Subject: SMML VOL 2598 Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 04:43:17 +1000 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http//sandlehobbies.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1 Re Unusual A/S Weapons for Type 15 Frigates 2 USS Yorktown returning to Pascagoula from final deployment 3 wingy-thingy modellers 4 Thanks/Last Armored Cruiser? 5 Re USS Olympia visit 6 Model Shops in Sydney? 7 Re RN ships that never were 8 Help! Revell/ Matchbox 1/72 HMCS SNOWBERRY 9 Photo identities for SMML site 10 Trade request If you built the Skywave Echo II model... 11 Lindberg Instructions? 12 WWI camoflauged WWII destroyer - update 13 DML 1/700 Bismarck 14 Dunkerque Colors 15 Need photo of PGM 16 Re Naracoopa 17 Search to begin for 1863 wreck of Navy's earliest submarine 18 Request 19 HyperWar US Navy Ships, 1940-1945 20 Re Naracoopa 21 Scientists find human remains on Civil War sub -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1 1200 Plastic Yamato Battleship ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From brownatfareham@surefish.co.uk Subject Re Unusual A/S Weapons for Type 15 Frigates In response to Les Pickstock's comments, the 'two three barrelled launchers at the stern' are standard Limbo mortars. The model shows these precisely as fitted to the actual ship hence the forward weapons are even more interesting - if they are intended to be ASW weapons that is? Particularly as the ship also carried two torpedo tubes on either side for anti-submarine torpedoes. The development of this weapon was a failure and so the torpedo tubes (not exactly the same as on the original model) were removed in 1955/56 during a refit. Regards Les Brown ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From JRKutina@webtv.net (John Kutina) Subject USS Yorktown returning to Pascagoula from final deployment http//www.sunherald.com/mld/thesunherald/9417812.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp Regards, John Kutina ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From Iain Wyllie Subject wingy-thingy modellers Oops - smacked botty time! John, I should, of course, have said "non floaty boaty modellers". Ned, right on, I just didn't want to offend anybody! Allan, I was referring to 1/700 and 1/350 scale but I take your point about Airfix 1/600. Still, if you want to build yourself same-scale fleets, 1/700 seems to be the best choice. I would prefer to work in 1/350 and you don't seem to be able to get anything bigger than destroyers from WEM any more - where are Dido and Towns Class?. 1/400,1/500 and 1/600 seem to be blind alleys - OK, that's only my opinion!! Maybe you could use them for a diorama in perspective, so to speak. Now that Trumpeter are producing American carriers I live in [faint] hope that they will extend their range to include RN carriers as well - I like carriers as they form a base for aircraft to sit on. <> .... why? Is this part of the Titanic/Hood/Bismarck fascination wherein the interest lies in a first voyage/ battle action demise? ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From Tom Ruprecht Subject Thanks/Last Armored Cruiser? Thank you all for the helpful replies. Sure do enjoy the access to the expertise on this forum! Rupe ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From patrick galleguillos Subject Re USS Olympia visit I visited the Olympia last month. Wow! How cool! They don't make naval ships like that any more. The wood and brass were well maintained and shined. I proudly stood on the bridge and said to Captain Gridley that he may fire when ready! I now have an excellent idea of what the Chilean ship Esmeralda (truely the first armored crusier!) was really like. Amazing ships in an amazing time period. Thanks Philadelphia for saving the Olympia for us to enjoy. Patrick G ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From Peter Subject Model Shops in Sydney? I may be traveling to Sydney in the near future and of course would like to stop in on any good model/hobby shops. Can anyone recommend any, with some general directions or nearby landmarks if possible? I am unfamiliar with the city, but will be staying near the Kings Cross station. Many thanks! Peter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From Mike Potter Subject Re RN ships that never were >> Mike Potter didn’t happen to find any decent drawings of the 1950 Type 42 “East Coast Gunboat” in his travels did he? In particular those unusual 4” guns they should have carried. Someone in TF72 wants to build the Chilean Almirante Class destroyers that they ended up being fitted to but decent drawings of the ship or turrets is a problem. Type 62, was that to be the L/M class with US turrets? << Ahoy, fellow Michael I didn't check the Brass Foundry for drawings of the Type 42 frigate. Decades ago someone pinched very nearly all of the originally filed drawings. A sketch of it by David K. Brown appeared in George Moore, "The 1950s Coastal Frigate Designs for the RN" in Warship 1995, page 156. The same David K. Brown and George Moore in Rebuilding the RN, page 82, wrote of this 4-inch gun, "This gun was being developed by Vickers as a utility mounting which could be produced by engineering firms with no previous armaments experience." Norman Friedman, World Naval Weapons Systems (1989) described it in detail in the UK AAW section, page 282. You're right about the Type 62. A few more details It went through several design phases. The final phase, in 1954, was the M-class with one USN twin 3"/50 gun mount, a USN gun director, and a USN YE aircraft homing beacon. The Admiralty then wanted them for CV escorts but instead the DNC reduced the project to one prototype ship because he did not want a CV strike operation to be jeopardized by such a flimsy escort ship in a vital position. Soon thereafter the controller killed even the prototype on the grounds that the first Type 61 frigates would enter service before the Type 62 could be ready. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From "Maritime Prints" Subject Help! Revell/ Matchbox 1/72 HMCS SNOWBERRY Is anyone able scan in a sheet from the instructions for this kit as I am in desperate need of it. I have lost some parts and have found a place which can supply spares. However, they need the part numbers. If anyony has a spare moment I would be extremely grateful if they could scan in and email me the page wich has a diagram of all the parts on their sprues and the numbers of all the parts. I don't have broadband so it would be best if the file size was kept quite, though obviousy not so low that the numbers of the parts can't be read. Please could it be emailed to crc.maritimeprints@btopenworld.com I would be very thankful for any help. MAX ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From Mike Potter Subject Photo identities for SMML site At http//smmlonline.com/reference/misc_ship/misc_ships.html Shane requests identification for ten photos of RN ships. I can help with the eight photos of battleships. Photos 1-3 (kgvbb01.jpg, kgvbb02.jpg, kgvbb03.jpg) All show HMS Duke of York in service between her refits of 1942 and 1944. She was the only ship of the class to wear this camouflage pattern at a time when she mounted the radar “lantern” on the foremast. Photo kgvbb01.jpg is in Dulin & Garzke, Allied BBs of WW2, p. 218. Photo 4 (kgvbb04.jpg) HMS King George V in 1943 or 1944. This camouflage was unique to this ship during that time. Raven & Roberts, British BBs of WW2, pp. 303 & 396. Photo 5 (kgvbb05.jpg) HMS Anson before her 1944 refit (when a new radar set replaced the wooden lantern). This camouflage was unique to this ship during that time. Raven & Roberts, British BBs of WW2 p. 302. Photo 6 (qebb01.jpg) HMS Malaya in 1942 or 1943 (when her 6-inch gun battery was removed). Malaya was the only RN BB with a large trunked funnel and a catapult amidships. The ship behind her appears to be Duke of York in the same configuration as photos 1-3. Photos 7-8 (royalsovereignclassbb01.jpg, royalsovereignclassbb02.jpg) In fact both show HMS Warspite in 1942 or early 1943 (when her aircraft was removed). Warspite was the only WW2 BB with this arrangement of secondary guns in casemates. Her foremast (her own original mainmast) and the aft main battery director were unique, too. BTW none of the Royal Sovereign class had aircraft facilities amidships or 6-inch guns concentrated forward. Photo glory01.jpg indeed seems consistent with HMS Glory as the file name suggests but I haven't researched it to verify that independently. Cheers, Mike Potter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From "Poutre, Joseph A" Subject Trade request If you built the Skywave Echo II model... And haven't used the F-15 and F-4 models elsewhere, I would like to trade for them. I have planes, helos, detail sets and leftover parts available, including the US and modern detail sets, and a couple IJN sets. Not all the pieces are there, but I might have something you need. Thanks! Joseph Poutre ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From Ned Barnett Subject Lindberg Instructions? Help I need the complete instructions for Lindberg's War of Independence Schooner (1/79 scale). I've got the second half an instruction sheet (illustrated) in English, plus a page of instructions in French that make no sense at all. Anybody able to help? I've been reading the Aubrey/Maturin stories by O'Brian and thought it's time to do a rigged sailing ship - but to start with an easy one, and that's what this Lindberg kit is - easy. Plus, it's paid for Thanks Ned ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From John Sutherland Subject WWI camoflauged WWII destroyer - update Hi Shane, A couple of months ago there was a discussion about a photogrpah of a A or B class destroyer at Scapa Flow in April 1940 in a WWI disruptive camouflauge style. I believe no-one was able to track this down. Recently I visited the Musem at Narvik - an excellent Museum about Narvik in WWII. On the wall they had a poor photograph encaptioned HMS Enterprise on guard duty. This was taken by a local sometime after the 2nd battle of Narvik and before the withdrawal. There are three ships in the picture - the Enterprise in the far back ground, a class D, E or F in the foreground (overall 507A or B, quad 0.5in, flat fronted bridge, and no markings visible) and the mysterious WWI camo destroyer in the middle. If someone can work out which destroyers were present with Enterprise in Narvik we may be able to finally solve this one. John Sutherland ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From "The code" Subject DML 1/700 Bismarck Hello list, My local modeling club had a meeting the other night and one of the guys had purchased this new injection molded kit.. I thought it compared quite well with the Samek resin kit that I have till I looked at the part tree that the bridge is on... The darn thing is cast in a soft rubbery plastic that is quite springy and pliable.. Will paint stick to this ?? I hear that Trumpeter is bringing out a Bismarck in this scale also?? Might just wait as I sure don't like the look of that parts tree. BC ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From "Cameron Lynch" Subject Dunkerque Colors I just picked up a Samek 1/700 Dunkerque on a smokin good deal and have little or no references on it. What would be the appropriate color? I'm hoping to update it to Mers-el-Kebir in 1940. Much thanks. Cameron ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From JRKutina@webtv.net (John Kutina) Subject Need photo of PGM If any of you know or have photos of WW II subchaser PGM please advise where I can buy or get them. Thank you. Regards, John Kutina ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 16) From Subject Re Naracoopa >> Here's one for the scratch builder and maritime historian! Has anyone any information on a small Tasmanian coastal vessel called "Naracoopa"? She was built in 1940 originally for Holymans but later operated for the Tasmanian Government (I believe) and was the subject of a book "There Was a Ship" by Patsy Adam Smith. A long shot I know but any info would be gratefully received as I would like to make a model of her. << Hi all, Only relatively new here so have been 'lurking'! Bob, I have found the following info for you on Naracoopa from the books "On the Tide" and "On the Tide 2" editor Peter Richardson. About vessels in Tasmanian waters. William Holyman and sons had 2 ketches built on the Tamar river in Launceston by E.A. Jack. The 'Loatta' in 1938 and 'Naracoopa' in 1940. They were sturdy and could carry 250 tons. Built for carrying stock from Flinders and King Islands to Launceston or Melbourne. Both had a small aft hold for general carge and a main forward hold with partitions and pens for sheep and cattle. Naracoopa mainly used between King Island and Melbourne. The aft hold carried bags of scheelite from the Grassey mine and boxes of butter, 44 gallon drums of fuel would be carried on deck. Both vessels had accommodation for 12 passengers. Hope this helps there are some photos in the books, one of Naracoopa on the slipyards as she is being built (almost finished). Regards Peter Hawkins Mudgee Australia ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 17) From JRKutina@webtv.net (John Kutina) Subject Search to begin for 1863 wreck of Navy's earliest submarine http//seattletimes.nwsource.com/cgi-bin/PrintStory.pl?document_id=2002012249&zsection_id=268448413&slug=sub22&date=20040822 Regards, John Kutina ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 18) From Hans Bosma Subject Request Hi All, I am looking for a detailed deck plan of the Russian Training Vessel "Kruszenstern". Also High resolution pics are appreciated. I am trying to improve a very crude Russian Kit. 1200 Thanks in advance Hans Bosma ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 19) From JRKutina@webtv.net (John Kutina) Subject HyperWar US Navy Ships, 1940-1945 http//www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/USN-ships.html To all scratch builders -- great photos in this website -- especially "NavSources Photo Archives" by Paul Yarnell No plans but many good detail photos. Regards, John Kutina ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 20) From "Bob Evans" Subject Re Naracoopa Peter, I am very grateful for any info I can get and appreciate the effort you have made to unearth this much. I will try to get photocopies of the photos in the books from a library, I guess Hobart or Launceston would be best? Rgds Bob Evans ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 21) From JRKutina@webtv.net (John Kutina) Subject Scientists find human remains on Civil War sub http//seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/sub21ww.shtml?searchpagefrom=1&searchdiff=1250 Regards, John Kutina ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From "Bendorf, Robert W Mr BACH" Subject 1200 Plastic Yamato Battleship I have a 1200 Plastic Yamato Battleship that I originally purchased in 1985 I believe…It is in mint condition/never assembled/in the original very big long box 5’ long or so….I am willing to sell it for a fair market price. The buyer will pay UPS Postage which I will inquire about at the package store…. Drop me a note if anyone is interested…I also have a lot of other smaller scale plastic ships from this area. Thanks bbendorf@charter.net ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at http//smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at http//apma.org.au/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume