Subject: SMML VOL 2146 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 03:04:30 +1100 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http://sandlehobbies.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: Copyright 2: How do you paint your models? 3: Off Topic Swastika Trivia 4: Re: Swastika orientation 5: Japanese LST - and other IJN warship info 6: Request for help: USS ARIZONA Hawsepipes 7: Misc stuff 8: David Macgregor PLans 9: Visa Fees (Off topic) 10: Copyright 11: Liberty Ship Models 12: Re: SMMLiecon and Noreastcon 13: Re: Copyright -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Return to Normalcy at WEM ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS IMPORTANT Notice Hi all, With the very real likelyhood that war will break out in Iraq in the coming days, we would like to remind people that this is an International forum for ship modellers and not a forum to voice either their approval or disapproval of the current events. We have no desire to moderate between the opposing views at such a time. Please, now more than ever, keep your posts On Topic. Shane & Lorna ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: Michael McMurtrey Subject: Re: Copyright There is in copyright law a provision known as the 'fair use' doctrine, which says in effect that it is okay to copy portions of a 'work' for private use, i.e., research. I have always interpreted this to mean that is perfectly legal to make one copy of an out-of-print work (a book, for example) as long as you are copying it strictly for your own use and not for distribution or reprinting. I would think this provision applies to out-of-print plans as well. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "Cameron Lynch" Subject: How do you paint your models? I'm working on my first ship (Tamiya 1/700 Scharnhorst) and I'm rapidly approaching the painting stage. I've got at least 50 different ways to do it, but I'd love to hear how some of you guys approach the problem. Thanks in advance. Here are some of my ideas. 1. Paint the deck first then mask it and paint the hull. Then paint the superstructure in components and add prepainted rails last then rig it. 2. Paint the hull first then mask it and paint the deck. Then paint the superstructure in components and add prepainted rails last, then rig it. The fundamental issue is whether you paint as much before you assemble as you can, or do you wait until it is assembled to paint? FWIW it will be airbrushed using WEM paints. Cameron Lynch ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Leonard, Michael W" Subject: Off Topic Swastika Trivia Franklyn wrote - >> I must confess that although the ends of the Nazi swastika's upper cross bars are bent to the right in either configuration, I don't know which way the American Indian's (or Viking's, that's a new one on me) ends are bent. Nor do I know if the American Indian's (or Viking's) logo has the center bars horizontal and vertical or has them 45 degrees from horizontal, or if there is any significance to which way they are arranged. << The US Army's 45th Infantry Division adopted as its insignia a red diamond with a yellow swastika (arms bent to the right). This was in keeping with its origins in Oklahoma -- formerly "Indian Territory". Sometime in 1941 or '42, the swastika was dropped -- for obvious reasons! -- and a yellow thunderbird symbol substituted. You can see it at: http://www.45thdivisionmuseum.com/ MWL ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Dizzydismal Subject: Re: Swastika orientation I was surprised to note swatikas on headstones in Viet Nam. I had no idea it had some type of meaning in the far east. Dennis Disbrow Euclid OH ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: Rich Marsh Subject: Japanese LST - and other IJN warship info Don, Several good sources online exist. I'd start with the Imperial Japanese Navy ("Nihon Kaigun") Page - http://www.combinedfleet.com/kaigun.htm or it's associated list forum Japanese Navy & Ships Message Forum - http://www.j-aircraft.org/bbs/jship_config.pl - Under the Long Lancers page, you'll find stories of Japanese DD's escorting LST's - and there are several pictures. (Check under "Leyte"). There are other sites, but I've noticed that you can find the from Nihon Kaigun Enjoy! Rich ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Graham Preston Subject: Request for help: USS ARIZONA Hawsepipes My current model ship project (for the last ten years) is a 1/96th scale RC model of the USS ARIZONA based on a Scale Shipyard fiber-glass hull. I'm reaching the stage where I will soon have to make the four Anchor Hawsepipes, but don't have enough accurate information on their size, specifically the inside diameter of each hawsepipe "tube". I have two sets of plans from the Floating Drydock, in both 1/96th and 1/192nd scale, as well as Paul Stillwell's book on the ARIZONA, but still need more information. In this scale, any error would be noticeable. As near as I can tell, the hawsepipes are somewhere between three and four feet in diameter. The only ship of the same type (I.E. WW I battleship), built in the same era, and still in existence, is the USS TEXAS. Although the hawsepipes would have a different lip at the end, I believe they would have the same inside diameter. Can anyone confirm this, and provide me with an accurate inside diameter measurement? Can anyone shed more light on this subject, for me........please? Thanks, and Happy Modeling. Chris Preston, Victoria, B.C. Canada ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: andrew jones Subject: Misc stuff (1) Copyright..... i am always nervous about doing items for my clubs stuff, cuz i am no good at drawing from photos, so the best i can do is tracing..though i have been told its quite legal cuz its used for reference & i don't intend to trace an entire book for one article, but i would always use a bibliography... that reminds me.. Shane i know i promise articles.... have 3 started, but never completed well actually stated more, but never happy with them... (2) USA Visas..last time i was in the states only business people had to pay for a visa if they stayed over 40 days or something like that..its been 2 or 3 years since i applied for a visa, as i was on holidays not business i did not need to get anything regards Andrew oz ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "John Barnum" Subject: David Macgregor PLans Dear All I was able to obtain Some of the Norman Ough plans 2 to 3 years ago. This was after wait for over a year for a reply from Mr Macgregor. I even tried phoning him. All through this time he was not producing any plans BUT was still advertising in the Model Boats Magazine. I have a copy of The WEM catalogue dated 20th Feb 2003 and it states that the Macgregor Plans are currently unavailable, BUT Macgregor plans are still being advertised in the April Model Boats. After the trouble I had I believe WEM. John Barnum Margate UK ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Peter Subject: Visa Fees (Off topic) Sorry this is so off topic, but I wanted to help with the US visa fees question. The US$100 fee is for a visa stamped in your passport. Travelers who can enter without a visa (The "visa waiver program") like British passport holders don't pay the fee, as they do not obtain visas at an Embassy or Consulate outside the US. The fee I am told covers the costs of issuing the visa is unlikely to go down or go away I'm afraid... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Chris and Kayo Amano-Langtree" Subject: Copyright Hi all There is a problem with the interpretation of the copyright law. However, what Bill has been doing does not violate copyright law (at least not in the UK). Remember he has not tried to make money out of it or distribute it widely. Neither has he tried to pass it off as his own. This clearly falls under fair use. The point about being mean-spirited is that it is not very nice to try and force a narrow and dubious interpretation of the law on others under the guise of being helpful. It also does not help the hobby and free exchange of information. Tolerance and a bit of give and take would not go amiss. Chris Amano-Langtree ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "Vess Irvine" Subject: Liberty Ship Models Hi Lou: Halinski Liberty Ship USS Jeremiah O'Brien appears very accurate and detailed. There are a couple of thousand parts. Looks like the real thing to me. Hull is made up from crossway bulkhead formers (card model lingo for the laminated and doubled up cardstock that gives stiffness and shape to the model), glued to mid-plate and vertical spine (above waterline and below waterline are separate assemblies, then glued together lengthwise, I think, without actually digging out and checking the model). You have about 20 of the hull cross-sections on paper which can be scanned into a computer (for personal use only, ever mindful of copyright issues) and scaled up or down with Photoshop, Corel Draw, or even Microsoft Illustrator, which everyone has on Windows computers). Better then blueprints. External plates of hull are paper areas so you have three dimensional "plates" as two dimensional areas on the paper, before cutting out (very precisely with X-acto and straight edge or French curve) and rolling into curvature. These "plates" are pre-printed oxide red, gray and with black bootstrap. You even get brass colored propeller (in paper). You have about 16 pages of pictures of virtual subassemblies of the model (computer generated 3-D renderings) used to design it in the first place, in grayscale, probably done using AutoCAD for super accuracy, and doing double duty as the construction guide manual. They are so good, that the written instructions (in Polish) are only three or so paragraphs and are redundant. Easy on eyes. Detail of ship just pops off the page. If you scan and scale it, be careful about aspect ratio distortion introduced by your scanner and again by your printer. My HP scanner distorts enough that I have to "resample" the images in my computer down by factors of width=.995 and vertical length=.999. HP LaserJet printers are pretty bad on distortion too, but the newer Epson inkjets are pretty good (and inexpensive, except in ink cartridges, mine is the state of the art Epson Stylus C82, found in OfficeMax, Best Buy, Circuit City). The aspect ratio problem would be enough to ruin the fit of the scanned parts. I found this out by running experiments where I scanned an engineering ruler image, measured the result in the computer in Photoshop, and then manually measuring again off the printers, using the "one eyeball" technique. The model is a great painting guide. For example, the hatch covers are simulated wood colors and very realistic. Navy gray ship with deck gray decks, I think. All rigging and boom details are shown almost as clearly as in 1:1 detail. Gun platforms and guns themselves look terrific. As I recall, there are about two pages of "wire templates" in scale for masts, railings, flagstaffs, etc. You use bent paperclips for wire. Wood dowels chucked in Dremel and sanded for tapered masts. The model comes in quality published "booklet" form. For $20, you get immense value. At that price, just buy the thing instead sitting around mulling over the idea and asking for advice. Just buy it. You have a credit card? It will arrive in the mail in about 10 days from the Czech Republic. It is not like you have a lot to lose if you find it worthless. The on-line dealer there is reputable from my experience, and eager for your business. He sends his "buyer" directly over to Warsaw by car to pick up the latest kit releases hot off the presses. You can get the model sooner from him then most Poles can get it: http://www.maquettespapier.com/ Then you can verify or discredit my raving about the model here in SMML. I need some support and backup with all the resin and plastic modelers who are not paying attention and who are finding my promotion of card models to be somewhat tiresome. LOL!!!! I like these cardstock models so much, that I am ignoring the Trumpeter aircraft carriers. I think you will be so impressed that you might just forget about building it in wood, and build the card model instead The Halinski Liberty Ship has been out on the market only for about six weeks. I have yet to see a picture of a built one. I have some source material on the "how to do it" methods. There is a good Card Modeling FAQ on the Internet that is hundreds of pages long. Do a www.google.com search and you will find it right away. Keep in mind the scale is 1/200th. So the Halinski Liberty Ship is huge. But since paper is flat, the model itself takes up little room. I stash all my unbuilt ones under the bed with ease. Easy to dust, pack up when moving. Vess Irvine Estes Park, Colorado ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "John Rule" Subject: Re: SMMLiecon and Noreastcon >> I have been to the USA twice this year already, the last time was last week. I wasn't asked to pay a $100 Visa fee. I would check your source, because unless this 'fee' came in this week, I very much doubt this is true... << The new "security" measures were activated on Monday 17 March, 2003. As far as I can tell it applies to all Commonwealth members including Ireland. I presume that includes England, Scotland and Wales. They do have a help line to call if you need to check your status but guess what they've put a toll on the line. I understand that it will also apply to Canada in the future. I suggest if the US want to reduce the incidence of violence against their citizens, they would be better to look inward. It is not the people crossing the border who are perpetrating the vast majority of the violence. Sorry if I am ruffling some feathers but as you can gather I am pissed off about this new Visa crap!! I will miss seeing my friends at SMMLiecon. John ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: "James M. Pasquill, II" Subject: Re: Copyright http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/ A little knowledge goes a long way.. This discussion comes up on every hobby list about once a year. This is the 3rd time that I can remember this topic appearing on this list since I joined. Common to all of discussions is that folks who believe that "I can do whatever I damn please," never change their mind. They just stop defending themselves after a while. Nonetheless, I suggest that the above site has all you need to know if you truly do want to follow the law and feel confident about your interpretation of "fair use". There are also links at this site to the international copyright conventions. Actually the law isn't too hard to figure out. What's "right" to do is always a bit tougher. Personally I feel that if you give a copy of a plan to someone that could afford to buy his own and that plan is available for purchase, then you have hurt the producer by depriving him of income, and by extension have hurt your hobby. Gray areas exist, but if we are decent people and love our hobbies, we should not do things that hurt our hobbies and the people who to try to produce the things we want, no matter what the law is. Jim ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: wem Subject: Return to Normalcy at WEM Hi All, Caroline and I have returned to South Farm from the wilds of Southern Nevada, so everything is back to normal at WEM. We're here to take your orders. Lots of Trumpeter ESSEX and HORNET kits available, Colourcoats are well stocked up with new colours on the way.... Best, John Snyder The Token Yank White Ensign Models Home Page for WEM, http://WhiteEnsignModels.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume