Subject: SMML VOL 1327 Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 03:56:26 +1000 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Hull Plating Survey 2: Re: Blackthorne and hypothetical 3: Re: Turner Publishing's naval books 4: Re: Open letter to the SMML 5: German battleship Super Size it! 6: Re: Rigging with hair 7: Re: USS Kidd (DD-993) 8: It's not me, really! 9: Re: USS Kidd (DD-993) 10: Lindbergs Lighthouse 11: USS Kidd 12: USS Kidd DD-993 13: Hood is very close to being found 14: Last word on name postings 15: First ship designated USS 16: Blackthorne 17: Prinz Eugen could be saved 18: Product Review: Solder It 19: Re: USCG Air Station 20: French Museums 21: LST 632 22: Konig & Grosser Kurfurst 23: not agent 1908... 24: Turner Publishing & Bob Santos -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation 1: Queensland Model Hobby Expo - August 2001 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Re: Jim Chaconas -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Devin J. Poore" Subject: Hull Plating Survey My current project is the BWN 1/350th scale USS Juneau. I am going to simulate hull plating on this kit, and have thought of a few ways to attempt this. 1. Masking off alternate areas on the hull in the shape of the hull plates, then applying a semi-thick coat of primer. After removing the tape, there would be alternate low and high plates. 2. Painting the entire hull with camo and all, and then using the above masking technique. After masked, shoot the hull with clear coat tinted with light gray. After removing masking, this would leave some plates lightened, and some plates in the original shade. 3. Also, I've thought about putting masking solution over the hull plate lines, and then shooting the gray/clear coat. This would leave darker paint where the separation lines should be, and lighter colors towards the center of the plates. I'm intrigued by this option, seeing it as a sort of variation on the "pre-shading" that aircraft modelers use for panel line enhancement. I don't know if it would be possible to get a fine enough line with the masking solution, though, to keep the lines from being grossly over sized. Maybe dipping thread in white glue and attaching that as a mask? 4. Finally, there's always the option of just drawing in the lines with pencil; lightly. Anyone have any comments/feedback? I'll most likely try two of the above options, I'm doing a diorama with the USS Juneau and USS Laffey, so I have two hulls to "experiment" on. Thanks, Devin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: AAA Hobby Supply Subject: Re: Blackthorne and hypothetical >> The only ship that was moved into hypothetical was the USS United States. << Rusty, There was also the CSS Manassas. It was moved because the modeller stated on his sheet that the configuration is conjectural. Any model of the kit that included anything above the waterline would be conjectural. There are no photos and two illustrations (that I know of, Naval History doesn't have any online) that disagree with each other! BTW, the Manassas took first in 821 - Scratchbuilt & Kitbashed. here is a link to a website with info: http://hinds-warboats.com/CSS-Manassas.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: John Maze Subject: Re: Turner Publishing's naval books >> these are very nice items to have, albeit SPENDY... << I'll say, $50 for a 96 page book - it better be VERY nice! JohnM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: AAA Hobby Supply Subject: Re: Open letter to the SMML >> I agree completely. This is also a matter of courtesy to the readers. << Is this sig file courteous enough for everybody JZ James Corley Strong words and a bitter tone indicate a weak cause - Confucius Owner AAA Hobby Supply Nautilus Models Always offering 15% off all store stock to SMML and RMS subscribers http://www.aaahobby.com http://www.nautilusmodels.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: German battleship Super Size it! I was watching the History Channel last night on the Battleships when they made an astonishing statement. They said that Hitler was considering a battleship with 20" guns and almost twice the size as the Yamato! I would LOVE to see some conceptual drawings of that monster! That I would love to scratch build. Anyone know of any sources that could have any drawings if they exist? Of course this could have been in the very early conceptual stages, so drawings may be impossible to find. TALK ABOUT HYPOTHETICAL ENTRY!!! Rusty White 2003 IPMS/USA National Convention Chairman OKC IN 2003! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Poutre, Joseph A" Subject: Re: Rigging with hair >> After following this thread (!) for a while, I feel safe in saying that this list has to be the world's premier source of model shipbuilding information. My own model building skills are pretty modest, and sometimes it doesn't occur to me that the material I'm impatiently trying to stick to the tip of the mast is out of scale. But even my aging eyes could detect that the nylon thread from the fabric store looked too fat on my 1/700 models. Solution? I reached up and pulled a few gray hairs out of my own head. Right color, right diameter, and long enough for tying knots, too. So I'm a woonie! But it worked, and there is still enough left for another couple models. << Egads no! Human hair is significantly affected by variations in temperature and humidity. If it dries out it could pull tight and even snap parts, and if it gets wet it will sag noticably. Simply, wire and thread in 1/700 scale would be invisible to the human eye. My practice is a limited number of strands to represent what the actual ship carried, and to hold flags and signals. Besides, working on 1/700 will eventually cause you to lose your hair as you rip it out when a teeny-tiny part drops into the carpet or a crack in the floor. :-) Joe Poutre -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Poutre, Joseph A" Subject: Re: USS Kidd (DD-993) From: "Glenn and Kelly Neklason" >> Does anybody make a 1/350 USS Kidd (DD-993)? I'm not talking a Spruance here, but of the modified Spruances that were destined for the Shah of Iran. There are subtle structural differences (notably the radar platform above the bridge). Or perhaps of a conversion kit that goes with a 1/350 Spruance? I've a novice modelbuilding friend who served on the Kidd and wants to do a model of it. << No, or _maybe_ not yet. There are significant differences in the superstructure of a Kidd from a Spruance - go find your old photos (if you have) and compare them to a Spru-can. Almost everything above the bridge level is different, and there are differences below, also. They all have the widened hangar. And they underwent a mid-life rebuild that significantly altered the arrangement above the top deck, so check your references carefully for the year you plan to model her. However, since Taiwan will be aquiring the Kidds, DML may come out with a kit based on their Spruance, with a new sprue or two, if that doesn't offend the Chinese government. Joe Poutre -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: It's not me, really! >> Either way, my phone number at the shop is (770) 973-5666. Either I will be there or my trusted manager Rusty will be. << Some other Rusty (although I complement him on his excellent name) not me. I do know James though. Hey, what can I say? He has good taste in the names of people he knows and works for him. Rusty White 2003 IPMS/USA National Convention Chairman OKC IN 2003! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Craig R Bennett Subject: Re: USS Kidd (DD-993) Hi Guys Concerning the 1/350 USS Kidd DDG-993 kit. Back in the early 90's, DML was considering making them along with 1/700 Russian Kirov battle cruiser kits. But by 1993 they decided it was more profitable to produce aircraft and tank models. Craig -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Ken Youngstrom Subject: Lindbergs Lighthouse The scale is 1/82 "virtually HO." So is it THAT hard to get to 'exactly HO?' Sigh... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "John Rule" Subject: USS Kidd >> Does anybody make a 1/350 USS Kidd (DD-993)? I'm not talking a Spruance here, but of the modified Spruances that were destined for the Shah of Iran. There are subtle structural differences (notably the radar platform above the bridge). Or perhaps of a conversion kit that goes with a 1/350 Spruance? I've a novice modelbuilding friend who served on the Kidd and wants to do a model of it. << I believe that Pit-Road (Skywave) under their Hi-Mold label make a USS Kidd model. Try Bill Gruner at Pacific Front Models. I f anyone can get it for you , Bill probably can. Best of luck. John Rule -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "T. Stephen Rogers" Subject: USS Kidd DD-993 Glenn, There is a great article in the July 1995 Fine Scale Modeler on converting the Arii 1/700 Spruance to a Kidd class ship. Step by step modifications including drawings. Contact me off list and I can send you photo copies of the article. I kept up with this issue so I can convert a 1/350 kit. Regards, Steve Rogers -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "Simon Wolff" Subject: Hood is very close to being found Hi you all... This e-mail just came in from the Hood expedition site, after sixty years will they find the Hood, one hopes so. >> Channel 4 and ITN’s Hunt for the Hood expedition is “very close” to finding the wreck of HMS Hood. The team have received sonar signals indicating a very large, solid object on the sea bed and are sending a remotely operated vehicle down to investigate. If found, this will be the first contact with the famous warship since she was sunk 50 years ago off the coast of Greenland. The expedition hopes to be able to send the first pictures of the wreck back over the weekend. Underwater footage will also be streamed live on the internet. Keep checking the expedition website for breaking news and up-to-the minute information www.channel4.com/hood The Hood Team << Simon Wolff -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: SteveWiper@aol.com Subject: Last word on name postings All that I was suggesting was to have a name to go with the post. Kind of like having a name to go with the face, sort of thing. That's all. No more. No less. No hidden agenda's from me. Some people really over reacted. What I said in the original post is all that I meant. Steve Wiper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: ALROSS2@aol.com Subject: First ship designated USS Trivia question (for which I don't have the answer) - What was the first naval vessel designated USS and when was it so designated? Al Ross -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "John Anderson" Subject: Blackthorne >> Surely as this was (apparently) not a real ship - this would have gone into the hypothetical category? Is that where it ended up? << The Blackthorne was an actual ship she was United States Coast Guard Ship, anyone remember the USCG Blacthorne and the 23 peopel that died on her as a result of a ramming and then sank http://www.rushw.com/skyway/sky3.html this shows and actual picture of the USCG Blacthorne Also there was an HMS Blacthorne a Tree Class minesweeper commanded by Lieutenant J G Hilliard and operated in the English channel see attached web site http://www.navy.mil.nz/rnzn/sub_page.cfm?Article_ID=279&Sequence_ID=4 John Anderson West Coast 1/72nd -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: NEVENGER@aol.com Subject: Prinz Eugen could be saved Say I ran into this site tonight and found it interesting. It appears that their may be an effort to raise and restore the Prinz Eugen from it's grave site. I have no idea if this is a feasible endeavor, but I sure would not mind seeing such a ship restored to life. http://www.brandes.de/pg/book/indexe.htm -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Harold Stockton" Subject: Product Review: Solder It Sometimes there comes along a product that just screams out for the modeler to try, and this one caught my eye immediately. This product was found at Home Depot in the paint department, as if you needed to solder anything in and around a painted area. But, I saw the instant use of this cold or low heat soldering system anyway. With the need to either super-glue or low heat solder so many metal and photo-etched pieces in modeling today, this system uses the flame of a lighter or a match to activate the solder. What makes this product so useful is the ability for it to stick to so many ferrous and non-ferrous metals, leaving the final attachment to the model with super-glue or five-minute epoxies. According to the manufacturer, SOLDER-IT, Inc., this stuff instantly bonds copper, brass, bronze, nickel, platinum, chrome, model, stainless, galvanized, gold, silver, coated steel, cast iron, black steel, and steel. This product is stated to not work with aluminum, magnesium, or pot or "Monkey Metal" for you Brits out there. According to the manufacturer's claims, the tensile strength of a properly done joint is between 10,000 to 25,000 PSI., flows freely and smoothly at 450 degrees F., solders almost all metals, and is a very good conductor of electrical conductivity, and, is stress and vibration resistant. In order to use this product successfully, a person needs to be able to read and follow the adequate instructions on the back of the English only instructions. These read as follows: 1. Remove cap from nozzle. 2. Press plunger forward (into syringe) and paste will flow. Bead, strip or spot SOLDER-IT paste in an adequate amount to obtain a satisfactory joint. 3. Pull back slightly on plunger to stop the flow of paste. 4. Replace cap on nozzle. 5. Place the materials with SOLDER-IT joint directly IN the low temperature flames (do not place the SOLDER-IT above the flame as this will tend to smoke or soot blacken the joint - place directly in the flame). If a torch is used hold flame 2" to 3" from surface, evenly heating the work piece. Avoid playing flame on solder paste until flow temperature is reached, then with top of flame at the joint area direct the SOLDER-IT paste the length of the joint area. Allow to cool and wash flux residue off, using warm water and a stiff brush from the material and you have a superior silver finish solder joint or connection that will not blacken or tarnish. NOTE: Depending on thickness of metals to be soldered, use proper heating source to bring temperature up to 430 degrees F. Not for use with Aluminum, Magnesium, or Pot Metal. As with any soldering system, some experience with using it will produce the desired final appearance. What this system does offer is the ability to use very fine fuse wire for rigging purposes, after the metal wire has been stretched properly to hold a straight line, and for quickly soldering and reinforcing folded metal joints. Considering the 1/72 scale Flower class detail sets that are out there, and the folded aircraft handling cranes in the smaller scales, this product should save modelers many hours of time and frustration. I just finished "soldering" the ExtraTech cockpit tun together for that MiG-19 together and it was very simple and effective. One warning though, after you have heated something up to over 430 degree F, the item soldered can stay hot to the touch for some time depending on the "mass" of the item that you have just soldered. Happy soldering. Harold Stockton P.S. For those who may have difficulty obtaining this product from a local Home Depot or hardware store, contact me and I can help you get a sample. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: Craig R Bennett Subject: Re: USCG Air Station HI About the posting about the Coast Guard Air Stations. A couple years ago I was at a maritime display and watched on the Delaware River one of their copters drop a swimmer in the water and set off a flare so they could up a survivor(manquain) and then picked them up. Thanks for reply. Craig -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: "Paul and Renee Jacobs" <1250man@home.com> Subject: French Museums There is an excellent naval museum in Toulon, with lots of models, paintings and other stuff. Smaller than the collection in Paris, but every bit as good. Also there is a museum ship, an LST, loaded with vintage vehicles. And to top it off you can take a boat tour of the harbor and see lots of naval ships. Paul Jacobs -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: Ed8710@aol.com Subject: LST 632 Does anyone know where I could get a photo of WW11LST 632 (circa 1944 - 1946?) I have a friend who served aboard her during the Phillipine Campaign. Thanks, Ed -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: RhinoBones@aol.com Subject: Konig & Grosser Kurfurst Of the two ICM kits Konig & Grosser Kurfurst, which one is closest to it's original configuration as commissioned? Do the kits lend themselves to back dating? Regards, RhinoBones -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: royrichey@att.net Subject: not agent 1908... Mike, For those of us that haven't been around that long, is there a story behind the lumber cartel denial? Just curious. Roy -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: BSteinIPMS@aol.com Subject: Turner Publishing & Bob Santos >> I am converting the Old Revell Arizona to a 1935 USS PENNSYLVANIA and I have their (Turner Publishing's) book USS PENNSLYVANIA (BB-38). Could not have done the model without it. << Oh, c'mon, Bob. In scrutinizing all of the photos you've sent me of your magnificent models (especially the Revolutionary War gunboat PHILADELPHIA) I don't believe this for a minute. I'm firmly convinced you can make *anything* out of *nothing*, with no reference materials at all, and to museum standards. When I examined your photo of your 1/700 scratch-built LANGLEY (CV-1) with aircraft on the flight deck being attended by deck crewmen and aircraft struck down below on the open hangar deck, all fully detailed, I realized I was in the presence of greatness and that I was not worthy. Your fan, Bob Steinbrunn Minneapolis Member, Nautical Research Guild Tin Can Sailors IPMS/USA #3345 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Infomation -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Shane Weier Subject: Queensland Model Hobby Expo - August 2001 Hi guys, Just a notice to Australian members about the Queensland Model Hobbies Expo, which this year will be held: 25-26 August Brisbane Table Tennis Association Centre 86 Green Terrace, Windsor Brisbane, Australia All the usual model show features - Trade stands Club Displays Raffles Qld Scale Modelling Championship Demonstrations ..as much modelling talk as you can stand Contest entry forms and further information from myself at: sdw@qld.mim.com.au (Actually - the show isn't restricted to Aussies, several times in the last 4 years we've had international entrants carrying off armfulls of kits and pocketsfull of awards!) Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: EMSR569@aol.com Subject: Re: Jim Chaconas Hello Jim, I might be interested in purchasing your 1/720 Tribal Class DD. How much are you asking? Cheers, Sal Ruiz -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume