Subject: SMML VOL 1561 Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2002 00:45:57 +1100 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http://sandlehobbies.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Where would I want to be? 2: HYPOTHETICAL 3: Italian flags 4: Eaglewall Kits 5: Re: Hypothetical time travel 6: Indian Type 41 Frigates 7: Ships and time travel 8: Wish List 9: Museums in Seattle 10: Graf Spee 11: Model Ship Journal 12: Time travel 13: 20mm mounts 14: Re: Enjoying our hobby 15: USS North Carolina 16: Back In time 17: Re: Banner/Trumpeter 18: Re: In defense of the Airfix Bismarck 19: Re: Ship Wish List 20: Ocean Liner Models 21: Re: Colour References 22: Re: discussion time again..hypothetical 23: Debrecen 1944 24: Ticonderoga class CGs (1st batch) 25: Chinese kits -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Jeremiah O. Coughlin" Subject: Where would I want to be? I would like to be a 18 year old Petty Officer again, on any ship, anywhere. I would never lay hands on another Bosn'Mate again in anger, never give my Chief a piece of my mind, drink Coke instead of whiskey, go with ladies I met at church instead of a saloon. I would be a boring 4.0 sailor. Naw, never happen. Semper, jeremiah... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "DUCKMAN" Subject: HYPOTHETICAL HOW ABOUT THE ANXIETY, RELIEF, AND FINALLY ABSOLUTE EUPHORIA ON THE BRIDGE OF ENTERPRISE, JUNE 4TH TO 7TH, 1942. DAVID IN DIXIE -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: CokerRE@aol.com Subject: Italian flags Anyone out there know where I can obtain a real (or copy) Royal Italian Naval flag like the ones they flew in World War II roughly 4 by 6 feet to 5 by 8 feet. Please reply off line to PC Coker at cokerre@aol.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Barry Fleet" Subject: Eaglewall Kits As we seem to be on a trip down memory lane (1/600 Bismark et al) does anyone out there have photos of the 1/1200 Scale models made by Eaglewall of Brighton, UK. Theses were immensly popular in the 1960's in the UK. For a young lad they were affordable (10p UK for the cruisers, destroyers etc and 15p for the battleships and carriers) and the range of kits was extensive and unusual. I remember building all of the available kits at the time (~1960-1965) and though they were amazing. For nostalgias sake I would like to see a photo of a completed model although probably like most memories they are better than the reality. Cheers Barry Fleet Canada -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Roland Mar Subject: Re: Hypothetical time travel "Tis a bit on the ancient side from most of the scenarios posited here, but I would like to have been aboard the Washington Schooner [one of the pseudo-navy created by George Washington before the Congress got around to creating a real Navy] HANNAH as she took the British supply brig NANCY in 1775. Crewed by Col. John Glover's 21st Mass. Rgmt. {the Marbleheaders} they were sent out to capture supplies for the army besieging Boston. Some units were down to 3 rounds per man, and the army was desperate. When they took the NANCY she was loaded to the gunwales with tons of powder and shot, and what was then the largest mortar in N. America. Upon its first firing, it was promptly dubbed "Congress"; presumably because of the vast amount of noise and hot air emitted. That capture literally saved the Revolution. It would have been magnificent to see the reaction on shore as she came in with her prize. I might be persuaded to leave my usual 1/600-1/720 WW II genre to model her if I can get enough data. Roland Mar -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Dave Swindell Subject: Indian Type 41 Frigates Anyone interested in these? I've just been playing with a new toy, a film scanner and trying it out on some old Black and White negatives I'd just un-earthed. I found a series of shots I took in 1985 of three Indian Type 41's leaving Mina Qaboos, Oman. I managed to ID the series using Conway's Fighting Ships, but this throws up an anomaly as it states the three Indian 41's were F31, Brahmaputra; F37, Beas; and F38, Betwa; whereas two of the photo's are of a 41 carrying the Pennant no. F39, very clear in one shot. Anyone know what this one was called? or is Betwa's Pennant no mistyped in my Conway Book? It's not entirely accurate as it only notes Brahmaputra as having the rear 4.5" twin mount removed and a large deckhouse classroom being added, but all 3 were identical when these photo's were taken (I thought it was just one until I looked closer at the Pennant no's !) For anyone interested I've posted the pics on alt.binaries.pictures.military. Dave Swindell -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: raisingirl@mindspring.com Subject: Ships and time travel hi all.... In the spirit of keeping things fun, which ship(s) would I want to be aboard if I could go back in time? Let me see.... a. S/S United States, maiden voyage, July 1952 b. USS Hornet, July 24, 1969 or USS Yorktown, December 27, 1968 (tie) c. M/S City of Rayville, summer 1937, so I could interview Ben Robertson, the guy I wrote my dissertation about, who signed on as a seaman to research a book about life at sea :) d. USS Nimitz, December 6, 1941 (oops! Too much "Final Countdown"!) :) jodie -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: Richa5011@aol.com Subject: Wish List There are so many... But I would be thrilled with a 1/700 Scale: Pennsylvania or Tennessee class Armored Cruiser (or better yet, both!) HMS Tiger (Battlecruiser) British S/T/U/V/W/Z Class destroyer Lexington Class Battlecruiser And even more thrilled with a 1/350 Scale: SMS Moltke/Goeben British S/T/U/V/W/Z Class destroyer Queen Elizabeth Class Battleship (preferably QE or Warspite) Nat -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Robert Lockie" Subject: Museums in Seattle Hi One of the kind souls out there in SMMLie land posted an address for a website which had records of all (or at least most) of the museums in the USA some time ago. Like an idiot, I have mislaid it, and someone who is going next week has just asked me what military museums there are to see in Seattle. My only trip there was limited to a conference and half a day getting to Bremerton and back, so I am no expert, but can anyone recall the address and post it again please? Or even answer the specific question about what there is there! Many thanks. Robert Lockie Swindon UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Graeme Martin Subject: Graf Spee An acquaintance was telling me when he was on passenger ships 20 years ago out of England, that they ran aground a 20,000 ton liner in the Rio da la Plata on a sand bank that was uncharted as the channels keep shifting in that enormous estuary. He also said that the Graf Spee wreck was still visible at certain tides and that she kept moving also on the shifting seabed. The Uruguay governement never salvaged the wreck and that it must have been and or still is, a shipping hazard. Does anybody know whether she is still there and what has become of her? Graeme Martin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Denis & Marilyn Campbell Subject: Model Ship Journal A few days ago,Victor Baca posted a list of articles available as reprints and, since nobody has piped up with this yet, I will. Having been a subscriber since the first issue (00), as soon as I saw the list, I saved it to disk and also printed a copy which I keep with my collection of MSJ magazines. It will be a great index when I am trying to find an article. Fine Scale Modeler has indexes for several years posted on their web site (they no longer print an index in the first issue of each year) and I downloaded those too - they have not yet posted for 2001 - and printed them and keep each with its own year of magazines. Victor, you might want to consider doing the same or, printing and index for the previous year in the first issue of each year - we are always trying to find articles we KNOW we have read and an index saves a lot of wear and tear on fingers tired from building models. By the way, MSJ is one of the best modeling related magazines I have ever come across. Denis Campbell Avon MA -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "D.Przezdziecki" Subject: Time travel I would have to have my camera but here are my choices: 1 - Port Arthur during Russo-Japanese war sometime from April to August 1904, 2 - Spithead Fleet Review 24th of June 1911, 3 - Mary Celeste, just to see what has really hapenned. D.P -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "Devin J. Poore" Subject: 20mm mounts I just picked up my first Tamiya 1/350th scale kit, the Fletcher. Does anyone know how accurate scale wise the 20mm mounts are, specifically the base and breech of the gun? I always replace the rest of the guns (whoever makes them) with brass rod and the GMM details anyway. thanks, Devin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: "D.Przezdziecki" Subject: Re: Enjoying our hobby Axel, while I agree with most of your post I do have some problems with this statement: >> So, we should not laugh about people who buy cheap kits, with less details and less quality. If they enjoy building them and they are satisfied with the results, let them be. They have reached their goal and shouldn t be discouraged by modellers talking bad about these models. And dont forget, for many of us is building a kit from our boyhood again from the 5th or 8th reissue a trip down memory lane << We certainly should not laugh at anybody for making their best efforts or spoil their fun by slamming their achievements as long as choices they make are an informed ones. Price of the kit isn't always a measure of it's quality and without proper informations people will sometimes go for the top of the box illustration hoping that inside will match outside. We all have to start somehere and beginners should be given all the encouragement they need but an unobtrusive advice or a tip should not be a problem should it??? Nobody will surely object if you were to tell him/her that "Yes of course you can have this kit but you will me much better off buying this one!" I have spend long hours helping two 12 years old in their modelling adventures and I know for a fact that as long as they know that their efforts are appreciated they do not mind a positive criticism or two. After all they can see what other people can achieve and they want to get better too. Best wishes D.P -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: Graeme Martin Subject: USS North Carolina Wooden Decks. I physically visited the USS North Carolina in 1998 and at that time she had a lot of new teak timber staked on the aft deck waiting to be laid. I believe the timber was gifted by the Sultan of Brunei. A worthwhile ship museum to visit as are all the American battleships. Graeme Martin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: "Mark Krumrey" Subject: Back In time As I gave this some thought, it finally occured what ship I would want to be on. I would want to be on the signal bridge of the USS Marvin H. Macintyre, APA 129. My dad was a 3rd class Signalman, and I think it would be so neat to see what he was like at 21 years of age, during the final days of WWII, a salty Sailor. Naturally, I would want to be a Marine, hanging out on the signal bridge, as Marines are wont to do! I should know. Was on 9 different ships, a Marine on each one, and always found my way to the signal bridge! Mark Krumrey New RIchmond WI Master Gunnery Sergeant USMCR (Ret.) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: IAAFru2@aol.com Subject: Re: Banner/Trumpeter Does anyone know if Trumpeter/Banner plans to release any more of the "Pearl Harbor" Battleships? Since I cannot afford the "Resin" (Which are only for rich people) I look forward to manufactures like Banner/Trumpeter to release the kits I have or can only dream about. George -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "Robert Hernandez" Subject: Re: In defense of the Airfix Bismarck Steve/Chuck, I too like the old Airfix 1/600-scale Bismarck kit. My feelings (Steve) are also based on fond memories of my childhood, building and playing with my Airfix and even the Revell model ship kits. I wrote one of the kit reviews on this particular kit for the IMM site that you may have read. The Airfix kit can make a reasonable representation of the ship with a little work. The Airfix kit is a very old kit from the late fifties. It is not as accurate as the 1/570-scale Revell Germany kit which is an early sixties model kit. The newer Monogram 1/617-scale kit (as Chuck mentioned) is the best of the three but a little small for a 1/600 scale fleet. These old kits are not only a good source for walking down memory lane but are a good starting point for plastic modelers looking to improve their skills. A little (or a lot) of scratch building can be done without risking far more costly kits to what might prove to be unsuccessful plastic surgery. I know I can purchase some of these old kits heavily discounted in my area. The same cannot be said for the Tamiya or Samek kits, which I believe are the most accurate of the battleship Bismarck. Bottom line is that they bring us some enjoyment! Best regards, Robert Hernandez -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From: "Michael J. D'Silva" Subject: Re: Ship Wish List Ted wrote: >> Please, please, please to the ship model Santa Claus- HMS Tiger 1916 HMS Invincible 1916 (coming in resin) HMS Agincourt 1916 << Yes please, and may I add: HMS Bellerophon BB(1909) HMS St. Vincent BB(1909) HMS Neptune BB (1911) HMS Indefatigable BC (1911) HMS Colossus BB (1911) HMS Orion BB (1912) HMS Queen Mary BC (1912) HMS KGV BB (1912) HMS Iron Duke BB (1914) HMS Queen Elizabeth BB 1915, Barham BB 1915, Malaya BB 1916, Valiant BB 1916 or Warspite BB 1916 HMS Royal Sovereign BB 1916. HMS Erin BB 1914 HMS Canada BB 1915 HMS Repulse BC (1916) Wow, this could turn out to be an expensive Christmas. Michael -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From: "xy Evans" Subject: Ocean Liner Models I would appreciate any information on how to contact Ocean Liner Models by email. I am interested in their etched metal and resin conversion sets for the Titanic to Britannic conversion. Numerous emails to raytom@gte.net have brought no response. Many thanks Bob Evans -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From: "Kelvin Mok" Subject: Re: Colour References >> Take a look at the bottom of page 33 in the WP #15 Schnellboote book. The is a row of color samples that relate to the S-boats with the German name and the English translation. << Oops. I spotted that only after I made the post. That's a great feature. but it was almost lost in a richness of data found in your book - so many things to look at at once - and I didn't expect to find that under a photo. A suggestion. The chips should be larger, 1.5 cm or 2 cm squares and displayed either in the center page with the colour drawings or on the cover itself in its full glossy glory. The German names are fairly easy to remember, rot=red, grau=gray, grin=green, dunkel=dark, mittel=middle and so on. Its the US Navy colours (measure so and so) that are really hard to remember. I am numerically challenged and my memory doesn't get better any more. Kelvin Mok -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 22) From: Minadmiral@aol.com Subject: Re: discussion time again..hypothetical Me?; HMS VICTORY at TRAFALGAR. Or CSS HUNLEY. Chuck Duggie WoodenWalls Listmeister eGroups : WoodenWalls Naval wargamer, amateur naval historian, and ship modeler -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 23) From: Friedrich Kappes Subject: Debrecen 1944 Hi, I look for the following information, can you help once again? Debrecen (Hungarian river gunboat, ex k.u.k. Lachs) since when armed like in 1944? http://picpage7.tripod.com/debrecen.jpg TIA Friedrich The FriedrichFiles http://www.geocities.com/friedkappes/flagship.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 24) From: Marsh Edwin Subject: Re: Chinese companies and new stories Mr. Wiper stated: >> Sometimes persons will get related stories mixed up and create a new story that will be perpetuated. And so on. And so on. P. S. I never gave Trumpeter my Indianapolis pattern. This rumor is an example of the above statement. << So I guess this is an example of a new story starting. Here's what I seem to recall about your statements. During a discussion on this subject (or a similar one on what was coming from Trumpeter) on the Steelnavy message board, you announced that Trumpeter was basing their Hornet off the BWN kit, and their Essex off the Tom's kit. In addition, you stated that they were also doing an Indianapolis, and either a North Carolina or South Dakota, leaning toward a North Carolina (which, in lieu of their recently released catalog, could be considered another new story). Because they were doing this, you stated that they were going to receive all of your research, including your patterns, since, in your words, they would steal it anyways. Yes, you may be correct in that you never gave your pattern to them, but you certainly gave the impression that you were not only willing to give it to them, but also were working in conjunction with them to develop this supposed kit. Now, I realize that this little episode does cause harm to your position in opposing their kits, but I think that since you claim to be a straight shooter and only constrained by facts, you should address your new statements in light of your past statements on the same subject. So, I ask which of these contradictory positions is yours? The one that bashes, or the one that colludes? Could it be that both are correct when the time periods are taken into consideration? Could it be that one party didn't keep, as you said in your message in #1554, their part of the "deal"? Edwin -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 25) From: tangui De Saint Hilaire Subject: Ticonderoga class CGs (1st batch) Hello there! I am currently finishing Revell's USS Ticonderoga, and, as ever, recieving contradictory data, this time on auxiliary armament: on U S NAvy's own website, I see Ticonderoga CGs carry two Mk46 triple-tube torpedo-launchers; I go to check this on Hazegray's and see instead of this two 20mm machine guns! As one could expect, Revell's kit provides nothing of those. Can anyone tell me the truth about that? The actual ship is USS Vincennes CG 49. Thanks for an answer, Tangui de Saint Hilaire -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 26) From: AAA Hobby Subject: Chinese kits Oh, I just realized/remembered something and want to be the first to point it out: The 1/350 Arizona kit has -never- appeared in a Trumpeter box. It was boxed as Banner thru Marco Polo and Mini Hobby Models (their second tier name). I guess they did this to cheat themselves out of the their own deal? And, BTW, Stevens does not have the sole import rights to all of the kits produced by the PLAMC, just the Trumpeter name. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume