Subject: SMML VOL 2197 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 03:11:46 +1000 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http://sandlehobbies.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Re: Fiber Optics 2: Decommission and stricken 3: Re: Decommissioned and stricken 4: Cadillacs and Fiber Optics 5: Re: Colour codes for Measure 33 14/d 6: Re: Colour codes for Measure 33 14/d 7: Re: Aleksander III 8: Fiber Optics 9: QE and QM as troopers 10: Re: Colour codes for Measure 33 14/d 11: USS Constellation & Mobile Bay 12: First with electric lights -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: 1/350 Arleigh Burke ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: rolie muise Subject: Re: Fiber Optics I work with FO. If you are not familiar with it,from a safety point of view.avoid it. Small pieces of hair sized glass are not a good thing to have loose in ones house. The amount of light that will be transmitted is also very small. Friends who build large models use the old lamps that have the multi plastic fibers. Much safer and transmitte more light for a smaller source. A suggestion. rolie ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: WILLIAM ORETO Subject: Decommission and stricken I'm no expert but it would take months if not a couple of years to reactivate. The ships are stripped of anything useful.There are no trained crews, and threats and technology have changed since there decommissioning which means new equipment assessment, repairs and overhauls which weren't done to be done and on and on. I believe certain ships are kept in different reserve status readiness. I understand the reactivation of the Iowa class took years and major bucks. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: "Ouellette, Lawrence M" Subject: Re: Decommissioned and stricken "Pwesty" wrote: >> I was just wondering something about the many decommissioned aircraft carriers that the US Navy has laying about. It a case national emergency how easy would it to reactivate the ones that are decommissioned and stricken (I E the Saratoga and Forestall, America etc etc) or are those carriers all lost causes? << Nothing is a lost cause if you throw enough money at it! When a ship is decommissioned and put into 'reserve', that usually means the ship is mothballed. This is a time consuming process where everything on the ship is shut down, preserved, tagged, documented and sealed. The ship itself is 'dead' but a dehumidification system is running to prevent moisture build-up inside, which would ruin everything. Re-activating a mothballed ship is still very expensive and time consuming. I think the Iowa's cost something like $500 million(?) each to reactivate in the 1980's. Once a ship is 'stricken', the dehumidifier is turned off and the only preservative work done is to make sure the ship doesn't sink. Stricken ships are destined to be scrapped, sunk, or on very rare occasions, donated as museums. When the US Navy strikes a ship, they are basically saying there is no chance it will ever be reactivated. For the last few years, most stricken ships in the US Navy just sit at piers as they are too costly to scrap. A stricken ship starts to deteriorate as soon as the dehumidifiers are turned off. The USS Salem was in pristine condition (inside) until 1992 when she was stricken. In the two years that it took to get her donated and moved to Quincy. The 3 inch guns had started to rust, the barber shop was flooded and mostly destroyed due to a hole in the deck that allowed rain to collect in the compartment. Only one of 5 barber chairs survived in one piece, two were 100% unsalvageable and discarded. The areas subject to the most temperature extremes had paint that had lasted 40 years, fall off! From what I've read on www.hazegray.org it looks like USS America, Forrestal, and Saratoga were all decommissioned, and stricken almost immediately thereafter, if not the same day. I think the only way the Navy would reactivate these ships would be if we lost a few of our active carriers outright. Larry Ouellette Volunteer, USS Salem (CA 139) United States Naval Shipbuilding Museum Quincy, Massachusetts, USA http://www.uss-salem.org/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: "Ralph Batykefer" Subject: Cadillacs and Fiber Optics Hey Kurt, Would you possibly tell us what years and models had the fiber optics in them? I am more knowledgable about Chevys and ships... Thanks!!! IHS, Ralph ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: "Allan Wotherspoon" Subject: Re: Colour codes for Measure 33 14/d >> Could someone inform me as to the color codes on my camo pattern sheet for 33 14/d I know that 5-L is light grey but what is 5-0? Also what is the Difference between 32 14/d and 33 14/d? << 5-O is Ocean Grey. Allan ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: EDWARD GRUNE Subject: Re: Colour codes for Measure 33 14/d C.S. Bailey wrote in SMML2196 >> Could someone inform me as to the color codes on my camo pattern sheet for 33 14/d I know that 5-L is light grey but what is 5-0? << 5-0 is Ocean Gray, it is a mid-dark gray. >> Also what is the difference between 32 14/d and 33 14/d? << Measure 32 is a mid-colored dazzle pattern camouflage measure. Its colors are: 5-L Light Gray 5-O Ocean Gray Dull Black The decks are 20B and they may be patterned with 5-O. Measure 33 is a light-colored dazzle pattern camouflage measure. Its colors are: 5-L Light Gray and 5-O Ocean Gray. Decks are 20B, and they may be patterned with 5-O. The other 3x camouflage measure is 31, and you guessed it, is a dark-colored dazzle pattern measure. Its colors are: 5-H Haze Gray 5-O Ocean Gray Dull Black The decks are also 20B and may be patterned with 5-O. The 14/D pattern number indicates the 14th destroyer pattern. As you can see it can be painted in any of the three 3x camouflage measures. See John Snyder & Randy Short's excellent website: http://shipcamouflage.com/ that has all this and more information on US camouflage measures. Ed Mansfield, TX ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: "D.Przezdziecki" Subject: Re: Aleksander III >> Mr Przezdziecki. given the harsh tone of the review and the detailed character of it I would really like to see your sources on the list. So far I am temped to buy a kit of Slava or Alexandr III because of the review. << Pieter, I am sorry for the late reply but I was one of the people deprived of receiving SMML for quite a while. If you thought that was trying to disuade people from buying Kombrig's "Slava" and "Aleksander III" than you are very much mistaken. They are a class above the old Kombrig's "Borodino" and "Suvorov" and can be made into very good looking models indeed!!! As long as hulls are ok (and they are very nicely cast and mostly correct) I am quite happy to scratchbuilt the incorrect superstructure and platforms. I will rebuild "Slava" as "Suvorov" simply because I do not fancy removing all 12 of nicely cast 75mm gun ports midships ("Slava" had them plated over in 1916). And of course you don't HAVE to believe me when I say that it is impossible to assemble midships' superstructure of those kits using only parts provided in the kit and instructions provided by Kombrig. Buy any (or both) of those kits and find out for yourself. As to my sources: in almost 20 years of collecting materials about RIN I have come across quite few rare sources both published and unpublished. While I am happy to share all of the published references with fellow modellers I am not prepared to do that with some of the unpublished sources. I gather them for a possible future use and while you can have a look at them (next time you are in London you can email me) I am not prepared to put them into public domain. HOWEVER :-) if you want to see how superstructure of "Suvorov", "Aleksander III" and "Slava" really looked like go to Modelwarships.com website: http://modelwarships.com/reviews/ships/ru/bb/ks-index.html It is an article about building old Kombrig's model of "Suvorov" by Norm Koger. In the section "Midships" it includes a perspecrive drawing of midships section of "Suvorov" which was almost identical to that of "Aleksander III" and "Slava". Norm writes that he got this drawing from Siergiey Myagkov. While my references aren't from Mr. Myagkov I agree that, to the best of my knowledge, the picture shown is indeed a correct representation of the superstructures of those three ships. Regards Darius Przezdziecki ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: Kelvin Mok Subject: Fiber Optics >> Can someone provide me with a source for fiber optics. APC sells a fiber optic kit but it retails for around $35.00 and its only for a two foot bundle. << One of those fiberoptic accent lamps that are found in the same place as Java lamps may fill your requirement. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Reid, John (AFIT)" Subject: QE and QM as troopers There are many battered Triang Minic 1/1200 Cunarders Queen Elizabeth and Queen Mary (the 30s originals) out there at swap-meets like Theale, UK. I had thought of a conversion to trooper configuration. Apart from overall grey paint (which grey, BTW?) and external degaussing, what else is involved? Perhaps a slightly crumpled bow on QM for a very specific modelling moment.... The photos I have seen (e.g. in Carmania Press books) are detailed enough to show any armament. Any ideas on sources? John Reid ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: Colour codes for Measure 33 14/d >> Could someone inform me as to the color codes on my camo pattern sheet for 33 14/d I know that 5-L is light grey but what is 5-0? Also what is the Difference between 32 14/d and 33 14/d? << 5-O is Ocean Gray. The difference between a given design in Measures 31, 32, and 33 is the colours used and the overall tone of the vessel. Measure 31 designs were dark-toned patterns, Measure 32 designs were medium-toned patterns, and Measure 33 designs were light-toned patterns. Measure 31 used Dull Black BK, 5-O Ocean Gray, and 5-H Haze Gray. Measure 32 designs used Dull Black BK, 5-O Ocean Gray, and 5-L Light Gray. Measure 33 used 5-O Ocean Gray and 5-L Light Gray. So you can see that in Measure 31 the lightest colour was darker than the lightest colour in Measures 32 and 33, and Measure 33 dispensed with the darkest colour (BK). Best, John Snyder The Token Yank White Ensign Models Home Page for WEM, http://WhiteEnsignModels.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: "testolog" Subject: USS Constellation & Mobile Bay To: SMML I understand from a radio interview this last weekend with her current and last Captain, that the USS Constellation was on her last deployment and will be decommissioned some time soon after her arrival back in the United States. This is a sad moment for a gallant lady, but this old gal's definitely been around the block -- I'm an old fart now but I was aboard a Gearing class destroyer and we escorted and plane guarded Constellation back when I was in the Navy in 1968-71 during 'Nam! And I don't remember exactly when she entered service, one of you will probably know. But given that she was fully operational then, at least 30+ years!! Even with refits that's a pretty long service life for a carrier. Anybody know what the record for the longest serving US carrier might be, or does Big Connie get the award? Oh, a second question-- I am gonna build my daughter's (now a QM2 just returned from the Gulf) CG, the USS Mobile Bay, from a Minicraft 1/700 kit, the hull and superstructure look OK but I'll scratch build a VLS. But the kit masts and yards look like 60's Revell!! Anybody know the best single etch detail set that would work for a Ticonderoga class? (Rusty?) BTW a lot of the Gulf footage of Tomahawks lifting off from VLS systems, and sailors manning gun stations in the Gulf were shot aboard the Mobile Bay and there was a BBC reporter aboard much of the time. He did not endear himself to the crew, I was able to infer. Tom Detweiler in Grass Valley CA ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: Edwparent Subject: First with electric lights No SMML member has come up with the correct answer yet. It was before 1881 and it was an American ship. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "The Captain Subject: 1/350 Arleigh Burke Mates this is a great looking kit. It has a one piece hull all parts are very crisp & nice detail. Plus it has decent not the best but decent photoetched railings and detail for the mast. These kits are in stock. Plus decals for 8 ships of the class $24.95 http://www.totalnavy.com/350arleighburke.htm The Captain Naval Base Hobbies www.totalnavy.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume