Subject: SMML Vol 3093 Date: 9 Mar 2006 18:37:06 -0000 The Ship Modelling Mailing List (SMML) is proudly sponsored by SANDLE http//sandlehobbies.com For infomation on how to Post to SMML and Unsubscribe from SMML http//smmlonline.com/aboutsmml/rules.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Test 2: What no messages yet? 3: Re: USS Arizona 4: Ark Models 5: cut-away sub kits 6: Re: Best cut-away Sub Kit? 7: Re: WWII Merchant Ship Armament 8: Re: What no messages yet? 9: Re: USS Arizona 10: Post French Ships, French Sources 11: Sub Chaser kits ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From "Phil Gollin" Subject Test Just a test to see if this new set-up works. Also, to wish it well Phil ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From "lmo1960" Subject What no messages yet? Well I'll be the first, unless someone beat me to it and their message is awaiting moderator approval. Shane and Lorna, the move to Yahoo may not be so bad, aside from the built-in annoying advertising, that is. The Ship Modeler's List and the Seaways' list have both been sent via yahoo groups for years now. Larry Ouellette Volunteer, USS Salem (CA 139) United States Naval Shipbuilding Museum Quincy, Massachusetts, USA http//www.uss-salem.org/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From MPMenache@aol.com Subject Re: USS Arizona Hello, Planning to build the revell USS Arizona. Does anyone know the approximate colors of the ship at the time of Pearl Harbor. Thanks michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From Graeme Martin Subject Ark Models I found this crowd somewhere on the internet. At the moment they only seem to have a few Chinese ship models in final form to sell. But HMS Hood in 1/200 scale is to be marketed shortly. I can see lots of inaccuracies. But these could be corrected to build a nice looking model. see below for photos.... http//www.arkmodel.com/hood_e.htm Graeme Martin www.shipmodels.co.nz ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From David L Miller Subject cut-away sub kits While not a cut-away kit, the 1/72 Revell VII U-boat has potential. Aftermarketers are offering fwd torpedo room, control center, and engine room resin castings for this kit. Of course, the aftermarket parts cost more than the original model. By the way, I am building the 1/72 U-boat, not as a cut-away, and I really like it.Dave Miller Macomb, IL ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From David Wells Subject Re: Best cut-away Sub Kit? "Charles Stephanian" > I'm interested in building a cutaway sub model...something I've never > done...and to top it off, I'm mostly a model car builder so I'm not very > familiar with what kits would fit the bill. The kit doesn't have to > currently be in production...I don't mind looking. > I'd just like to hear what folks have to say about which kit might be > best (or offer the most potential). Although I haven't built but a few > ships, I > have been modeling for a long time, so I'm not afraid to tackle a kit > with a few challenges. It depends what sort of sub you want to build. There have long been two early ballistic missile sub kits the old Revell kit, and the ex-Renwal (now Revell) kit. IMHO, the Renwal is the better of the two. It represents an Ethan Allen (SSBN-608) class Polaris sub. (no matter how many times Renwal and Revell have tried to pass it off as the Andrew Jackson) Tom Dougherty recently sent me some excellent data on the Ethan Allen class, which has given me new ideas on how to correct this old kit. Revell Germany has recently re-issued the old Renwal kit as Andrew Jackson, kit 05010. Revell also produced two cutaway U-boat kits A Type VII and a Type XXI. I haven't seen either of these in years. The cutaway version of the Type VII was sold as U-47. I don't recall the kit number of the cutaway version of the Type XXI. I haven't built the cutaway version of either one. If there are others, I don't know about them. "There seems to be something wrong | David R. Wells with our bloody ships today" | Adm. D. Beatty, May 31, 1916 | http//home.att.net/~WellsBrothers/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From Ron Smith Subject Re: WWII Merchant Ship Armament SMML wrote >From Don >Subject WWII Merchant Ship Armament > > 1. I am interested in locating sources for drawings of 5"/38, 3"/50, and > 20M/M guns as installed on C2 merchant ships during WWII. A recurring > note in Armed Guard Commanders voyage reports indicates the 3"50 was a > Mark X #1807 gun dated 1919 with "slowness to return to battery limits" > and notes repeated requests for replacement for a newer mount. I have > copies of the Smithsonian generic C2 Moore built drawings and attempting > to learn more details of her configuration as SS Great Republic. Early ships of the Maritime Commission usually had obsolete USN guns that had been removed from older ships with the exception of the 20mm's. Quite a few had 4"-50's instead of 5"-38's on the stern mount. Nautical Research Journal has been running a series of articles on the light guns of the USN and it has some very nice drawings. As war production ramped up and there were enough of the current guns available to outfit ships of the fleet excess production was diverted to the MC ships. > 2. Has anyone had experience with professional researchers and can give > some thoughts here? Again, main interest is images, Navy ship command > histories, CO command photographs, and CO biographies. Well I am one. The best public sources of images are NARA II in College Park, MD and NHC in DC. Ships' decklogs, work orders and some correspondance can be found at both places but it is mostly for commissioned USN vessels. There is some USNAG documentation and some Maritime Commission documentation but I am not as familiar with those Record Groups. CO photos and bios are a little more problematic since the Navy did not always archive those and the records for civilian CO's of MC ships might not exist at all. I've provided a general answer here since others have be interested. For more details on research contact me directly. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From donsrcships@wmconnect.com Subject Re: What no messages yet? GOOD Morning, OK your old Rustbucket is still on board, I was thinking about jumping off but now have decided to stay on for the long hull. OK SO your stuck with me again . ;-) arnt you so lucky. SO lets put this ship in shape and start sailing. YOU Will fine me in the engine room . ;-)) BUT I have to figure out where all of the RC Radios are and servos. Maybe I should start in the Radio room instead. DON That Portland Rustbucket ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From "John Snyder" Subject Re: USS Arizona Hi Michael, All vertical surfaces up to the level of the top of the funnel, and all steel decks and steel horizontal surfaces were painted 5-D Dark Grey; vertical surfaces above the top of the funnel were painted the 1941 version of 5-L Light Gray. Wood decks were natural teak. In our Colourcoats enamels, that would be US 03 1941 5-L Light Gray US 04 5-D Dark Gray C 01 Teak Best regards, John Snyder White Ensign Models http//WhiteEnsignModels.com -----Original Message----- Behalf Of MPMenache@aol.com Subject [SMML] Re USS Arizona Hello, Planning to build the revell USS Arizona. Does anyone know the approximate colors of the ship at the time of Pearl Harbor. Thanks michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From "Reid, John (AFIU)" Subject Post French Ships, French Sources Regarding a couple of recent threads, a bit of non-Anglophone info which is probably new to some SMMLies. 1. Re ex-Clemenceau scrapping and asbestos decontamination. From magazine Navires et Histoires, issue 101 (Feb-Mar 2006), major article on Clemenceau's career, a side panel on page 31 details the scrapping saga. My translation of some paras (and I apologise to Francophones on the list who have the original magazine!) [omitted background about former widespread use of asbestos for insulation and its now-known dangers] Normally, the story of a ship after her disarmament takes only a few lines in a scholarly history. It stays a while in a naval lay-up, is sold, and is discreetly broken up in a workshop often far away. Only the sale of the hull sometimes merits a few lines in some dailies. The case of Clemenceau (or more exactly, the former Clemenceau) is very different and has periodically appeared for over ten years. The [French] Navy has already recovered useful material, notably the propellers for FNS Charles de Gaulle. [I omit summary of events prior to 2004.] A contract for asbestos removal was signed 23 June 2004 with the German consortium SDI which subcontracted operations to the companies Technopure and Prestocid; about 220 tonnes of lagging and fire protection remained aboard. [JJR Metric tonne is 2204 lbs, almost equal to imperial long ton of 2240 lbs] The ship was moored at the pier in the Grand Bassins [near Toulon], the works began 22 Nov 2004 and were completed 2 Sept 2005. Then a new polemic began, that the asbestos removal in France could not be complete before the demolition in India. The asbestos was removed (the figure of 115 tonnes has been mentioned) where that was possible without weakening the structure needed to permit her being towed to India. The demolition and final decontamination must be performed by the Indian workshop Shree Ram Vessels Scrap Ltd, which is specialized in removal and treatment of dangerous goods and which has certifications under ISO 9001 and ISO 14001, under the control of the French engineers. Two associations (Andeva and Ban Asbestos) spoke up against the conditions of asbestos decontamination in India. For its part, Technopure, which must train the Indians in decontamination, withdrew from the part of its contract covering the training, which it had never seen [!] and explained that decontamination, limited to powdery asbestos of the machinery compartments and the catapults, had been pushed to the limits and that only non-powdery asbestos remained, recoverable without touching the structure. The affair was taken to court by 4 associations (Andeva, Ban Asbestos, Greenpeace, and the Jussieu anti-asbestos committee). [short omission of Greenpeace militant occupation of vessel at Toulon] As this issue goes to press, the carrier is in the Suez Canal, and is due to arrive in India 13 feb. To be continued…. End of translation and as SMMLies all know, she is now on her way back to France; if she doesn't sink, like, say, São Paulo in 1946. By the way, (a) this magazine has great photos, has global coverage, and is worth considering buying even if your French is poor to non-existent; EUR 7.50, less if on subscription; (b) if ever you visit Toulon, be sure to take a trip around the harbour, launches leave from the quay frequently and you can get terrific shots of vessels ­ depends what is in port at the time of course. The Naval Museum is definitely worth a visit too. 2. Re FNS Arromanches colours The website www.marines-editions.com features a number of books which look to me as if they would be useful references, in particular "Les navires français en Indochine 1946-1956. Par Jean MOULIN" which features her on the front cover. Note Although I have bought and been happy with some of their books, I haven't dealt with their mail order, no idea how good their system is. John Reid Rome ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11) From "Roger Pearson" Subject Sub Chaser kits Greetings all from 'Downunder', I'm on the lookout for any available kits, either the old Glencoe or Ringo ones, they are/were both 174 I believe ? I know it will be difficult to find any, but if I can get my hands on FOUR I have the following projects in mind 1. A WW1 RN ML, an interesting conversion as the ML is 30' shorter !!!! 2. The "Hitra", one of the 'Shetland Bus' SC's, 3. A WW1 SC and 4. A WW2 SC. If ANYONE, ANYWHERE hears or sees one of these kits (yes I'm watching ebays in the US & UK) I would be very gratefull. I guess I would go as high as $US40 ???????? Cheers and Thankyou, Roger Pearson. Bendigo, Australia. debrogerp@hotmail.com +61 3 5447 8693 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Reviews, Articles, Backissues, Member's models & Reference Pictures at http//smmlonline.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume