Subject: SMML VOL 1536 Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 00:15:23 +1100 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http://sandlehobbies.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Ship performance "Sea Stories" 2: Re: Top Speeds and other Sea Stories 3: Re: Turbo airbrush 4: Submarine top speed 5: Re: Top Speeds and other Sea Stories 6: Re: Sub Speeds 7: Re: Paasche turbo 8: Aztec Airbrushes 9: ships bells 10: AOE speeds 11: Re: Sub Speeds 12: Airbrush Questions 13: 1:600 Kits and Yamato 14: Re: Airbrushes 15: Re: USN speeds 16: Aztec -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Devin J. Poore" Subject: Ship performance "Sea Stories" Well, the one I always heard is that the USS Enterprise, due to her being "over-boilered" (evidently they didn't know how many boilers would be required due to her being the first nuke carrier, so they went the overkill route), can attain speeds high enough to warp the props on the shafts. Don't know if it's true, but that was going around while I was in the Navy. As far as a high speed factual story, I was on the USS Barney (DDG-6) for her final INSERV inspection and she did attain the rated 32 knots, plus a little more, but damn if we didn't think she was going to shake to pieces in the process. Not a bad performance considering she was 28+ years old at the time. Devin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: ALROSS2@aol.com Subject: Re: Top Speeds and other Sea Stories >> Had a chief at Machinist Mate school who claimed that if they came upon a nuclear ship and the conditions were right, they turn down the forced draft blower on the boilers and lay a large cloud of black oily smoke over the nuke << Between DEC 69 and JUL70, I was on a Med cruise on FORRESTAL (CVA 59). One bright, beautiful sunny day, we were steaming with our usual Soviet PETYA class gunboat off our starboard quarter. The off-duty Soviet sailors were enjoying the sun and getting nice tans. Then, over the flightdeck reproducer comes "Now clear the flight deck - blowing stacks". Well, I knew what was coming, so I headed for the fantail which was protected by the aft round down. A couple of minutes later, this nasty black stuff came belching out of the stack and drifted downwind, right onto the PETYA. Sure as hell ended the tanning session. I've often wondered whether it was coincidence or a skipper with a nasty sense of humor...:-} Al Ross -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Edward and Eleta Malewitz" Subject: Re: Turbo airbrush >> Does anyone use a turbo airbrush? Paasche sells a turbo-airbrush that is used for "very fine detailing" (read: more freehand work and less masking). It looks quite a bit different from a regular airbrush, but still uses a compressor (or gas). I have not been able to find any specific performance info or reviews on the web. The turbo costs about $200, so I would want to know a lot about the turbo before I bought one. << The Paasche (AB) turbo airbrush uses a high-speed turbine to move a needle in and out of the airflow very rapidly. The needle picks up a tiny drop of ink on each oscillation. This produces incredibly fine detail. But the operative word is ink. Vargas uses a AB on his Playboy illustrations. It's an ink illustrators tool. Bottom line: It will not spray paint. Ed Malewitz IPMS 7955 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Scott Weeks" Subject: Submarine top speed Now this is no s***: Back when I was in, the Navy changed the official line from "greater than 20 kts etc" to "greater than 25 kts." For those of us on Used-ta-fish, we had a hard time with that phrase, because our beloved scrap-heap could most assuredly NOT do greater than 25 kts! Of course, that wasn't a design flaw: the boat was restricted in speed due to various problems with the drive train. Upon her decommissioning, a lot of the crew were assigned to the Los Angeles, and I asked them what it was like to go from a slow-approach to a bona-fide fast attack submarine. They lamented that they still couldn't do top speed (at least sustained) as it tended to rip the SHT (the anechoic tiles) off the hull! True, not, I don't know, I'm just reporting what they said. However, it was generally acknowledged that the LA was still among the fastest boats out at Pearl at the time, even with the newer boats reporting in. Scott Give me Heaven or a 637 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: NAVYDAZE@aol.com Subject: Re: Top Speeds and other Sea Stories Re: Jim Johnson - Top Speeds Jim, I can believe the America did the speed you indicated. Not sure how fast the HAWK was but we had to go up to Korea when they shot down one of our planes and we were really moving - how could we tell? The damn stern was vibrating so bad you could hardly walk a straight line. Everyone thought we had a bent shaft or broken prop. The snipes assured us we that was not the case and they just had all the steam open and we were hauling a.. Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: Sub Speeds >> How fast is a 688 class sub? << That is classified, but it is generally given in public literature as just above 30 knots. In his book, "Running Critical", Patrick Tyler discusses the speed issue with US Nuclear submarines. Basically, they got bigger (more wetted hull, hence more resistance) and heavier thorugh Skipjack, Thresher/Permit and Sturgeon classes, all of which had the same S5W reactor. Speed dropped off. The LAs were made specifically to break 30 knots, using the more powerful S6G reactor. In order to reduce weight, the hulls were made lighter (thinner), thus giving up some of the diving depth gained wih the Thresher/Permits and Sturgeons. Seawolf is reported to be very fast with her S9G reactor, and she has HY-100 steel for her hull, stronger than the HY80 of the the three preceding classes. How fast, how deep? "In excess of 24 knots and depths in excess of 800 feet" Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: SHIPMDLR@aol.com Subject: Re: Paasche turbo >> Does anyone use a turbo airbrush? Paasche sells a turbo-airbrush that is used for "very fine detailing" (read: more freehand work and less masking). It looks quite a bit different from a regular airbrush, but still uses a compressor (or gas). I have not been able to find any specific performance info or reviews on the web. The turbo costs about $200, so I would want to know a lot about the turbo before I bought one. << Paasche has a web site that give details on all their airbrushes. I went there when I was bidding on a Turbo on eBay. Sorry, can't tell you the URL. One thing I know for sure. It's built for professionals like photo retouchers. It very easily clogs and sounds like a HO scale Formula 1 race car. Paint thinning must be precise or it will clog and it's not fun to clean. Rusty White Flagship Models Inc. Purchase on line with your Visa/Master Card/Amex/Discover http://okclive.com/flagship/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: Robert & Rose Brown Subject: Aztec Airbrushes Hi there: I have an Aztek A430, double-action airbrush. The beauty of the Atek system is that the nozzle is a separate piece, which you can easily switch. Each of it's nozzles does have a needle, but it's only about an inch long. When a nozzle gets clogged, it takes all of 10 seconds to unscrew it, and screw a new one back on. My previous airbrush was a Badger, and when it got clogged, the whole thing had to be taken apart, the needle pulled out, cleaned, and then put back together, a very frustrating task when all you want to do is paint the silly model.. Not to mention that the Aztek is very light, and has a colour cup that you can mount on the left or the right side, without it falling off halfway through the paint job. I recently switched to acyrlics, and the Badger was always clogging up as it is something of an art to get the paint thinned correctly. With the Aztek, it hasn't been a problem, mainly because it comes with some nozzles specifically for acyrlics, but also because it is real easy to switch to a new nozzle. Acyrlics certainly do have a large learning curve, but being able to sit for hours and do touch-ups without smelling up the whole house and developing a headache is a great benefit. When a nozzle gets clogged, it's into a bucket of water and a brisk scrubbing under the tap, much easier than all that thinner I used to have to deal with. You can't really use water to thin the paint for spraying, I use some stuff put out by Polly S for that, works great, but water is perfect for cleanup and for cleaning brushes. It took me a while, but I really like using them now, and for my money, the Aztek airbrush is outstanding, couldn't live without it.. Cheers Rob -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Subject: ships bells regarding provenance of Hornet's bell.... while I can't account for how the dealer got a hold of the thing--it very well could have come to him as a result of a dissolved 'hobby' museum, I don't recall. the bell is authentic. it came with the stub of the mounting bracket still attached--having been torch cut from off the ship. I didn't go into detail with the backstory of the bell, because I'd heard it told awhile ago and didn't want to make anything up out of a vague memory of lost details. knowing how frivolously the Navy treats some of its history and artifacts, it wouldn't surprise me if some bells got away despite the best efforts of the Naval History Branch which has some very dedicated historians. tracing bells from various ships can be a fun pastime. after all the palaver over Hornet's I started seeking out the locations of the other Essex class bells. I was pleased to discover that some of the new namesake gators (Essex and BonHomme Richard) have the original Essex bells aboard. S. Sachsen, Archivist USS Hornet Museum -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Subject: AOE speeds this is from Silverstone's US Warships since 1945: AOE's designed to supply a carier battle group... Sacramento and Camden have turbines built for cancelled BB Kentucky. shaft horsepower: 100,000 = 26 kts. s -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) To: "SMML" Subject: Re: Sub Speeds Hi SMMLies, ships speed. While aboard the USS Inchon LPH 12 for 3.5 year we got up to flank speed only a few times. The LPH's only put out 23 knots with a tail wind. At that speed the ship shuttered as if it were coming apart. I notice all ships do that at their designed top speed. Maybe they could squeeze a few more knots out of her in an emergency but who would want to ride her. Forget sleeping and as for chow you held on to your tray or it bounced to the deck. Keith -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "Jim Johnson" Subject: Airbrush Questions The turbo airbrush referred to is the Paasche AB. It has a turbo run by the air that ends up spraying the medium. The turbo has an eccentric on it which pushes a small needle back and fourth. This picks up the medium and carries it into the airstream. I have held an AB but have never used one. It looks to be quite fiddly. The brush cane with about 25 spare needles so I can imagine that their life expectancy is not to long. They are designed primarily for very fine work. Commercial illustration and photo retouching are their stock and trade. They need very thin medium. Paint would not work very well unless thinned way down. They usually use water colors or inks. The brush might be good for putting on rust stains in 1/700, but wouldn't be very practical for most model building. The Aztec airbrushed do indeed have a needle in them. It is just very short. It is contained inside the nozzle assembly. The needle is very sharp and the cone it fits in is made of teflon or nylon. According to the instructions, you can't disassemble the nozzle for cleaning. It also stated that you don't need to. I used an Aztec for several years and can tell you that statement is false. I had to take the nozzle apart many times and clean the components. There is a metal spring inside that gets gunked up. This happens most often when you interchange acrylics and enamels. It is not hard to do. They tell you not to do it because the needle is so delicate that it can be easily bent. Go over to Hyper-scale, which is a model aircraft and armor site, and ask about an Aztec. Some will say that they would never use anything else and other say they would rather paint by brush than use an Aztec. I have never seen an airbrush have such diametrically opposed viewpoints. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Mike Bartel Subject: 1:600 Kits and Yamato >> How is the 1/600 Arii/Otaki Yamato/Musashi? They are sitting on the shelf at the Hobby shop I pass on the way home. I'm looking to make the 1/700 and 1/350 Y'm'tos in boxes in the cabinet jealous. << I have the 1:600 Yamato from Arii, and I like the looks of it. The hull is in one piece. The detailing is good (mostly accurate), proportions are nice, and it's in the 1944/45 fit. One of the more accurate older Yamato kits. It was designed for motorizing, and the whole deck is removable. That makes for a little challenge to fill the seam at the hull side near the deck, but you shouldn't have any trouble with it. You can otherwise build it so that motorizing features (like holes for switches, props, etc. won't show. And, it comes with all the proper rudders and propellors to build a nice display model. Spend the money- if you like the Yamato, it's a good kit to have. Now, if you can get Otaki's old 1:750 scale Yamato, you'll have a ball with that one. You can motorize it for water, or with low-gear wheels protruding from the hull for tabletop play! It got some smiles at the local club when I showed them the one I built! If you're into 1:600 scale, the Yamato kit from Nichimo is nice, too. It has the typical Nichimo 2-piece hull. >> Ok ok, if somebody would start making new 600 scale kits I "might" open my wallet. Anybody out there listening? << I second Keith's request. My wallet is ready too. How about a 1:600 Renown (WW2 fit)? DISCLAIMER- Don't read anything into this- just thinking out loud for the future. Mike Bartel IHP http://ihphobby.tripod.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "Ken Goldman" Subject: Re: Airbrushes >> One problem area that all airbrushes (except Aztec) have is with the tip or needle. << That sharp pointy thing in my Azrec airbrush sure looks like a needle to me. The design of the nozzle housing gives it some protection even if it is dropped, but it still is possible to bend the point. Ken Goldman THE WALRUS AND THE CARPENTER unique wood sculpture and fine scale models www.walruscarpenter.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: Minadmiral@aol.com Subject: Re: USN speeds John Snyder sez; >> Seriously, there's LOTS that remains understated by the armed forces, the Navy included << So John; A diorama of a major USN warship (DD or larger?) towing a water skier would be reasonable?? Or BAINBRIDGE drag racing a CALIFORNIA?? Chuck Duggie WoodenWalls Listmeister eGroups : WoodenWalls Naval wargamer, amateur naval historian, and ship modeler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "Malcolm N. Waite" Subject: Aztec Hi The Aztec airbrush does have a needle but they are very short and built into the interchangeable nozzles. After years of spending more time cleaning a conventional airbrush than actually painting with it I have to say an Aztec is a joy. Malcolm Waite -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume