Subject: SMML VOL 2879 Date: Sat, 09 Jul 2005 01:09:36 +1000 The Ship Modelling Mailing List (SMML) is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http//sandlehobbies.com For infomation on how to Post to SMML and Unsubscribe from SMML http//smmlonline.com/aboutsmml/rules.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1 Re USS Lagarto 2 Request for info on a proposed aircraft carrier with a parallel landing runway 3 Posting names 4 RE Smithsonian collection of US Maritime Commission ships plans 1939-1970 5 Re Smithsonian collection 6 RE Type 42 plans 7 Subject Ship Plans 8 Re HMS Apollo plans 9 Subject RE Type 42 & Apollo Class 10 Subject Maritime administration plans 11 Smithsonian Ship Plans 12 Subject RE WSW tanker ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Information -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) Subject Re USS Lagarto >> I was just wondering if anybody else has heard about the finding of one the lost 52 submarine from WW2 the USS Lagarto. From what I have heard from the person that founder that she is in out-standing shape, up right and proud looking with no damage as far as can be seen. I am kind of wondering if we could have a Squalus/Sailfish like happing here? Maybe she was depth charged and lost some of her water tight compartments but other where tight and could not refloat? Anybody have an idea about this? << Here's part of the news release on Lagarto Divers discover WWII U.S. sub in Gulf of Thailand By Ed Cropley BANGKOK (Reuters) - A team of deep-sea divers has discovered the wreck of a U.S. submarine sunk by a Japanese minelayer 60 years ago in the Gulf of Thailand during the closing stages of World War II. The U.S.S. Lagarto, a 1,500 ton"Balao class" submarine, disappeared without trace on May 4, 1945 after attacking a Japanese tanker and destroyer convoy around 100 miles off the southeast coast of Thailand. All 86 men on board are still listed as missing in action. "We've always known that since the end of the War there's been a submarine missing around there," said British wreck diver Jamie MacLeod, who discovered the 110 m (310-foot) submarine sitting in 70m (225 ft) of water in May. "We went into all the war-time records, cross-referenced them with fishermen's marks and then searched with the sonar and it came up trumps -- we found a bump on the bottom, went down the line and there it was," MacLeod said. The Pentagon has not yet confirmed the identity of the wreck, which remains the property of the U.S. Navy under international maritime law, although MacLeod says there is little doubt in his mind. "It's a Balao class sub for sure because I've seen it and touched it and it's the only one lost in Thailand," he said. "It looks to me like it's intact and it's sitting upright on the bottom in very clear water, so you can get a good idea of what it looks like," he said. "Everything is still on it -- all the armaments, the brass navigation lights. It's beautiful." Lagarto was one of the submarine built in Manitowoc, Wisconsin, using plans from Electric Boat Co. It should be noted that many of the 52 "lost submarines" have been accounted for in terms of finding the wrecks. As for the state of the wreck, it may very well have suffered a diving casualty of some kind, although steps had been taken (multiple cutoff valves, etc.) to reduce the possibility of a main induction flooding casualty such as Squalus suffered. Perhaps further exploration would reveal some clues, but technically, the US Navy still owns the submarine, so diving on it may be problematic (in addition to the depth, which would require technical diving gear). Tom ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) Subject Request for info on a proposed aircraft carrier with a parallel landing runway Hello Everyone. I would like to request your help in pointing me in the right direction. I am looking for plans, books or websites with information on a proposed aircraft carrier with a parallel landing runway, especially the deck layout. As you know, during the late 1990's and early 2000's, the US Navy was funding the CVNX program, now called CVN-21, which sought to define new aircraft carrier designs. Back then, several deck layouts were investigated, including a catamaran, "stealth" hull, ski jump, and a wider deck with a parallel landing runway. There was an article in Popular Mechanics in October 1998 about them. Here's the link http//www.popularmechanics.com/science/defense/1281161.html But other than the magazine and a few scattered internet images, I have found nothing else. Any ideas where I can find some more info? Thanks in advance, Pablo Sifuentes ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) Subject Posting names Hi Shane and Lorna, I notice that you no longer put up the posters name and email address. I assume this is because more virii have appeared? It would be nice if you at least included the posters full name in the heading, I think most of us would prefer it this way. Thanks! Your efforts are appreciated! Darren Scannell Hi guys, We originally had to remove the email addresses because the issues this causes certain ISPs. They were back in again until this week when I've been doing SMML as Shane has been up-country with St John Ambulance and the Army (I know it's not as well done as usual but I'm rusty). He'll be back soon and the list will be back to what passes for normal. On the issue of posting names, we generally do if people sign their posts. I think it makes for a nicer list if people do include their names after their posts but you'd be amazed at the people who forget. Guess they're in hurry to post Cheers Mistress Lorna ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) Subject RE Smithsonian collection of US Maritime Commission ships plans 1939-1970 Check out the Smithsonian's website at http//americanhistory.si.edu/csr/shipplan.htm Vince McCullough ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) Subject Re Smithsonian collection As a general question, has anyone ever seen plans for the U.S.S. Liberty, the radio intelligence ship attacked by the Israelis in 1967. She was a converted Victory ship. That makes sense, a Victory ship named Liberty! Oh Well! Bill Shuey ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) Subject RE Type 42 plans These guys list the Jecobin series, amongst others, and there is a stretched Type 42 on the list. http//www.modelboatplans.com/plans.html No commercial connection, just a happy customer, I bought a set of Type 23 plans from them earlier this year. Good service!The plans were very good, too, more than enough to do a decent model. Tim Perry ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) Subject Ship Plans I wonder if anyone knows what happens to the ship plans for RN ships when they are scrapped? Each ship is given a full set of plans on completion of build, in later years this is on Microfiche (I brought HMS Cumberland out of build in 1988 and even on microfiche the plans filled a transit van and took two of us most of the day to transfer from Yarrows Office to the ship's) When a ship is brought in for disposal it is stripped and a lot of the stuff goes to hard pressed maintenance units who are so far down the supply requisition priority order some of them are still waiting for spare cannon flintlocks to be delivered. Although I know the electrical and engineering schematics were plundered if there were other ships of the class still in service; but the main architectural drawings would be unlikely to attract the attention of a scavenging, tool starved, ragged mechanic dashing out from the FMB NAAFI with loud cawing noises. Any jack Dusties on the net happen to know where the plan graveyard is? I imagine it is somewhere in the BR of Naval Stores, Chapter Returns Policy, sub section Drawings Mike ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) Subject Re HMS Apollo plans White Ensign models sell a Sambrook Marine plan of HMS Apollo in her 1909 minelayer fit - GA, no lines. I can help you with her earlier appearance and hull lines and also point you to a website with some photos of a good model of HMCS Rainbow. I have built up quite a libarary of stuff on these ships - I am in the process of VERY slowly designing and publishing a card model of HMCS Rainbow. Contact me offline. David Hathaway ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) Subject RE Type 42 & Apollo Class Can't help with the Apollo class, but we carry plans of HMS York Type 42 from Jecobin Plans. You can order them from our secure website. Best regards, John Snyder White Ensign Models http//WhiteEnsignModels.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) Subject Maritime administration plans Thanks for the response on my question regarding the Smithsonians catalog of ships plans from the Maritime Administration. I would like to continue this discussion with others who find an interest in merchant ships from the 1930's and 40's. My email is PaulShip57@hotmail.com Paul Giltz, Toledo, Ohio. I think that the last few days SMML lists are lacking email addresses because the usual site administrator is traveling or on vacation? Hi Paul, Yes, Shane is running around on a firing range looking after Army personnel and Army Cadets for almost a whole week - I'm just filling in. Mistress Lorna ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) Subject Smithsonian Ship Plans The ship plans are located in the collection of the National Museum of American History. Just happens that the latest issue of Ships in Scale magazine (pg 7, July/August 2005) has a blurb about the collection. Two of the catalogs have been updated with new plans. Smithsonian Collection of Warship Plans 7th ed ($15) has 50 pages of new plans, mostly by Merritt A Edson jr. Ship Plans List/Maritime Collection ($20) has some new drawings. Maritime Administration Collection of Ship Plans (1939-1970) ($15) has not been updated because no new plans. Web address is http//americanhistory.si.edu/csr/shipplan.htm Rich in Richmond, VA ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12) Subject RE WSW tanker The 1942 edition of Talbot-Booth's "Merchant Ships" lists SALOME as a naval auxiliary, so presumably she would have been in French naval colours. Best regards, John Snyder White Ensign Models http//WhiteEnsignModels.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Model club & SMMLcon Information ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Reviews, Articles, Backissues, Member's models & Reference Pictures at http//smmlonline.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume