Subject: SMML VOL 2033 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 12:13:22 +1100 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http://sandlehobbies.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Yubari 2: FAA colours 3: MV Durban Castle 4: MV Dunbar Castle 5: Durban/Dunbar 6: Trumpeter kits planning 7: Cancelled Battle Ship Kits 8: Re: proposed capital ships 9: Nagato resin kit 10: Re: WWII USN Submarines 11: Re: Cancelled French Battleships 12: Re: ORP Dragon 13: Re: Skywave Benson & Monssen 14: Re: WWII USN Submarines 15: Nabob scheme 16: Re: Early American Battleships 17: Heller 1/400 Hood 18: Skywave Livemore / Monssen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Re: 1/700 underwing details ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Kerry L. Jang" Subject: Yubari Hi All, I am thinking about scratchbuilding the a waterline version Japanese light cruiser YUBARI in 1:350 or something. Does anyone have a the hull lines for this ship they can lend or copy for me? Mainly I beed the sections for the bw. I could estimate the sheer of the bow from the 3 views I have, but a few hull stations would be helpful. Thanks, Kerry ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Cisco Academy" Subject: FAA colours Many many thanks to Chris Langtree and Cliff Franklin for their help with FAA colours in '43! Great stuff! What a brilliant source of knowledge and info this list is! Keep it going Shorna.....and Lane! Regards, Chris Drage ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Millen, Alan R." Subject: MV Durban Castle >> The Union-Castle house flag was a combination of the Union house flag (white flag, blue border, red cross) and the Castle house flag (blue ground, white cross, red 'C' in white diamond in centre). Thus, after the merger of the Union and Castle companies in 1900, the Union-Castle house flag was a blue ground, white cross and diamond with red cross superimposed. This is the flag on the enamel badge on the mug which Alan Millen has acquired. << Many, many thanks for the way you guys came through. I have one further question for Harold, though. When did the merger take place, as the emblem does NOT include the red cross. Thanks again! SMMLies rule! Alan R. Millen ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Millen, Alan R." Subject: MV Dunbar Castle One other note, one of the websites furnished, http://www.union-castle-line.com/home.htm, gave out this information: "Union-Castle ships lost during World War II 9th January 1940 Dunbar Castle - mined and sunk 2 miles NE of Goodwin Sands" So this mug would date to early 1940 AT THE LATEST? Alan R. Millen ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Millen, Alan R." Subject: Durban/Dunbar Hoo, boy, getting my Castles mixed up. DURBAN I have, not Dunbar. All who answered my original question were correct, my subsequent questions were about the wrong ship. Except the one regarding the logo. It still has no red cross. Alan R. Millen ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Bruno Gire" Subject: Trumpeter kits planning Hi folks, Some comms ago, some of you listed the planned 2003 Trumpeter 1/350 kits to include Hornet (CV8) and an Essex class (maybe Essex, if I remember well). Hornet is now arriving, but what about Essex? The extended 2003-2004 provisionnal list, as announced later via SMML didn't include this carrier. Bruno Gire Bordeaux, France ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: Mike Bartel Subject: Cancelled Battle Ship Kits > I suspect that part of the lack of earlier interest may have been associated with the fact that your earlier "what if's" were more in the form of "craftsman" kits as opposed to more complete kits to which you now appear to be moving. << No, not really. I sell the kits when I have them- that doesn't seem to be a problem. But, more about that in a minute. Though the Lexington will be mostly complete, the other 'what if' kits (No.13, BB-49) will continue to be in the craftsman format. I am soon going to add the 1921 Invincible to the reissue list for 2003, and it requires a Tamiya Rodney or Nelson kit to complete it. The latter two are so inexpensive these days that even with the price increase on the Invincible one can build a nice model out of both of them without spending too much unecessary money. It is only my series of 'built' designs that will be complete (i.e. Algerie, Sims class, Fantasque, Lion, Indefatigable, Repulse). I am improving the old masters for the 'what if' designs I've made in the past by cleaning up some rough areas, adding some parts, and adding detail to other parts. But, I doubt I'll make them 100% complete. I just don't anticipate selling enough of some of them to make the extra tooling costs worth it. That said, 'lack of interest' is actually somewhat relative. I've always sold the 'what if' ship kits I've produced, so there is a healthy market out there amongst the dedicated modelers. It's not lack of interest in the kits (for which I thank everyone for their support!). It's lack of knowledge or familiarity with the prototypes by the casual modeler. I've had to explain the Montana and some of the other ships to modelers when I worked in the hobby shop back in the '90s. That is the kind of thing that is taken into consideration and determines whether or not a kit is complete, produced in large or small numbers, or produced at all. Mike Bartel ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Bruno Gire" Subject: Re: proposed capital ships Hi Paul, The French 1939 Jean Bart follow-on BB projects are shortly, but well depicted at the end of Robert Dumas' book on the Jean Bart (Marines Editions). Dumas even gives profile and planview for both Clemenceau and Gascogne (as well as wartime projected rebuilding of Jean Bart with twin 5"38 turrets in place of main guns). If you want more on this, please contact me off line. Bruno Gire bgire@club-internet.fr Bordeaux, France ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Bruno Gire" Subject: Nagato resin kit Hi folks, Working on the Hi Mold/ Pitroad 1/700 Nagato kit (1931 state, before major reconstruction), I discovered the beautifully molded hull is surrounded by a small catwalk, about 1mm wide (at 1/700) at the main deck level, from just forward of the capstan right to the stern. I've been unable to identify this on the period pictures published in Monografie Morskie nr5, Nagato & Mutsu (by Miroslaw Skwiot). Did this catwalk really existed, and if yes, what was it for? Bruno Gire Bordeaux, France ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Ives100 Subject: Re: WWII USN Submarines Yes, the deck level railings, etc. were stored during patrols, but I believe they were stored onboard, not ashore. This was indeed done to remove sources of noise, as well as to keep them from being blown off by depth charges. There were several lockers in the deck and on the connong tower to store items, including waterproof lockers to store ready ammunition for the deck guns. The early Gatos originally were built with a small boat beneath the deck (between the superstructure and the pressure hull). Tom Dougherty ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Sanartjam Subject: Re: Cancelled French Battleships Hi, I would love to see a 1/700 kit of the French "never was" battleship Gascogne, the one with one quadruple turret forward and one aft. Art Nicholson ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "John Sutherland" Subject: Re: ORP Dragon Many thanks to all those that replied. Between your answers and the web-sites you directed me to I think I have the answers I require. Best regards John Sutherland ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Sanartjam Subject: Re: Skywave Benson & Monssen Hi, Now that Skywave has done the Benson, I guess we can do the Farenholt in her really great camouflage scheme. I would like to use the kit of the Monssen to build the Hobson when she was in her Ms. 15 camouflage scheme, but I'm having trouble making out her light AA fit at the time. Anyone have any thoughts? I think I see some single 20mm guns forward of the bridge and abreast one of the funnels, but can't make out what is atop the deckhouse just forward of the third 5-in. gun. Some of the ships had a quad 1.1-in. gun there, but I can't see one in the photograph I looked at. Also, has anyone announced or come out with a dedicated photoetch set for the Skywave Benson/Livermore kits? Or should we just use the generic US destroyer sets that are already out? Thanks! Art Nicholson ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From: NAVYDAZE Subject: Re: WWII USN Submarines I check with a friend of mine, Frank Toon who serverd aboard the USS BLENNY during WWII regarding the hand rails. He states: "They were cables stretched thru eyes mounted on the deck, but can't remember exactly how they fitted. Believe they were put ashore as I can't remember any place to store them aboard. We were so crowded with stores that there was hardly room for us." Mike Donegan NAVYDAZE ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From: "Reynaga, Tim@EDD" Subject: Nabob scheme >> I'm hoping to build the Tamiya 1/700 Bogue Class escort carrier into either HMS Nabob or HMS Puncher. While I've got the colour schemes sorted out (me thinks!), can anyone advise how the AA armaments on RN Bogue/Prince William class carriers differed (if at all) from the standard US AA armaments as supplied in the Tamiya kit? Any other modifications to the kits (other than radar) required to properly RN-ify it? Any suggestions or points in the right direction would be appreciated. << HMS(HMCS?)Nabob is one of those projects I have had on the back burner for some time. There's a really cool site on the RCN CVs at http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/2230/history.html. As best I can tell, the RCN AA armament was unchanged from the US provided fit. However, I have only incomplete information on her camouflage colors/scheme at the time of Nabob's torpedoing. Could you help me out? Thanks! Tim ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From: GKingzett Subject: Re: Early American Battleships Bob, there are many pictures available which show the pilot houses of Oregon, Indiana, Iowa, etc. The paneling and other detailing clearly indicate wood. Now the fun part. There are no color pictures, only colorized pictures. But there is plenty of written documentation which describes the wood structure. The finish is called "bright" and refers to a varnished red mahogany color. It was a point of pride with the old time skippers and crew to have a nice shiny "bright" wooden pilot house. The captain's gig was usually finished the same way, again, as a point of pride. When building the Oregon, it is necessary for you to get a photo and date. Build to that photo and that date. If the pilot house is dark, it is mahogany varnished wood. If it is the same color as the surrounding structure, it is either buff or white, depending upon the photo. It is possible that some pilot houses were steel, but they were paneled and detailed to look like wood, and the steel ones were buff or white, not "bright". To confuse the issue further, it appears that the wooden pilot houses were portable, and were taken down and stowed when battle was impending. I don't know if that was universal, and I don't know for sure which ships had their pilot houses in place at the Battle of Santiago, given the fact that the American fleet was surprised when the Spaniards broke out. I don't think you can trust any of the artists renderings of the period. And finally, the Oregon's pilot house was removed sometime after 1905 and possibly after 1910 when when she received her cage mainmast. The ship was conned from an open steering position where the pilot house had been. I suspect this was done because the Navy had become very sensitive to the issue of topside clutter and battle damage, and also because Oregon was stationed in the tropics where enclosed spaces would have been brutally hot. By the time the Virginia and Connecticut classes were built (including New Hampshire), their "bright" wooden structures had become the chart house and captain's sea cabin, located behind the conning tower/ military mast. The steering position was in front of the military mast, behind a very light steel wind screen. I repeat, find a dated photo and build to that. Any other approach requires too much guess work. Contact me off line if you need specific references. Gary ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From: "Peter Crandall" Subject: Heller 1/400 Hood Does anyone know if Heller's reintroduced 1/400 Hood is any better than their 1970's model? What are the major faults of the ship? Where online is this kit being sold? Thank You ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From: "John Sutherland" Subject: Skywave Livemore / Monssen Ok, several people have mentioned these kits in passing lately - anyone prepared to give a top level review? ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: SHIPMDLR Subject: Re: 1/700 underwing details >> I'm looking for 1/700 Underwing stores to use on my 1/700 Mordern Aircrafts and Helicopters. Does anybody has any spares from PitRoad/Skywave or others available, that could sent it to me, please? If just underwing fuel depots are available, I'll be already happy.!!! << Flagship Models makes an under wing stores detail set for modern jet aircraft. It's FM 700-12 and you can see it on the web site and order there as well. Hope this helps. Flagship Models Inc. Purchase online with your Visa/Amex/Discover/MasterCard http://flagshipmodels.com Proud sponsor of the 2003 IPMS/USA National Convention http://www.ipmsmetrookc.org ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume