Subject: SMML VOL 1517 Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 10:25:45 +1100 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http://sandlehobbies.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: SS Norway / UU France 2: UNREP 3: A true story 4: Re: Norway/France and underway replenishment 5: Re: French Leave 6: Re: various - see below 7: Re: Alan Raven & John Roberts For sale 8: Swedish Tanker 9: AO64 10: Re: AO-64 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: New Reviews for ModelWarships.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: BECJPARKER@aol.com Subject: Re: SS Norway / UU France The Norway and the France are the same ship, not sure if the Norway is still in use as she was suppose to be pulled from service a year or two ago. She is really the last of the old trans Atlantic steam ships and was not built as a cruise ship in the modern day sense. If you are interestd in seeing some pictures of her I did a walk around on her during a cruise in 98 and sent the photos to Navies I think they still have them in their archives. Charlie -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Dean, Tom" Subject: UNREP HI Gang: Just joining in on the conversation about UNREP. In the RCN and I believe the RN it was refereed to as RAS (Replenishment at Sea). VERTREPS were just refereed to as cross decking. As many have stated it was always an evolution that kept you on your toes. Night RAS was especially tense. The distance line of flags became a line with small coloured lights, much like the ones we hang out at Christmas. Light sticks replaced the paddles for orders for the guys doing the actual refueling. Everything became larger and closer, and the decks were distorted shapes and shadows. Try it at night in the North Atlantic in December. On the fun side of this, we use to have a great deal of fun when we were only doing a light jackstay transfer from the fo's'cle. Usually for practice with a dummy, or transferring a live dummy to another ship, collecting mail or the night movie (yes before VCRs!). Don't recall what ship started it but the following usually happened. The gunners and stoker branch got together and would make a small cannon out of a spent 3"50 brass casing. They would make a carriage resembling guns of the days of sail. A small gun crew was formed and the gun positioned on the quarterdeck of helodeck. A thunder flash was dropped into the "gun barrel" and a grapefruit jammed into the end. The resulting explosion would send the fruit flying in the direction of the other ship. As time went by, more ships suddenly developed a "secondary battery". Ships would have 3 or 4 of the grapefruit guns. The guys would dress like pirates or the crew of a ship of the line. Became quite a ritual after awhile. Helped break the monotony. More fun would follow when the hoses were broken out to clean up the pulp. Don't really know if the guys in the Canadian Navy still do this, but hope that they do. Tom Dean Hamilton, Ontario Canada -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Subject: A true story Hi All I have heard of the venturi effect whilst rasing at sea. There is another aspect though. I was a Stoker P.O. serving aboard HMS Bulwark during1964 in the Far East. It was much cheaper ad quicker to replenish and refuel at sea from one of our RFA's. This, particularly when we had our RM Commando on board. It was turned into a major evolution and each time the stores came aboard in double quick time. On one occasion they were bringing in NAAFI stores. This included beer in cases, 24 cans to a case. Although supervised, the theory was that a large number went missing. Nothing was said but rumours abounded. By all accounts, a number were hidden behind the spuds in the spud locker on the fox'l. I assume by the Royal Marines. These too went AWOL. Even Stokers know that spud lockers were ment for potatoes I was duty watch and Duty Stoker PO. I was sent for by the Master At Arms. "Were doing a search of the Stokers mess, we want you down there while we search lockers". Each man had to stand by his locker, each about 3' x 3' x 3' deep. On the request everyone was told to open their locker for a search. One of my stokers opened his locker, it was full of cans of beer. Not one item of kit. He said "I think I'm in the S..t PO". There must be a moral there somewhere. About a year later I had joined the Met Police. How many times have I been in the same situation. A "hands-Up" job. When I consider the number of hiding places on a carrier in all the machinery spaces, watertight compartments etc. As we used to say in The Job - His wheel had come off! I digress. I must Back to my drawing board. I hope to have some GOOD NEWS on Volume 3 shortly. Oh, does anyone sell any of my books in Aus or NZ. (Those still in print that is). Yours "Aye" John -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Jim Johnson" Subject: Re: Norway/France and underway replenishment When the France was bought and renamed Norway, two of the four engines/screws were removed from the ship. This, of course, made her slower but gave her more revenue producing space. The underway replenishments went just as has been described by several people on the list. I might add several details from my days as a sailor. The oiler (or the supply ship) would set the course and speed. The ship taking on oil/bombs/supplies would have to match the speed and course of the supply ship. When on Yankee Station in off Vietnam, we (USS America) would refuel every third day. In-between these we would resupply/rearm. We would have a ship alongside two days out of three. We would be alongside the AO, AE or AOE on her portside while two or three DDs (usually FRAMed Gearings) would take turns on the starboard side of the supply ship. Usually when we supplied form an AOE, vertical replenishment was taking place. Large and light items were brought over by helicopter (CH-46s). The item that was most common were bomb tails. They were wrapped up in a cargo net and lifted straight up and then across and set on the rear of the flight deck. There were two helicopters workings at a time. After setting the bundle on the flight deck, the first helo would drop straight back then across to be astern of the supply ship, then straight forward to pick up another load. The other helo would be 180 degrees from the other one. Took a lot of co-ordination. One item of interest, the helicopter blades generate a huge amount of static electricity. If a crewman tried to grab the loop on the cargo while the cargo was grounded to the ship, he was in for a shock. One other item to contemplate. When a carrier goes across an ocean on a deployment with escorts, the escorts need to refuel from the carrier (or BB as in the case that was sighted that started this thread). Therefore the nuclear carriers have to have fuel tanks for NSFO (Navy Special Fuel Oil). One of the arguments for nuclear escorts. While on way to Vietnam, we went around the cape and through the Indian Ocean. We refueled from the British oiler HMS Tideflow. The British ship had about 20% of the men on deck as a US Oiler. They were much more professional than their American counterparts. (don't forget, that was back in the days of the draft). -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Donald Woolley Subject: Re: French Leave >> The French for "to take a French Leave" is "Filer ŕ l'Anglaise", that is (litterally): "to leave the English way"!!!! This is probably what we call "Entente Cordiale" << In the same vein, Spanish merchant sailors use to refer to syphilis as "the French disease". In France of course, it was called "the Spanish disease". Donald Woolley -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: various - see below >> Can somebody please tell me what airplanes the Japanese battleship Fuso carried? << From May 1933 - February 1937 she carried the Nakajima E4N2 Navy Type 90-2; from April 1938 until the end of 1942 she carried the Nakajima E8N2 Navy Type-95; and from early 1943 until loss she carried the Mitsubishi F1M2 Navy "Type-0". >> Upcoming USS Lexington? Have I been in a fog? I didn't know they were going to produce one. Which is it, CV2 or 16? << That will be CV-2. >> Just having come from a weekend of fighting with a tin of humbrol white paint & thinner, would like to know what other people use use for white paint or prefer to use... << We've heard the same from several of our customers regarding Humbrol white and some of their other light colours. We don't know if Humbrol have changed their formulation. Now that we are involved in paint production, I CAN tell you that light colours are problemmatic due to the necessary ratios of thinners and driers that have to be mixed prior to tinning; it's a headache for our producer, but he does a nice job of balancing things. >> How do WEM and Humbrol get their paint products to the customer? I note that paints and varnishes are prohibited items for mailing in the UK. Does this apply in North America? Could it be that quantity is a factor that allows postal delivery or do these suppliers have to rely on couriers or or other means? Just interested. << The restrictions are quantity-based, which is why we (and Hannants, and Humbrol) use 14ml tins; this allows regular postal shipment. And--to reiterate--the current shortage of a few Colourcoats colours is a short-term problem. Best, John Snyder White Ensign Models http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: dlfowler@apple.com Subject: Re: Alan Raven & John Roberts For sale Sami, Do Alan Raven or John Roberts know that you are trying to sell them. Have there families been notified? I thought this sort of thing wasn't allowed here any more. Regards, Duane Fowler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Michael London" Subject: Swedish Tanker I have a nice plan, from Motor Ship, of the handsome tanker Gustav Brodin delivered to Rederiaktiebolaget Disa at the end of 1958. I have been unable to find colour information for this ship or company and am hoping there is someone out there who can fill this gap in my knowledge. From b&w photos hull appears to be a dark grey, superstructure white, waterline ?, funnel buff or yellow with three red (?) bands. The same bands also appear at the bow. Any help would be appreciated. Michael London -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: CPOWEWAX@att.net Subject: AO64 Some key points not already addressed are as follows: The NWP specifys that the replenishment vessel always has OPCON (operational Control) of all vessels alongside. In other words the Tanker is the vessels that passes commands to ships alongside i.e. course,speed etc.,as well as if a vessel is failing to hold station. All rigs are equipped with more than enough cable to cover emergencies. Rigs are all equiped with tensioning devices that will break a rig when too much strain is put on it. A lound alarm systems goes off before this happens. My first tour of duty was on on the USS Neosho AO-143 fleet oiler. Learned much about underway replenishment back in 1964-1966. Back then a carrier burning NSFO (black oil) took up to 8 hours to refuel. On my last ship at sea USS Dwight D. Eisenhower (CVN-69) we completely refueled and resupplied in 3 1/2 hours. Of course today all the carriers carry distillate to refuel small boys, and JP for aircraft. Wayne CPO,USN (ret) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: NAVYDAZE@aol.com Subject: Re: AO-64 I guess with all these "sea stories" we have been telling, we never really answered Gary's question. My opinion is yes, the photo would be correct in the proportions of the distances of the ships in the UNREP photo. 50 to 80 feet - anywhere around there would be fine. I would like to add one more item to our stories - I mention that we "beached" or port side UNREP gear, but there was a time when carriers did port and starboard refueling at the same time. Can you imagine how that must have looked to the Bridge on the starboard side island and know that somewhere out of sight is a destroyer nearly under your port flight deck angle. Probably could see the mast though. Probably an accident waiting to happen. Mike Donegan NAVYDAZE - Naval & Aviation Artist -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Cadman Subject: New Reviews for ModelWarships.com Hi everyone, sorry this notice is late but the Ice storm that hit KC, Mo. last week really made it hard to get online. The site wasn't affected but my ability to respond and upload updates has been. New Reviews for February ModelWarships.com include: Modelkrak's NEW 1/700 Russian Protected Cruiser Aurora (resin kit) Loose Cannon Productions NEW 1/700 Barge set (resin kit) Loose Cannon Productions NEW 1/700 Tug Set (resin kit) Corsair Armada's NEW 1/700 Repair Ship Vestal AR-4 (resin kit) Pitroad / Skywave Japanese WW2 Destroyer Michishio (plastic kit) Fujimi 1/700 USS New Jersey WW2 Iowa Class Battleship (plastic kit) Tamiya 1/700 Japanese WW2 Destroyer Akatsuki (plastic kit) JAG Collective's NEW USS Newport LST-1179 (resin kit) JAG Collective's NEW USS Austin LPD-4 (resin kit) Plastic Ship Modeler Magazine #26 Model Ship Journal Magazine Winter 2001-2002 In addition we have added the following ships to the Gallery since our last announcement: 1/700 USS Lexington CV-2 (Fujimi) by Gabor 1/700 "Gulf Dawn" Operation JMSDF minesweeping operations in the Gulf War by Patrizio Carlucci 1/700 USS Arleigh Burke DDG-51 (Pit-Road) by Douglas Chan 1/96 Scale HMS Manchester British Light Cruiser by Dave Smithdale 1/350 IJN Battleship Yamato (Tamiya) by Guido Hopp 1/32 Scratchbuilt Oil Rig Diving Support Vessel, the Star Perseus by Ron Horabin 1/24 scratch built Clearway 1938 harbour dredger by Ron Horabin 1/400 USS Mission Capistrano Revell T-2 tanker by Daniel Jones 1/720 USS Enterprise CVN-65 (Revell) by Bert Legaspi New Images added 1/700 USS Normandy CG-60 (Dragon) by Patrizio Carlucci 1/720 USS Enterprise CVN-65 (Revell) by Bert Legaspi 1/24 Scratchbuilt S.S Norrix a 1920 twin hatch coaster by Ron Horabin 1/350 IJN Battleship Musashi (Tamiya) by David Fraser Scratchbuilt Hungarian Riverine Minesweeper AM-22 Óbuda by Tamás Házi Patrol Craft of the Royal Thai Navy by Somyot Khuptawathin 1/350 IJN Yamato Japanese Battleship by Jeff Farr 1/24 Scratchbuilt S.T. Foundation Franklin 1931 by Ron Horabin 1/350 USS Missouri (Tamiya) by Kelly Quirk Scratchbuilt 100 Gun Ship HMS Victory (new images) by Hankster 1/40 Scale USS Vermont BB-20 by Ron Horabin 1/200 IJN Yamato Japanese Battleship by Takaatsu Fukuoka AKA Mike 1/24 Scale Flower Class Corvette HMS Bryony by Ron Horabin Stay tuned for more. Timothy Dike Webmaster and Editor ModelWarships.com http://www.modelwarships.com/index1.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume