Subject: SMML VOL 2684 Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 02:33:37 +1100 SMML is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http//sandlehobbies.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1 Re wheel well color 2 Re WW2 National Emblems 3 Japanese Kate Camo - Dec. 1941 4 R.N. colours. wheel well colour 5 Oversized Flags 6 Italian Navy Colours 7 Re wheel well color 8 Oscar II sail fittings -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1 More military/aviation books at below-Amazon's Lowest ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From Gary Subject Re wheel well color As mentioned earlier the wheel well color for Navy carrier based a/c was the same as the underside (of course there is always the exception). The PV-1 should have interior green wells. This is an excellent web site http//www.ipmsstockholm.org/magazine/2004/05/stuff_eng_interior_colours_us_part3.htm As to the TBD, the only 1/72 kit is from Airfix (also boxed by MPC), while not currently available it's pretty easy to find at swap meets, e-bay, and kit resellers. I believe WEM is releasing an etched set for this. HTH Gary Schurr ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From Subject Re WW2 National Emblems An interesting topic particularly for those who like to add that extra bit of color to their models. Some of these can be quite tricky. When, for example, (a) did the US flag carry 49 stars and (b) what are the color proportions, and they are not equal, of the French tricolor? Even prestigious annuals such as Jane's get this last one wrong. (a) The US flag is changed following the admission of a new state into the Union on the July 4th following the date of admission. In 1959 two states were admitted, Alaska (Jan 3rd) bringing the number of stars to 49, and Hawaii (Aug 21st) too late for 1959 but stars increased to 50 on Jul 4th 1960. (b) The French tricolor has these proportions- blue 30%, White 33%, and red 37%. Michael London ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From Tom Saundry Subject Japanese Kate Camo - Dec. 1941 I am making up a set of the Aichi Val, Mitsubishi Zeke and Nakajima Kate in the colours that they would have had at Pearl harbour. I have one reference that shows a green mottled camo on the upper wings and a Bare metal body, but it specifies that this was used only by Kate’s deployed from land bases. Can anyone provide references that would help me. I am on a limited budget due to disability and would prefer not having to but a Squadron book or the like. Web reference would be ideal. Thanks in advance. Kind Regards, Tom Saundry Vancouver, BC CANADA ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From "bert" Subject R.N. colours. wheel well colour When I served, AP was used for Admiralty Pattern, but I always thought it referred to hardware, As far as aircraft camouflage colours these all had a DTD (Directorate of Technical Development) No followed by an S or a C, indicating synthetic or Cellulose base thus- DTD567s or DTD789c it was fatal and expensive if they were mixed, As I well remember having to help strip a Barracuda of paint for this reason, and a Barra was a big aircraft in those days! A lesson well learned!. the same nomenclature applied to hydraulic oil as Lockheed and Girling, one was mineral oil and the other was a vegetable oil. Those parts of the undercarriage that covered the wheel openings that were visible in the retracted state were the same as the surrounding areas but up inside they were green as was most of the internal colour of the aircraft. the operating parts of the oleo legs were in natural metal, the sleeves being painted in appropriate colours. We also operated Corsairs and Avengers these were painted in the same manner but the description of the paint No's was different, and I cannot recall them, Yours Aye (TaT). ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From Kelvin Mok Subject Oversized Flags Something I always wanted to ask. We see in paintings of galleons and other sailing ships of that era resplendent with flags and pennants flying fully spread by the wind. Questions. 1. The flags present a lot of surface area to the wind, especially the one on the stern is often as large as a mainsail. Is there ever enough wind to spread it to its full glory? 2. What about the stability of the ship? Surely that much untethered surface forces must make keeping stability pretty chancy. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From M Brown Subject Italian Navy Colours Anyone out there happen to know what the current hull and deck colours are for the Italian Navy? Anti fouling colour would be nice to know too. Michael Brown ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From "Devin" Subject Re wheel well color >> I'm in the process of painting a Lockheed Ventura and Grumman Avenger. It has dawned on me that, what was the color in the wheel well of USN/Marine Aircraft? Was it the same as the Army Air Corps (Humbrol 81)? Or could I just apply ordinary cockpit green (Humbrol 78)? With much wondering Kim LC PS Do a 1/72 scale kit of a Douglas Devastator torpedo bomber still exist on the marked? And if it do, where can you acquire one? << Kim, Those wheel well's can vary, depending on type of aircraft, part of the world in use, factory built in, and time frame. Could be gray, white, silver, green, or sea blue. I'd suggest posting over on the message board at www.hyperscale.com . You will likely have a half dozen people answer your question within a day. I am not aware of Airfix re-releasing their TBD kit anytime recently, and they are the only one I know of that do that aircraft in 1/72 (Monogram's 1/48 Devastator has been re-issued, though). I picked one of the Airfix kits up on eBay for less than $10 earlier this year, so you might want to give them a look. Devin ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From "Robert Lockie" Subject Oscar II sail fittings Learned SMMLies In search of a quick project, I picked up a Tamiya Oscar II SSGN at a show at the weekend, my thinking being that with only 15 parts including the weight, I should be able to get it finished in under six months. My reference library on the Oscar class is limited but looking through the best photos I have, in a couple of issues of Jane’s Soviet Intelligence Review from 1989, the number of assorted masts and periscopes provided in the kit seems rather more than is on display when cruising around on the surface. To add to my confusion, Tamiya identifies the foremost projections (A1 and A2) as periscopes (combat and observation respectively) but the JSIR captions suggest the latter to be a comms mast and the periscope to be much further aft and offset to the starboard side. Actually three seems to be the maximum number of pointy bits deployed at once although my best shot of those is bow-on and thus gives no idea of where they fit longitudinally (they are clearly not all on the centreline as Tamiya would have us believe however). There is also an odd transverse bar ahead of the depression at the front of the sail, which I suspect is intended to represent an opened cover for the surface conning position, although it does not appear on most photos at all. Can anyone please help me to drag out the project for even longer by pointing out what needs changing and correcting so that I can expand the wholly pathetic parts total to something closer to the numbers I am used to tackling? I’m not sure I can cope with only 15 parts….. Thanks Robert Lockie Swindon UK ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Information ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From Ned Barnett Subject More military/aviation books at below-Amazon's Lowest More in that first-come, first-served pre-Amazon auction - all priced at 10% below the lowest price listed on Amazon for these books. As always, payment in USD by PayPal (to ned@barnettmarcom.com), please, and allow $2.50 for shipping unless otherwise noted. Many of these books are rare and are often in new condition or only-read-once condition. Airlift Military Air Transport The Illustrated History (Osprey Aerospace) /Bickers Price $15.50 plus $2.50 Shipping Sixty Glorious Years A Tribute to the Douglas Dc-3 Dakota/Pearcy Price $26 plus $2.50 Shipping Panzer- A Pictorial Documentation of the German Battle Tanks of World War II/Schiebert Price $11 plus $2.50 Shipping The Panther Tank (Weapons of War Series Volume 4)/Hughes Price $35 plus $2.50 Shipping Illustrated Encyclopedia of Military Vehicles/Hogg Price $7 plus $2.50 Shipping Great American Air Battles of World War II/Bowman Price $6 plus $2.50 Shipping Consolidated B-24 Liberator/Bowman Price $11 plus $2.50 Shipping Liberator Album B-24 Liberators of the 2nd Air Division, USAAF/Bailey Price $18 plus $2.50 Shipping Bombers of WWII/Ethell Price $12 plus $2.50 Shipping Bombers/ Kaplan Price $16.50 plus $2.50 Shipping Mustang The story of the P-51 fighter/Gruenhagen Price $10 plus $2.50 Shipping P-Screamers The History of the Surviving Lookhead P-38 Lightings/Grantham Price $35 plus $2.50 Shipping The Lockheed P-38 Lightning/Bodie Price $14.50 plus $2.50 Shipping Fighters of the Mighty Eighth, 1942-45/Hess Price $22 plus $2.50 Shipping Triumphant We Fly A 381st Bomb Group Anthology 1943-1945/Stone Price $36 plus $2.50 Shipping Secret Squadrons of the Eighth/Carty Price $15.50 plus $2.50 Shipping Jane's Battles with the Luftwaffe The Bomber Campaign Against Germany 1942-45/Boiten Price $11 plus $2.50 Shipping The Battle of Britain/Townshend-Bickers Price $14 plus $2.50 Shipping Junkers Ju 87 Stuka/Griehl Price $21 plus $2.50 Shipping Coast Guard Action in Vietnam Stories of Those Who Served/Scotti Price $11 plus $2.50 Shipping Republic's P-47 Thunderbolt From Seversky to Victory/Bodie Price $90 plus $5 Shipping Thunderbolt A documentary history of the Republic P-47/Freeman Price $13 plus $2.50 Shipping USAAF fighters of World War Two in action/O'Leary Price $4 plus $2.50 Shipping The B-17 Flying Fortress Story/Freeman Price $110 plus $5 Shipping Ned Barnett ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Reviews, Articles, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at http//smmlonline.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume