Subject: SMML VOL 2285 Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2003 12:07:12 +1000 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http://sandlehobbies.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: 1/700 sub kits 2: flat top 3: Re: Flat Top 4: Re: Flat top 5: Re: Flat top 6: Re: Boot topping on WWII SCs 7: Re: Boot topping 8: Re: HP Models Dreadnought 9: "Flat tops" 10: Re: Boot topping 11: HP-Models 12: Re: origin 13: Re: Clear Flat problems ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Roy Knight" Subject: 1/700 sub kits Hello all; I am trying to locate a couple of full hull sub kits, and I'm hoping someone can help. I am trying to find a full hull Gato kit and a full hull type VII U-Boat kit. Variant type on the U-Boat is unimportant. I would prefer a plastic kit but am will to work with resin if that is the only option. Thanks in advance for any help. Roy ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: andrew jones Subject: flat top Im sure im probably wrong on this.....but did it start at Midway..with the words scratch one flat top..... regards Andrew Jones ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Richa5011 Subject: Re: Flat Top >> O.K., SMML people, can anyone identify the origin of the term "flat top"? << Flat Top was an American slang term for a style of haircut...that made the hair on top of the head effectly flat and short and cut very close on the sides and back. This hair style came back in vogue for a while about a decade ago. There may be another meaning as well for all I know. Nat ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: DILIANE Subject: Re: Flat top Well, reference Franklyn's question about the origin of the term "flat top". I do know it was the only kind of haircut my dad could do, until I could move out. Does that count? Jim Campbell ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: URUDOFSKY Subject: Re: Flat top Origin? "Flat Top" was a name for a haircut style in the 40's and 60's. Some people call it "crew cut" now. Ulrich ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: Phil Kirchmeier Subject: Re: Boot topping on WWII SCs >> This is not a definitive answer because I have not taken the time to be absolutely sure, but none of the SCs that I know about had boot topping. They had only the two colors, the red lead on bottom and the "battleship grey" above, starting at the waterline. << Your post caught my eye as I'm researching PC craft for an upcoming FSM article. I've found that they did carry the boot topping.....or at least PC 820 did in 1943. The Veigele book "PC Patrol Craft of World War II, A history of the Ships and Their Crews" shows a dry docked picture of her, and even though it's b/w the divisions for a red bottom, black boot topping and the gray upper works are clearly visible. Phil ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: GKingzett Subject: Re: Boot topping I too, am one of the mortals interested in this topic. The information discussed so far helps me greatly, and Brian Taylor's input about the characteristics of anti-fouling paint allow me to interpret some photos I have to my satisfaction. That said, I wonder if any of the luminaries to which Mr. Taylor refers might be willing to give their opinion of the accuracy of Tony Gibbons' "Complete Encyclopedia of Battleships", published by Salamander Books, Ltd, in 1983? It appears to be comprehensive and accurate, but its major feature is that it is in color. Mr. Gibbons rendered drawings of all the classes of ships in color. They are very attractive, are they mainly accurate? Mssrs. Roger Chesneau and John Roberts are listed as contributors, could we get an opinion from them? And I suspect that wr might have knowledge of the book's contents as well. The book is pertinent here, because it appears to show the waterlines and boot toppings of the various ships accurately, ie, the IJN's ships do not have the black stripe, the US Navy's white hulled ships do not have the black stripe, but the gray ones do, etc. (As an aside, Bismarck's turret tops are shown as yellow, without the recognition stripe, and Scharnhorst is shown with blue turret tops for "Operation Cerebus") Thanks to all of you who have responded to my original inquiry about boot topping, hopefully we can also have the benefit of the knowledge of those of you familiar with Mr Gibbons' book. Gary ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: "Harold Stockton" Subject: Re: HP Models Dreadnought A review of the HP Models Dreadnought appeared at this address: http://www.internetmodeler.com/2003/august/ships/Dreadnought.htm. Harold Stockton ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: Steve Singlar Subject: "Flat tops" >> American aircraft carriers have been known as "Flat tops" for a long time, although the term is not heard very much lately. O.K., SMML people, can anyone identify the origin of the term "flat top"? << Franklyn, I believe this term dates back to the early days of aircraft carriers, probably to Langley but certainly to Lexington & Saratoga. There was a book called Queen of the Flattops about the Lexington. There was a book fromthe 60's or 70's titled "Flattops and Fledglings" about the history of carriers and their aircraft. That was the last time I recall seeing the term used. When I was in the active navy in the 60's, I rarely heard the term flattop used. Occasionally they were called "Bird Farms" but mostly we referred to them as carriers. Hope that helps. Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: "Bruno Gire" Subject: Re: Boot topping In his excellent Warship Pictorial #3, USS Louisville CA-28, Steve Wiper suggests an interpretation for boot topping. He writes: "When coal fired ships evolved into oil-fired ships, petroleum in the form of fuel and lubricants found its way into the habor waters. The wide black "boot topping" at the water line came into existence as a mean to hide the unsightly oil ring around the ship" That makes sense.... That would made the appearing of boot-topping during the early 20' Any further comments, Steve? Bruno Gire Bordeaux, France ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From: Iain Wyllie Subject: HP-Models To Detlief and Russ, Thanks for the url - don't know why it didn't come up on the search engine. That's some stash of HP kits Russ- makes me feel less guilty about the amount I've spent on ship reference books lately! As I have around a thousand or so aircraft ref. books I felt the need to expand the ship section drastically and as most of the books are OOP and rare it has been a case of biting the bullet. Still, the Revell Ark Royal was cheap and now looks really good after the amount of work I've done on it. It is so much more satisfying to scratch build or turn a pigs ear into a good, accurate model than to simply assemble a top class kit - must be the hair shirt syndrome! Iain ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From: "bert" Subject: Re: origin Franklyn, H.M.S. Argus, commissioned as the first aircraft carrier in the world by the R.N.1917/18. was known in the fleet as "The flat iron" because it's flight deck was a flat clear space and looked like no other warship. this could be the progenitor of the term flat top. Yours Aye (TaT). ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From: Marc Flake Subject: Re: Clear Flat problems I has the same experience StE had, only my problem was with PolyScale Clear Flat. I used it for the first time on the HP Models HMS Dreadnought. It left a white residue under the gun barrels and in nooks and crannies all over the model. I ended up just painting over the white stuff, then using Gunze Clear Flat to even it out. I have no idea why this happened. I would like to know because there seem to be a lot of people who think PolyScale is the best clear flat. Does it need to be thinned? If so, how much and with what? Marc Flake PS: My apologies to the list, I was responding to a posting on another list. After reading numerous messages off three lists I got a little confused. That happens on long weekends like we had here in the States. I'm not even sure if StE (alias Shane Weier) still frequents this list. By way of background, he had a similar Clear Flat problem to mine, only with Gunze Clear Flat. StY knows what I'm talking about. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume