Subject: SMML VOL 2764 Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:54:56 +1100 The Ship Modelling Mailing List (SMML) is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http//sandlehobbies.com For infomation on how to Post to SMML and Unsubscribe from SMML http//smmlonline.com/aboutsmml/rules.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1 exploding Battlecruisers 2 TRUMPTER MODEL OF THE USS NORTH CAROLINA 3 Re Kearsarge 4 Re Revell Kearsarge 5 Re LCM(3) Landing craft color 6 Re Just seen at my local hobby shop Revell KEARSARGE steam sloop reissued 7 Re LMC (3) Landingscraft 8 Re Sidewheeler 9 Re Kearsarge 10 Revell Kearsarge/Alabama 11 Imai Susquehanna 12 Re Queen Mary armament 13 Re LCMC (3) Landingscraft 14 Re figures in 1/72 scale 15 Vosper MTB 220 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1 Re LCM (3) Landingscraft 2 KBismarck.com news! ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From Tom Ruprecht Subject exploding Battlecruisers The article mentioned by Nick quite clearly agrees with Darius re. rapid fire priority to the exclusion of safety. It discusses this state of affairs as tacitly encouraged by seagoing officers. Beatty wrote on November 17, 1916 that there was not "any proof of irregularities in the *then prescribed drill* for cordite supply." He didn't write that he (and many other officers) winked at the dangerous method of obtaining a rapid rate of fire by ignoring that prescription on his ships. Although the scholarly article clearly avoids the popular term, "cover-up," we can use it here. -) Then First Lord Jackson accepted the verdict of his commission which agreed that the handling of cordite in the fleet was the major cause of the disaster. Jellicoe and Beatty immediately began damage control, which was easily accomplished by Jackson being succeeded by Jellicoe the very next month. many of the discussions and writings since then have been colored by the "damage control" efforts of Jellicoe and Beatty as First Lords as well as senior officers who also had a lot to lose in sticking their necks out. The article also notes that the principal member of the commission, Third Sea Lord Rear Admiral Frederick Tudor, "instead of receiving an appointment to the Grand Fleet, as was his due, Tudor was sent to command the handful of dilapidated cruisers guarding British commercial interests in China." Perhaps, if Hollywood ever made a movie of Jutland/Skagerrak, Tudor would be cast as the noble, martyred whistleblower.... Rupe ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From "David Zimmerman" Subject TRUMPTER MODEL OF THE USS NORTH CAROLINA I HAVE RECEIVED A PIECE OF THE OLD NORTH CAROLINA DECKING [TEAK] AND WAS WONDERING HOW BEST TO PREPARE IT FOR USE ON THE MODEL? I KNOW THAT THE MODEL IS NOT YET RELEASED BUT WOULD LIKE TO BE THINKING AHEAD. THANKS DAVID ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From "Ed Wandall, Aviation Research Group/US" Subject Re Kearsarge >> On a related note, I once saw years ago a plastic kit for a 19th century steam/sail gun ship with side wheels. Does anybody know what that kit might have been? Just guessing but maybe around 1/220 scale? << Tom, You might be thinking of the Revenue Cutter "Harriet Lane" which was made by Pyro in the dark ages. Lindberg sold it as the "Civil War Blockade Runner" and in that incarnation it still turns up occasionally. Its about 1/96 scale but builds up into a pretty decent lookink kit. Model Shipways also did her in wood. Ed Wandall ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From Bill Michaels Subject Re Revell Kearsarge The Revell Germany Kearsarge is the re-release of the original kit form the late 1960s. If you go to the Steelnavy website, you can find a great comparative review of th eboth the Kearsarge and the Alabama. Here's the URL http//www.steelnavy.com/Alabama&Kearsarge.htm Basically, the Kearsarge is a fairly accurate model, but of the ship as she appeared in 1880, not her Cicil War appearance. The Alabama is based on the Kearsarge models, and as a result, is not that accurate a model. (But, to be fair, a lot of research on Alabama has come to light since Revell did their kit 40+ years ago.) The Kearsarge was released first, and followed by the Alabama. Until now, the Kearsarge had been only released once, while the Alabama was released several times, including the mid 1980s and the mid 1990s. Based on this history, and the similarities of the two kits, there was a widely held belief that the Kearsarge molds had been modified to produce the Alabama. As a result, collector prices on the Kearsarge were very high- I've seen kits go for over $300 on ebay. The unexpected announcement by Revell Germany of the Kearsarge last fall has probably driven these prices down some, as buidlers won't have to pay collector's prices to get a kit. Bill Check out my list of USCG subjects in model kit form home.earthlink.net\~billkaja\kitlist.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From Bill Michaels Subject Re LCM(3) Landing craft color What color to paint the LCM(3)? As is often the case with this type of question, the answer is "it depends". If you're doing a WW2 era boat, the boats were usually painted the same color as the Transport they came from. Post-war boats were typically light gray, again, the same color as the ships they came from. I'm probably going to do my boat as a Pacific Theater (Iwo Jima, maybe) boat, so I'll be picking a transport and going with that color scheme. Bill P.S. Box art to the contrary, apparently the LCM(3) was not used to transport Sherman tanks at Normandy. I really want a Sherman in my boat, and I have found information that says that they were used to caryy M4s in the Pacific. Check out my list of USCG subjects in model kit form home.earthlink.net\~billkaja\kitlist.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From David Wells Subject Re Just seen at my local hobby shop Revell KEARSARGE steam sloop reissued Brooks Rowlett wrote >> This famous large (1/96 scale) Revell kit from the 1960s has been reissued, listing for over $100 now. Can the ALABAMA kit be far behind? << I recall hearing from someone that the Alabama was re-issued in 2000, but I never saw one. "There seems to be something wrong | David R. Wells with our bloody ships today" | Adm. D. Beatty, May 31, 1916 | http//home.att.net/~WellsBrothers/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From AAA Hobby Supply Subject Re LMC (3) Landingscraft >> Can anybody tell me if the LCM (3)Landingcraft of the USN is to be painted in dark grey (as per Trumpeter) or in field grey (as per Dragon)? Or is it another colour which the USN or RN used it for ? << The LCMs were painted in a myriad of schemes, from overall 5-O to 5-H to mottled Ms32 Ahmibious schemes to blend into the works of the larger ships that carried them and the few permanently assigned to bases in the SoWesPac area. Postwar saw them painted in the generic "Haze Grey" with shadowed letters. The Squadron Landing Craft book shows the overall schemes of 5-O & 5-H, by far the most common, but there are a few painted with the lighter gray upper works in a false Ms22 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From "Devin J. Poore" Subject Re Sidewheeler >> On a related note, I once saw years ago a plastic kit for a 19th century steam/sail gun ship with side wheels. Does anybody know what that kit might have been? Just guessing but maybe around 1/220 scale? << I think you might be thinking of the old Lindberg kit; not sure if anyone else had the molds or not. I've seen from time to time on eBay a side-wheeler kit from Lindberg, looks about the scale you mention, and to me (I didn't study it closely, mind you) it looks a lot like the Civil War era ship Harriet Lane. It doesn't show up that often, which is too bad, as I'd really like to snag one for a good price. Devin ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From John Fraser Subject Re Kearsarge Hi Could maybe have been "USS Susquehanna" by Imai or "Harriet Lane" by Pyro, only ones I know with guns and paddles. John ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From Joel Labow Subject Revell Kearsarge/Alabama >> They're the same kit in a different box. The kit more closely resembles the Kearsarge, but it is really neither ship. << Sorry, but this is wrong (see my detailed analysis of these kits at (http//www.steelnavy.com/Alabama&Kearsarge.htm)). The Kearsarge kit is actually a quite accurate reproduction, but based on Kearsarge's final appearance on the 1880s rather than her appearance at the time of her engagement with Alabama. The Alabama kit is an extensively modified Kearsarge but since it is based on the Kearsarge hull it only vaguely resembles the prototype. Joel Labow ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From Joel Labow Subject Imai Susquehanna >> On a related note, I once saw years ago a plastic kit for a 19th century steam/sail gun ship with side wheels. Does anybody know what that kit might have been? Just guessing but maybe around 1/220 scale? << Tom, You are probably referring to the Imai USS Susquehanna in 1/150 scale...a very nice kit comparable in detil to the Revell Kearsarge. I believe they are out of production but occasionally crop up on eBay. Joel Labow ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) From SantMin@aol.com Subject Re Queen Mary armament >> Can anyone point me to a source for the armament layout of the Queen Mary when fitted out as a troopship? I am trying to put together enough reference for a wartime build of her and the Queen Elizabeth. Any help would be most appreciated!! << It's all shown very clearly on pages 54-55 of the Anatomy of a Ship Book, Queen Mary. Cheers, Bob Santos ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 13) From "Ed Grune" Subject Re LCMC (3) Landingscraft The color which a LCM would have been painted was based largely on the color of the parent ship which carried it. In Measure 22 (Overall Navy Blue) the landing carft would be Navy Blue also. In Measure 21 (Graded Haze Gray over Navy Blue) the craft would have been Haze Gray. If the ship was painted in one of the 3x dazzle patterns, the craft would be painted to match the pattern with their assigned position on the deck. I have photos of my fathers ship, the USS Oberon (AKA-14), an attack cargo ship with deck loads of LCMs. The Oberon was painted in Measure 21 - and the LCMs were in what is to my eye - Haze Gray. I just finished watching a Mail Call program on the History Channel which dealt with the Normandy Invasion. There was color footage of LCVPs loading in England which I would describe as Navy Blue. So the answer to your question is, what color was their parent ship? Additional research is required. Ed Grune Mansfield, TX ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 14) From Sab1156@aol.com Subject Re figures in 1/72 scale Greetings to all of you! The two Mail-order companies "Squadron Shop" and "VLS" are selling sets of 1/72 scale sets of german U-Boot crews. Best Regards Detlef Hartwig ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 15) From "Osvaldo Leandri" Subject Vosper MTB 220 Does anyone have any info on the Vosper MTB 220 captured by the german? See website http//warships.web4u.cz/lode.php?language=E&stat=GB&typ=MTB&trida=Vosper+71 thank you, O. Leandri ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From "John Snyder" Subject Re LCM (3) Landingscraft Hi Johnny, Neither set of instructions is correct. For a USN LCM(3), paint it 5-O Ocean Gray. You'll find that available in our Colourcoats enamels as item number US 06. Best regards, John Snyder White Ensign Models http//WhiteEnsignModels.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From José M. Rico Subject KBismarck.com news! Hello everyone! Please feel free to check the most recent updates made to the website http//www.kbismarck.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=155 Best regards to all, José M. Rico http//www.kbismarck.com http//www.kbismarck.org ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Reviews, Articles, Backissues, Member's models & Reference Pictures at http//smmlonline.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume