Subject: SMML VOL 3019 Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 01:20:12 +1100 The Ship Modelling Mailing List (SMML) is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http//sandlehobbies.com For infomation on how to Post to SMML and Unsubscribe from SMML http//smmlonline.com/aboutsmml/rules.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1 Happy Holidays 2 Re K267 Model Kit - Sub ID 3 Re Old US model kits 4 Super-Bug, Technology and Strategic Defense 5 Re Spitfire? 6 Re This model of a Submarine - What is it? 7 Re Super-Bug, Technology and Strategic Defense 8 Re This model of a Submarine - What is it? ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From AFisherJr@aol.com Subject Happy Holidays Whatever your faith, may you all have a terriffic holiday season! Particular thanks to all those who labor to make this site so interesting. Al Fisher ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From "Robert Mosher" Subject Re K267 Model Kit - Sub ID George - I found the following website forum http//www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=225824&sid=f29620b096d963e1dce59bce675cc0e6 and someone had posted the following list of Russian submarines of the AKULA class including K267 - hope that helps. AKULA I Improved - 971 U K157 Tigr (N) K267 Samara (P)(Formerly the Akula I Drakon) K328 Leopard (N) K 412 Morzh (P) also referred to as the K419. This confusion may be from the registry change. K267 Nerpa (Refit Suspended) Robert A. Mosher ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From RDChesneau@aol.com Subject Re Old US model kits >> Revell's ships were indeed "flat-bottomed boats" in many cases, but then again, lack of hull detail does not seem to conscern today's builders of water line models, so maybe it was a moot point even then. What concerned me more was the lack of consistent scale between the models (even a kid likes to have his models look good displayed together). The Revell ships were apparently scaled to the size of the box used. << Les Well, yes, sort of, but my guess is that the kits were of myriad scales because they were individually designed as large as possible within the size limits of the manufacturer's existing tools (or injection-moulding machines); the fact that they would fit boxes of common size was handy from the packaging/warehousing standpoint, but was of secondary importance in the grand scheme of things. Tool size was without doubt the reason why the Matchbox 1/72 scale 'Flower' class corvette had its hull broken down on the way it did moulding it in two full-length halves would have required massive investment in new machinery, and the management considered this uneconomic in view of the limited utility (as it was seen at the time) of the equipment. A matter of incidental interest is that Airfix were considering producing a big-scale 'Flower'class corvette at the time Matchbox's effort was in design, but pulled the plug when they got wind of the news. Roger ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From Subject Super-Bug, Technology and Strategic Defense >> Ned the Spitfire did not win the battle of britian, there was more german plane shot down by hurrcaines than pitfires, the hurricaine could take more damage and was a more stable gun platform << Neither the Spitfire nor the Hurricane won the Battle of Britian. What won the Battle of Britian was the system into which both of these aircraft were integrated. It was a system designed to defend the British Isles against a sustained air attack from the European continent. In war, superiority of individual weapons does not necessarily ensure success, it's how resources are applied to the task at hand. Rick Lundin ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From Ned Barnett Subject Re Spitfire? In a sense, you're right, Graham (though you missed my point). If anything "won" the Battle of Britain, it was the Chain Home radar net, backed by the volunteer observer corps (which made intercepts - instead of standing patrols - possible). If anyone won the Battle of Britain, it was Stuffy Dowding, and he never fired a shot (but he stopped Churchill from sending more priceless fighter squadrons to the lost cause in France. Actually, the Spits and Hurricanes each shot down (proportionately) about the same number of planes - Spits were one-third of the fighter force, and shot down one-third of the enemy aircraft lost. But they arguably shot down the more difficult one-third. What the Spitfire did, during the Battle of Britain, was to go after the fighters, freeing up the slower Hurricanes to go after the bombers. Without the top cover of Spitfires, Hurricanes would have had a harder time of it - they were slower than the Bf-109s, and less maneuverable than the Spits (though they could take more damage, were better gun platforms - and, a key point often overlooked, they had their guns concentrated, making it easier to put a lot of metal on target). It was the teamwork of these two planes that was decisive - without the Spit, the Hurricanes "might" have won the Battle on their own, but would you bet your country's life on that? ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From ives100@aol.com Subject Re This model of a Submarine - What is it? From Reynold.Oh@defence.gov.au >> 1. I've just received an Alanger 1/350-scale model of a Soviet Submarine, and the instructions are wholly in Russian (I believe). It is listed as a "K-267". Does anyone know what type of Submarine it is? I consulted John Jordan's "Soviet Submarines, 1945 to the Present" (= 1985) and have narrowed it down to a Victor, a November, an Alpha, a Serria or an Akula (which I understand translates to Shark).<< It's an Akula SSN. The Sierra and Akula somewhat resemble each other, both being SSNs. They were part of a high/low mix that the former USSR Navy was building. An Alfa would be much smaller, and a November looks totally different in the stern. Alanger plans on bringing out a Delta (III or IV) and a Typhoon class also. The Akula is the first release. Tom Dougherty ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From ives100@aol.com Subject Re Super-Bug, Technology and Strategic Defense >> The strongest rational for continuing with "old" computers is the software issue. If you want to see some really ancient computers, go to a FAA Inroute Center. Again, very old and tired equipment. In these cases the cost of testing new software to insure that it isn't buggy and is truly as safe as the old stuff that has been running for ages is prohibitive, if not impossible.<< Rick nailed this one. I remember reading an article a few years back when the FAA was making an attempt at updating its computers "It contains half a million lines of Jovial code and assembly language that was first installed in 1972 and ported from IBM 9020 onto IBM 3083 computers, starting in 1985". In the interim, they apparently were looking for someone, anyone, who could still program in Jovial, an ancient and obscure computer language. The IBM mainframe itself had 16 Mb of RAM. The FAA is moving toward Commercial Off The Shelf (COTS) systems, but porting over the software is still very much a problem, perhaps even more so as the shelf life of computer hardware these days is much shorther than in the past. Hey, just try reading one of those old 5 1/4 inch disks these days... Tom ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From "Brett Soden" Subject Re This model of a Submarine - What is it? Hi George, the sub is that of Project 971 SSN (NATO CODENAME Akula) and "K-267" is that of the "Drakon" and is of the Akula I class. This class entered service in the 1990's and is as far as I know the RFN's primary nuclear powered ASW (both anti ship & sub) platforms. Most of her sensors are thought primarially for the detection and survalance of ships and submaribes. As for being used as a means of inserting special forces troops, I can not say that I have heard them being used for such purposes, and I would have assumed that the Project 636 SSK Kilo class would be better suited for that type of mission. Anyway, I hope this is of sume help to you. Good luck with the building of her, and I hope you have better luck in applying the decals than I did. But over all, it's a rather nice kit and I look forward to getting ALANGER's next set of sub kits when they are released later in the new year. regards, Brett... Townsville Australia ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Reviews, Articles, Backissues, Member's models & Reference Pictures at http//smmlonline.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume