Subject: SMML VOL 1920 Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 14:05:22 +1000 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http://sandlehobbies.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: U-103 2: Re: Re Releases 3: fireboat 4: Re: Re Releases 5: Naval Jacks 6: Revell Schnellboot 7: Revell's Fire Fighter 8: Bring Back the Oldies, but Sort-of-Goodies 9: LCC plans 10: Re: Fireboat 11: firefighter 12: fire boats 13: RE-RELEASES 14: Re: Heller Strasbourg 15: Re: SSP RE-Releases ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Victor M. Baca" Subject: U-103 >> I again turn to SMML, and ask if someone can please tell me more about this class of submarine, and possibly supply a photo and/or a general line drawing thereof. << Hi Franklyn: Have you seen Osprey's book titled, "U-boats of the Kaiser's Navy" by Williamson and Palmer? I just bought this one at my local hobby shop and it tells the history of these early U-boats in a concise fashion with good illustrations and photos. The development of the WWI U-boats is detailed clearly and there's a lot of info packed into this little softcover volume. U-103 was a coastal unit assigned to Unterseebootsflotille 2, one of the home flotillas in 1918. This flotilla was commanded by Kapitanleutnant von Rosenberg Grusycyznski. Victor Baca ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: Rod Dauteuil Subject: Re: Re Releases >> However, some stuff that didn't make the cut were the original ESSEX. << I trust you're talking about the 1/720 straight deck, not the 1/540 modernized. You're right about this not being an SSP. But this is currently available through Revell of Germany. >> Ya I think I would like to see the old kit of the Pine Island again but what I would really like to see is the Lindberg Minesweeper and the LSD << Naval Base Hobbies is supposed to be releasing the Minesweeper in their own box. I've been watching their site monthly. Shaya, any anticipated release date? Rod ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Kurt Van Dahm Subject: fireboat I have two of these kits tossed together in one box after one got wet and soggy in a water pipe leak. Great kit and can be r/c'd with just a bit of planning. What is real neat is that one set of the chrome parts is "brass" plated. The other kit's parts are chrome - the brass ones are really a lot nicer. I plan to build the model with a lot of kit bashing and scratch building of the water towers and railings. It will make an outstanding static display model with these additions. Take care, Kurt Van Dahm Westmont, IL ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: David Wells Subject: Re: Re Releases Michael Donegan (NAVYDAZE@aol.com) wrote: >> Ya I think I would like to see the old kit of the Pine Island again but what I would really like to see is the Lindberg Minesweeper and the LSD, could do a lot of scratch building additions to them. Of course as always I would really like to see some of the old Renwal kits, which I guess if the story is true, they no longer exist. I also remember a very detail, at least for that time, was a model of a DE, not the Revell Buckley, could have been another one of the Renwals. For those who have never seen a Renwal they were not accurate at all, sometimes pure fantasy, such as their missle cruiser and missle destroyer (or DLG?) but damn they were neat to build as a kid. Lots of good molded in detail on the bulkheads if I remember right. << I have to come to Renwal's defense, at least a little. While far from perfect, they had a lot of potential if you knew what to do with them. First of all, I like them because they are 1/500 scale and full hull. Many Renwal kits were apparently molded before the actual ships were complete, and Renwal often cut corners by using details from other ships. The Renwal DLGs certainly have major problems. The superstructure is clearly that of a Mitscher-class DL. It will take considerable modification to make the superstructure into a correct Dewey (Coontz?) class DLG/DDG. I know, because I have an ongoing project to do this. On the other hand, I may take another of these kits and make a Mitscher class DL. All I will have to do is shorten the hull a bit, and I'm almost all the way there. The hull will take some considerable work below the waterline, (as with many kits of their era, the hull below the waterline is kind of "boxy".) The 5" gun and the Terrier launchers are quite nice. The Renwal CLGs are another interesting case. It seems clear to me that Renwal did not have correct plans for any of the CLG conversions, so they simply took Cleveland class CL plans, swapped 3"/L50s for the old 40mm quads, and replaced the two aft turrets with Terrier missile launchers. The resulting kit is pretty hard to make into a correct converted Cleveland, but I suspect that they might make nice uncoverted Clevelands with a little less work. As with the DLGs, the missile launchers are quite nice, (I'm using some of the spares on a Revell Long Beach) and the 6" guns are pretty good too. The Renwal Essex SCB-125 kit is also interesting. The kit, when completed, looks a little flat, but it's got some interesting advantages. The F9Fs are REALLY nice, and the wooden flight deck detail is impressive, especially compared to the Revell SCB-125. IIRC, when the Essexes were first modernized under SCB-125, you could still see the wood planking on the deck. (couldn't find a picture to confirm this quickly) And then there were the SSBNs, which are an entire topic unto themselves. Now THEY would be a far better re-issue for Revell than their own inferior SSBN models. I agree with Mike that they were nice kits to build. I always thought that Renwal kits fit together very nicely. I'm not sure that Revellogram destroyed the molds, though it is possible that they did. I know that Revell re-issued the old Renwal CLG kit and SCB-125 kit. I think they re-issued the North Carolina as well. While it is possible that they scrapped the molds in the years since, I hope they still have them in a warehouse somewhere. Some others have mentioned the old Revell Boston and Forrest Sherman kits and the old Monogram Brooke as good candidates for re-issues. I agree that these would be great to see on the market again. David R. Wells "There seems to be something wrong| David R. Wells with our bloody ships today" | Adm. D. Beatty, May 31, 1916 | http://home.att.net/~WellsBrothers/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Donald Woolley Subject: Naval Jacks I noticed this in the caption of some of the pictures at The USN's Around the Fleet Page (http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/images/in-news.html): "Secretary of the Navy Gordon R. England has directed all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Jack in place of the Union Jack for the duration of the war on terrorism. Since the nation's Bicentennial when all Navy ships flew the jack, only the oldest active commissioned ship, USS Kitty Hawk (CV 63), was authorized to fly it. " Donald Woolley ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Doug Bauer" Subject: Revell Schnellboot The colors listed on the instruction sheet for the S-100 are given a number, but I couldn't find anything identifying who the manufacturer is....I checked the Revell AG website but didn't see any numbers for their line of paints. If anyone knows what these numbers signify, do you also have a comparison chart for other manufacturers' color offerings? Doug Bauer Poway, CA ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "Victor M. Baca" Subject: Revell's Fire Fighter Here's a capsule history for Dave re: the Fire Fighter-- The Revell Fire Fighter was written up in an old issue of Scale Ship Modeler by Loren Perry. He R/C'd the model and it was a nice little kit. You might also try obtaining Paul Ditzel's "Fireboats" published by Fire Buff House, a division of Conway Enterprises in New Albany, Indiana. The ISBN is 0-925165-01-0. There is extensive photography showing Fire Fighter on duty, using her powerful firefighting appliances and of course portrait shots and the obligatory water cannon displays. She's a formidable apparatus and beautifully designed from a naval architectural viewpoint. In all, the Fire Fighter is referenced and illustrated in no less than 21 pages of Ditzel's book. The Fire Fighter's name was chosen by Mayor Fiorello H. Laguardia who wanted to honor all of New York's firefighters with this boat. She was the first of FDNY's boats not be named after a mayor of the city. It's almost unheard of for a politician to pass on a chance for personal glory and Mayor Laguardia chose an appropriate name for the new boat he was instrumental in obtaining for his city's protection. Fire Fighter was designed by no less than William Francis Gibbs of the noted naval architecture and marine engineering firm Gibbs & Cox. Gibbs was a fire buff and knew how to get City Hall to fund and support the project. Mayor Laguardia obtained approval and funding for the boat in 1937 and turned Gibbs loose in designing the ultimate fireboat. This was no mean feat as the Great Depression was on and most citizens were leery of such an expensive boat when New Yorkers were standing in line at soup kitchens. The project did employ quite a few men, though. The Fire Fighter was FDNY's first diesel-electric boat, she threw 20,000 GPM of water at the fire and packed that kind of wallop on a 135' hull, displacing nearly 600 tons. Because Gibbs used the innovative diesel-electric propulsion system in this new vessel, he was instrumental in drawing the age of steam and gasoline to a close in fireboat design. Officially known as Hull-856 at her builder's yard (United Shipyards, Inc.), The fire Fighter was launched in August of 1938. A bottle of champagne across her bow sent her down the ways and into firefighting history as the most recognized fireboat in the world. The new boat was welcomed into the brotherhood by FDNY's fireboat fleet with whistles and water cannon spray. The "Fighter" carried two submarine type Winton/Cleveland diesels with enough power to run the propulsion generators. They also feed power to everything from fire pumps to concrete cutters and chainsaws. She not only 'takes the heat,' her reinforced bow is also capable of breaking through ice to attack a fire. Fire Fighter is driven by two 6' bronze three-bladed props and twin rudders for excellent control. All the vessel's controls are operated from the pilothouse, a pioneering design for fireboats. Her pilothouse is huge compared to earlier tug-style designs and was found only in Los Angeles Fire Department's landmark fireboat Ralph J. Scott which originated this design element. Fire Fighter draws water to feed her fire mains from the harbor through a 27" diameter T-shaped hull tunnel. Her DeLaval pumps can disgorge 5,000 gallons each at 150 psi. For really big fires, they can be connected in series to provide 10,000 gallons at 300 psi. She can also deliver 500 gallons per minute of firefighting foam for chemical and petrochemical fire suppression at 100 psi. In 1980, the Fire Fighter was placed aboard a barge and shipped to Robert E. Direktor's boat yard in Rhode Island for a complete overhaul including replacement of her fire mains. Ditzel's book has a very good shot of her on the barge and her twin screws, rudders and hull shape show to good advantage. Other photos show almost every inch of this impressive fireboat--so you gotta get his book if you're interested in fireboats. The Fire Fighter's history is replete with brave deeds and includes a Gallant Ship Award bestowed on her by the U.S. Government. When a disaster is so huge, the city's fire mains fail, it rests on the fireboat and her crew to supply water using their pumps to augment the city supply. Fire Fighter was adjacent to the seawall at the World Trade Center on 11 September 2001 providing direct attack on the worst fire in our history. She added this attack on America to the long line of alarms she answered during her long career. Fire Fighter celebrated her golden anniversary in 1988 and I'm really pleased to see Revell re-issue this kit again. As a matter of fact, we need more fireboat kits. Any of you manufacturers want to step up to the plate? Last time I checked the hobby shop shelves there was an awful lot of dull Navy Gray--Revell's Fire Fighter will add a bit of color to the retail shelves and maybe get more young boys and girls to consider the fire service as a career. There's certainly no better calling than that. Victor Baca Editor & Publisher MODEL SHIP JOURNAL ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Katz, Gene S" Subject: Bring Back the Oldies, but Sort-of-Goodies I'll join the old Revell bandwagon also: Pine Island, T2 tanker, C-3 (I think) freighter, Brasil/Argentina, AH, APA, FDR/Midway (straight deck), AG or EAG (this may have been Renwal?). Oh, the Aurora raider "Atlantis" of course. Maybe the cutaway FBM "boomer boat". Gene S. Katz ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: ALROSS2@aol.com Subject: LCC plans Aside from those in "Allied Landing Craft of WWII", has anyone ever come across any factory/BUSHIPS plans for a Landing Craft, Control (LCC) or Landing Craft, Support (LCS [S])? The former was a 56' steel boat while the latter was essentially a decked-over Higgins LCP (L) with a cockpit. Would like to add them to my collection. Also, for ACF V3, I'm trying to track down a set of Higgins plans for the 69' types supplied to the RCN and RNN and a set for the 78' Huckins PT. In the RN, the 69' boats served as MGB 69-73 & 100-106, while the Huckins boats were PT 95-102, 255-264. I have partials for both types, but am always looking for more. Huckins is currently selling some very detailed drawings for a PT, but (curiously) they are for an experimental type that does not appear to have ever been built. Al Ross ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Loren Perry Subject: Re: Fireboat >> Loren Perry took one of the Fireboats and RCed it with full fire house capability. He did an artical about it for Scale Ship Modeler. Watching it was great - typical of Loren's fantastic work! I have one and someday, I'm going to attempt to build it like his. Darn... come to think of it, that was 20 years ago! << Yes, Ray, it just about was! How times flies! I built this R/C model in the mid-1980's when I was stationed at Navy Recruiting District Jacksonville, Florida. This was before inexpensive micro-R/C components were available. The two Kraft mini servos I used cost $70.00 USD each! And that was way back when. I used two other disassembled servos (motors and amplifiers) to drive the twin propellers independently. I still have the model (boxed up in storage.) It originated back in the early 1960's and is in 1/87 scale (HO train scale.) The model represents the Fire Fighter as built with the large retractable fire tower (long since removed on the prototype.) Revell did a really nice job on this particular kit. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: BiRdMaN32853@aol.com Subject: firefighter David the Firefighter is docked outside my back door. If you'd like me to shoot a roll of film (i'm not digital yet) i'll send it to you. Steve Berti Staten Island' NYC ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Kurt Van Dahm Subject: fire boats Check out this web site on NY Fire Boats http://www.fireboat.org/index.asp Kurt Van Dahm Westmont, IL ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "DUCKMAN" Subject: RE-RELEASES HI ALL, I KEEP SEEING THE "PINE ISLAND". HOW MANY OF YOU REMEMBER IT AS THE "NORTON SOUND"? (I THINK THAT WAS IT, BACK IN THE 60'S, OR WAS IT THE 50'S?) DAVID IN DIXIE ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: Allan and Crystal Plumb Subject: Re: Heller Strasbourg >> I understand the rarity so I don't expect to get something for nothing. I bid a ridiculously large amount of money on E-bay and still lost--So I'm willing to pay!! << I see others have already responded about the kit, so I won't tell you about mine (built, sorry). I think the Heller battleships are a good value, at the original prices. Unless you just gotta-have-it, why not go off and build things already in your unbuilt pile (don't we all have one?) and hope that Heller re-releases one of those two, so you can spend a lot less? They've been re-releasing several older kits, viz. Hood, so it's not an idle fancy. Allan (Strasbourg, Gniesenau, Scheer, J. Bart) Plumb ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: MikeH34OC@aol.com Subject: Re: SSP RE-Releases There are 2 ships I would love to see re-released: USS Kearsarge (1/96, inaccuracies and all) and one of the Essex class (Bon Homme Richard or Essex) with the attack carrier airwing. Liner Brazil also sounds great. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume