re: Rusty White's Photo Etch Concerns.... 7: Re: Mastering 8: Re: RAF rescue launches 9: Re: Vittorio Venetto and Ebay 10: Re: B I T - Brit in Training 11: Kombrig's Tserarevitch 12: Re: Mastering 13: Yamato aircraft deck question 14: Re: Models for sale and links 15: Shrink Wrap 16: Re: Winch orientation on Airfix 1:72nd E-Boat 17: Lycra Thread 18: USS Langley at Tarakan, Borneo on 10 January 1942? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Re: Open request of Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Wolff, Richard - CICT-2" Subject: Taiho color scheme Regarding Randy Short's question (SMML #1277): I believe that Shinano is shown in the Tamiya box top as being solid green even though THE picture of Shinano shows a pattern. Several views of the capsized Amagi shows a pattern as well. Unryu was used to test patterns in the summer of 1944. As Taiho precedes the patterned paint schemes incorporated in late 1944, I think that she would have had the solid green scheme which was used prior to the patterned scheme. I am not so quick to speculate as to whether or not Taiho used a green copper based anti-fowling paint below the waterline. Richard Wolff -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Jodie Peeler Subject: Request (more like a desperate plea) for Liberty ship help hello all.... At the moment this request has more to do with my dissertation (rapidly approaching completion) than with modeling, although at some point there's bound to be a model built by me on this subject, so there's a modeling tie-in, too: Can anyone out who's well-versed in Liberty Ship history, or who has a good selection of materials on specific ships, help me with further details about the history of the S.S. Ben Robertson (MCE 2432)? All I have at the moment are just the basics you find on almost all the other ships, such as builder, launch date, etc. I'm looking for more details on the ship's career, her postwar disposition, and her ultimate fate. My web searches have uncovered a great D-Day story, but little else that opens new ground to me. I'd be much obliged to anyone who can help me. Thanks! jodie http://www.mindspring.com/~raisingirl -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: rolie muise Subject: Re: Lycra thread for rigging I build ships in bottles along with ship models of other scales. Fly tying thread comes in many small sizes. I use# 0006 and# 0008 for my SIBs which measure out at .004" and .002".It comes in larger sizes and many colours. Might be worth a look. rolie in NovaScotia, home of HMCS Sackville -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Glenn and Kelly Neklason" Subject: A-1H Skyraiders Hi All Does anyone have or know where to find any pictures of VF-152 A-1H Skyraiders while stationed aboard the USS Oriskany in 1965/1966/1967? Thanks, Glenn -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Victor M. Baca" Subject: DELICATE PHOTOETCH Regarding ultra thin PE parts. I was just talking with Don Preul a couple of weeks ago and he suggested that the best way to go would be with nickle-silver alloy. I just bought a set of nickle-silver etched parts from him for destroyers in 1/192 scale and I think he has a good point. The nickle-silver is not as soft as brass but is easier to work than stainless steel. Anyway, just musing as I look over my goodies. Ain't it nice when the mailman comes bearing packages? Victor Baca Model Ship Journal -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: stillmo@mb.sympatico.ca Subject: Re: Rusty White's Photo Etch Concerns.... Hey Rusty.... Thanks for the heads up on the kit....I just ordered the BJ from WEM (that abbrev.sounds good doesnt it???) The 350th brass sets must be a piece of cake....try working their 1/700 PE sets !!!!!! This could have a normally patient modeller putting his kit into the wall at Mach II.... RDB -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: Mastering >> Wood is not recommended as the grain could very well transfer to the mold. << >> WRONG!!! << Come on Steve, lets not beat around the bushes!! Actually you are both right, and wrong!! Fine grained woods i'e' poplar maple etc or woods with the grain sealed are fine for masters, Open grain woods like oak would be rather problematical!!! Regards, Bradford Chaucer -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: ALROSS2@aol.com Subject: Re: RAF rescue launches In the late 1980s, Geoff Pilborough produced a series of monographs on the various RAF and RCAF marine craft. These soft-cover books were about 100 pages in length and contained a nice selection of photos and a few drawings, along with historical text. I think there are at least four books in the series (at least that's how many I have...). The series is titled: The History of Royal Air Force Marine Craft 1918-1986 and is (was?) available from: Canimpex 619-21, 10405 Jasper Avenue Edmonton, Alberta Canada T5J 3S2 If you are "into" HSLs, these books are well worth having. Another useful, but probably rare, reference is a small monograph written by John Pritchard in the early 1970s titled: An Introduction to Roayl Air Force 1936-1945 Air Sea Rescue Launches. It was published in 1974 and republished in 1979 by the Royal Air Force Museum, Hendon. It's only 31 pages long, but is another "worth having" in the collection. While there are no drawings, it does contain photos of the types listed. Al Ross -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: Vittorio Venetto and Ebay >> Now there's a good thread idea...tell us about your amazing kit finds, err...steals...$29 for Tamiya Bismarck and $17 for BWN Akizuke are mine... << Best kit purchase; I paid $20 for a Tamiya Tirpitz, and when I opened the box later that day, found that it had a Gold medal Models photo etch set in it. That was a $80 retail kit with a $32 photo etch set, all for $20. I spent an extra $20 on beer that night. Even tipped the strippers, if you know what I mean. Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: B I T - Brit in Training >> Oh, and Steve--we DO have Marmite in the cupboard.... << Quick. Call the Health Board and establish a Quarantine! Cover yourselves with butter! Arm yourselves with lemons! Whoops that was for giant lobsters! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: RhinoBones@aol.com Subject: Kombrig's Tserarevitch Some months ago I promised a picture of Kombrig's Tsesarevitch as she comes out of the box. Well, I finally have the picture. The requester, and anyone else interested, is welcome to a copy. Mind you though, the picture is basically nothing more than the hull/superstructure casting. Regards, RhinoBones PS - Thanks all for the information/comments concerning the (e-Bay) Royal Sovereign. One of the three listed is still at a discount to the commercial prices by about a buck fifty . . . however, I would rather do business with the retailers who frequent this forum. Also, I rather build out of the box, therefore, back dating is not a problem. Finding the time is the problem. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: Mastering >> I believe I still may have some RTV molds out in the garage. I made some terrain pieces for 1:285 microarmor and the wood grain (basswood and pine) did show on the RTV. I used the molds anyway as the resin pieces would be painted and flocked which covered up the grain marks. << If one bothered to treat the wood properly, then one would not get the grain to show! 84 ship model master patterns and no wood grain proves me correct. A master pattern can be made from almost anything, you just have to finish it correctly. Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Mike Connelley Subject: Yamato aircraft deck question Howdy: The Skulski book states on page 22 that concrete was used on the aircraft deck. This makes sense since it'll provide a better non-slip surface than bare steel. However, I don't know to reconcile this with available photos. There is the well known photo of the Yamato fitting out, taken from her port quarter. In the lower right corner you can see that they're laying the trolley tracks and the turntables. There also appear to be lifting eyes in some of the deck plates. To me this suggests that at this time, the deck was still steel. I'd imagine that you'd weld the rails to the deck rather than try to fix them into concrete, and you wouldn't have lifting eyes in concrete either. There is also a photo of the Musashi's aft deck taken from the tower. The rails and turntables appear to be the same height above the deck, and you can still see the gaps under the rails. So, to reconcile these two photos, I have considered the following options: -They actually did fix the rails to the concrete surface. -The concrete layer is very thin. -There is no concrete. I don't think they'd fix the rails to concrete. Also, I think a thin layer would crack and break up easily. Since I'm not a contractor, I could be wrong on both accounts. Could they have used something other than concrete, such as what the US now uses on carrier decks, and painted it gray? Cheers Mike Connelley, perplexed -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Darren Scannell Subject: Re: Models for sale and links Rod, Your link does work, sort of. Long links show up like this: http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?MfcISAPICommand=ViewListedItems&userid=ca139salem&include=0&since=-1&sort=2&rows=25 Notice that where the link changes lines, it goes black. This just means you have to cut and paste the rest onto the end in the address box of your browser. Not sure why this happens, perhaps a certain listmaster has a comment? Hmmm? Darren Hi Darren, I think it has a lot to do with the individual's email program & how they've set up wordwrap in it, but I am not sure. The prob could be from either end in this situation. Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: Edd Pflum Subject: Shrink Wrap A modeler on another list passed the word that, with the current availability of shrink wrap machines, buying a kit in shrink wrap does not guaranty it has not been opened or tampered with. A friend of his bought a shrink wrapped kit at a swap meet with the intention of building it. When he got it home and opened it, the box was full of junk! No model at all! The seller had evidently thought the kit would be bought by a collector and sold and resold without ever being opened (or, of course, was a victim himself.) You might want to check the contents of any kit where the shrink wrap does not appear to be original. Caveat Emptor! (Trans: There's a sucker born every minute.) Edd -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "Doug Wilde" Subject: Re: Winch orientation on Airfix 1:72nd E-Boat Mike, I took a look at Paul Beaver's "E-Boats and Coastal Craft", Warship Profile #31: German Schnellboote, and Fock's "Fast Fighting Boats". The photos in the first two are ambiguous. The photo at the bottom of page 25 in E-Boats looks like it is sloped both fore and aft (?). Warship Profile includes a picture of the actual S-10 underway, but the angle on the bow shot does not help. The drawings in Fock definitely show the vertical facing aft with the slope toward the bow (Figure 71, page 114 and Figure 73, page 116). Most of the photographs show the anchor windlass covered by canvas. Perhaps you can punt, be really authentic, and have canvas on yours, too. After all, the kit comes with the rails thus covered. Only a pervert would look under the skirt! Doug Wilde -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: "chenyangzhang" Subject: Lycra Thread Hi Joe Fishing tackle shops - Fishing wire is what you need and it comes in various thicknesses as well. Chris Langtree -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Harold Stockton" Subject: USS Langley at Tarakan, Borneo on 10 January 1942? I have been corresponding with a the Webmaster of dutchsubmarines.com about the war record of the dutch submarine K.X during her stay at Tarakan, Borneo to repair her broken compressor. On this date just mentioned, the K.X had to submerge because of a Japanese air-raid. While submerged, and looking threw the K.X's periscope during the air-raid, the captain of this Dutch submarine is surprised at seeing an American aircraft carrier in port, the Langley. Does anyone have any further information about the Langley's mission during this time period than what I have already supplied to this excellent submarine site? Below is what I have already supplied. Thanks. Harold Stockton >> Sir: In the following passage about the War Record of K.X, you have this segment and a question: "Jan 10 1942: The Prins van Oranje sails approximately 30 miles up the Kali and K X anchors off the harbor. The broken compressor is brought to the shore by the 'hoofd M.K.' (head engine room) and two other men. After the departure of this party the K X sails up the Kali another mile and anchors. Jan 10 1942 at 07:00 hr.: The air-raid alarm is sounds, the K X submerges and lays down on the bottom. Through the scope the submarine observes the alarm of the aircraft carrier (when you have any idea which aircraft carrier then please contact me at webmaster@dutchsubmarines.com) and of course the radio is monitored as well. Strangely the K X does not spot any airplanes." The identity of this "carrier" was that of the USS Langley, AV-3. The Langley had sought shelter at Tarakan in order to seek some kind of protection from the watchful eyes of the IJN. Langley's mission had been to deliver 90 +/- crated P-40Bs to Surabaya. As you may well know, the IJN 3rd Rikusentai, Special Naval Landing Force (SNLF), entered Tarakan on 16 January 1942, which was less than a week after the above mentioned account. The 3rd Rikusentai was comprised of two separate Riku groupments. The first Base Force groupment, known as the Naka Rikusentai, was a purely amphibious assault group that was carried aboard the IJN CL Naka, Rear Admiral Shoji Nishimura commanding. The Yokosuka element of the 3rd SNLF was made up of the 839 men of a Riku (Special) parachute assault groupment. The 3rd SNLF was stationed at Hainan Naval District, and was attached to the 3rd China Fleet. The IJN force that had been assembled to conquer the NEI was their 4th Destroyer Squadron, under the command of Nishimura, who's Flag was aboard the CL Naka. The original meaning of the word Rikusentai was a group of sailors detached from a warship for a special, temporary mission. For example, the cruiser Kashima detached a groupment of men for occupying small bases in New Guinea for a short period. This group was known as the Kashima Rikusentai. The meaning of this word progressed further to include a group of sailors sent from one base force to another. As an example, a groupment from the Yokusuka Rikunsentai or 3rd Base Force was detached to the 4th Rikusentai Base Force for the joint assault against New Guinei, which startes Although the echelon symbol used by the Japanese Navy for the SNLF was the one applied to regiment sized units, the strengths of the SNLF were not uniform and varied from 700 to 1800. The average size seems to have been about 1500 men. I hope that this bit of information is advantagageous on your site. << -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Re: Open request of Steve Wiper Mike thank you for your kind words and your purchases. I am currently in the process of working with two separate individuals on the Pearl Harbor subject, one is just the subject of the battleships, while the other is of the entire attack. When will these come out? It will be awhile, as there will be numerous drawings in both. Maybe mid 2002? In the meantime, #14 USS Wichita is being proofread, while I am just now receiving the final batch of photos on the Gleaves, for book #12 Benson/Gleaves class destroyers. #15 Km Scnellboote is well underway to hopefully be released at the same time as the new Revell/Germany 1/72 S-100 schnellboote in October this year. #17 IJN Myoko class cruisers is also well underway, with lots of exciting photos and drawings of this class of ship, plus even better colorized photos on the front and back covers. #19 KM Admiral Hipper is far along at this time as well. Colorized photos on the covers, lots of great photos, and a ton of copies of original German drawings of this overlooked ship. #16 will be on the USS New Jersey, #18 will be on the Arliegh Burke class DDG's, and #20 will be on the USS Wasp CV-7. I hope to have all of these out by this time next year. Thanks again, Steve Wiper Classic Warships -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://www.tac.com.au/~sljenkins/apma.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume